I knew it was Paula, then i forgot as I have not seen movie for many years now, then I got reminded too.....infact, u can see Paula actually dancing.....she is front center for a few seconds!

Plus Arsinio Hall was in "straight up" and they had a thing going.....same with emilio estevez (I think?)

glamslamkid said:

What about Pleasure Principle? I thought that was very good. It helps that the song ROX!
But I will give it to Paula. It is only logical that since she taught Janet anything Paula has the dance talent. Some people are just true fans of Janet, and can't be objective.

sosgemini said:

Yeah, I agree that Paula is not fluid. But I think that is not her style. Fluid or not, she is still a better dancer on technique than Janet. Some of Janet's moves are so basic in execution, you can see just how to learn the moves. ya know that I mean? With Paula, the moves look so natural... you don't know where the moves start and end... just seems more natural, not learned the way some of Janet's moves are. I am thinking in particular the Pleasure principle video, where she puts her hand on her stomach and go into the ... I think the dance step is "the worm" backwards out of the picture. She seem to stop, think about it, then get her feet in postion and then execute the move.

My vote goes to Paula, for her choreography skills.

I'm sorry, but Madonna as a dancer in the same breath as a Jackson?



Fuck right off!

Tito could probably smoke her!

Marrk said:

it's easy to be good at moves you've been doing for 30 years

Paula is a "trained" dancer. In fact, for those of you who have attended dance conventions, one of her mentors is Joe Tremaine, a famous teacher, choreographer and dance advocate. Paula is extremely talented in regard to her ability and her "vision" as a choreographer. As a matter of fact, I really would like to see her return to her "dance" roots as a choreographer for musical artists or maybe even for a Broadway show. So judging on strictly professional dance ability, I don't think Janet could compete with Paula.

Janet is more of a "hoofer." She has a ton of natural talent, but she doesn't have the training. If she were to audition with a trained, professional dancer for a "gig" requiring an all-around dance ability, I don't think she would be hired. THAT SAID, Janet is one of the best performers (if not THE BEST) in regard to music videos and tours. Therefore, if we are talking about "music video performers" then probably Janet would have the edge over Paula in regard to that style of dance just by virtue of Janet's amazing dance performances over the years.
[Edited 11/27/04 18:18pm]

TheDeacon said:

I dunno dude, looks like Brit-ney to me!

Marrk said:

VoicesCarry said:

Wow, I should buy stock in Maybelline. I can't believe what bad complexion Brit-ney has. I thought she was just a pretty face. She is not pretty enough to be a model, can't act good enough to be an actress, can't sing good enough to be a singer (sorry but she can't touch Christina, among others), can't play an instrument, can't write anything but the stupid messages she wear on her t-shirts "He loves me". What good is she??

GrayKing said:

if you're referring to MJ, go back and look at him as a 10 yr old and anything else he did through the 70's. all natural baby, he didn't need to be trained. If Madge was trained, WTF was that shit on 'Lucky Star'?

Marrk said:

I don't think Madonna is a particularly interesting dancer, but that was a silly dance she did for a video - I have absolutely no idea why you cite it as an example of her actual dancing. She was supposed to be just another teen girl in that video, not Nuryev.

glamslamkid said:

Same thing that I said about Paula and Janet is true for Madonna and Janet: Madonna has more FORMAL training, BUT THAT DOESN'T MAKE MADONNA NECESSARILY A BETTER DANCER.

JANET IS A HOOFER, BUT SHE IS A TALENTED, WONDERFUL DANCER, NONETHELESS. I WOULD EVEN VENTURE TO SAY THAT JANET IS PROBABLY A BETTER FREESTYLE DANCER THAN EITHER PAULA OR MADONNA. I mean just because a dancer has a ballet background, doesn't mean he or she can dance jazz or hip-hop.
[Edited 11/27/04 18:28pm]
[Edited 11/27/04 18:28pm]

Marrk said:

hey, we can all sit down and watch video tapes of the Temptations to get our moves. i'm talking about the stuff MJ's been doing for the last 20-25 years (and the stuff Janet's been doing for 15-20).... if i was doing the same dance moves for that long, i'd be a badass dancer too.

glamslamkid said:

Many times Paula WAS the show... meaning she choregraphed many of those award shows, not just individual performers but also many dance routines that were part of the show's structure, you know where the dancers were professional dancers hired specifically for the show... so who would she be stealing the show from? Paula, Debbie Allen, Michael Peters, they were the hottest choregraphers of the 80's and ruled market for choregraphers of these televised award shows. So WHAT are you talking about??

Oh, and I'm real sure Gordy let pre-teen MJ go out on stage without training in basic choreography and dance, considering how controlled everything was at Motown.

It's not like he just stepped out there and "knew" what to do.

Isel said:

freestyle? when did she ever do that? every move she's ever done has been choreographed to the detail. you can tell, because every time she appears on TV or on tour, the choreography for whatever song is straight out of the video.


she is a great dancer, but hardly original or that interesting.

kinke said:

Well that settles it for me... because I thought that video was some of the hottest dance moves I have ever seen Janet do.... and Paula taught her THAT too???

prodigalfan said:

Actually, Barry Lather choreographed Pleasure Principle.He won a few awards for that video. He was one of Paula's proteges,though. Also I just wanted to add the Barry Lather is currently serving as Usher's artistic director for some past and up-coming performances including the 2005 Super Bowl.
[Edited 11/27/04 18:50pm]

GrayKing said:

Well, they ALL are choreographed to some extent. Jamie King choreographs for Madonna.. Anyway, I'm just talking in terms of movement. Janet just seems to have a natural grace about her.
[Edited 11/27/04 18:40pm]

Isel said:

Madonna actually has choreographed a lot of her own stuff since ROL. ie, Ray Of Light, Nothing Really Matters, Beautiful Stranger, etc.

on the other hand, i absolutely detest the choreography in those videos

GrayKing said:

whatever you do, just don't start a 'Better Dancer? Madonna Vs MJ' thread. please! Just stop people in the street tomorrow and ask them instead or something!

There'd only be one winner.

GrayKing said:

I don't know about the videos, but I know FOR SURE is that Jamie King choreographed the Drowned World Tour and the Reinvention Tour. I believe that Madonna and King have worked together for a while.

Marrk said:

Meh

MJ hasn't shown us his fabulous dancing skills in a long time, however Madonna just finished a world tour and proves she can still strut her stuff.

And Madonna doesn't need 20 dancers behind her either

It's a matter of opinion my friend, i enjoy watching Madonna dance better than MJ simply because she's non-repetitive.

Marrk said:

i wouldn't start a thread like that. as i don't care. in fact, i didn't even bring up Madonna in the first place. i was responding to your comment. get over your MJ-inferiority complex. nobody cares anymore.

Isel said:

certainly.

VoicesCarry said:

you must have seen the B&W audition when he appeared to be a JB clone? right? There was nothing 'basic' about Michael's dancing, even at 9-10 yrs old. c'mon!

Comparing Madonna's dancing to Michael Jackson's is plainly fucking ridiculous.

Marrk said:

Yes, ok, we all get it, Michael is the little talented bundle of angel sent down from heaven by a benevolent God. Thanks.

Now, where did I compare Madonna and MJ again? Oh yeah, that was you.

GrayKing said:

That just has to do with having a good choreographer, no less, no more

Paula is an excellent choreographer. She can do no wrong in my book, from the work I have seen her do. Debbie Allen is a great choreographer also, as well as Rosie Perez. Rosie said in an interview that be a good choreographer and being a good dancer are two different things and she saw her self as a better choreographer than dancer. Paula is more jazz, but she has versatility due to her training. The routines she did for Janet are more jazz dancing than street and Janet did it very well. Janet decided to go a different direction with Anthony and did more street dancing. She stuck with that type of dancing with Tina, Shawnette, and Gil, but Janet can do the jazz stuff too

Jennifer is also a very good dancer and has a lot of energy. I've been watching her dance since she was a fly girl on In Living Color. Actually, I think she's a better dancer than she is an actress or singer.

Britney is just a Janet copy cat hands down. Even Janet sees that.

Madonna is just someone who has rythm and can keep the beat. She can learn moves as long as they're not too difficult and she did modern dance which I've always seen as chaotic and not logical. Anybody with an imagination can do it. You do have to train your body physically, but there are different levels of it and she was on the easy level, at least from the college footage I saw

So, in terms of routines, Janet wins. They are very intricate and have subtle details you have to catch, which makes the choreography difficult (I have lifted entire dance numbers from her videos and performance for my own dance group). Paula wins for versatility and the fact that she knows how to wow a crowd with a routine and her blocking and direction is beautiful. They way a photographer sets up a wonderful photo is how she choreographs. She can see the big picture.

Oh and Michael isn't good like he used to be and I'm tire of seeing him kick his leg in the air and grab his crotch. He shouldn't be in this thread at all
[Edited 11/27/04 18:54pm]