She looks like a drag queen. She should form a cabaret partnership with MJ.

Cloudbuster said:

We could call it: Just M.

I didn´t get this.

I don´t see how having a great make-up and clothes people makes you a "reinventor".

Madonna is smart. She knows how to get attention. I mean, could you please tell me what was that Britney/Christina kiss all about, if it wasn´t for attention? You may think of MJ - the person - whatever you want, but he doesn´t use a controversy in his art to sell his albums. It´s always just about the dance and music. Anyways I think we should leave Mj out of this, because this threat would go on and on after that.

Can someone help me....What exactly did Madonna reinvent? Help me understand!

dag said:

i wouldn't worry about it. MJ is the Better artist. Better singer, dancer, writer and alway will be. Where people get he hasn't reinvented himself from i don't know.
He'd still be in day glow flowery costumes and afro otherwise. Musically though, of course he's evolved. 36 years in the biz should tell anyone with half a brain he's had to (41 if you include his nightclub performances at 5 years old)

I've nothing to say on Madonna, i said what i had to say in that 'Deconstructing Madonna' thread. I'm not repeating myself and i can't be arsed to link to it.

bds70 said:

SHe's done more than you...that's for sure.

What a stupid statement...even if you don't like her. It's like saying Stephen King has contributed nothing good to the literary world or Steven Spielbeg has made a bunch of crappy movies...just because you think so.

She's done plenty...not all of it great but a lot of it pretty decent. If she didn't, she wouldn't have lasted this long.

well, gee whiz, why don't we compare madonna with hendrix and lennon. heck, we could even compare her with nietzsche or kant.

anyway, in a group of her peers, madonna stands right up there with them. is she better? i suppose that depends on your own opinion...its far too subjective to have an ultimate answer. to say she is irrelevant in the business or that she is even mediocre at was she does is just wrong. sure, it can be your opinion but it is an uninformed or unobjective opinion. i think to say she has done nothing musically is extemely naive. madonna is the epitome of trendsetting. atfirst you may think that has nothing to do with music but, really, look a little deeper. trends are what makes pop music and music video. madonna has influenced the way we SEE music. she has influenced what kind of topics can be discussed in a POP format. is she the first to present her topics? of course not...we haven't seen any firsts in ages (as far as pop music goes). even prince was not doing any firsts...he simply elaborated on those that came before him while bringing some of his own flavor to things. for thoe of you who would argue that madonna has failed to bring any of her own flavor to the scene all i can say is "why has she lasted then?" if hiring great producers is all you need to succeed for over 20 years in such a finicky industry...well, it wouldn't be too finicky because everyone would just hire great producers.

what madonna has done can't be easily described nor can the secret of her success be easily explained. she just has that thing. that thing transcends all elements of pop music.

.
[Edited 10/8/04 13:05pm]

Marrk said:

STOP RIGHT THERE. No more MJ vs. Madonna comments in this thread - every damn Madonna thread devolves into that.

DavidEye said:

let's talk about
her last movie..how much did it gross again??? That's what I thought
her last album again...how many copies didn't it sell?? wasn't it the worst of her career?? that's what I thought.
And if i charged $300 dollars a ticket of some bubble gum oldies I would have a high grossing tour as well.

DavidEye said:

and still going on in 2004!! what's it telling ya!!!

VoicesCarry said:

or the even more likely madonna v. janet avenue. so tired, either way.

bds70 said:

yet, strangely enough, everyone who went to the show agrees that the american life segment was the best.

by the way, its hardly a greatest hits tour when at least 5 of the songs performed are from the latest album...

oh, and are we now considering her movie career as requirements for pop music relevance? if that's the case...um, hello? prince...acting...two words that go well together. let's just stick to music.
[Edited 10/8/04 13:24pm]

bds70 said:

It's telling me a lot of people are in major denial.

kinaldo said:

Go back and listen to Electric Ladyland.

CynicKill said:

"Deconstructing Madonna" was too cerebral a title for a thread. Now this one gets right to the point and brings out all the bashers and defenders alike. You've got to dumb it down if you want the most people to respond.

sextonseven said:

I have to say that thread was toolong...and very drawn out. I felt it really left no room for discussion. And here we have one that does the exact opposite. At least the other one was well thought out unlike the poster of this one. Might as well have been "I hate Madonna".

If you are going to bash the girl, you ought to have some reasons better than her last 2 years as an artist to back up your statements.

superspaceboy said:

I think people are just upset that Madonna will be remembered as the biggest woman in the history of rock 'n' roll. Now whether she deserves to be is open for debate, but the fact is no woman has been more popular for a longer period of time than she has.

I like these comments and if and when I come up with another thread of this type I'll take those suggestions into careful consideration.

But the reason it might seem drawn out was because I was trying to touch on a lot of different things that might interest people about her and word it in such a way that it might cause debate.

Suffice it to say deconstruction makes it sound like what it is, long. The analysis leaves nothing to be debated.

Yeah everyone hates Madonna because she's a woman who's had extreme success and others can't handle it. She's a woman, and people hate woman who stand up for themselves and take a stand and become successful-especially men. And then other women claim her to be a bitch and go about their womany ways about her.

But Madonna will still have a strong fan base till the day she dies and she'll always be able to sell out shows within minutes and you people who hate her can just keep on blabbering bullshit like Elton John

But why would Elton be jealous of Madonna? Last time I checked his ticket prices were about as expensive as hers. He's doing well and he's been in the business about 30 yrs.

CynicKill said:

He's performing in Vegas where all the washed up stars go to. Celine Dion? We'll see Cher there soon

And 8 years from now, unless she happens to die, Madonna will be around too still making music and performing.

Internationally Madonna is a bigger icon

bds70 said:

you're absolutely right. thanks for tellin' it like it is.


thread over. let's move on now...

cnutty77 said:

check out this site - it will help alot!!

http://media2.ms11.net//i...index.html

check the rip-off links on the site - she's 'reinvented' everyone from Jean Harlow to Deborah Harry - hardly original is it now - id call it re-unoriginal!! LOL

Madonna Pays Up To Settle Copyright Claim

Lawsuit alleged singer ripped off French erotica photographer

MAY 24--On the eve of Madonna's launch of her "shocking" new tour, the singer has quietly settled a federal lawsuit that accused her of ripping off the work of an acclaimed photographer. Details of the financial settlement are confidential and Madonna acknowledged no wrongdoing in her liberal appropriation of the images of the late French photographer Guy Bourdin. Last September, Bourdin's son Samuel filed a federal copyright lawsuit against Madonna, claiming that her video for the song "Hollywood" was a blatant visual theft job of his father's racy images. "It's one thing to draw inspiration; it's quite another to simply plagiarize the heart and soul of my father's work," Bourdin said at the time. Included in Bourdin's federal complaint were side-by-side comparisons of his father's work with images with stills from the "Hollywood" video. Bourdin's lawyer, John Koegel, said the parties reached a "very, very successful settlement," adding that terms of the deal did not allow him to discuss exact dollar amounts. Below you'll find the stipulation and order of dismissal signed earlier this month by Judge Lewis A. Kaplan.

edited
[Edited 10/8/04 18:52pm]

kremlinshadow said:

You do realize that this is an anti madonna site, do you not? LOL you're quite pathetic posting something irrelevant.

jayaredee said:

Great site...To the Madonna Brigade it is irrelevant that's for sure. Excellent photos as well...



Oh my god look at that body isn't she hot.. Wow!!!! Come on Madonna Brigade...What do you say???

NICEEEEE!!!! Look at that ass!!!!

gman1966 said:

gman do you have a wife or a girlfriend? If so when she's 43 i want to see a picture of her in the exact same bathing suit, until then shut up.

And you do realize that "great site" you looked at was designed by a middle aged woman who quit her job in 2002 and has spare time on her hands.

Is that your dream job too gman? designing hate sites towards other artists? LOL

I hate Britney Spears, but i would never dedicate my life to designing a hate site to her, people who do that have no life.