VinnyM27 said:

R&B isn't the first love to most of the folks who hate on it, so I'm not surprised. Even though soul, rock and countless other genres are derivatives of it.

If you wanna talk about ClearChann... I mean, commercial radio's fixation with Ursher then, yeah, that's a valid discussion. I can see how some kids would think R&B sucks. Ursher isn't the crux of R&B and what's playing on radio isn't the consummate representation of it.

Then again, it's pretty myopic to berate a 50+ year genre based solely on what's being overplayed in the commercial market.
[Edited 10/5/04 19:51pm]

Rhondab said

I think if you want good music....you can find it. I truly believe that if some of the old school artist came out today....MOST of you wouldn't like it.

You can find good music as long as you look for something old in the record store. As for the old school artists coming out today, many of them have. Their new albums were horrible because they watered down their music to fit in with today's music.

i think the reason like Snorah Jones so much, is because she sounds old and plays the piana. just because you play the piana doesn't mean you're great but i'm sure people feel that way about A. Keys too.

everything good doesn't just have to be old. There are some good new artists out there (not many, but there are some): rachael yamagata, john mayer, Norah Jones...




i think the reason like Snorah Jones so much, is because she sounds old and plays the piana. just because you play the piana doesn't mean you're great but i'm sure people feel that way about A. Keys too.

You can find good music as long as you look for something old in the record store. As for the old school artists coming out today, many of them have. Their new albums were horrible because they watered down their music to fit in with today's music.

You are right; just because one plays the piano doesn't make that person great, BUT Norah Jones's piano playing beats out A. Keys piano playing! I don't know... Norah seems "legit" whereas A.Keys seems "fraudulent."

Everyone here wants more funk BANDS. Not solo acts with a makeshift band. But besides Jamiroquai I'm not even sure who I could name.

Lauryn Hill was the same way, too. She copied (lyrically) Stevie Wonder and copied (lyrically and the way the song was sang) Donny Hathaway, too. It doesn't make you a genius just because you copy. I was saying something like this in the other post about Dre3000.

Maybe that is why Lauryn Hill had a "breakdown" -- because she realized that she wasn't as genius as people were making her out to be. My friend (she analyzes situations as much as I do) even said, waaaay before Lauryn Hill did her unplug album, it's all going to come out in the open that Lauryn Hill isn't as talented as people make her out to be and when she realizes that she isn't as talented as, say, the people she is copying, then she'll be seen as a fraud and she'll be ashamed. And she was "ashamed." She went and tried to do her "own thing" with that unplugged album and it went nowhere. So she has to be sitting somewhere thinking, "Am I really a genius?"

LittleLamb said:

What do you mean by "fraudulent"? You think that she doesnt really know how to play?

Norah can play the piano very well. I heard her on a show called piano jazz and she's very good.

and what about vanessa carlton? are her piano skills any good?

dragondayz said:

I AM NOT CALLING NORAH FRAUDLENT-- I LOVE THE GIRL. IT'S A.KEYS THAT SEEMS LIKE A FRAUD TO ME-- meaning: she probably knows how to play a few keys here and there where as Norah seems as though she could be a piano teacher later in life when all is said and done. Alicia appears to only know enough to be labeled a "piano player." However, to me, she is just a Mary J. Blige that knows how to play a few keys. She's hardly behind the piano now. As for NORAH, NORAH IS GREAT!!!!

I knew that you were not talking about Norah. I was basically agreeing in that she is a good piano player.
I think that Alicia can play too. Just think that it isn't showcased as much

MARRY SOME RAP STAR AND BECOME A HAS BEEN (AND DON'T YOU ALL DARE TO MENTION HER CRAPPY POETRY BOOK)


HOLD IT RIGHT THERE BUDDY! did you say Ashanti has a poetry book? don't make me laugh!

D'Angelo, Maxwell, Badu and Jill Scott come along, and The Crowd digs them all right, but criticizes them for not being prolific enough.

Lauryn Hill was the same way, too. She copied (lyrically) Stevie Wonder and copied (lyrically and the way the song was sang) Donny Hathaway, too. It doesn't make you a genius just because you copy. I was saying something like this in the other post about Dre3000.

Maybe that is why Lauryn Hill had a "breakdown" -- because she realized that she wasn't as genius as people were making her out to be. My friend (she analyzes situations as much as I do) even said, waaaay before Lauryn Hill did her unplug album, it's all going to come out in the open that Lauryn Hill isn't as talented as people make her out to be and when she realizes that she isn't as talented as, say, the people she is copying, then she'll be seen as a fraud and she'll be ashamed. And she was "ashamed." She went and tried to do her "own thing" with that unplugged album and it went nowhere. So she has to be sitting somewhere thinking, "Am I really a genius?"

Y'all are some hard people to please. I hope you weren't in the crowd in the early 90's who were crying for "real" musicians playing "real" music to come back. Let me talk about that "crowd" for a minute.

When Brand New Heavies came along, that crowd didn't buy their records, and The Crowd called them gimmicky for copping a 70's sound.

Jamiroquai drops their first 2 albums, and The Crowd called them Stevie Wonder/EWF wannabes notwithstanding the nice, listenable grooves they were churning out.

D'Angelo, Maxwell, Badu and Jill Scott come along, and The Crowd digs them all right, but criticizes them for not being prolific enough.

In the interim, Remy Shand, Res, Donnie, Dwele, Rashaan Patterson, Lewis Taylor and others come along and The Crowd doesn't pay attention, doesn't buy their records or take any initiative to support these artists. Or The Crowd dismisses them as wannabe Marvins, Stevies, Princes, etc.

Artists like india.arie (whom I don't really dig personally) win handfuls of Grammys, but don't sell in large proportions a la Beyonce. The Crowd doesn't buy the records.

Artists like Ledisi burble under the surface and The Crowd doesn't pay attention.

Legends like Ray Charles and Al Green release records and many in The Crowd don't buy them.

But listen to the radio and watch video channels, and on the basis of Mary J. Blige, Beyonce, Mariah, Usher et al., The Crowd proclaims R&B dead and tired.

I'm not calling out anyone on this board, I am criticizing a mindset. We all whined about real music coming back to R&B. and real musicians come along to give us what we claim we want, and we don't buy their records because we don't take time to find out about them or dismiss them as copycats.

But we can say R&B is dead, right?

Guess who killed it?

And give me a f'in break... "breakdown"?? You must know little about artistic process

Well put!!!!

Ooooooh, then you don't know who I am. Anyone that knows me, knows that I am literary and I understand the "artistic process" -- geniuses have breakdowns, but also, people pretending to be geniuses have breakdowns, too, cos they can't live up to the "visions" in their own heads. Lauryn Hill is a visionary, at best. She has good intentions, but she is no Nina Simone or Fiona Apple!
[Edited 10/22/04 7:16am]
[Edited 10/22/04 7:18am]

. What is tired is hip-hop!! It's laughable and not the least bit interesting anymore. Same old shit every time you turn on the tv. Hip-hop is boring as hell and completely uninspired.

kisscamille said:

Boy, now that's another thread altogether. But check out Madvillainy and The Grind Date before writing off hip-hop altogether.