I have recently gone head first into a Radiohead rabbit hole. KID A...all that I'd read. Supreme album. However, also started in on The Bends which is just amazing....and Moon Shaped Pool, also excellent. So, i started reading and some writer highlighted the fact that Radiohead was a rock band based on their 1st three albums...Pablo Honey, The Bends and OK Computer that did a left turn with the release of the highly electronic ....it reminded me of the Man of course. We all know the left turn he took from Purple Rain to ARTWIAD but Purple Rain itself was a turn...highly guitar to the fore which was a departure from he'd done up to then. Sure, there were flashes of guitar greatness on all the first 5 albums but PR was just next level...

Then there is Radiohead's songs. Like Prince, i'm finding some of their hooks to be totaly special. It makes me return to the song over and over. ...exactly like Prince always was able to do.

Finally, i'm finding how adventurous they are to be yet another similarity. I'm sitting there listening to National Anthem and suddenly hear what sounds like another song being mixed in...all these horns. I realize, it's intentional...it's the same song. If it was the undeniable funk of Lady Cab Driver and Controversy that got me in, it was unconventionally stark When Doves Cry and Adventure-funk of Around the World that grabbed a hold of me firmly like a boa positioning for the big squeeze....and then the squeeze itself, Parade....total submission. Then I must have gone to heavan and heard Sign O The times! hahaha

Radiohead, like Prince, is not following any frameworks. The really seem to be doing what ever they feel like which is so good to hear.

now having said all that, still think Prince's Creep live kills Radioheads's !! Sorry. It really is like a Marvel Superhero vs a mortal Tyson Fury....just can't compare live.

I don’t know, I think that any connections between Prince and Radiohead are tenuous and a bit of a stretch. The "similarities" that you identify are quite broad.

Radiohead's change of direction with Kid A was largely a response to the stuff coming out of Warp Records in the 90s/early 2000s, and a result of Thom’s love of Aphex Twin. You can identify loose connections between Prince and “IDM” – Prince was always championed by the The Electrifying Mojo who was a key figure in the Detroit Techno scene, so Prince’s music was part of the musical fabric from which Techno developed, but it’s quite indirect. That said, I’ve always felt that IDM would have been a more natural and authentic source of inspiration for Prince over Hip-Hop, so I would have welcomed Prince's version of "Kid-A" at the time . If you compare something like Batdance with Aphex Twin's Windowlicker, you can imagine how it might have worked.

Personally, I’ve always really disliked what Prince did with the lyrics of Creep. It’s a solid musical performance, but conceptually shallow to me. Creep is a song about self-doubt and self-loathing and therein lies its power, whereas Prince turned it into something arrogant and spiteful sounding. Just my view.

Ahh, if only Prince had discovered Super Furry Animals and The Boo Radleys, bands superior to Radiohead. Maybe he did. Stevie Wonder did and he was blind.

fen said:

I don’t know, I think that any connections between Prince and Radiohead are tenuous and a bit of a stretch. The "similarities" that you identify are quite broad.

Radiohead's change of direction with Kid A was largely a response to the stuff coming out of Warp Records in the 90s/early 2000s, and a result of Thom’s love of Aphex Twin. You can identify loose connections between Prince and “IDM” – Prince was always championed by the The Electrifying Mojo who was a key figure in the Detroit Techno scene, so Prince’s music was part of the musical fabric from which Techno developed, but it’s quite indirect. That said, I’ve always felt that IDM would have been a more natural and authentic source of inspiration for Prince over Hip-Hop, so I would have welcomed Prince's version of "Kid-A" at the time . If you compare something like Batdance with Aphex Twin's Windowlicker, you can imagine how it might have worked.

Personally, I’ve always really disliked what Prince did with the lyrics of Creep. It’s a solid musical performance, but conceptually shallow to me. Creep is a song about self-doubt and self-loathing and therein lies its power, whereas Prince turned it into something arrogant and spiteful sounding. Just my view.

Prince did shit EDM, notably with '1999 the new master', but he also did good to brilliant dance music, as demonstrated on Emancipation disc 3, as well as Rave Un2 The Year 2000's techno dance groove - probably his best effort, and yeah probably those samples from Batdance.

I think the similarities are mainly in spirit...they both do whatever they want and it's actually good and great. I do recognize some sounds in the Radiohead stuff I am getting into that sounds like stuff I've heard in PRince's music. There are little squeaky vocals, or underwater feels that are similar. There was story by a lady named Ruth Violette about Prince living in LA and wanting to see every live show and Radiohead was a favorite of his. It was not a surprise. I'm sure he was familiar with their albums. I haven't ever read much from Thom Yorke or the Radiohead band about Prince but for their comments on his blocking 'Creep' but there is no doubt they must have respected him...maybe they didn't actually like him..whow knows. Prince rubbed many the wrong way

I'm big fans of both. I really thought about this and tried to find any similarities. Not just musically, but even culturally, stylistically, politically, or . . . anything.

I just can't.

PJMcGee said:

I don't know. I think Thom owns all those Radiohead songs, including Creep. In part because he's a great singer, but also because he's way more convincing at delivering lines like I'm a creep, I'm a weirdo. He feels and expresses his lyrics like no one else could. Reminds me of the aching sadness of Bonnie Raitt's I Can't Make You Love Me compared to Prince's clueless, seductive interpretation.

I can hardly imagine Thom Yorke writing - let alone singing - songs like;

''My Name Is Prince''

''Baby I'm A Star'',

or Prince writing a song like ''Packt Like Sardines in a Crushd Tin Box'', or ''Knives Out''.

Though he acknowledged the greatness of the song by performing it - true.

As far as Prince's serious self-reflection went for me is ''When Doves Cry'', of which I believe was written to fit the Purple Rain's character and movie story. Correct me if i'm wrong though.

(Also ''Reflection'' had a seldome touch of deep Prince. Anyways...)

For me, Prince was never really deeply self-reflective the way Thom Yorke does in basically all of his (personal) lyrics.

Prince's self-knowledge and self-reflection was often attuned to his faith.

Not to mention the star position he put hmself into.

It is actually very difficult, if not irrelavant, to compare the two artists in that respect.

Musically indeed it is different, where you can draw some comparisons.

All this is my personal opinion of course.

an excerpt from a LA TImes review of In Rainbows sort of catches what I was trying to say:

Devotees did know, in part, what “In Rainbows” would bring. A track listing surfaced when the band announced the album, and it was full of titles familiar from recent bootleg live recordings. It may be more correct to call “In Rainbows” an edition, rather than a definitive album; these studio versions sometimes differ significantly from their earlier counterparts, and it’s possible that Radiohead will redraw these maps another time. There’s really no guarantee, in fact, that the album won’t change by the time it becomes a physical CD release next year

These guys obviously tried out new material live and then the studio incarnations were just a point in time as they performances kept changing....hmmm...Prince?????? Sometime a disappointment (Fury) and sometimes you're just blown away by how he could change the same song into some totally diff animal (for the good).

BTW, In Rainbows...wow...so damn good.

Vannormal said:

PJMcGee said:

I don't know. I think Thom owns all those Radiohead songs, including Creep. In part because he's a great singer, but also because he's way more convincing at delivering lines like I'm a creep, I'm a weirdo. He feels and expresses his lyrics like no one else could. Reminds me of the aching sadness of Bonnie Raitt's I Can't Make You Love Me compared to Prince's clueless, seductive interpretation.

I can hardly imagine Thom Yorke writing - let alone singing - songs like;

''My Name Is Prince''

''Baby I'm A Star'',

or Prince writing a song like ''Packt Like Sardines in a Crushd Tin Box'', or ''Knives Out''.

Although he performed 'Creep'' live only once I believe. Which honestly I found positively shocking in the way it he did it. I mean the lyrics are so un-Prince in a way (to me) ...

Though he acknowledged the greatness of the song by performing it - true.

As far as Prince's serious self-reflection went for me is ''When Doves Cry'', of which I believe was written to fit the Purple Rain's character and movie story. Correct me if i'm wrong though.

(Also ''Reflection'' had a seldome touch of deep Prince. Anyways...)

For me, Prince was never really deeply self-reflective the way Thom Yorke does in basically all of his (personal) lyrics.

Prince's self-knowledge and self-reflection was often attuned to his faith.

Not to mention the star position he put hmself into.

It is actually very difficult, if not irrelavant, to compare the two artists in that respect.

Musically indeed it is different, where you can draw some comparisons.

All this is my personal opinion of course.

I think these are fair points...which is why when he infrequently said something very personal, it stuck out to me...the passing comment about his mother in Reflection was always one that stuck in my mind. The frrustration of having an older brother 'handsome and tall' on Lady Cab Driver...another one When Doves Cry, I feel was personal...it happened to fit the PR charachter but you know his dad was bold, his mom not satisfied...

He had so many songs that if you pulled together the deeply personal songs, you'd have a great list....Comeback anyone? That's the man's feelings totally left open which surely is why i packaged it away in a 5 disc set never to be heard by most.

Vannormal said:

PJMcGee said:

I don't know. I think Thom owns all those Radiohead songs, including Creep. In part because he's a great singer, but also because he's way more convincing at delivering lines like I'm a creep, I'm a weirdo. He feels and expresses his lyrics like no one else could. Reminds me of the aching sadness of Bonnie Raitt's I Can't Make You Love Me compared to Prince's clueless, seductive interpretation.

I can hardly imagine Thom Yorke writing - let alone singing - songs like;

''My Name Is Prince''

''Baby I'm A Star'',

or Prince writing a song like ''Packt Like Sardines in a Crushd Tin Box'', or ''Knives Out''.

Although he performed 'Creep'' live only once I believe. Which honestly I found positively shocking in the way it he did it. I mean the lyrics are so un-Prince in a way (to me) ...

Though he acknowledged the greatness of the song by performing it - true.

As far as Prince's serious self-reflection went for me is ''When Doves Cry'', of which I believe was written to fit the Purple Rain's character and movie story. Correct me if i'm wrong though.

(Also ''Reflection'' had a seldome touch of deep Prince. Anyways...)

For me, Prince was never really deeply self-reflective the way Thom Yorke does in basically all of his (personal) lyrics.

Prince's self-knowledge and self-reflection was often attuned to his faith.

Not to mention the star position he put hmself into.

It is actually very difficult, if not irrelavant, to compare the two artists in that respect.

Musically indeed it is different, where you can draw some comparisons.

All this is my personal opinion of course.

A bit like Susan Boyle, Thom Yorke is somewhat of a one trick pony. I only say that because having seen Radiohead a couple of times in concert, he sang well enough but didn't switch anything up. Like, it was the same sung style all the way through. The rest of the band looked bored too, which was a shame because they incorporated some proper good dance rhythms to which guitarist jonny greenwood did some novel guitar slaying. Which had me quite in awe, but because it was Radiohead I still ended up leaving the concert feeling depressed.

... I'm alright now tho

fortuneandserendipity said:

Vannormal said:

I can hardly imagine Thom Yorke writing - let alone singing - songs like;

''My Name Is Prince''

''Baby I'm A Star'',

or Prince writing a song like ''Packt Like Sardines in a Crushd Tin Box'', or ''Knives Out''.

Although he performed 'Creep'' live only once I believe. Which honestly I found positively shocking in the way it he did it. I mean the lyrics are so un-Prince in a way (to me) ...

Though he acknowledged the greatness of the song by performing it - true.

As far as Prince's serious self-reflection went for me is ''When Doves Cry'', of which I believe was written to fit the Purple Rain's character and movie story. Correct me if i'm wrong though.

(Also ''Reflection'' had a seldome touch of deep Prince. Anyways...)

For me, Prince was never really deeply self-reflective the way Thom Yorke does in basically all of his (personal) lyrics.

Prince's self-knowledge and self-reflection was often attuned to his faith.

Not to mention the star position he put hmself into.

It is actually very difficult, if not irrelavant, to compare the two artists in that respect.

Musically indeed it is different, where you can draw some comparisons.

All this is my personal opinion of course.

A bit like Susan Boyle, Thom Yorke is somewhat of a one trick pony. I only say that because having seen Radiohead a couple of times in concert, he sang well enough but didn't switch anything up. Like, it was the same sung style all the way through. The rest of the band looked bored too, which was a shame because they incorporated some proper good dance rhythms to which guitarist jonny greenwood did some novel guitar slaying. Which had me quite in awe, but because it was Radiohead I still ended up leaving the concert feeling depressed.

... I'm alright now tho

I wonder if it's just cultural....white bands just don't dance or seem to enjoy as much. It looks that way anyway...like a statue. Take Jeff Beck, Eric Clapton or any other fantastic player (David Gilmour). Each stand still and play guitar. I see Radio head doing the same. Prince would do the same but cover a lot of stage square footage. He was just in a diff league.

JoeyCococo said:

fortuneandserendipity said:

A bit like Susan Boyle, Thom Yorke is somewhat of a one trick pony. I only say that because having seen Radiohead a couple of times in concert, he sang well enough but didn't switch anything up. Like, it was the same sung style all the way through. The rest of the band looked bored too, which was a shame because they incorporated some proper good dance rhythms to which guitarist jonny greenwood did some novel guitar slaying. Which had me quite in awe, but because it was Radiohead I still ended up leaving the concert feeling depressed.

... I'm alright now tho

I wonder if it's just cultural....white bands just don't dance or seem to enjoy as much. It looks that way anyway...like a statue. Take Jeff Beck, Eric Clapton or any other fantastic player (David Gilmour). Each stand still and play guitar. I see Radio head doing the same. Prince would do the same but cover a lot of stage square footage. He was just in a diff league.

Though I know many other black artists who don't move one inch on stage.

Just sayin'. but that's not the point here I believe.

What white folks do (or don't) on stage, is what some black artists do through blues etc.

They inveted it and it was further contaminated throughout the world.

The blues, Cajun, folk, whatever you call it, is and was fantastically beautiful heartfelt and real, a clear cry out.

True, white folks have sort of a different approach to that, but in their own way also brilliantly done.

It's all about how you read it personally. Don't get me wrong, I love both ways enormouly.

The outspoken misunderstood troubled soul vs and the introverted nameless pain, both towards some oblivion where help is far to seek. Love it.

I love both non moving whites and the clearly outspoken blacks (if so).

I just love people showing how to get through things in whatever visual mood. Forget colour.

JoeyCococo said:

fortuneandserendipity said:

A bit like Susan Boyle, Thom Yorke is somewhat of a one trick pony. I only say that because having seen Radiohead a couple of times in concert, he sang well enough but didn't switch anything up. Like, it was the same sung style all the way through. The rest of the band looked bored too, which was a shame because they incorporated some proper good dance rhythms to which guitarist jonny greenwood did some novel guitar slaying. Which had me quite in awe, but because it was Radiohead I still ended up leaving the concert feeling depressed.

... I'm alright now tho

I wonder if it's just cultural....white bands just don't dance or seem to enjoy as much. It looks that way anyway...like a statue. Take Jeff Beck, Eric Clapton or any other fantastic player (David Gilmour). Each stand still and play guitar. I see Radio head doing the same. Prince would do the same but cover a lot of stage square footage. He was just in a diff league.

Beck likes to dance🕺. But is his music as good? I prefer his slower rootsy stuff. Country Phase is decent enough, if a little overproduced. But you just can't dance to that💃. Unless you're a nut. I like to think I'm not.

Not many bands dance to their own music. And shoegaze bands don't even move at all - they gaze at their shoes. Tends to be a more solo artist endeavor then. David Bowie and Todd Rundgren have moves of their own, and they don't typically dance. Even Ray Charles and Stevie Wonder swing, like literally, as only blind people can.

JoeyCococo said:

fortuneandserendipity said:

A bit like Susan Boyle, Thom Yorke is somewhat of a one trick pony. I only say that because having seen Radiohead a couple of times in concert, he sang well enough but didn't switch anything up. Like, it was the same sung style all the way through. The rest of the band looked bored too, which was a shame because they incorporated some proper good dance rhythms to which guitarist jonny greenwood did some novel guitar slaying. Which had me quite in awe, but because it was Radiohead I still ended up leaving the concert feeling depressed.

... I'm alright now tho

I wonder if it's just cultural....white bands just don't dance or seem to enjoy as much. It looks that way anyway...like a statue. Take Jeff Beck, Eric Clapton or any other fantastic player (David Gilmour). Each stand still and play guitar. I see Radio head doing the same. Prince would do the same but cover a lot of stage square footage. He was just in a diff league.

oh thommy dances alright:

https://www.youtube.com/w...fOa1a8hYP8

LILpoundCAKE said:

JoeyCococo said:

I wonder if it's just cultural....white bands just don't dance or seem to enjoy as much. It looks that way anyway...like a statue. Take Jeff Beck, Eric Clapton or any other fantastic player (David Gilmour). Each stand still and play guitar. I see Radio head doing the same. Prince would do the same but cover a lot of stage square footage. He was just in a diff league.

oh thommy dances alright:

https://www.youtube.com/w...fOa1a8hYP8

Yah, kinda like Ian Curtis but more controlled. I really meant on stage though. Prince has no peer in that his moves seem to always fit the music.

fortuneandserendipity said:

LILpoundCAKE said:

oh thommy dances alright:

https://www.youtube.com/w...fOa1a8hYP8

Yah, kinda like Ian Curtis but more controlled. I really meant on stage though. Prince has no peer in that his moves seem to always fit the music.

no I get what you mean, and you're right, prince is always right on with his moves, even if he doesn't strictly dance a lot at times, he still moves in a very fluid way and all his little gestures are right on the beat.

Just now getting into In Rainbows which beats out KID A in my favourite Radiohead albums. I listen to Thom sing Reckoner and I just can not help but think if Prince. I don't know what it is...i'm not musically trained enough to say i but ...some fearlessness or inhibitivie quality is here that Prince always had. Some trust in not sounding like others ...just going for it. Authentic...sincere...words come to mind.

Damn, how did I sleep on these guys...

Nude is also just amazing and I understand, they sat on this song for years? hmm...sounds like a Prince thing to do:)

Music is something to hear and listen to.

Live shows are something to hear and see.

Dancing or not moving mostly is often, not to say completely irrelevant to a performance of the music.

With Prince doing splits and spins and all, you think it make his music better, or it added to the music ?

I wonder...

Vannormal said:

Music is something to hear and listen to.

Live shows are something to hear and see.

Dancing or not moving mostly is often, not to say completely irrelevant to a performance of the music.

With Prince doing splits and spins and all, you think it make his music better, or it added to the music ?

I wonder...

Good point, and I get what you are saying...whether he did the splits or not did nothing for the music BUT, to me, those moves were like visual exclamation points to the music. When he did the moves, he highlighted the music even more. However, to me, he was so at one with his music...so fluid. I absolutely LOVE Radiohead and their new album (The Smile) is blowing me away completely...but Thom Yorke's dancing although fun, makes me think of a dork. Prince was at one with his music. Thom maybe too but...it looks dorky I remember how blown away I was by Mark Knopfler's solo on Sultan's of Swing. I knew/know every lick and thinks he's one of the best ever...but then i saw him doing it live..jogging on the spot, jumping up and down like a kindergarten student, a red jogging bandana on ....a DORK. I vowed to never watch them play again...just listen

The new Smile album A Light For Attracting Attention - wow is it ever great. In the last month, I've taken in:

Kid A

Amnesiac

The Bends

Moon Shaped Pool

In Rainbows

Each have thrilled me totally. Then I hear about a 2nd disc for In Rainbows and it blew me away again! Then to my great surprise, I hear of this new album coming out and I think it is right up their with their best. I haven't started listening to OK Computer, Hail to the THief or Kiing of Limbs. I know OK is widely known to be possibly their best....

The new The Smile album is stuuuuuuuuunnnnning !

Very exciting about this.

I hope they do live shows over here.

And I don 't care if Thom's dance moves are dorky or whatever, I just love the guy !

I do hope he bounced around like a complete fool, also that is rock 'n roll.

Sinds music had become a visual experience where the focus is put on looks and moves and most of all became a pre-teen industry without musical talents ... it all has so become so predictable pre-programmed musical-ish-ness.

But I understand that some think it adds to their musical experience. Whatever. Not mine (at all).

I go for the music, and whatever comes along with a live performance.

just b/c I think Thom and the others are dorky doesn't mean I like the junk that passes as music ...

Prince had it all...a musician of the highest standard, and someone who could put the visual together too...it was a balance for the most part.

Off topic,

Just noticed that Martin Buff the engineer posted on instagram that he's back in the @electricladystudios, ''Seriously walking down the @Prince memory lane with the amazing @sugasteve...'' he said.

What's seriousness is going on there down the Prince memory lane...

Suga Steve may be part of QuestLove's QL Supreme podcast. Maybe Hans is doing an episode.