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Reply #30 posted 12/06/19 3:37pm

udo

avatar

AaronReturn2005 said:

I actually heard infomation about Sony buying Prince's WB catalogue in 2021, excluding Batman (his only "proper" soundtrack) for obv. reasons.

.

Hmmm.

They could redo the PR emaster thingie...

But they should employ Bernie Grundman for that and the Lovesexy deluxe kit.

Pills and thrills and daffodils will kill... If you don't believe me or don't get it, I don't have time to try to convince you, sorry.
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Reply #31 posted 12/06/19 10:17pm

AaronReturn200
5

udo said:

AaronReturn2005 said:

I actually heard infomation about Sony buying Prince's WB catalogue in 2021, excluding Batman (his only "proper" soundtrack) for obv. reasons.

.

Hmmm.

They could redo the PR emaster thingie...

But they should employ Bernie Grundman for that and the Lovesexy deluxe kit.

Doing some research.

"35-album deal"

23 1995-2010 albums have been issued through streaming services by Sony in 2018

The remaining 12 are presuambly all Warner-era "Prince" albums (1978-1996) excluding the four "soundtracks"

However, stuff like HitNRun, ArtOfficialAge and Plectrumelectrum are excluded from the number, and both 2014 albums were issued through Warners and HitNRun should stay on Spotify like it is.

Could that mean it's actually a "40-album deal"?

[Edited 12/7/19 15:25pm]

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Reply #32 posted 12/07/19 8:38am

eugenius

If there's money to be made, yes. Make no mistake -- it's all about money with the estate, not art.

Why is it so difficult to upload an avatar?
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Reply #33 posted 12/07/19 10:44am

geetee71

avatar

FUNKNROLL said:

nayroo2002 said:

At least the 12" of "Lovesexy" should be released.

Thanks smile

Is there a 12" version?

Not seeing anything mentioned at PrinceVault.

.

There was a TV show in the UK in '88 called 'Behind The Beat' that had some footage of Producer Rick Neigher and Engineer Femi Jiya at the desk in Paisley working on a remix of Lovesexy.

.

They were working from a yellow legal pad containing Prince's handwritten instructions for the mix which they showed a partial shot of.

.

I do remember Lovesexy appearing on 'forthcoming' lists (in Record Collector) at the time, but that obviously never happened.

.

.

.

.

.

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Reply #34 posted 12/07/19 11:05am

jfenster

so hopefully Howe will look for this remix

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Reply #35 posted 12/07/19 3:10pm

bonatoc

avatar

The videos should include the Omnibus Documentary uncut.
This thing has lasted for eight minutes for far too long.
I want it all.

The Colors R brighter, the Bond is much tighter
No Child's a failure
Until the Blue Sailboat sails him away from his dreams
Don't Ever Lose, Don't Ever Lose
Don't Ever Lose Your Dreams
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Reply #36 posted 12/07/19 8:39pm

udo

avatar

bonatoc said:


I want it all.

.

yeahthat

Pills and thrills and daffodils will kill... If you don't believe me or don't get it, I don't have time to try to convince you, sorry.
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Reply #37 posted 12/07/19 11:47pm

purplepolitici
an

avatar

Every Lovesexy aftershow released right now please. Thems like the best thing ever in life 🤤. I'll take complete Camden Palace asap then every other 1 I don't know about in a timely manner 😂🙏. N a disc or 3 of outtakes just cuz 😁.
For all time I am with you, you are with me.
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Reply #38 posted 12/07/19 11:55pm

udo

avatar

Would an official 'Paard van Troje' soundboard be acceptable for this set?

(i.e.: not a b00tleg remaster)

Pills and thrills and daffodils will kill... If you don't believe me or don't get it, I don't have time to try to convince you, sorry.
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Reply #39 posted 12/08/19 12:22am

purplepolitici
an

avatar

^ Y not? Its the most infamous n it's been rocking my world the past few days 😍. That should be the DVD though 😁 or 1 of them. All dem aftershows though... now 🤨.
For all time I am with you, you are with me.
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Reply #40 posted 12/08/19 2:13am

udo

avatar

OK..

Hmm.
If the Estate does not like the amount of discs, then a DVD-ROM with FLACs can be OK as well.

Pills and thrills and daffodils will kill... If you don't believe me or don't get it, I don't have time to try to convince you, sorry.
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Reply #41 posted 12/08/19 3:57am

PURPLEIZED3121

I think a deluxe set will struggle for stellar out-take material - the ones I've heard like cross the line etc are fairly weak. If aiming for mass market appeal & good sales I personally would package as follows:

CD 1 - Remastered original album [obviously!]

CD 2 - Singles & 12" mixes & B-Sides

CD 3 - Any of the legenday afreshows

DVD - Remastered TV broadcast gig

The liner notes & photos from this era should in theory be stunning too.

The biggest USP I suspect for us will be hearing seeing the stunning aftershows. If I am not mistaken one of the Washington aftershows is frankly off the bloody scale ! - it's out there on bootleg of course BUT a mass audience will only need to hear one stellar show. So the only realistic way to get the volume out is via online NPG style subscription.

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Reply #42 posted 12/08/19 4:03am

LoveGalore

PURPLEIZED3121 said:

I think a deluxe set will struggle for stellar out-take material - the ones I've heard like cross the line etc are fairly weak. If aiming for mass market appeal & good sales I personally would package as follows:



CD 1 - Remastered original album [obviously!]


CD 2 - Singles & 12" mixes & B-Sides


CD 3 - Any of the legenday afreshows


DVD - Remastered TV broadcast gig



The liner notes & photos from this era should in theory be stunning too.



The biggest USP I suspect for us will be hearing seeing the stunning aftershows. If I am not mistaken one of the Washington aftershows is frankly off the bloody scale ! - it's out there on bootleg of course BUT a mass audience will only need to hear one stellar show. So the only realistic way to get the volume out is via online NPG style subscription.




Actually 1987 and 1988 have tons of killer songs.

It's 1989 and 1990 that are poopyshit.
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Reply #43 posted 12/08/19 5:10am

bonatoc

avatar

Let us not forget that almost all the album exists in alternate takes.

Even Escape has an "Alternate Version" (seems like what ended on the B side was en edit of it) that is better than what was released.

"Eye NO"’s first minimalist incarnation (not referring to "The Ball") is totally worth it, it's funky as hell.
"Positivity" is circulating in several mixes (although I'm not a fan of the Cindy C. rap portion being pasted over it), including a rough one that fits better its purpose and intent, more "violent", in-your-face than the album version.

"Anna Stesia" early incarnation, while not my cup of tea, is interesting if only for the glance it offers into Prince's creative process. It's phenomenal to realize that such a pivotal song could have gone in a different direction.

Oh, and it's about time we get instrumentals.
Although I doubt the Estate would allow them, for fear of savage sampling from hoards of musicians all over the world. But Prince as an arranger is so fascinating, and instrumental versions would emphasize his brillance and inventivity. There's so much going on.

As for the aftershows, of course!
1988 is the apex of Prince as an experimental guitarist.
What I mean by that is that you won't find another era with so much inventivity and risk-taking.
With time, his virtuosity became unstoppable (SNL’s "3121" is another apex), but after Lovesexy he seemed to return to... just being brilliant.

But the Blue Angel solos in "Anna Stesia", "I Wish U Heaven Pt. II", or "The Cross" and "Purple Rain" in Dortmund, or, of course, the Trojan Horse’s "Just My Imagination", "Still Would Stand All Time" and "Rave 2 The Joy Fantastic" have this incomprehensible quality, they shy away from standard harmony rules, they're incredibly expressive, emotive and riveting, and they're more trueful to Jazz than all the Montreux in the world.


[Edited 12/8/19 5:12am]

The Colors R brighter, the Bond is much tighter
No Child's a failure
Until the Blue Sailboat sails him away from his dreams
Don't Ever Lose, Don't Ever Lose
Don't Ever Lose Your Dreams
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Reply #44 posted 12/08/19 7:30pm

RobertDitz

Are there any liner notes circulating (from the Lovesexy era)
<3
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Reply #45 posted 12/08/19 10:14pm

udo

avatar

At http://princevault.com/in...1980)#1988 I see 11 gigs that could count as `aftershows` and such.

I see over 75 concerts at http://princevault.com/in...esexy_Tour

Hmm.

What will they choose?

Will they ever see a market for CD's of all live shows?

.

.

.

.

[Edited 12/8/19 22:21pm]

Pills and thrills and daffodils will kill... If you don't believe me or don't get it, I don't have time to try to convince you, sorry.
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Reply #46 posted 12/09/19 4:21pm

ufoclub

avatar

bonatoc said:

Let us not forget that almost all the album exists in alternate takes.

Even Escape has an "Alternate Version" (seems like what ended on the B side was en edit of it) that is better than what was released.

"Eye NO"’s first minimalist incarnation (not referring to "The Ball") is totally worth it, it's funky as hell.
"Positivity" is circulating in several mixes (although I'm not a fan of the Cindy C. rap portion being pasted over it), including a rough one that fits better its purpose and intent, more "violent", in-your-face than the album version.

"Anna Stesia" early incarnation, while not my cup of tea, is interesting if only for the glance it offers into Prince's creative process. It's phenomenal to realize that such a pivotal song could have gone in a different direction.

Oh, and it's about time we get instrumentals.
Although I doubt the Estate would allow them, for fear of savage sampling from hoards of musicians all over the world. But Prince as an arranger is so fascinating, and instrumental versions would emphasize his brillance and inventivity. There's so much going on.

As for the aftershows, of course!
1988 is the apex of Prince as an experimental guitarist.
What I mean by that is that you won't find another era with so much inventivity and risk-taking.
With time, his virtuosity became unstoppable (SNL’s "3121" is another apex), but after Lovesexy he seemed to return to... just being brilliant.

But the Blue Angel solos in "Anna Stesia", "I Wish U Heaven Pt. II", or "The Cross" and "Purple Rain" in Dortmund, or, of course, the Trojan Horse’s "Just My Imagination", "Still Would Stand All Time" and "Rave 2 The Joy Fantastic" have this incomprehensible quality, they shy away from standard harmony rules, they're incredibly expressive, emotive and riveting, and they're more trueful to Jazz than all the Montreux in the world.


[Edited 12/8/19 5:12am]

I've never heard of this alternate AnnaStesia

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Reply #47 posted 12/09/19 6:43pm

Moonbeam

avatar

Check it out here: https://www.youtube.com/w...FR7PjPfH5M

It's really nice, IMO!

ufoclub said:

bonatoc said:

Let us not forget that almost all the album exists in alternate takes.

Even Escape has an "Alternate Version" (seems like what ended on the B side was en edit of it) that is better than what was released.

"Eye NO"’s first minimalist incarnation (not referring to "The Ball") is totally worth it, it's funky as hell.
"Positivity" is circulating in several mixes (although I'm not a fan of the Cindy C. rap portion being pasted over it), including a rough one that fits better its purpose and intent, more "violent", in-your-face than the album version.

"Anna Stesia" early incarnation, while not my cup of tea, is interesting if only for the glance it offers into Prince's creative process. It's phenomenal to realize that such a pivotal song could have gone in a different direction.

Oh, and it's about time we get instrumentals.
Although I doubt the Estate would allow them, for fear of savage sampling from hoards of musicians all over the world. But Prince as an arranger is so fascinating, and instrumental versions would emphasize his brillance and inventivity. There's so much going on.

As for the aftershows, of course!
1988 is the apex of Prince as an experimental guitarist.
What I mean by that is that you won't find another era with so much inventivity and risk-taking.
With time, his virtuosity became unstoppable (SNL’s "3121" is another apex), but after Lovesexy he seemed to return to... just being brilliant.

But the Blue Angel solos in "Anna Stesia", "I Wish U Heaven Pt. II", or "The Cross" and "Purple Rain" in Dortmund, or, of course, the Trojan Horse’s "Just My Imagination", "Still Would Stand All Time" and "Rave 2 The Joy Fantastic" have this incomprehensible quality, they shy away from standard harmony rules, they're incredibly expressive, emotive and riveting, and they're more trueful to Jazz than all the Montreux in the world.


[Edited 12/8/19 5:12am]

I've never heard of this alternate AnnaStesia

Feel free to join in the Prince Album Poll 2018! Let'a celebrate his legacy by counting down the most beloved Prince albums, as decided by you!
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Reply #48 posted 12/09/19 7:12pm

ufoclub

avatar

Moonbeam said:

Check it out here: https://www.youtube.com/w...FR7PjPfH5M

It's really nice, IMO!

ufoclub said:

I've never heard of this alternate AnnaStesia

oh... ha... it has come to that point in life where you are old anough and have hundreds upon hundreds of outtakes that you forget... yes, I have this somewhere. From last years leaks. I have heard the adiditonal lyrics and everything.

It is very cool.

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Reply #49 posted 12/10/19 7:51am

emesem

Would love to see them try.

LoveSexy was the first Prince album mastered digitially I believe. (rather than analogue first then converted). I believe the sound suffered for it.

The multiple layers of vocals and instrument choices probably didnt help.

THis and Batman sound pretty bad in retrospect. D&P and onwards the sound got a little more organic but never really felt quite as real as the pre-88 albums.

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Reply #50 posted 12/13/19 2:15pm

dualboot

avatar

i am afraad it Will be a clipping galore on lthe song ovesexy.

Will come with a dress-your-prince cardboard where you actually can put Him Some clothes on.

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Reply #51 posted 12/15/19 9:21am

RobertDitz

dualboot said:

i am afraad it Will be a clipping galore on lthe song ovesexy.



Will come with a dress-your-prince cardboard where you actually can put Him Some clothes on.




I would blaspheme those mothers if they do that.

That makes me wondering, would they be afraid to put it our because of the nudity? Well, some hesitation maybe?
<3
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Reply #52 posted 12/15/19 10:21am

leadline

avatar

Does it really need one? I have always been happy with the audio on that album. Plus, every remaster has been botched in one way or another so far. Lovesexy specifically would be a very touchy album to remaster correctly, I doubt highly anyone would get it right.

I will just accept Lovesexy and most other albums as is, the sound is representative of how Prince layed it all out at that specific time, and much like the music, the mix itself can be appreciated in its historical context as well.

"You always get the dream that you deserve, from what you value the most" -Prince 2013
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Reply #53 posted 12/17/19 3:41pm

bonatoc

avatar

emesem said:

Would love to see them try.

LoveSexy was the first Prince album mastered digitially I believe. (rather than analogue first then converted). I believe the sound suffered for it.

The multiple layers of vocals and instrument choices probably didnt help.

THis and Batman sound pretty bad in retrospect. D&P and onwards the sound got a little more organic but never really felt quite as real as the pre-88 albums.


It always boils down to the shitty digital conversion that flattened everything on the CD's.

I have fond memories of Lovesexy and Batman on analog supports.
Prince's music in the eighties was made for analog mastering, and I think Bernie Grundman nailed what Prince was all about, pushing the needles in the red.

But there's some truth about Lovesexy. Even if you get your hands an .flac files from analog sources, you need to pump out the bass an unusual amount to bring back the warmth.

But stay away from the CD's. They're a massacre.

The Colors R brighter, the Bond is much tighter
No Child's a failure
Until the Blue Sailboat sails him away from his dreams
Don't Ever Lose, Don't Ever Lose
Don't Ever Lose Your Dreams
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Reply #54 posted 01/02/20 10:02am

FUNKNROLL

bonatoc said:

emesem said:

Would love to see them try.

LoveSexy was the first Prince album mastered digitially I believe. (rather than analogue first then converted). I believe the sound suffered for it.

The multiple layers of vocals and instrument choices probably didnt help.

THis and Batman sound pretty bad in retrospect. D&P and onwards the sound got a little more organic but never really felt quite as real as the pre-88 albums.


It always boils down to the shitty digital conversion that flattened everything on the CD's.

I have fond memories of Lovesexy and Batman on analog supports.
Prince's music in the eighties was made for analog mastering, and I think Bernie Grundman nailed what Prince was all about, pushing the needles in the red.

But there's some truth about Lovesexy. Even if you get your hands an .flac files from analog sources, you need to pump out the bass an unusual amount to bring back the warmth.

But stay away from the CD's. They're a massacre.

Thanks for sharing this. I've struggled to explain how the quality of sound recording, not just the music, affected my enjoyment. Prince aside, it seems like the mid to late seventies was a sweet spot for studio recordings. Most have a depth, warmth, and separation of instruments that inspires me to imagine being in the room with the band. I'm clearly not a sound engineer but that all seems to have gone away in the 80s.

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Reply #55 posted 01/03/20 12:09am

lavendardrumma
chine

They remaster everything at some point if people are buying them, but I think once you get to Lovesexy, it's less about the mix and more about the Deluxe box and extra releases. Lovesexy was recorded at Paisley Park (I think the first full album recorded there?) and Prince had good equipment with no restrictions taking all the time he wanted mixing it. Unless he left behind marked up notes of things that bothered him, or someone knows he would have wanted the benefits of digital technology, or had issues with the mastering process, it gets into an ethical issue. Didn't Prince regard it as a masterpiece? I don't know, it's not my favorite of his, but it still seems wrong. Have at it with Batman or Grafiti Bridge though.

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Reply #56 posted 01/03/20 5:37am

SquirrelMeat

avatar

AaronReturn2005 said:

LoveGalore said:

AaronReturn2005 said: Uhhhh, it is listed on PR Deluxe as 7" b side edit. Lol.

I was simply saying that the Erotic City 7" mix should've been listed as "Erotic City (Make Love Not War Make Erotic City Come Alive) (7" B-Side Edit)" cause it was mentioned as such on the original LGC 7", but then the 12" version counts as either a regular "Extended Version" or have the same subtitle as the A-side...



If we are getting picky, the full copyrighted title of '17 Days' is '17 Days (the rain will come down, then U will have 2 choose. If U believe look 2 the dawn and U shall never lose)', but they missed it off some of the printing too.

.
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Reply #57 posted 01/03/20 1:39pm

jfenster

people willl be dead by then

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Reply #58 posted 01/04/20 3:43am

bonatoc

avatar

jfenster said:

people willl be dead by then


Positivity, yes?

The Colors R brighter, the Bond is much tighter
No Child's a failure
Until the Blue Sailboat sails him away from his dreams
Don't Ever Lose, Don't Ever Lose
Don't Ever Lose Your Dreams
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Reply #59 posted 01/04/20 5:42am

bonatoc

avatar

lavendardrummachine said:

They remaster everything at some point if people are buying them, but I think once you get to Lovesexy, it's less about the mix and more about the Deluxe box and extra releases. Lovesexy was recorded at Paisley Park (I think the first full album recorded there?) and Prince had good equipment with no restrictions taking all the time he wanted mixing it. Unless he left behind marked up notes of things that bothered him, or someone knows he would have wanted the benefits of digital technology, or had issues with the mastering process, it gets into an ethical issue. Didn't Prince regard it as a masterpiece? I don't know, it's not my favorite of his, but it still seems wrong. Have at it with Batman or Grafiti Bridge though.


biggrin

I assume you know how Prince worked on a daily basis?
Restrictions, we know they were self-imposed,
even when the song was incredible.

Oh, set the mix on the Studio A SSL,
I would play with it for hours (hint, Estate, hint).
Leave just the horns and bass, solo the "BKG VCS",
we could play for days.

Lovesexy took a month,
Prince was handling business,
just launched the complex officially,
managed the protégés (hum),
wrote B-sides,
outtakes,
extendeds,
envisioned the Tour,
the clothes,
started organising The Vault (hum),
Paisley Park as a video facility shooting for The Muppets, I have Muppets in here?,
Got over a breakdown,
Got over Sheila,
Took (and pissing off) WB, the media and all the fans by surprise (who remembers the reviews published? The Black Album was announced and reviewed in selected magazines),
Got some (natural? Divine?) high from the whole anaesthetic experience,
a home in Paris,
Anna Fantastic
and All That Funk.


I don't think Prince took his time.
More like he grabbed it by the throat in 1988.
Seems like you need a tour on the BBC Omnibus.


Ethical Schmetical.
Lovesexy needs a remix à la AOA. Some digital pump.
A remix AND a remaster.

The problem since Lovesexy, is that Prince mixed like everyone had Genelecs at home.
Albums became "headphones only" albums.
Anyone who listened to Prince with a decent late eighties walkman knows what I mean.
Or with the proper headphones and amp, or a bitchy hi-fi system, in the living room.


Really listening to Prince is expensive, and LOVESEXY is, for the hear to concentrate on all the incredible overdubs, dubs, hip-hop cuts, beat-breaks, tempo changes, cold new wave sounds, warm fat bass rolls (push it up) happening all the time.
Jumping atcha.

Under perfect listening conditions, pick an instrument
and try to focus on just that one all through "Alphabet St.".
You can't. Progressing through the album it gets more expensive,
Prince gets emotional on top of it all.

"Anna Stesia" may be one complex arrangement ecstasy after the other,
they don't beat The Naked Man crying on top of his lungs,
no chorus nor reverb, cords and heart both breaking.

The 3 "Maybe" descent, it lasts a second, but it's all in there.
But it's also in everything happening around (the Blue Angel is a big deal here).

And it's the song which brings the darkness in,
another "YES" song and the album's gonna end sounding
like one naive epiphany after the other.

It's the first song where Prince shouts a blatant "Eye don't NO",
and boy as a fan you would think Prince was many beings,
but not someone going through life with uncertainties,
or without wearing the cocky self-assurance patch since Purple Rain.

A desperate "I don't know" on a joyful album that started
barely twenty minutes ago with "I know".


It takes balls to lay your own distress on tape like this.
The Seduction of Darkness,
the Redeeming of Love/Light,
and all that Blue Angel.

But also the lyrics.
And that firecamp end refrain.
And what's going on underneath that firecamp refrain.

Ten seconds of Leeds and Bliss over congas,
with a fuzzed guitar that mimicks steel drums,
is enough to make Lovesexy a masterpiece.
Every musical idea is exquisite.
It would be a blast to have all the instrumentals
in the Deluxe box. This is not music, this is a trip.
I love Prince's voice. This is the album when he's in full posession of all of his powas.
But I also want to feel the jazz of the whole thing.

So many layers, and meticulous constructions, which, paradoxically, happened live with himself.
You would think all of this gets written on a 16 bar sheets, and yes, in the end, it was so transcribed for the musicians so they could rehearse.

But no musician gets it easy thinking Prince got that fine an arranger by playing live takes only.
Lovesexy sounds so carefully arranged, every arranger imagines himself taking days to refine a riff.
But for Prince, it happens live. It may take more than one take, but it's just there in his head, he's going to approximate it, maybe nail something else, but he's not gonna seat at a piano and try shit. He's done for years that by 1988.


Really listening to Prince is a luck affair, and Lovesexy is, for the kids of the eighties whose parents buyed brand new seventies hi-fi systems in the best decade for high fidelity sound throughout the whole audio chain, from the console to your living-room speakers.

Because parents bought it, but never touched it, they were mostly in pristine state.
Generation X usually had Prince in 3D at home.
And then in the nineties, some intern butcher appears outta nowhere,
and The Mangler flattens poor Prince and his first decade albums,
taking all the juice out of it. Getting Prince some "meh" reaction whenever
you try to convince someone with a Prince's CD.

Prince got so pissed, he pushed the Loudness Wars to 11.
The Gold Experience and Exodus, the whole Dawn project,
is screaming "that's not how I sound!".

But I digress.



"Graffiti Bridge" had an incredible sound. It has aged.
But in context, when it came out, it was still one of the more
interesting, punchy, riveting sounds around.
Prince never lost his sonic edge. It changed radically,
that's why it's hard to be a consistent fan.
You have to accept the metamorphoses.

But New Jack has aged badly.


But I digress.

[Edited 1/4/20 12:42pm]

The Colors R brighter, the Bond is much tighter
No Child's a failure
Until the Blue Sailboat sails him away from his dreams
Don't Ever Lose, Don't Ever Lose
Don't Ever Lose Your Dreams
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Forums > Prince: Music and More > Will we have Lovesexy remastered someday?