Free2BMe said:

Wolfie87 said:

Yeah, and what's your fans reactions when Prince is mentioned in a MJ forum? Not that flattering I would think. Shit, I would imagine you guys putting Madonna in a higher regard on a MJ forum, just to deminish Prince's legacy. I've seen YouTube comments. A sad state of affairs.

The reaction from MJ fans about Prince on the MJ forums that I visit is all about respect. Even if they are not fans of Prince, they don’t degrade or demean him, as Prince fans do MJ. When Prince died I didn’t see a single MJ fan act with glee, mock him or celebrate his death. It was the exact opposite on this forum and other Prince forums. Prince fans were actually cheering and jumping for joy when Michael died. Ironically, I guess these same people actually thought that Prince would live forever. It is wrong to wish the worst on another person, when it could happen to your favorite artist. I have always been honest and said that I respect Prince as a musician,but I have never been a fan. However, since his death, I have become more interested in his music. That’s the difference between MJ and Prince fans, we don’t HAVE to demean Prince in order to build Michael up. We don’t feel threatened by his success, as Prince fans are. Madonna fans have always been the same way. They feel they have to tear down Michael. I think that is not only immature, but ignorant and insecure as well.

Yes, this is true. As special as Michael Jackson fans are, I think they've long stopped pitting Prince and Michael against each other. It all just seems a bit tired now.

Mikado said:

Wolfie87 said:

Yeah, and what's your fans reactions when Prince is mentioned in a MJ forum? Not that flattering I would think. Shit, I would imagine you guys putting Madonna in a higher regard on a MJ forum, just to deminish Prince's legacy.

I don't know about that. For the most part, at least at MJJC which the only one I've looked at, I don't see much negativity about Prince (or any other artists, unless they've said something anti-Michael like Gene Simmons). Some might say Prince's music is too dirty for them or that playing instruments doesn't automatically make his music better. There's even a thread about making the Bad album with Prince songs. The other siblings, including Janet, and Papa Joe get more negative talk. But not for their music per se. A lot of the people there don't even look at the non-Mike music section, it's pretty dead. I think most of the people there doesn't know Prince's music at all to comment on it one way or the other. I guess they're from countries where Prince doesn't get a lot of radio airplay. Some don't even know the J5 or Jacksons records or like Off The Wall. I figure they're younger pop or adult contemporary music fans and not R&B, rap, or rock fans. The types who would like the kinds of songs Diane Warren writes. I know one poster in which Mike is the only non-Bollywood singer she listens to. Which is why some like Heal The World and Little Susie over anything from Off The Wall and some don't like The Lady In My Life and call it "filler". It seems that most posting there have grown up with 1990s or 2000s music. They weren't born when Thriller & Bad was originally released. The 1990s is when Prince was losing mainstream popularity, so I would understand them not knowing much about Prince.

Because, first and foremost, he is The Artist, .

And great Artists don't always have the widest appeal, but to people who get their art they are everything.

MickyDolenz said:

skywalker said:

kingricefan said:

You do realize that all a 'singer-songwriter-dancer' has to do is change one little teeny tiny word in a song that has been written by someone else specifically for said 'singer-songwriter-dancer' and they get credit for being a writer/co-writer of a song. Or they have in a contract that their name is always applied to song writing credit of any song released by a band, such as John Lennon getting co-writing credit for a song that was only written by paul McCartney. So calling someone a songwriter doesn't really have much weight to it. I'm not bashing Michael here, just adding a different perspective to your arguement.

Hmm. Which legacy would you choose? A. Arguably, the most popular entertainer/musician that ever lived (with the sales stats to prove it) also widely regarded as a child molester. - B. A guy from Minneapolis that is generally considered to be a musical genius and the most talented musician of his (arguably any) generation. Also widely regarded to be overly sexual, religious, flamboyant, weird, mysterious, independent, and rude. - Don’t get me wrong, I love MJ...but the pissing contest needs to stop. Chris Rock said it best: Prince won. Michael Jackson died chasing one of Prince’s records and as a shell of his former self. [Edited 7/12/19 18:43pm]

do you realise that there is difference between what the media say and what the general public thinks?

if MJ was widely viewed around the world as a child molester,i am sure that people would have muted or canceled him

but the exact opposite happened even after this movie

his numbers on streaming platforms increased and are still increasing

people around the world(europe,asia,africa,south america,north america) paid tribute to him

his show is still selling

and there is no contest between them because right now their legacies are not on the same level

MJ's music is more listened on streaming platforms than Prince altough MJ died before Prince and even with all the negarive press

Prince was great and was a genius but to say that MJ is just known as the most popular entertainer that ever lived is a lie...MJ is known as an artist who made great music and has one the best music catalog in the popülar music that is why on Spotify,Deezer,etc..he is in top 3 of the most listened legacy acts on streaming platforms..he was number one but Queen surpassed him due to the movie

if he was just a dancer,i don't think people would have streamed or bought his albums like they did

on Spotify his albums are among the most streamed albums before 2000

i don't think you need to downplay MJ in order to elevate Prince

This thread seems to be more MJ based than it is Prince based.

Prince was a bit too eclectic for most people (talking about the majority of the population, not Prince fans). They only know the HITS, the top stuff from the mid 1980s.

It's been 35 years since Purple Rain, and in that time Prince has steadily declined. I doubt anyone off the street can name a Prince song from the last 10, 20, or maybe even 30 years!

Granted, I doubt anyone could name an MJ song from Invincible, Michael or Xscape either. They'd sure as hell know Thriller, Bad and Dangerous though.

Free2BMe said:

Very astute observation. However, there are old school R&B MJ fans like me who are mature enough to respect Prince’s talent; but are huge MJ fans. We have never been in that pathetic and ignorant group of people who demean and diminish Prince to build Michael up. That’s the way it has always been since the beginning. The only time you will hear a MJ fan speak badly about another artist is if they have said or done something to Michael personally. That had not been the case with Prince fans and Madonna fans. Those fans are extremely hateful and vicious against Michael, the person. There is a difference between not liking a person’s music, but these people have a vendetta against MJ and it is disgusting and ignorant on their part. I am pleased that you had the decency and COURAGE to tell the truth about what you have observed about the majority of MJ fans. That is truly refreshing!!

I doubt most fans even look or post on a fansite, especially the older ones who are more likely to know the music of The Jacksons or the J5. The posters on the fansite are younger, just like the newer artists on Youtube are more likely to get higher views than an older one. For the most part, Top 40 radio has always been about a young adult and teen audience. So is mainstream entertainment in general since rock n roll blew up in the late 1950s and more so today. There'a a lot of people who have never lived in a world where hip hop hasn't existed or there wasn't an internet & when there were phone booths everywhere. There's less likely to be a Murder She Wrote or Matlock type show on NBC, ABC, & CBS. Clint Eastwood is the only actor of his generation whose movies (that he acts in) still make a lot of money at the box office. Almost much everything else really popular is Disney. But I don't think it's just negative here, trolls are everywhere. Some newspaper/magazine sites don't let people comment or they screen them. It's like the Big Boi verse on OutKast's Hollywood Divorce. The comments on the Michael Jackson VEVO on Youtube were cut off for a long time. Or look at Lipstick Alley.

Se7en said:

It's been 35 years since Purple Rain, and in that time Prince has steadily declined. I doubt anyone off the street can name a Prince song from the last 10, 20, or maybe even 30 years!

Granted, I doubt anyone could name an MJ song from Invincible, Michael or Xscape either. They'd sure as hell know Thriller, Bad and Dangerous though.

That depends on who you ask. If a person listened to R&B radio in the USA at the time, they'll know Butterflies if nothing else. Butterflies is still played on adult R&B stations to this day. The mainstream audience probably won't know it though.

MickyDolenz said:

Free2BMe said:

RJOrion said:

Prince vs Michael Jackson

round 356,444

Yep, and it always seems to start with Prince fans bringing up or demeaning Michael in a thread that’s originally supposed to be about Prince’s legacy. Strange isn’t it.
[Edited 7/12/19 22:05pm]

Se7en said:

RJOrion said:

LOL...but Thriller and Bad are over 30 years old...and Dangerous is over 25 years old... i dont know what "people in the street" youre referring to, but "people in the streets" where im from, can name several more recent Prince songs... Breakfast Can Wait, Baltimore, 1,000 Xs & Os, This Could Be Us....all these songs got regular airplay...and some still do on urban radio formats...Prince's so called declining popularity was NOT a universal thing...maybe certain demographics lost interest in Prince, but not everybody ... be clear

I haven't heard a new Prince song on any local radio stations past Musicology, R&B or otherwise. The last time I heard a new Prince song on Top 40 radio was The Most Beautiful Girl In The World. Some of those songs I don't know because I haven't heard a Prince album past the one only sold at Target. I don't know about any of the online only stuff either. I've heard Breakfast Can Wait because I saw the video on Youtube, the rest I don't know.

The op is also trolling the Prince forum on LSA, so doing nothing except shit-stirring.

RJOrion said:

Free2BMe said:

Yep, and it always seems to start with Prince fans bringing up or demeaning Michael in a thread that’s originally supposed to be about Prince’s legacy. Strange isn’t it. [Edited 7/12/19 22:05pm]

its really not strange at all though... even while they were alive, the two men were SUPER competitive and very aware and conscious of each other's position in the game... underneath the competitiveness there was a mutual respect and admiration for each other's work...Prince definitely looked up to MJ early in his career, and MJ definitely felt somewhat challenged and possibly threatened by Prince's emerging popularity...so for both fanbases to go at each other constantly, its just a reflection and an extension of the competitiveness they had towards each other...and even though they are two of my favorite musical artists of all time, im here for every round of it... and by the way....PRINCE WON😎

Mumio said:

The op is also trolling the Prince forum on LSA, so doing nothing except shit-stirring.

We seem to have a lot of those on here.

MickyDolenz said:

RJOrion said:

top 40 is not the only radio format though...its extremely limited...the name itself "top40" is indicative of those limitations... thats a very narrow demographic thats listens to, or follows "top40" lists anymore...there are literally millions of people who dont follow or prescribe to "top40" listed music

Top 40 has the largest amount of listeners though which results in higher sales or for today the highest streams. The other formats are for niche audiences. Taylor Swift sells more than acts played on a blues, a jazz, or a Tejano radio station. It's called mainstream for a reason. They buy the most records, buy the most movie tickets, and give the highest ratings for TV shows. Like The Cosby Show & Family Matters had mainstream audiences, not just a primarily black audience. Eddie Murphy had a mainstream audience, but Rudy Ray Moore had mostly a black audience. Which one made more money and got more media coverage? It's no accident that performers tried to crossover to Top 40. If Michael Jackson was only depending on the sales of the R&B only audience Thriller would have never gotten nowhere near the sales it got. Same for Lionel Richie, Billy Ocean, Whitney Houston, Bobby Brown, TLC, & others who had Top 40 success. They would have sold as well as Teddy Pendergrass or somebody and their albums would probably be out of print now except for Greatest Hits/Best Of. Same with country singers like Kenny Rogers & Shania Twain or smooth jazz like George Benson, Herb Alpert, & Kenny G. Glam metal bands like Mötley Crüe sold more in the 1980s than regular metal bands, because regular heavy metal didn't get Top 40 airplay. All of these acts sold more once they got the mainstream audience, same for disco in the 1970s. The major labels didn't spend the same amount of money to promote the non-Top 40 genres. If you look at the top 20 of the biggest selling acts in history, the majority are white male rock acts because that is what was given the most promotional dollars and the audience for rock was bigger than for country, R&B, and other sub genres. Even today it is classic rock artists who generally make the most touring like Rolling Stones, U2, Eagles, Paul McCartney, & Bon Jovi. They don't have to do package shows like veteran R&B acts either. Now rap is the most popular in the mainstream, so that is what the most money is spent on now.

It's his own fault for denying his music videos/songs to the world when people didn't care for physical media. I think his numbers ARE amazing considering the fact he joined Spotify, Youtube and most popular platforms after dying.

MickyDolenz said:

RJOrion said:

youre moving the goalposts and changing the premise of the discussion i was having regarding Prince vs MJ... someone said "people on the street" cant name any recent Prince songs and offered up Bad, Dangerous, and Thriller, and then Butterflies and Rock My World to support their debate...i offered that "people in the streets" that I drive, DO know recent Prince songs...to be clearer, just because the majority white and european descendants have lost interest in Prince over the years, doesnt account for the millions of black and brown people and the urban media formats that still play his music and remain followers and purveyors of his recent material...just because mainstream top40 formats which are supported by major labels and their distributors, support mostly white pop/rock artists, it doesnt change the fact that Prince still has a consistent loyal following on black or urban media formats, moreso recently than MJ whose music has been almost blackballed in some places since the pedophilia charges came to light...lets not act like the white gatekeepers of the industry or the white fans are the judge and jury when it comes to Prince's enduring legacy...by putting so much emphasis on top40, youre eliminating millions of people who dont, or no longer pay attention to, or listen to mainstream top40 lists...and that doesnt mean its relegated to "niche" subgenres either...

I changed nothing. I said in the first place that I haven't heard new Prince music after the Musicology album on any local R&B stations. I told the other poster that R&B radio played Mike's Butterflies, but Top 40 didn't. The local Adult R&B station plays a lot of Charlie Wilson new music, he's been constant since his comeback. But the Adult R&B station also play some of the artists from the main R&B/hip hop stations like Ella Mai & those Bruno Mars/Cardi B duets plus a few AC singers like Sam Smith & Adele. Maybe they played new Prince where you live, but not where I live. The local Adult R&B & the soul oldies station play zydeco & southern soul artists too, but I don't think they're played nationwide. Where I live they've never stopped playing Mike's music on any station that was playing him before including the Top 40 oldies station which plays 70s, 80s, 90s, and a few hits from the early 2000s.

RJOrion said:

Free2BMe said:

RJOrion said:

youre moving the goalposts and changing the premise of the discussion i was having regarding Prince vs MJ... someone said "people on the street" cant name any recent Prince songs and offered up Bad, Dangerous, and Thriller, and then Butterflies and Rock My World to support their debate...i offered that "people in the streets" that I drive, DO know recent Prince songs...to be clearer, just because the majority white and european descendants have lost interest in Prince over the years, doesnt account for the millions of black and brown people and the urban media formats that still play his music and remain followers and purveyors of his recent material...just because mainstream top40 formats which are supported by major labels and their distributors, support mostly white pop/rock artists, it doesnt change the fact that Prince still has a consistent loyal following on black or urban media formats, moreso recently than MJ whose music has been almost blackballed in some places since the pedophilia charges came to light...lets not act like the white gatekeepers of the industry or the white fans are the judge and jury when it comes to Prince's enduring legacy...by putting so much emphasis on top40, youre eliminating millions of people who dont, or no longer pay attention to, or listen to mainstream top40 lists...and that doesnt mean its relegated to "niche" subgenres either...

Sorry to disappoint you, but Michael has not been banned, muted or cancelled. On the streets that I drive, I hear MJ even more than ever since the fraudomentary came out. I know the sycophants are angry their agenda did not work.

RJOrion said:

Free2BMe said:

Sorry to disappoint you, but Michael has not been banned, muted or cancelled. On the streets that I drive, I hear MJ even more than ever since the fraudomentary came out. I know the sycophants are angry their agenda did not work.

im not disappointed at all...i love Michael Jackson music...but dont act like Dangerous, History and Blood On The Dance floor wasnt being pulled from the shelves and from rotations in many places...look it up... you always act like im attacking Mike in some kinda way... AGAIN he and Prince are my favorite solo music acts...of ALL time... i just think Prince is the more complete, total artist...no shade on Michael, but for some reason when people obsessed with MJ hear or see that, they get all in their feelings and lash out like giant toddlers... its hilarious at this point...

MJ was ALWAYS looking to see what Prince(r.i.p.) was doing...

Free2BMe said:

ChocolateBox3121 said:

MJ was ALWAYS looking to see what Prince(r.i.p.) was doing...

Jealous of that Academy Award son!

ChocolateBox3121 said:

RJOrion said:

ChocolateBox3121 said:

MJ was ALWAYS looking to see what Prince(r.i.p.) was doing...

You think that Prince wasn't doing the same thing?

[Edited 7/13/19 23:13pm]