databank said:

OK, thx It's really cool that you bothered to check that out.

.

So it's not a computer problem: we have definite proof that there are two different original US printings of Rave. Discogs only shows one so I suspect they have the same catalogue number and are undistinguisable from each other except for the tracks themselves. I assume your cat. number is 07822-14624-2 as should be?

.

I suspect it could be a misprint and not something intentional that would have been changed later, since apparently both versions were available from day 1. But if so, I'm a bit confused as to how this could have happened and why only some CD's were affected. Does anyone know about the pressing factories in the US? Do major labels usually press CD's in a single factory for the whole country or can it happen that a single release is being produced in various locations at the same time? Is there any other way 2 versions of a single release can be different?

.

Again, thx for your help if you can help.

Yes, my catalog number is 07822-14624-2. The bottom center of the disc indicates that it was pressed by Sonopress USA.

.

I don't know if this is worth mentioning, but on the spine of my jewel case above the catalog number are supposed to be the words "DIGITAL STEREO," except in my case it's misspelled as "DIGITAG GTGRGO."

.

Does anyone else's spine have this glaring error? Is it on every single copy of Rave? Does anyone's have "DIGITAL STEREO" spelled correctly? Could it possibly be that the 8-second segue variant is limited to sets that also have the typo? The plot thickens...

I think this thread has fried my brain.

Just checked my Rave CD and actually feel disapointed that my segue is only 4 seconds long!

thievesinthetemple said:

AhPook said:

thievesinthetemple said: That’s the one...

I used to shop there all the time back in the 1990s. I bought my copy of Exodus from there, as well as a copy of the Ingrid Chavez album from the cutout bin.

That's funny. I bought Exodus from there too, and The Vault... Old Friends for Sale.

Woah- this is blowing my mind.

I just checked my copy of it and yes, I do have 8 seconds of silence instead of four. Mine also says "DIGITAG GTGAGO" on the spine. I got it used at half price books in Minnesota, which isn't very helpful...

sexton said:

databank said:

Yes. I've orgnoted KingSausage and DevotedPuppy, hopefully they can tell us where they got their copies. And hopefully other owners of this version will show up in the thread. Infos about whether albums are often printed in one or several factories in the US would also help a lot. It could also be that if it all came from the same factory the first batch was a misprint and they though no one will notice such a little thing so let's just ship them anyway and correct it from the next batch onwards. I'm just theorizing out loud here, I have no clue what happened.

I've met DevotedPuppy. She lives in New York. So do I and I did check my CD rip in iTunes last night and the first segue is 0:08. I'm almost positive I bought my CD at a store in New York too. Maybe the Virgin megastore or Tower Records.

Thx

Florida, NY, California, maybe DC: it was everywhere

thievesinthetemple said:

databank said:

OK, thx It's really cool that you bothered to check that out.

.

So it's not a computer problem: we have definite proof that there are two different original US printings of Rave. Discogs only shows one so I suspect they have the same catalogue number and are undistinguisable from each other except for the tracks themselves. I assume your cat. number is 07822-14624-2 as should be?

.

I suspect it could be a misprint and not something intentional that would have been changed later, since apparently both versions were available from day 1. But if so, I'm a bit confused as to how this could have happened and why only some CD's were affected. Does anyone know about the pressing factories in the US? Do major labels usually press CD's in a single factory for the whole country or can it happen that a single release is being produced in various locations at the same time? Is there any other way 2 versions of a single release can be different?

.

Again, thx for your help if you can help.

Yes, my catalog number is 07822-14624-2. The bottom center of the disc indicates that it was pressed by Sonopress USA.

.

I don't know if this is worth mentioning, but on the spine of my jewel case above the catalog number are supposed to be the words "DIGITAL STEREO," except in my case it's misspelled as "DIGITAG GTGRGO."

.

Does anyone else's spine have this glaring error? Is it on every single copy of Rave? Does anyone's have "DIGITAL STEREO" spelled correctly? Could it possibly be that the 8-second segue variant is limited to sets that also have the typo? The plot thickens...

The plot thickens indeed. Unfortunately Discogs does not show the spine of the US edition but if you look at the European spine for example, it says DIGITAL STEREO normally: https://www.discogs.com/T...se/1430692

.

Now what I f ound on Discogs is that there IS a misprint. It doesn't say anything about the tracks or the spine though, but that the CD itself lacks the purple ink on the symbol, and you can see a picture: https://www.discogs.com/T...e/10881412

.

Is your CD like this?

.

Alos, If you look there you can see the Matrix number on the misprint CD. Unfortunately Discogs does not give them or a pic of them for the regular US/Canada edition, but i was wondering if those with the 8 seconds and those with the 4 seconds version could write their Matrix numbers here, could we find a consistant difference? Could we please try this?

.

Also, those with an American 4 seconds version, where did you buy it?

ThePartyman said:

I think this thread has fried my brain.

Just checked my Rave CD and actually feel disapointed that my segue is only 4 seconds long!

Actually it probably means you have the right version so you should be glad

Could you still tell us 1/ where in the US you purchased it and 2/ what the Matrix number on your CD is?

Thx for your help

fruitcocktail said:

Woah- this is blowing my mind.

I just checked my copy of it and yes, I do have 8 seconds of silence instead of four. Mine also says "DIGITAG GTGAGO" on the spine. I got it used at half price books in Minnesota, which isn't very helpful...

Thx for checking

We can't be sure where the CD was originally issued indeed but you can still help by telling us if your CD looks like this misprint with the silver symbol instead of purple on the CD: https://www.discogs.com/T...e/10881412

And if you could tell us the Matrix number on the CD it would also rock

olb99 said:

databank said:

I've contacted PrinceVault again with a more detailed explanation and a screenshot from my hex editor (to illustrate my point).

.

IIRC, a lot of CDs were available in Switzerland a day or two before the official release dates. I don't know why.

Pvault has updated it

.

As for the release date that's kind of odd. Technically that means for any record that was available in Switzerland one or 2 days before me and Pvault should have to adjust the release date, but I think that'd be a little complicated to implement. How do you even remember the exact date you bought it?

databank said:

olb99 said:

I've contacted PrinceVault again with a more detailed explanation and a screenshot from my hex editor (to illustrate my point).

.

IIRC, a lot of CDs were available in Switzerland a day or two before the official release dates. I don't know why.

Pvault has updated it

.

As for the release date that's kind of odd. Technically that means for any record that was available in Switzerland one or 2 days before me and Pvault should have to adjust the release date, but I think that'd be a little complicated to implement. How do you even remember the exact date you bought it?

Since the very first record I bought, I have logged everything.

My database covers every format (physical and digital) I have ever purchased with full purchasing and release information.

As I have done this from the start, it's not been any great effort to keep it updated.

Subsequently I've digitized and scanned everything as well.

darkroman said:

databank said:

Pvault has updated it

.

As for the release date that's kind of odd. Technically that means for any record that was available in Switzerland one or 2 days before me and Pvault should have to adjust the release date, but I think that'd be a little complicated to implement. How do you even remember the exact date you bought it?

Since the very first record I bought, I have logged everything.

My database covers every format (physical and digital) I have ever purchased with full purchasing and release information.

As I have done this from the start, it's not been any great effort to keep it updated.

Subsequently I've digitized and scanned everything as well.

So what about your Rave? 8 seconds? 4 seconds?

databank said:

darkroman said:

Since the very first record I bought, I have logged everything.

My database covers every format (physical and digital) I have ever purchased with full purchasing and release information.

As I have done this from the start, it's not been any great effort to keep it updated.

Subsequently I've digitized and scanned everything as well.

So what about your Rave? 8 seconds? 4 seconds?

LOL, well I have diligently been following this thread with the anticipation of checking my copies of Un2 and In2.

I keep meaning to check so I will do that this evening! I think I may have a copy with the spelling error mentioned early as that issues does sound very familiar!

Yet I'm worried I may only have a 4 second segue and risk becoming a social outcast!

If this transpires to be the case I'll have to hunt down a copy with the 8 second segue to re-establish my place in society once more!

Time will tell! Fingers crossed!

databank said:

olb99 said:

I've contacted PrinceVault again with a more detailed explanation and a screenshot from my hex editor (to illustrate my point).

.

IIRC, a lot of CDs were available in Switzerland a day or two before the official release dates. I don't know why.

Pvault has updated it

Cool!

.

As for the release date that's kind of odd. Technically that means for any record that was available in Switzerland one or 2 days before me and Pvault should have to adjust the release date, but I think that'd be a little complicated to implement. How do you even remember the exact date you bought it?

Aren't release dates a bit different in each country? AllMusic even has a release date of Nov. 2, 1999 for "Rave Un2...". Since I'm a geek, I have a list of all my musical purchases. Also, my diary corroborates that I bought it on Monday, Nov. 8, 1999. I wrote that there was absolutely no promotion for the album in the record store, which was surprising to me, apparently.

darkroman said:

databank said:

So what about your Rave? 8 seconds? 4 seconds?

LOL, well I have diligently been following this thread with the anticipation of checking my copies of Un2 and In2.

I keep meaning to check so I will do that this evening! I think I may have a copy with the spelling error mentioned early as that issues does sound very familiar!

Yet I'm worried I may only have a 4 second segue and risk becoming a social outcast!

If this transpires to be the case I'll have to hunt down a copy with the 8 second segue to re-establish my place in society once more!

Time will tell! Fingers crossed!

Thx for telling us then

olb99 said:

databank said:

Pvault has updated it

Cool!

.

As for the release date that's kind of odd. Technically that means for any record that was available in Switzerland one or 2 days before me and Pvault should have to adjust the release date, but I think that'd be a little complicated to implement. How do you even remember the exact date you bought it?

Aren't release dates a bit different in each country? AllMusic even has a release date of Nov. 2, 1999 for "Rave Un2...". Since I'm a geek, I have a list of all my musical purchases. Also, my diary corroborates that I bought it on Monday, Nov. 8, 1999. I wrote that there was absolutely no promotion for the album in the record store, which was surprising to me, apparently.

I really don't know about release dates. I think in France sometimes we got 'em a bit after the US but I ain't 100% sure. I think Pvault and me should mention the earliest release date worldwide, not necessarily the US date. But unless I have serious motive to believe one of their dates is wrong, or they don't have a specific date and I manage to find one on my own, I usually stick to their data as it comes from the Uptown/Nilsen files and those dates were themselves based on labels' documents and shit.

In that case I'll take your word for it because I know you and I know you're reliable. But I won't take Allmusic's word for it because IDK how they work and where they get their dates from. Typically, Amazon dates often contradict Pvault's.

If you ever have time to do it it'd be inetersting to confront your logs with my/Pvault's dates.

I haven't got a clue about this... I checked all my "Rave Un2 The Joy Fantastic" CD's and 2 of them (both US releases, 1 is the white on blue cover promo for the Arista board) have the 8 second silence, the rest (1 US, 1 French and 1 Japanese) have the normal 4 second silence... I have some sealed up so I don't know about those...
I never knew about this before this thread... So thanks for the heads-up...

Neversin.

olb99 said:

databank said:

Pvault has updated it

Cool!

.

As for the release date that's kind of odd. Technically that means for any record that was available in Switzerland one or 2 days before me and Pvault should have to adjust the release date, but I think that'd be a little complicated to implement. How do you even remember the exact date you bought it?

Aren't release dates a bit different in each country? AllMusic even has a release date of Nov. 2, 1999 for "Rave Un2...". Since I'm a geek, I have a list of all my musical purchases. Also, my diary corroborates that I bought it on Monday, Nov. 8, 1999. I wrote that there was absolutely no promotion for the album in the record store, which was surprising to me, apparently.

Yes release dates used to differ. The U.S used to be Tuesday and the UK (and other parts of Europe as well I think) used to be Monday.

.

I used to know a guy at a local record shop in Liverpool and he'd let me have the new releases the Friday or Saturday before when they got them in.

.

Releases are now Friday globally I believe.

Neversin said:

I haven't got a clue about this... I checked all my "Rave Un2 The Joy Fantastic" CD's and 2 of them (both US releases, 1 is the white on blue cover promo for the Arista board) have the 8 second silence, the rest (1 US, 1 French and 1 Japanese) have the normal 4 second silence... I have some sealed up so I don't know about those...
I never knew about this before this thread... So thanks for the heads-up...

Neversin.

Hi Neversin !

Do u have a clue about or heard one of different configuration of Rave ( 88/89 versions) ?

Thanx if u can Help & thanx too if u can't

Have a nice day

S.

While on this subject, let's take a moment (that could be 4 or 8 seconds if you wish) to remind ourselves why we have this silent segue.

From memory (I'll have to check my notes), the Greatest Romance Ever Sold is a dedication to the likes of Miles Davis and other musicians who have lost out to record companies and management ripping them off.

The silent segue is a moment to respectfully reflect.

[Edited 2/27/19 4:51am]

databank said:

Now what I f ound on Discogs is that there IS a misprint. It doesn't say anything about the tracks or the spine though, but that the CD itself lacks the purple ink on the symbol, and you can see a picture: https://www.discogs.com/T...e/10881412

.

Is your CD like this?

.

Alos, If you look there you can see the Matrix number on the misprint CD. Unfortunately Discogs does not give them or a pic of them for the regular US/Canada edition, but i was wondering if those with the 8 seconds and those with the 4 seconds version could write their Matrix numbers here, could we find a consistant difference? Could we please try this?

.

Also, those with an American 4 seconds version, where did you buy it?

My disc has the purple ink.

Matrix #03202-01.

thievesinthetemple said:

databank said:

OK, thx It's really cool that you bothered to check that out.

.

So it's not a computer problem: we have definite proof that there are two different original US printings of Rave. Discogs only shows one so I suspect they have the same catalogue number and are undistinguisable from each other except for the tracks themselves. I assume your cat. number is 07822-14624-2 as should be?

.

I suspect it could be a misprint and not something intentional that would have been changed later, since apparently both versions were available from day 1. But if so, I'm a bit confused as to how this could have happened and why only some CD's were affected. Does anyone know about the pressing factories in the US? Do major labels usually press CD's in a single factory for the whole country or can it happen that a single release is being produced in various locations at the same time? Is there any other way 2 versions of a single release can be different?

.

Again, thx for your help if you can help.

Yes, my catalog number is 07822-14624-2. The bottom center of the disc indicates that it was pressed by Sonopress USA.

.

I don't know if this is worth mentioning, but on the spine of my jewel case above the catalog number are supposed to be the words "DIGITAL STEREO," except in my case it's misspelled as "DIGITAG GTGRGO."

.

Does anyone else's spine have this glaring error? Is it on every single copy of Rave? Does anyone's have "DIGITAL STEREO" spelled correctly? Could it possibly be that the 8-second segue variant is limited to sets that also have the typo? The plot thickens...

Mine has that same spine mispelling...maybe it's supposed to say that for whatever reason.

thievesinthetemple said:

databank said:

Now what I f ound on Discogs is that there IS a misprint. It doesn't say anything about the tracks or the spine though, but that the CD itself lacks the purple ink on the symbol, and you can see a picture: https://www.discogs.com/T...e/10881412

.

Is your CD like this?

.

Alos, If you look there you can see the Matrix number on the misprint CD. Unfortunately Discogs does not give them or a pic of them for the regular US/Canada edition, but i was wondering if those with the 8 seconds and those with the 4 seconds version could write their Matrix numbers here, could we find a consistant difference? Could we please try this?

.

Also, those with an American 4 seconds version, where did you buy it?

My disc has the purple ink.

Same

databank said:

olb99 said:

I've contacted PrinceVault again with a more detailed explanation and a screenshot from my hex editor (to illustrate my point).

.

IIRC, a lot of CDs were available in Switzerland a day or two before the official release dates. I don't know why.

Pvault has updated it

.

As for the release date that's kind of odd. Technically that means for any record that was available in Switzerland one or 2 days before me and Pvault should have to adjust the release date

.

No. Stores ignoring release dates doesn't mean release dates aren't official.

databank said:

darkroman said:

LOL, well I have diligently been following this thread with the anticipation of checking my copies of Un2 and In2.

I keep meaning to check so I will do that this evening! I think I may have a copy with the spelling error mentioned early as that issues does sound very familiar!

Yet I'm worried I may only have a 4 second segue and risk becoming a social outcast!

If this transpires to be the case I'll have to hunt down a copy with the 8 second segue to re-establish my place in society once more!

Time will tell! Fingers crossed!

Thx for telling us then

So... the segue I have is EIGHT seconds.
The last ten seconds of The Greatest Romance are also silent.

The digital version has removed the silence at the end of The Greatest Romance and has removed the silent segue.

Details:

Rave Un2 The Joy Fantastic

L.P : Tuesday February 29, 2000.
Purchased from : www.cdnow.com

CD : Tuesday February 29, 2000.
Purchased from : www.cdnow.com

07822-14624-2.

Made in the USA.
(All packaging for the USA, Europe and Japan printed in USA as stated on artwork).

Rave In2 The Joy Fantastic

CD : Tuesday May 15, 2001.
Purchased from : www.npgmusicclub.com
257J1RAVEIN2.
Made in the USA.
(I need to check if this is the misspress or not).

databank said:

fruitcocktail said:

Woah- this is blowing my mind.

I just checked my copy of it and yes, I do have 8 seconds of silence instead of four. Mine also says "DIGITAG GTGAGO" on the spine. I got it used at half price books in Minnesota, which isn't very helpful...

Thx for checking

We can't be sure where the CD was originally issued indeed but you can still help by telling us if your CD looks like this misprint with the silver symbol instead of purple on the CD: https://www.discogs.com/T...e/10881412

And if you could tell us the Matrix number on the CD it would also rock

The CD has the purple guitar.

and the matrix is 07822-14624-2

Very happy to help! I'm very invested in this mystery of silence now

databank said:

ThePartyman said:

I think this thread has fried my brain.

Just checked my Rave CD and actually feel disapointed that my segue is only 4 seconds long!

Actually it probably means you have the right version so you should be glad

Could you still tell us 1/ where in the US you purchased it and 2/ what the Matrix number on your CD is?

Thx for your help

I purchased it in the UK, not 100% sure where but likely in my local HMV store on the day of release.

Matrix info: 07822146242 01 DISTRONICS IFPI L502

You guys are so last week. I'm already checking tracks 11 to 47 on Newpower Soul to see if I have any extended versions.

Neversin said:

I haven't got a clue about this... I checked all my "Rave Un2 The Joy Fantastic" CD's and 2 of them (both US releases, 1 is the white on blue cover promo for the Arista board) have the 8 second silence, the rest (1 US, 1 French and 1 Japanese) have the normal 4 second silence... I have some sealed up so I don't know about those...
I never knew about this before this thread... So thanks for the heads-up...

Neversin.

Wow you have a lot of copies

Thx for checking it out

So far this tends to confirm that this 8 seconds version exists only in the US.

dodger said:

olb99 said:

Yes release dates used to differ. The U.S used to be Tuesday and the UK (and other parts of Europe as well I think) used to be Monday.

.

I used to know a guy at a local record shop in Liverpool and he'd let me have the new releases the Friday or Saturday before when they got them in.

.

Releases are now Friday globally I believe.

Wow that's a headache. I don't think I'm going to go into that

darkroman said:

While on this subject, let's take a moment (that could be 4 or 8 seconds if you wish) to remind ourselves why we have this silent segue.

From memory (I'll have to check my notes), the Greatest Romance Ever Sold is a dedication to the likes of Miles Davis and other musicians who have lost out to record companies and management ripping them off.

The silent segue is a moment to respectfully reflect.

[Edited 2/27/19 4:51am]

Yeah? I've got to admit I've never really understood what the title of TGRES meant. The lyrics seemto be about a love story though not labels, but why was the romance "sold", that's the part I never figured.

I'm down with your interpretation but I'd be curious where you got it from (those "notes" you mention?), and also I didn't remember Miles being fuicked by the music industry but I'm not familiar with every aspect of his biography. I guess he was ripped off in the 50's as was everyone back then, but did he also have issues with Columbia and WB?