cloveringold85 said:

laurarichardson said:

I know how to count money. I also think all this stuff about addiction being a disease is a bunch of bullshit. My opinion and I am not going to get into a long drawn out thing with you about it.

.

Laura: Addiction is indeed an illness. It's a chemical imbalance in the brain and is oftentimes hereditary. My Father had it, my Mother had it and my Sister also has chemical dependency/addiction (alcohol).

.

Short Definition of Addiction:

.

Addiction is a primary, chronic disease of brain reward, motivation, memory and related circuitry. Dysfunction in these circuits leads to characteristic biological, psychological, social and spiritual manifestations. This is reflected in an individual pathologically pursuing reward and/or relief by substance use and other behaviors.

.

https://www.asam.org/reso...-addiction

Don't argue wth her. She know how to "count money".

BillieBalloon said:

Mumio said:

Like everything else in his life, he was in charge still. If he wanted help from anyone, he could have asked or accepted because we know some have said they called. I think he did what he could within the scope of his reality at that time. For all we know, many many people may have asked to help and given how things went, he apparently declined. I believe he knew what he was doing right up until the final moment.

Clearly he didnt know what he was doing, hence the outcome. What he was doing is what he WANTED to do and there's a huge difference. People in the midst of something like this are not making good decisions, his judegement was impaired, he had overdosed a week prior. This is when loved ones are supposed to intervene.

.

.

ThatWhiteDude said:

disch said:

If Prince had survived, should he be in cuffs for buying/possessing "dope"?

laurarichardson said:

What else do we have to delve into? You know what I think already and you know why I think it but you do not agree.

Andrew - Not a doctor had no business getting on the plane at all. Should be in cuffs for bring dope across state lines. I would think this if Prince were alive a well.

Dr. S being unprofessional but covered himself.

Kirk- I am not mad at him. I just think he is not that bright. He should not have lied to the police and he should never be on television every again in life.

And that's how disconnected from reality and determined he had become. That may sound like an oxymoron but I believe he checked out and could care less if he was caught or not.

After Moline, the logical thing to do was to completely and effectively erase traces of anything that might incriminate you or your staff as it relates to illicit purchase/usage of drugs. He had six(6) days to do that. Look at how much stuff was found and booked into evidence after those six (6) days. Talk about insane.

laurarichardson said:

cloveringold85 said:

.

I didn't mean it to sound that way. What I'm trying to say is that if Prince was in such ill health, and so sick and weak, and going through withdrawals, he wouldn't have the energy to make 2 more albums and go on tour.

.

I know Prince was not the type of person who would just sit around and waste away.

I honestly think he must have not been in withdrawals or over them when he went to Australia because who could make that flight puking your guts out for 18 hours. Then when he got to Australia he stayed down there for an extra week.

Something else was going on with him.

.

If I'm not mistaken, didn't Prince have a love interest in Australia?

BillieBalloon said:

Mumio said:

Like everything else in his life, he was in charge still. If he wanted help from anyone, he could have asked or accepted because we know some have said they called. I think he did what he could within the scope of his reality at that time. For all we know, many many people may have asked to help and given how things went, he apparently declined. I believe he knew what he was doing right up until the final moment.

Clearly he didnt know what he was doing, hence the outcome. What he was doing is what he WANTED to do and there's a huge difference. People in the midst of something like this are not making good decisions, his judegement was impaired, he had overdosed a week prior. This is when loved ones are supposed to intervene.

I disagree that he "clearly didn't know what he was doing". But you are entitled to think that way if you like.

LOVESYMBOLNUMBER2 said:

I didn't know people from Germany said "y'all" so much...

Damn, you were reading my mind.

Menes said:

disch said:

If Prince had survived, should he be in cuffs for buying/possessing "dope"?

And that's how disconnected from reality and determined he had become. That may sound like an oxymoron but I believe he checked out and could care less if he was caught or not.

After Moline, the logical thing to do was to completely and effectively erase traces of anything that might incriminate you or your staff as it relates to illicit purchase/usage of drugs. He had six(6) days to do that. Look at how much stuff was found and booked into evidence after those six (6) days. Talk about insane.

Because he did not care. He was not going to be around. It is a 65,000.00 sq foot building with a basement that runs the length of the building. Those drugs could have been hidden anywhere and the cops would have never found them. He had other homes, offices and storage units. The police could have come knocking as soon as his story hit the media.

His associates could have called the cops. He knew he was not going.

cloveringold85 said:

laurarichardson said:

I honestly think he must have not been in withdrawals or over them when he went to Australia because who could make that flight puking your guts out for 18 hours. Then when he got to Australia he stayed down there for an extra week.

Something else was going on with him.

.

If I'm not mistaken, didn't Prince have a love interest in Australia?

I never heard that but there was a long article in the Australia about his activities in Australia and the promoter talked quite foundly about him. Explaining how Prince stated longer then he was suppose to because he added another show at the last minute and he had a piano flown in from Paisley.

Promoter said he was a joy to work with and he never got the impression that he on drugs.

Nik West the bassist also had dinner with him.

[Edited 1/30/18 13:33pm]

The idea that private residences are routinely raided for drug possession (not dealing, just possession) is silly. Yes, we're in Trump/Sessions America now, but even still, cops have a lot of other places they need to put their drug-enforcement efforts

-

Laura, if Prince dope stash had been found by cops when he was alive, should he have been arrested?

laurarichardson said:

Menes said:

And that's how disconnected from reality and determined he had become. That may sound like an oxymoron but I believe he checked out and could care less if he was caught or not.

After Moline, the logical thing to do was to completely and effectively erase traces of anything that might incriminate you or your staff as it relates to illicit purchase/usage of drugs. He had six(6) days to do that. Look at how much stuff was found and booked into evidence after those six (6) days. Talk about insane.

Because he did not care. He was not going to be around. It is a 65,000.00 sq foot building with a basement that runs the length of the building. Those drugs could have been hidden anywhere and the cops would have never found them. He had other homes, offices and storage units. The police could have come knocking as soon as his story hit the media.

His associates could have called the cops. He knew he was not going.

The fact is we just don't know the facts.

laurarichardson said:

cloveringold85 said:

.

If I'm not mistaken, didn't Prince have a love interest in Australia?

I never heard that but there was a long article in the Australia about his activities in Australia and the promoter talked quite foundly about him. Explaining how Prince stated longer then he was suppose to because he added another show at the last minute and he had a piano flown in from Paisley.

Promoter said he was a joy to work with and he never got the impression that he on drugs.

Nik West the bassist also had dinner with him.

[Edited 1/30/18 13:33pm]

.

Seems like he was enjoying himself; then something went awry.

First of all I am not the one that questioned how stupid he was not to dump everything when he got from Moline. Remember the idiot tabloid would have us believe he left Moline with a plane full of drugs and no one batted an eyeball

Tour buses get pulled over and busted by cops all the time and I am not sure what neighborhood you are familar with but people's home do get raided.

Take a look sometime at the Carver County Sheriff log. The cops were at Paisley a lot over the years mainly for treaspassers and crank calls. That address was not unknown to them.

Again what is with the crazy questions. He would have been arrested just like anyone else in America.

disch said:

The idea that private residences are routinely raided for drug possession (not dealing, just possession) is silly. Yes, we're in Trump/Sessions America now, but even still, cops have a lot of other places they need to put their drug-enforcement efforts

-

Laura, if Prince dope stash had been found by cops when he was alive, should he have been arrested?

laurarichardson said:

Because he did not care. He was not going to be around. It is a 65,000.00 sq foot building with a basement that runs the length of the building. Those drugs could have been hidden anywhere and the cops would have never found them. He had other homes, offices and storage units. The police could have come knocking as soon as his story hit the media.

His associates could have called the cops. He knew he was not going.

[Edited 1/30/18 13:59pm]

cloveringold85 said:

laurarichardson said:

I never heard that but there was a long article in the Australia about his activities in Australia and the promoter talked quite foundly about him. Explaining how Prince stated longer then he was suppose to because he added another show at the last minute and he had a piano flown in from Paisley.

Promoter said he was a joy to work with and he never got the impression that he on drugs.

Nik West the bassist also had dinner with him.

[Edited 1/30/18 13:33pm]

.

Seems like he was enjoying himself; then something went awry.

Having seen pics from the Australian show he was not looking to good. Just like the St. Barts show.

So everyone in America who possesses drugs is arrested? Damn, that's a lot of people! Our prisons are already overstuffed but i'm amazed there aren't way more, given that.

-

My question was actually: SHOULD Prince have been arrested, in your view?

I was asking because you said "Andrew should be in cuffs for bringing dope across state lines" -- in reference to the prescription suboxone and other drugs he had that are used to ease withdrawal suffering.

-

And thanks for asking about the neighborhood I live in. It's New York City. Brooklyn, specifically. You?

laurarichardson said:

First of all I am not the one that questioned how stupid he was not to dump everything when he got from Moline. Remember the idiot tabloid would have us believe he left Moline with a plane full of drugs and no one batted an eyeball

Tour buses get pulled over and busted by cops all the time and I am not sure what neighborhood you are familar with but people's home do get raided.

Take a look sometime at the Carver County Sheriff log. The cops were at Paisley a lot over the years mainly for treaspassers and crank calls. That address was not unknown to them.

Again what is with the crazy questions. He would have been arrested just like anyone else in America.

disch said:

The idea that private residences are routinely raided for drug possession (not dealing, just possession) is silly. Yes, we're in Trump/Sessions America now, but even still, cops have a lot of other places they need to put their drug-enforcement efforts

-

Laura, if Prince dope stash had been found by cops when he was alive, should he have been arrested?

[Edited 1/30/18 13:59pm]

Of course if he had illegal drugs he would have been arrested. He would have been breaking the law. I also do not know how you do not know people are arrested in this country for possesing illegal drugs. ( with the pain pill crisis going on) I hope you are being sarcastic because you look silly and you are wasting my time.

It does not matter what I think or you think. What you keep forgetting is Andrew is not a doctor and he did violate federal drug laws for bringing that stuff across state lines and just having it in his possesion. What he was planning to do with it is irrelevant and the good sam thing is bullshit as well since the 911 call went out after Prince was dead.

I honestly think he had no fucking idea what he was doing and with no knowledge of what Prince had ingested that night he was probaly going to do more harm then good. I still do not even believe Prince even knew this dude was coming.

I am sure he will skate because of good old American privilage and the fact that he is not the fish that the police and DEA have spent almost two years looking for but he is guily because he did break the law.

disch said:

So everyone in America who possesses drugs is arrested? Damn, that's a lot of people! Our prisons are already overstuffed but i'm amazed there aren't way more, given that.

-

My question was actually: SHOULD Prince have been arrested, in your view?

I was asking because you said "Andrew should be in cuffs for bringing dope across state lines" -- in reference to the prescription suboxone and other drugs he had that are used to ease withdrawal suffering.

-

And thanks for asking about the neighborhood I live in. It's New York City. Brooklyn, specifically. You?

laurarichardson said:

First of all I am not the one that questioned how stupid he was not to dump everything when he got from Moline. Remember the idiot tabloid would have us believe he left Moline with a plane full of drugs and no one batted an eyeball

Tour buses get pulled over and busted by cops all the time and I am not sure what neighborhood you are familar with but people's home do get raided.

Take a look sometime at the Carver County Sheriff log. The cops were at Paisley a lot over the years mainly for treaspassers and crank calls. That address was not unknown to them.

Again what is with the crazy questions. He would have been arrested just like anyone else in America.

[Edited 1/30/18 13:59pm]

You have to have probable cause to request a search warrant to go into a house and search for drugs.

Its not as though someone can make a phone call to the police saying someone has recreational drugs in their possession in their home and the cops go over and break down the door.

Unreasonable search and seizure.

Fourth Amendment to the Constitution.

laurarichardson said:

cloveringold85 said:

.

Seems like he was enjoying himself; then something went awry.

Having seen pics from the Australian show he was not looking to good. Just like the St. Barts show.

.

I agree; he did not look good in St. Barts. I'm sorry, Prince.

.

laurarichardson said:

PennyPurple said:

You have to admit Laura, that Prince did dabble in drugs on and off for years.

I do not think the long rambling textbook nonsense applies to Prince because everybody's is sitiutaion is different. In addtion, none of us knew him on a personal level so the arm chair analysis needs to stop.

I do not believe that Prince was a recreational drug user. I am sorry he pissed off too many people and they would be running their mouths by this time. Estates cannot sue for defamation and the tabs would pay nice money for some drug stories. We have only heard he was a big time wine drinker and if someone said he had drinking problem I could believe that but I am not sure how wine drinking would work for 20 years with pill popping?

I think he had an Rx for these drugs. In fact we know he had surgery so he would of had to have an Rx at some point.

I do not think Prince was using drugs back in the 80s. If you read the book out now with his studio session Sunset sound logs I do not think it would have been possible for him to get that much work done high. I think we do not see him walking around with a cane until the early 90s. It also around the early 2000s that Kevin Smith said Prince complained about not being able to get up and walk due to pain. One of the girls in Millania Micki White said a tour he was suppose to do with him in the early 2000s was canceled because he re injuried his hip as he was suppose to stay off it.

We know he fell and injured his ankle on the JOTY tour. I think as his injuries progressed he used more pain killers. Knowing what we know now about how poweful these drugs were made in the last 15 years I suspect his problem started when the potency of these drugs increased.

We are missing so much info that we have no timeline or info on his overall health to say what exactly happened but anyone can see that he starts to look very different around 2013 and 2014. In fact he actually does not look as bad as he did doing the symbol period but something about his concerts and demenor are off.

We know he started shutting things down and scaling back and we know this is when Tyka got her call. I think he had issues with these drugs and something else happend to escalate it even more.

Does that include your arm chair analysis too?

I am not the one that brought up the fact that he was silly for not getting rid of the drugs in the first place.

If someone had contacted the police about anything at Paisley and they were not allowed in they would have just gone and got a warrant. ( Remember he was the one in the media with the plane coming down due to a drug overdose ) What was Prince going to do run back into Paisely and flush everything down the toilet with the police at the door.

These things happen everyday. I had a friend who had to wait on the side of the road while the police search their vehicle for a gun because another motorist claimed they pulled one on them in traffic.

No gun was in the car but guess what he did not get to go anywhere until the vehicle was searched.

I guess you guys miss out on stuff that happens in the real world everyday.

ISaidLifeIsJustAGame said:

You have to have probable cause to request a search warrant to go into a house and search for drugs.

Its not as though someone can make a phone call to the police saying someone has recreational drugs in their possession in their home and the cops go over and break down the door.

Unreasonable search and seizure.

Fourth Amendment to the Constitution.

ISaidLifeIsJustAGame said:

You have to have probable cause to request a search warrant to go into a house and search for drugs.

Its not as though someone can make a phone call to the police saying someone has recreational drugs in their possession in their home and the cops go over and break down the door.

Unreasonable search and seizure.

Fourth Amendment to the Constitution.

.

I will never understand why they waited so long to do a search warrant. This case hasn't been handled properly from the get-go.

PennyPurple said:

laurarichardson said:

I do not think the long rambling textbook nonsense applies to Prince because everybody's is sitiutaion is different. In addtion, none of us knew him on a personal level so the arm chair analysis needs to stop.

I do not believe that Prince was a recreational drug user. I am sorry he pissed off too many people and they would be running their mouths by this time. Estates cannot sue for defamation and the tabs would pay nice money for some drug stories. We have only heard he was a big time wine drinker and if someone said he had drinking problem I could believe that but I am not sure how wine drinking would work for 20 years with pill popping?

I think he had an Rx for these drugs. In fact we know he had surgery so he would of had to have an Rx at some point.

I do not think Prince was using drugs back in the 80s. If you read the book out now with his studio session Sunset sound logs I do not think it would have been possible for him to get that much work done high. I think we do not see him walking around with a cane until the early 90s. It also around the early 2000s that Kevin Smith said Prince complained about not being able to get up and walk due to pain. One of the girls in Millania Micki White said a tour he was suppose to do with him in the early 2000s was canceled because he re injuried his hip as he was suppose to stay off it.

We know he fell and injured his ankle on the JOTY tour. I think as his injuries progressed he used more pain killers. Knowing what we know now about how poweful these drugs were made in the last 15 years I suspect his problem started when the potency of these drugs increased.

We are missing so much info that we have no timeline or info on his overall health to say what exactly happened but anyone can see that he starts to look very different around 2013 and 2014. In fact he actually does not look as bad as he did doing the symbol period but something about his concerts and demenor are off.

We know he started shutting things down and scaling back and we know this is when Tyka got her call. I think he had issues with these drugs and something else happend to escalate it even more.

Does that include your arm chair analysis too?

My I analysis is not from a damm text book and Prince was not my patient. I have never tried to say what I think was going on in his mind other then what is obvious like estate management.

( I have greedy nutball sibs so I let the court handle matters )

Or things that we actually know and really some common sense.

I think he was ill and wanted to die. Not much of an armchair to put your arm on.

laurarichardson said:

I am not the one that brought up the fact that he was silly for not getting rid of the drugs in the first place.

If someone had contacted the police about anything at Paisley and they were not allowed in they would have just gone and got a warrant. ( Remember he was the one in the media with the plane coming down due to a drug overdose ) What was Prince going to do run back into Paisely and flush everything down the toilet with the police at the door.

These things happen everyday. I had a friend who had to wait on the side of the road while the police search their vehicle for a gun because another motorist claimed they pulled one on them in traffic.

No gun was in the car but guess what he did not get to go anywhere until the vehicle was searched.

I guess you guys miss out on stuff that happens in the real world everyday.

ISaidLifeIsJustAGame said:

You have to have probable cause to request a search warrant to go into a house and search for drugs.

Its not as though someone can make a phone call to the police saying someone has recreational drugs in their possession in their home and the cops go over and break down the door.

Unreasonable search and seizure.

Fourth Amendment to the Constitution.

Well, then the cops either got a warrant or your friend gave them permission to search the car.

If they didnt have a warrant and your friend didnt give permission and the police found a gun and he/she didnt have a CCW permit, an attorney would file a Motion to Suppress Evidence.

Because that is what the Fourth Amendment to the Constitution guarantees to Americans.

Unreasonable search and seizure.

Judges dont hand out search warrants just for funzies.

I dont miss out out the stuff that happens in the real world every day because I have practiced criminal law.

Actually, I don't think everyone who violates current drug laws should be arrested or prosecuted. I think our drug laws have profound racial bias and have led to the mass incarceration problem which has destroyed for families and lives than it has helped. I think the idea that we are going to arrest and imprison our way out of this drug crisis is unrealistic, given that that "drug war" approach has never worked before.

-

Where I live, recreationa marijuana is illegal, but people openly smoke it on the streets, often with no police interference or maybe just a verbal warning. You know why? Because it's a waste of police resources. Kind of like how every jaywalker is not handed a ticket.

-

Andrew was carrying those legal medications with the intent to help Prince. They were never used. Prince, by all assumptions, bought illegal drugs and in doing so supported drug cartels and trafficking. By that measure, Prince's crime was worse, if you view everything through a lens of who should be arrested and how long they should be imprisoned.

laurarichardson said:

Of course if he had illegal drugs he would have been arrested. He would have been breaking the law. I also do not know how you do not know people are arrested in this country for possesing illegal drugs. ( with the pain pill crisis going on) I hope you are being sarcastic because you look silly and you are wasting my time.

It does not matter what I think or you think. What you keep forgetting is Andrew is not a doctor and he did violate federal drug laws for bringing that stuff across state lines and just having it in his possesion. What he was planning to do with it is irrelevant and the good sam thing is bullshit as well since the 911 call went out after Prince was dead.

I honestly think he had no fucking idea what he was doing and with no knowledge of what Prince had ingested that night he was probaly going to do more harm then good. I still do not even believe Prince even knew this dude was coming.

I am sure he will skate because of good old American privilage and the fact that he is not the fish that the police and DEA have spent almost two years looking for but he is guily because he did break the law.

disch said:

So everyone in America who possesses drugs is arrested? Damn, that's a lot of people! Our prisons are already overstuffed but i'm amazed there aren't way more, given that.

-

My question was actually: SHOULD Prince have been arrested, in your view?

I was asking because you said "Andrew should be in cuffs for bringing dope across state lines" -- in reference to the prescription suboxone and other drugs he had that are used to ease withdrawal suffering.

-

And thanks for asking about the neighborhood I live in. It's New York City. Brooklyn, specifically. You?

LOVESYMBOLNUMBER2 said:

disch said:

Menes said:

btw where do you live? You asked me after you said that I don't understand what goes on in the real world, or something like that.

-

I answered I live in Brooklyn, NY. You?

laurarichardson said:

It does not matter what you think or what I think. It matters what law states and you are corrrect about bias. If the police had arrested Prince for drugs trust the full weight of the law would have fallen on him. Andrew got caught with drugs and he is free as a bird. —- disch said:

Actually, I don't think everyone who violates current drug laws should be arrested or prosecuted. I think our drug laws have profound racial bias and have led to the mass incarceration problem which has destroyed for families and lives than it has helped. I think the idea that we are going to arrest and imprison our way out of this drug crisis is unrealistic, given that that "drug war" approach has never worked before.

-

Where I live, recreationa marijuana is illegal, but people openly smoke it on the streets, often with no police interference or maybe just a verbal warning. You know why? Because it's a waste of police resources. Kind of like how every jaywalker is not handed a ticket.

-

Andrew was carrying those legal medications with the intent to help Prince. They were never used. Prince, by all assumptions, bought illegal drugs and in doing so supported drug cartels and trafficking. By that measure, Prince's crime was worse, if you view everything through a lens of who should be arrested and how long they should be imprisoned.

disch said:

Actually, I don't think everyone who violates current drug laws should be arrested or prosecuted. I think our drug laws have profound racial bias and have led to the mass incarceration problem which has destroyed for families and lives than it has helped. I think the idea that we are going to arrest and imprison our way out of this drug crisis is unrealistic, given that that "drug war" approach has never worked before.

-

Where I live, recreationa marijuana is illegal, but people openly smoke it on the streets, often with no police interference or maybe just a verbal warning. You know why? Because it's a waste of police resources. Kind of like how every jaywalker is not handed a ticket.

-

Andrew was carrying those legal medications with the intent to help Prince. They were never used. Prince, by all assumptions, bought illegal drugs and in doing so supported drug cartels and trafficking. By that measure, Prince's crime was worse, if you view everything through a lens of who should be arrested and how long they should be imprisoned.

laurarichardson said:

Of course if he had illegal drugs he would have been arrested. He would have been breaking the law. I also do not know how you do not know people are arrested in this country for possesing illegal drugs. ( with the pain pill crisis going on) I hope you are being sarcastic because you look silly and you are wasting my time.

It does not matter what I think or you think. What you keep forgetting is Andrew is not a doctor and he did violate federal drug laws for bringing that stuff across state lines and just having it in his possesion. What he was planning to do with it is irrelevant and the good sam thing is bullshit as well since the 911 call went out after Prince was dead.

I honestly think he had no fucking idea what he was doing and with no knowledge of what Prince had ingested that night he was probaly going to do more harm then good. I still do not even believe Prince even knew this dude was coming.

I am sure he will skate because of good old American privilage and the fact that he is not the fish that the police and DEA have spent almost two years looking for but he is guily because he did break the law.

.

Disch: With all due respect, what Andrew did was not legal, by any means. He carried controlled substances over several state lines without a license (he's a med student). I know you already know this, but pointing that out to other's who are just joining.