PennyPurple said:

laurarichardson said:

Did you think he put a gun to her head? Because to me that is forcing. She did not look distressed her that show and her mom was sitting right next to her. You run off and leave somone who is mistreating you. You do not stay in the big manision in Spain.

What I know comes from deduction and common sense. You are still caring on about his charater as if you had some personal relationship with him.

WTH you mean she didn't look distressed? She was trying to hold in her sobs and her lips were quivering trying to hold back.

Forget it, Laura knows it always better. 'Cause she got common sense.

laurarichardson said:

What about the Time? Morris wanted to go to Europe and Japane, but he couldn't because Prince was a controll freak and stopped them! Was he immature as well? Why didn't he just go with his band? Prince was in controll of every-fucking-thing! EITHER HIS WAY OR THE HIGHWAY!

I do not know anything about Morris wanting to go to Europe in the past. I know Prince is not around anymore and he is still on the casino circuit. I do not know that if the songs arre written by Prince , Prince played the bulk of the intstrutments, and owns the name of the group you do kind of have to do what he wants. He was the boss. Do you tell your boss what to do?

Wut?

I don't think it was just a promote an album...agree to disagree.

ThatWhiteDude said:

fortuneandserendipity said:

Granted, and P could always have delayed the interview, rather than cancel it altogether.

Let's try and be sane here, and seek the middle ground instead of being absolutist about everything

Okay that. At least he should've done that, rather than putting his wife through this shit just to promote a fucking Album

Last night, I wrote a long thought-out summary of my sympathy for both Mayte and Prince and I continue to feel that way. I see this event a bit different because of what I explained yesterday. I do want to disagree with a false equivalency...equating a battered woman's inability to leave a violent husband with P's psychological hold on Mayte. I dont see the parallel frankly. Battered women face stalking and a very real physical threat. Mayte faced being ostracized and cut out of a rock star's life. He wouldn't have stalked her. He would have left her. IT would suck and hurt her feelings but there is no parallel IMO... He left her years ago and yet she says recently that had they not lost their child they would still be together. She calls him the love of her life. Its not his fault he still has a hold on her. He left her and died---this is and was out of his hands.

Just to avoid people thinking I never see P's flaws... Here's my issues with Prince.

...when he threw nasty shade during performances at his sound techs...(I get how bad sound can ruin a performance but a nasty tirade is even worse)

---when he wouldn't go with Mayte to get her life saving surgery for the miscarriage because of his religious zealousness..

---taking his music off the internet and suiing fans and being bitchy about the TIme name.. because he was a paranoid ideologue. (I am not as mad as others because I think his paranoia was sad...but its a bit maddening.)

--when he tainted the legitimacy of his music by not being more clear about credits and contributions of others (now anyone can claim they were not credited if they want...dumb ass.)

---I am disappointed he was stupid enough to break another guitarist guitar on live tv (even if he did apologize immediately and pay to fix the guitar.)

---cheating...(but I am less angry than some about this because I believe his girlfriends knew right away the score and I dislike the phoniness about this whole thing coming from many of them.).

---sexism in the Rainbow CHildren (by all means, Prince, believe whatyou need to believe to get through a tragedy but leave the sexism out...especially since he had a side of him completely not sexist)

---expecting his employees to work as hard as his crazy ass did...(he seemed to get a bit better in 2000's and working hard has its benefits, but in the 90's, it seemed a funless place.) I do get annoyed however when people complain about 3 am phone calls. you work for a vampire, expect inconvenient hours...I say.

NOw I think we should get back to sympathizing with an overworked, sensitive, shy, tragic man who worked himself to death, suffered and did his best to find redemption later in his life? NOw can we remember the funny, warm, romantic, creative, quietly and unexpectedly generous, polite man of musical integrety who liked children ( despite what the Cat Glover baby-Daddy thread is implying? )

Oh and by the way, Mayte is holding back tears and stuggling during the interview during the part about their kid (I am not blind) , but she does relatively well the rest of the interview. As for P, I wonder if people are even looking at his eyes while he is being asked by Oprah about their family...I imagine most people's eyes now go to her during this moment (understandably) . But, look at him too.. He looks tired and vulnerable...(other than moments during the Gumbel interview and the Steve Wonder tribute, its the most vulnerable I have ever seen him while not performing.) I see it differently partly for that reason. I see him as being not strong enough to really deal with it these emotions so turning to work, public vagueness, spirituality, denial and fantasy to deal with and unfortunately thinking that this approach would somehow help his wife. None of this is rational thinking IMO. It is indeed "fucked up" but he has my sympathy and ultimately Mayte recovered much better than he did from this tragedy.

.

ThatWhiteDude said:

purplerabbithole said:

ThatWhiteDude said: Your line “I bet he didn’t give a fuck” does seem to step into demonizing because you are assuming the worst. Doesn’t seem calm. When I said Weinstein I was referring to the harassment and his ability to destroy careers more than the rapes. As for psychological issues after a child’s death, I imagine the father has some of the same ones. I am not spinning it to make Mayte seem bad

I said I guess, followed by who knows. Not that I know for sure. But he should've known it better. It's really fucked that you can't even critize one thing about Prince, people are fast to say you demonize Prince and don't belong here.

I didn't say his state of mind wasn't the same, but it was about him forcing Mayte to do the interview with him.

[Edited 11/15/17 15:54pm]

[Edited 11/15/17 16:02pm]

[Edited 11/15/17 16:10pm]

laurarichardson said:

TweetyV6 said:

Andrea Swensson said:

Prince’s death was the result of being in “a lot of pain and [being] scared to tell anyone.”

Prince's Death

Direct cause: Painkiller Overdose
Root cause: His acrobatics on high heels when entertaining us during his carreer.
Contributing cause: JW Doctrine. It prevented him from having decent surgery to get rid of the pain.

Jehovahs Witnesses are not allowed to have surgery?

Jehovahs Witnesses are not allowed to have surgery?

Yesterday i listened to a report of 2 women from Montreal, who died after childbirth , most likely due to their stated request not to have a blood transfusion if needed ,because of their JW beliefs.Yet I have been reading on the org that one may have blood tranfusions???? Can someone with direct knowledge clear this up please

Morgaine said:

laurarichardson said:

Did you think he put a gun to her head? Because to me that is forcing. She did not look distressed her that show and her mom was sitting right next to her. You run off and leave somone who is mistreating you. You do not stay in the big manision in Spain.

What I know comes from deduction and common sense. You are still caring on about his charater as if you had some personal relationship with him.

Mayte has publicly stated that she wasn't there for him, either, that they were both lost. She also stated she had her "mask" on during the interview. Her mother was not sitting next to her during the interview, though she appeared briefly with others who were asked how they addressed him. You've stated no one but P and Mayte know what truly occurred (which I agree with) but then state due to your personal "deduction and common sense" that she wasn't distressed because if she was she would have left him. Utilizing and possessing "deduction and common sense" is not synonymous with facts, truth, or inherent knowledge. And it appears you have a great deal of bias against several people involved. Peace & Be Wild

Mayte has publicly stated that she wasn't there for him, either, that they were both lost. She also stated she had her "mask" on during the interview

Glad you acknowledged this since no one else has.

Her mother was not sitting next to her during the interview, though she appeared briefly with others who were asked how they addressed him.

Her mom was present during a portion of the interview. Don't you think she might have had something to say if he was forcing or dragging her to the interview. Once again common sense.

Utilizing and possessing "deduction and common sense" is not synonymous with facts, truth, or inherent knowledge. And it appears you have a great deal of bias against several people involved. Peace & Be Wild

How about the facts of what all of our eyes saw on the program and the fact that unless Mayte was paralyzed and unable to walk? ( which she appears able to do in the interview ) she could have just got up a left the interview. If one is distressed does one stay or go?

If you want to have something broken down to you like a five year old. Well you got it. Have a nice day.

fortuneandserendipity said:

laurarichardson said:

Funny how Sly Stone could not find the stadium, George Jones drove off to get alcohol doing a concert, Ray Charles smashed his own hand threw a glass table and did not even realize it because of herion, funny how Miles Davis recorded no music for five year while he sat in his house as high as kite everyday and spent time looking for the hidden people in his clothes, funny how David Bowie froze his own pee because he thought someone was trying to steal it, funny how George Clinton said coke prevented him from making music as well as knowing what day it was for about 20 years.

Funny how Morris Day was so high during PR that had guard had to make sure he did not wander off the set. None of these people have anywhere near the volume of recorded music Prince had, logged as many hours at soundchecks, concerts, aftershows, producing, writting, engineering, running a record lable, making movies, donating to charity, running a real estate trust, and partying.

If you want to believe that he did all of these things for extended periods of time with very little breaks under the influence of drugs for 20 years I want to sell you the Brooklyn Bridge.

All of which explains why people out there are functioning every day off opioids like codeine, prescribed to them by doctor. They're not falling down the stairs or driving the wrong way down the road. You're talking about celebs who aren't moderating their dosage while self-medicating.

It always comes down to one thing: a volume issue, as in how much to take per therapeutic dose vs falling-over-while-slurring-their-words dose.

But according to the addiction specialist of the org he was abusing these meds for 20 years on with no direction from a medical professional. Don't you think he would have shown signs of the side effects of these meds or did he have some super power.

Do pain meds give you the albity to work 18 hours straight with Susan Rogers in the room and not slow down a clip?

The truth of the matter is there is no evidence to show that he was a life long user of pain meds.

Nothing you say will change that.

ThatWhiteDude said:

laurarichardson said:

Did you think he put a gun to her head? Because to me that is forcing. She did not look distressed her that show and her mom was sitting right next to her. You run off and leave somone who is mistreating you. You do not stay in the big manision in Spain.

What I know comes from deduction and common sense. You are still caring on about his charater as if you had some personal relationship with him.

That's why I stop to discuss that matter with you any further, you entitle yourself all over again and say that you know EVERYTHING better than the rest on the org.

Ever talked to a woman that was physically abused (NO I DON'T IMPLIE THAT P DID IT JUST TO MAKE THAT CLEAR), she'll tell you how hard it is to run off and leave when someone is mistreating you.

Once again stop trying to speak for this woman.

[Edited 11/16/17 7:33am]

80tomato said:

Jehovahs Witnesses are not allowed to have surgery?

Yesterday i listened to a report of 2 women from Montreal, who died after childbirth , most likely due to their stated request not to have a blood transfusion if needed ,because of their JW beliefs.Yet I have been reading on the org that one may have blood tranfusions???? Can someone with direct knowledge clear this up please

See the interview with Ebony below. His 2010 surgery is mentioned.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/arts-and-entertainment/wp/2016/04/22/the-day-i-hung-out-at-princes-house-talking-fame-disguises-and-michael-jacksons-death/?utm_term=.2d3567a94dea

Two hours passed before Prince strode into the room to meet us, wearing fairly casual clothing, in his own unique style, of course: fitted black button-up shirt and black slacks, accented by Lucite-soled sneakers inset with lights that blinked on his every step. His walk was more of a “pimp,” really — partially due to a recent hip surgery, but also because Prince just had incredible swag.

--- Surgery has been mentioned by a few associates and I wonder what that 65k on for medical expenses was for on his inventory sheet.

Prince spent his career building that ´larger than life´ persona (even George Michael, a pop star himself, said he couldnt imagine Prince cleaning his house).

So, he couldnt show any weakness. Unfortunately it cost his life. Other pop stars took a time to be treated and survived.

GustavoRibas said:

Prince spent his career building that ´larger than life´ persona (even George Michael, a pop star himself, said he couldnt imagine Prince cleaning his house).

So, he couldnt show any weakness. Unfortunately it cost his life. Other pop stars took a time to be treated and survived.

But you do not know that he was not treated.

GustavoRibas said:

Prince spent his career building that ´larger than life´ persona (.

.

He may have (intentionally?) built a persona.

But he was not (re)building his home when it leaked, nor cared for his children (his songs) when the tapes became wet when leaks occurred.

He did not care properly for his body.

He did not care for paying his bills.

Etc, etc.

That, sadly, is what paints the correct picture.

udo said:

GustavoRibas said:

Prince spent his career building that ´larger than life´ persona (.

.

He may have (intentionally?) built a persona.

But he was not (re)building his home when it leaked, nor cared for his children (his songs) when the tapes became wet when leaks occurred.

He did not care properly for his body.

He did not care for paying his bills.

Etc, etc.

That, sadly, is what paints the correct picture.

But he was not (re)building his home when it leaked, nor cared for his children (his songs) when the tapes became wet when leaks occurred.

He did not care properly for his body.

He did not care for paying his bills.

Etc, etc.

----

What are talking about? Did someone say their was a leaking roof in Paisley Park?

Appraently there was a flood year ago.

How do you know a vegeterian and non-smoker did not care for his body?

He had very little debt when he died. No mortages.

laurarichardson said:

But he was not (re)building his home when it leaked, nor cared for his children (his songs) when the tapes became wet when leaks occurred.

He did not care properly for his body.

He did not care for paying his bills.

Etc, etc.

----

What are talking about? Did someone say their was a leaking roof in Paisley Park?

Appraently there was a flood year ago.

.

So he had a year to repair the roof, fix the damaged tapes or at least remove them.

.

How do you know a vegeterian and non-smoker did not care for his body?

He had very little debt when he died. No mortages.

.

A mortgage is for debt slaves.

With his cashflow having a mortgage is only interesting if there are tax write-offs in that area.

How many options do you have to pay off your mortgage?

.

I see no arguments that show that Prince did care for his tapes, his building (house!).

ThatWhiteDude said:

fortuneandserendipity said:

Granted, and P could always have delayed the interview, rather than cancel it altogether.

Let's try and be sane here, and seek the middle ground instead of being absolutist about everything

Okay that. At least he should've done that, rather than putting his wife through this shit just to promote a fucking Album

Oh Baby, you are ON FIRE...loving every comment WhiteDude...carry on!!!!

ThatWhiteDude said:

fortuneandserendipity said:

Amazing how good The Smiths's Andy Rourke's basslines were, when he was hooked on heroin Or Peter Buck's brilliant guitar playing and songwriting when he was using drink and drugs since the age of 14 to deal with depression and anxiety issues

Funny that.

Stop with the facts, they don't belong on the org.

OMG, YES!!!!! HYSTERICALLY TRUE!!!!!

ThatWhiteDude said:

PennyPurple said:

WTH you mean she didn't look distressed? She was trying to hold in her sobs and her lips were quivering trying to hold back.

Forget it, Laura knows it always better. 'Cause she got common sense.

Yeah, VERY common.

Morgaine said:

laurarichardson said:

Did you think he put a gun to her head? Because to me that is forcing. She did not look distressed her that show and her mom was sitting right next to her. You run off and leave somone who is mistreating you. You do not stay in the big manision in Spain.

What I know comes from deduction and common sense. You are still caring on about his charater as if you had some personal relationship with him.

Mayte has publicly stated that she wasn't there for him, either, that they were both lost. She also stated she had her "mask" on during the interview. Her mother was not sitting next to her during the interview, though she appeared briefly with others who were asked how they addressed him. You've stated no one but P and Mayte know what truly occurred (which I agree with) but then state due to your personal "deduction and common sense" that she wasn't distressed because if she was she would have left him. Utilizing and possessing "deduction and common sense" is not synonymous with facts, truth, or inherent knowledge. And it appears you have a great deal of bias against several people involved. Peace & Be Wild

Thanks, excellent, intelligent observations.

udo said:

GustavoRibas said:

Prince spent his career building that ´larger than life´ persona (.

.

He may have (intentionally?) built a persona.

But he was not (re)building his home when it leaked, nor cared for his children (his songs) when the tapes became wet when leaks occurred.

He did not care properly for his body.

He did not care for paying his bills.

Etc, etc.

That, sadly, is what paints the correct picture.

Reality has no place on the Org.

Bodhitheblackdog said:

ThatWhiteDude said:

Forget it, Laura knows it always better. 'Cause she got common sense.

Yeah, VERY common.

laurarichardson said:

GustavoRibas said:

Prince spent his career building that ´larger than life´ persona (even George Michael, a pop star himself, said he couldnt imagine Prince cleaning his house).

So, he couldnt show any weakness. Unfortunately it cost his life. Other pop stars took a time to be treated and survived.

But you do not know that he was not treated.

Well, werent there some reports that Prince only seeked for help after the plane incident and the doctor´s son arrived at PP too late?

Bodhitheblackdog said:

ThatWhiteDude said:

Okay that. At least he should've done that, rather than putting his wife through this shit just to promote a fucking Album

Oh Baby, you are ON FIRE...loving every comment WhiteDude...carry on!!!!

Thank you Bod

How about all you pundits and armchair psychologists stop obsessing over something that happened 20 years ago and realize the death of his kid (and whichever way he handled it) would have no standing on how he died from unrelated causes 20 fucking years later. I swear people reach so hard on this website. And yeah we get it, it was wrong for him to make Mayte appear on Oprah, but give him the same sympathy you're giving her, he was a pop star with a career to continue. Imagine how hard it is to keep going with the happiest album of your life after your cause of happiness dies. Give him some cred. It's disgusting how some are going after Amiir's mother and others going after his father. It was a horrible situation, why the fuck are people looking for someone to blame?

laurarichardson said:

ThatWhiteDude said:

That's why I stop to discuss that matter with you any further, you entitle yourself all over again and say that you know EVERYTHING better than the rest on the org.

Ever talked to a woman that was physically abused (NO I DON'T IMPLIE THAT P DID IT JUST TO MAKE THAT CLEAR), she'll tell you how hard it is to run off and leave when someone is mistreating you.

Once again stop trying to speak for this woman.

[Edited 11/16/17 7:33am]

Well, I'm on the org, she's not. You're putting her down whenever you see the chance to do so. So, I was raised to raise my voice for people who simply can't. Mayte's not on the org to defend herself, so I chose to defend her on that subject.

ThatWhiteDude said:

laurarichardson said:

Once again stop trying to speak for this woman.

[Edited 11/16/17 7:33am]

Well, I'm on the org, she's not. You're putting her down whenever you see the chance to do so. So, I was raised to raise my voice for people who simply can't. Mayte's not on the org to defend herself, so I chose to defend her on that subject.

She is perfectly capable of speaking for herself while cashing her book checks.

laurarichardson said:

ThatWhiteDude said:

Well, I'm on the org, she's not. You're putting her down whenever you see the chance to do so. So, I was raised to raise my voice for people who simply can't. Mayte's not on the org to defend herself, so I chose to defend her on that subject.

She is perfectly capable of speaking for herself while cashing her book checks.

Not on the org.

FunkyBrotha said:

It's a good analysis of what happened and quite a simple root cause. I think this is a deep rooted problem in america that really strikes at the heart of how Americans feel and act at home and across the world. They have always had this fear of being perceived as weak, past it and vulnerable. Americans tend to 'put a face on' in dark times. There is nothing particularly wrong with that behaviour and in some respects its a mark of how America itself became a successful nation. But at human and personal level it seems to be causing individuals harm. That's the way I see it. In the UK if someone has something wrong with them EVERYBODY knows about it

Thanks for your interesting and thought provoking comment. More than a few people have opined here that the death of Amiir was a seminar turning point in Prince's life...associates have described it as downhill from there, going off the rails etc. Why can't some concede that it was so painful to him that it may have been just too hard to come back to a place of emotional equilibrium without self-medicating with whatever...?