Well I still stand by UTCM and Graffiti Bridge. I always got Prince when he tried to preach or throw God/Faith into his projects/music. Some people didn't like it, but I was ok with it but that is just me.

I still think the music is good in both films and I also appreciate that Prince was trying. I get that especially GB is like a gag film to most even Prince fans, but I like it!

AnnaStesia10 said:

Well I still stand by UTCM and Graffiti Bridge. I always got Prince when he tried to preach or throw God/Faith into his projects/music. Some people didn't like it, but I was ok with it but that is just me.

I still think the music is good in both films and I also appreciate that Prince was trying. I get that especially GB is like a gag film to most even Prince fans, but I like it!

ya, and i still say utcm isn't as bad as everyone says, it could have been a lot better but it wasn't bad. Maybe if we have some filmakers here, i made a few, and i can tell you it just isn't that easy getting anything to turn out right. So, for the experience he had it wasn't that bad. I think the Beatle's magical mystery tour was much worse, jimi hendrix had a silly film too but I don't think he directed it. Uh, Elvis never had any real input into his films but he was never so ambitious as to try to make a real feature film. He did make a documentary about Martial Arts that was pretty awful and embarrassing. Prince ain't alone, to say the least.

There are some genuinely wonderful moments in UTCM and some of the photography is stunning - nice choice of location. It is a bit of a wonky movie though but I still adore it.

ThePanther said:

GottaLetitgo said:

Prince's love for what he was trying to create is evident throughout, the movie works hard to be something meaningful. In the end, the movie is ultimately plagued by weak character development....

.

Lol! That's like saying World War II failed to win the Nobel Peace Prize because it was plagued by violence.

.

The movie does not work hard to be something meaningful. The movie does project Prince's fantasies on screen, in an entirely egocentric manner.

.

It's a 5-star turkey, sitting comfortably alongside Plan 9 From Outer Space and Santa Claus Conquers the Martians. Naturally, there are a few nutty Prince aficionados who like it -- these are the same kind of fans who find "deep meaning" in Prince's excrement. And the three decades of pop-culture detritus since its release have added kitsch to its "qualities". But make no mistake, it's an abysmal, horrendous, piece of crap.

I respectively disagree with your overall assessment. It has been cast as a bomb of that level (and won Multiple Gold Raspberries which is the Oscars for bad movies) but I think there was something there that Prince couldn't quite get to translate. I do agree that ego reins supreme in the movie. Literally every living thing is supposedly completely attracted to Christopher Tracy and it's hard to tell if this was Prince showing love for himself or drawing a character way too sharply (or both). I love all the scenee where the rich people just give Christopher and Tricky stacks of money for apparantly no reason...are they going to be doing something later or are Christopher and Tricky that irresisitable? I think a Prince fan is going to like, or at least get, the movie more than a non-Prince fan but I have seen Plan 9 and Howard the Duck and all the rest and I would not put it in that same category. Graffiti Bridge, however,...

SimonCharles said:

There are some genuinely wonderful moments in UTCM and some of the photography is stunning - nice choice of location. It is a bit of a wonky movie though but I still adore it.

that's my take, his photography was fantastic, he had a good eye, as they say. He could have done more if he weren't so big headed.

jkrumes said:

I just watched it again the other day and was thinking that because it's in B&W, it looks timeless, and could easily be passed-off as a recent release. I like it; it's a fun movie.

I can't remember where I read it, but Prince was apparently fascinated with movies from the 1920/30s around this time. Chaplin, Valentine, etc. He was even experimenting with it in the music - All My Dreams definitely has that feel. I like the black and white - but then, I watch a lot of classic film, so it looks "normal" to me.

Genesia said:

jkrumes said:

I just watched it again the other day and was thinking that because it's in B&W, it looks timeless, and could easily be passed-off as a recent release. I like it; it's a fun movie.

I can't remember where I read it, but Prince was apparently fascinated with movies from the 1920/30s around this time. Chaplin, Valentine, etc. He was even experimenting with it in the music - All My Dreams definitely has that feel. I like the black and white - but then, I watch a lot of classic film, so it looks "normal" to me.

Except the balck and white came off as the gimmick it was and never really took advantage of the things it offered. I'm thinking of Hitchcock's Psycho, Lynch's The Elephant Man and the Coen's The Man Who Wasn't There. Then again, comparing Prince as a filmmaker to those guys is like comparing them to him as a musician.

So there's that. Still not a good movie though.

herb4 said:

It's a pretty bad film but I dug it moderately enough at the time.

It's just such a total vanity project. All the preening and posing...it gets goofy after a while. PRince is supposed to be the "good guy" and a sympathetic character but half the time he just comes off as a self absorbed asshole who's trying to get this girl for her money. Several of the "comedic" bits fell flat, seemed like corny inside jokes and were often cringe worthy (the 'eyes', the bats, the bathtub scene).

I think it would have been better if Christopher Tracy had been played as a struggling street musician from the "wrong side of the tracks" who captures Mary's attention with something resembling charm and shyness, or maybe saves her from a mugger or a pickpocket, rather than the egocentric "gigolo" who's supposed to be rather poor but somehow has all these expensive clothes, a fancy car and a secret Prince cave by the beach. Maybe he crashes her party or is part of the band hired to play and cathes her eye and ears. Play him as a barely making it hustler/guitar player who secretly has a heart of gold and helps kids or something.

Instead of sequins and midriffs and things, have him still dress "cool" but in a more thrift store type of way that effectively describes his poverty but still emphasizes his artistic sensibilities.

This way we render the character sympathetic and actully get more scenes of Prince actually playing music which is what was really missing and why so many people disliked the film. Very few people want to watch Prince hamming it up, mugging for the camera and vamping like a dapper dandy for 90 minutes. It would have been a good vehicle to showcase his acoustic guitar skills and let people see that side of his talent too. Let him be doing his music on street corners while Tricky passes the hat.

I like your ideas.

Genesia said:

jkrumes said:

I just watched it again the other day and was thinking that because it's in B&W, it looks timeless, and could easily be passed-off as a recent release. I like it; it's a fun movie.

I can't remember where I read it, but Prince was apparently fascinated with movies from the 1920/30s around this time. Chaplin, Valentine, etc. He was even experimenting with it in the music - All My Dreams definitely has that feel. I like the black and white - but then, I watch a lot of classic film, so it looks "normal" to me.

i think you mean valentino. yes he was a 30's buff that's pretty much established.

herb4 said:

Genesia said:

I can't remember where I read it, but Prince was apparently fascinated with movies from the 1920/30s around this time. Chaplin, Valentine, etc. He was even experimenting with it in the music - All My Dreams definitely has that feel. I like the black and white - but then, I watch a lot of classic film, so it looks "normal" to me.

Except the balck and white came off as the gimmick it was and never really took advantage of the things it offered. I'm thinking of Hitchcock's Psycho, Lynch's The Elephant Man and the Coen's The Man Who Wasn't There. Then again, comparing Prince as a filmmaker to those guys is like comparing them to him as a musician.

So there's that. Still not a good movie though.

To be fair, though, Prince wanted the film in B/W from the beginning, while WB insisted that they shoot it on color stock, then move it to B/W. It was never going to look right because a movie shot on black-and-white stock has to be lit differently, the clothing needs to be colored so as to make the most of contrasts, etc. etc.

Unfortunately, a neophyte director who is fighting other battles isn't going to be able to make that case. So, yeah - the film looks like it was shot in color and then had a "mood" filter imposed on it.

herb4 said:

Genesia said:

I can't remember where I read it, but Prince was apparently fascinated with movies from the 1920/30s around this time. Chaplin, Valentine, etc. He was even experimenting with it in the music - All My Dreams definitely has that feel. I like the black and white - but then, I watch a lot of classic film, so it looks "normal" to me.

Except the balck and white came off as the gimmick it was and never really took advantage of the things it offered. I'm thinking of Hitchcock's Psycho, Lynch's The Elephant Man and the Coen's The Man Who Wasn't There. Then again, comparing Prince as a filmmaker to those guys is like comparing them to him as a musician.

So there's that. Still not a good movie though.

out of all the things that stunk the film up I think the b&w were the least of his worries. it was cool and consistent with the album and clothes.

PeteSilas said:

Genesia said:

I can't remember where I read it, but Prince was apparently fascinated with movies from the 1920/30s around this time. Chaplin, Valentine, etc. He was even experimenting with it in the music - All My Dreams definitely has that feel. I like the black and white - but then, I watch a lot of classic film, so it looks "normal" to me.

i think you mean valentino. yes he was a 30's buff that's pretty much established.

Thanks for pointing out my typo. Of course, I mean Valentino.

I liked too liked UTCM in B&W, and love the scenery in Nice, OMG. That movie made me want to go to France and I even took French in H.S. because of that film and the dang Parade album (no joke). But Prince was only 27 when he directed this film, and with him not having any real experience other than acting and contributing to Purple Rain, UTCM is not bad considering. The music makes it for me, and the humor between Prince and Jerome. This is the first time his fans got to witness his funny side and I couldn't get enough. And yes the clothes in UTCM are bad ass. Still 30 years later the fashion was tight. I loved the 20's/30's throwback as well. Man sorry y'all I love this film. But maybe I am biased because the Parade and SOTT albums have a special connection for me. This timeframe is when Prince started to heavily influence my musical tastes and everything. It's like your first boyfriend/girlfriend, you never forget that time and the feeling. So UTCM does that for me, along with SOTT music film!

SoulAlive said:

herb4 said:

...stuff...

This way we render the character sympathetic and actully get more scenes of Prince actually playing music which is what was really missing and why so many people disliked the film. Very few people want to watch Prince hamming it up, mugging for the camera and vamping like a dapper dandy for 90 minutes. It would have been a good vehicle to showcase his acoustic guitar skills and let people see that side of his talent too. Let him be doing his music on street corners while Tricky passes the hat.

I like your ideas.

Well thanks.

I think the idea of Prince playing a lowly street musician, or even an accomplished one, who sees some hustler, say, trying to steal Mary's purse or pick pocket her and stops it or points it out would work better. He gets her attention. He gives her back her purse and makes eyes at her. She gives him a reward or is shuffled off by her uptight parents before she can. Later, she encounters him again some way or another (or to come back and give him his reward) and he's WRITTEN HER A SONG. It's played poignantly and beautfully by Prince and speaks directly to HER on guitar or piano. Even accapella. He looks at ther with those big brown eyes and she's mesmerized. THAT the audience would buy.

As the film stands, we're supposed to like Christopher Tracy just because he's Prince and has a sequined midriff, wears heels, bathes with his hat on and is cooler than them uptight rich white folk, not for anything he DOES in the film. He's a narcissistic asshole thoughout.

AnnaStesia10 said:

I even took French in H.S. because of that film and the dang Parade album (no joke).

So what's the chick speaking French in Girls & Boys saying? I never figured it out.

herb4 said:

AnnaStesia10 said:

I even took French in H.S. because of that film and the dang Parade album (no joke).

So what's the chick speaking French in Girls & Boys saying? I never figured it out.

Marie France is a graduate of fine arts from a Beaux Arts School and of liberal arts from the Sorbonne in Paris, France. She has been designing costumes for 27 years, and began her career collaborating with musician-composer Prince, designing his features "Purple Rain" and "Under the Cherry Moon", and his music videos.

http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0289827/bio

Maybe we can play 2day
Vous êtes très belle, girls and boys

Vous étiez de l'autre côté de la salle

Vous dansiez si fort je sentais votre parfum

Votre sourire me dit que nous devrions nous parler...

Sur la piste de dance, baby

Fais cet appel pour moi

Oh oui, baby - sexe et repos

Et ne résistez pas

Vous savez que vous aimerez ca, baby, oh ouah

Je vous enlacerai avec mes jambes, baby

Pendant des heures je veux vous étonner, baby

Fleurs dans votre bain, amour dans vos draps

Faire l'amour, faire l'amour - où nous rencontrerons-nous?

.

U were on the other end of the room
U were dancing so hard I could smell your perfume
Your smile tells me that we should talk...
On the dance floor, baby
Make that call 4 me
Oh yes, baby - sex and rest
And U won't resist it
U know U'll like that, baby, oh ow!
I will wrap my legs around U, baby
4 hours and hours I want 2 amaze U, baby
Flowers in your bath, love in your sheets
Make love, make love - where will we meet?

OldFriends4Sale said:

herb4 said:

So what's the chick speaking French in Girls & Boys saying? I never figured it out.

Marie France is a graduate of fine arts from a Beaux Arts School and of liberal arts from the Sorbonne in Paris, France. She has been designing costumes for 27 years, and began her career collaborating with musician-composer Prince, designing his features "Purple Rain" and "Under the Cherry Moon", and his music videos.

http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0289827/bio

Maybe we can play 2day
Vous êtes très belle, girls and boys

Vous étiez de l'autre côté de la salle

Vous dansiez si fort je sentais votre parfum

Votre sourire me dit que nous devrions nous parler...

Sur la piste de dance, baby

Fais cet appel pour moi

Oh oui, baby - sexe et repos

Et ne résistez pas

Vous savez que vous aimerez ca, baby, oh ouah

Je vous enlacerai avec mes jambes, baby

Pendant des heures je veux vous étonner, baby

Fleurs dans votre bain, amour dans vos draps

Faire l'amour, faire l'amour - où nous rencontrerons-nous?

.

U were on the other end of the room
U were dancing so hard I could smell your perfume
Your smile tells me that we should talk...
On the dance floor, baby
Make that call 4 me
Oh yes, baby - sex and rest
And U won't resist it
U know U'll like that, baby, oh ow!
I will wrap my legs around U, baby
4 hours and hours I want 2 amaze U, baby
Flowers in your bath, love in your sheets
Make love, make love - where will we meet?

thx.

*tips hat*

herb4 said:

SoulAlive said:

I like your ideas.

Well thanks.

I think the idea of Prince playing a lowly street musician, or even an accomplished one, who sees some hustler, say, trying to steal Mary's purse or pick pocket her and stops it or points it out would work better. He gets her attention. He gives her back her purse and makes eyes at her. She gives him a reward or is shuffled off by her uptight parents before she can. Later, she encounters him again some way or another (or to come back and give him his reward) and he's WRITTEN HER A SONG. It's played poignantly and beautfully by Prince and speaks directly to HER on guitar or piano. Even accapella. He looks at ther with those big brown eyes and she's mesmerized. THAT the audience would buy.

As the film stands, we're supposed to like Christopher Tracy just because he's Prince and has a sequined midriff, wears heels, bathes with his hat on and is cooler than them uptight rich white folk, not for anything he DOES in the film. He's a narcissistic asshole thoughout.

haha and you're an asshole for pointing it out but it's true.

herb4 said:

AnnaStesia10 said:

I even took French in H.S. because of that film and the dang Parade album (no joke).

So what's the chick speaking French in Girls & Boys saying? I never figured it out.

i don't know but she sounds like she's pretty enthusiastic about it and says "baby" sounds like she's coming.

PeteSilas said:

herb4 said:

So what's the chick speaking French in Girls & Boys saying? I never figured it out.

i don't know but she sounds like she's pretty enthusiastic about it and says "baby" sounds like she's coming.

post #46

Genesia said:

herb4 said:

Except the balck and white came off as the gimmick it was and never really took advantage of the things it offered. I'm thinking of Hitchcock's Psycho, Lynch's The Elephant Man and the Coen's The Man Who Wasn't There. Then again, comparing Prince as a filmmaker to those guys is like comparing them to him as a musician.

So there's that. Still not a good movie though.

To be fair, though, Prince wanted the film in B/W from the beginning, while WB insisted that they shoot it on color stock, then move it to B/W. It was never going to look right because a movie shot on black-and-white stock has to be lit differently, the clothing needs to be colored so as to make the most of contrasts, etc. etc.

Unfortunately, a neophyte director who is fighting other battles isn't going to be able to make that case. So, yeah - the film looks like it was shot in color and then had a "mood" filter imposed on it.

Well, most modern black and white films were filmed in color. Black and white film is more expensive.

Everyone has already listed why it didn't work - he was so damn CUTE in it though GREAT music, bad film, especially the death scene. Prince was no actor, & him directing himself on his SECOND effort was a huge mistake, but you couldn't have told him that if you were Scorsese I find it enjoyable, there's some funny stuff & some seriously cringe-worthy stuff. It was also very "WHERE THE WHITE WOMEN AT??!!!" which is a thing in itself *cue the Org freak out*

Even with all that, GB makes it look like Goodfellas

DiscoBallz said:

A free spirited man and his his funny friend find themselves in a wealthy circle by fate and circumstance. The man encounters a rich girl who is snobby but also a bit of a rebel. She is not happy with the constraints that life has put on her, particularly the pressure from her parent to marry a wealthy suitor. The free spirit brings her down to his world, shows her how to have fun, and she falls in love with him. A scene occurs that casts doubt on his intentions, is it love or money that he wants. But they reconcile and overcome a deadly water-based occurence where the man ultimately sacrifices himself for the girl he loves. The rich girl breaks free from her oppressive parent and becomes her own person. Under the Cherry Moon? No, I am discussing the Oscar winning 1997 classic Titanic. James Cameron owes Prince a debt of gratitude. Other than that big boat in his movie, the plot for Titanic is a complete rip-off of UTCM. (Note: Anticipating responses where people will say that UTCM borrowed from numerous sources, going all the way back to Shakespeare, I would say this is correct. But dang if Titanic doesn't seem like it has the EXACT plot as UTCM, save the reference to the big boat and the tragedy that ensued).

I think people have to understand Prince's sense of humor to appreciate this movie. This is perfect Prince IMO. So campy it's funny. He was a brilliant artist but he could also take a joke.

CalhounSq said:

GottaLetitgo said:

A free spirited man and his his funny friend find themselves in a wealthy circle by fate and circumstance. The man encounters a rich girl who is snobby but also a bit of a rebel. She is not happy with the constraints that life has put on her, particularly the pressure from her parent to marry a wealthy suitor. The free spirit brings her down to his world, shows her how to have fun, and she falls in love with him. A scene occurs that casts doubt on his intentions, is it love or money that he wants. But they reconcile and overcome a deadly water-based occurence where the man ultimately sacrifices himself for the girl he loves. The rich girl breaks free from her oppressive parent and becomes her own person. Under the Cherry Moon? No, I am discussing the Oscar winning 1997 classic Titanic. James Cameron owes Prince a debt of gratitude. Other than that big boat in his movie, the plot for Titanic is a complete rip-off of UTCM. (Note: Anticipating responses where people will say that UTCM borrowed from numerous sources, going all the way back to Shakespeare, I would say this is correct. But dang if Titanic doesn't seem like it has the EXACT plot as UTCM, save the reference to the big boat and the tragedy that ensued).

I never thought of this. that's sort of funny. Major differences though: DiCaprio can act and Cameron can direct. Leo didn't wear a sequined midriff or a gaucho hat in the tub either.

Major similarity though is that, like the Titanic, Under the Cherry Moon was a disaster.

CalhounSq said:

Everyone has already listed why it didn't work - he was so damn CUTE in it though GREAT music, bad film, especially the death scene. Prince was no actor, & him directing himself on his SECOND effort was a huge mistake, but you couldn't have told him that if you were Scorsese I find it enjoyable, there's some funny stuff & some seriously cringe-worthy stuff. It was also very "WHERE THE WHITE WOMEN AT??!!!" which is a thing in itself *cue the Org freak out*

Even with all that, GB makes it look like Goodfellas

ya, in poplife the book, Hill mentions that scene where the old black woman scares christopher and asks him where he's been. that was a pretty insulting scene for his own. Dude coulda been a good filmaker though, i'm sure, no one complains about sott.

PeteSilas said:

CalhounSq said:

Everyone has already listed why it didn't work - he was so damn CUTE in it though GREAT music, bad film, especially the death scene. Prince was no actor, & him directing himself on his SECOND effort was a huge mistake, but you couldn't have told him that if you were Scorsese I find it enjoyable, there's some funny stuff & some seriously cringe-worthy stuff. It was also very "WHERE THE WHITE WOMEN AT??!!!" which is a thing in itself *cue the Org freak out*

Even with all that, GB makes it look like Goodfellas

ya, in poplife the book, Hill mentions that scene where the old black woman scares christopher and asks him where he's been. that was a pretty insulting scene for his own. Dude coulda been a good filmaker though, i'm sure, no one complains about sott.

Prince didn't direct SOTT.