Chiquetet said:

PositivityNYC said:

interesting comments on http://www.spin.com/artic...ase-desist

and http://therapup.net/2012/...big-prince ...

Very interesting - thanks for pointing it out.

More discussion about Andy Warhol that helps put it in perspective:

PurpleTrekkie

When Andy Warhol (who was a fan of Prince's) did the "Prince" portrait prints in 1984 (I read it was for an article about Prince that somebody wrote in "Vanity Fair") ~ when P was just getting really famous, and Warhol already was ~ Prince didn't try to sue him. They didn't even meet until 1986. Is it only famous, well-known artists that can create Prince-related art - for $$$ - and not get sued by him for it?

Did Warhol market/sell calendars of his Prince portrait?

Is there a difference between Andy Warhol and a fan making Prince dolls with little outfits?

kenkamken said:

This is really sad and pathetic. I wonder why we're all even still here? Whatever was left of our hero is lost in some labryinthe perhaps never to be seen again. If he does resurface out of this shell of his former self, who is even going to care? Wake up.

Don't know about you, but my hero (or as I just call him, Prince) always did/does whatever the funk he wants.

This is the same guy who ditched the "we are the world" recording session, fired Jimmy and Terry for missing a flight, fines band members, etc.

Are you/were you really a Prince fan because of what a nice dude he is/was? Are you thinking of Tom Hanks, maybe?

All I am saying is: Prince is the same as his former self. Were you not around in the 80's?

Also, he is WELL with in his legal rights. How do people not see that?

[Edited 11/15/12 16:37pm]

skywalker said:

kenkamken said:

This is really sad and pathetic. I wonder why we're all even still here? Whatever was left of our hero is lost in some labryinthe perhaps never to be seen again. If he does resurface out of this shell of his former self, who is even going to care? Wake up.

Don't know about you, but my hero (or as I just call him, Prince) always did/does whatever the funk he wants.

This is the same guy who ditched the "we are the world" recording session, fired Jimmy and Terry for missing a flight, fines band members, etc.

Are you/were you really a Prince fan because of what a nice dude he is/was? Are you thinking of Tom Hanks, maybe?

All I am saying is: Prince is the same as his former self. Were you not around in the 80's?

Also, he is WELL with in his legal rights. How do people not see that?

[Edited 11/15/12 16:37pm]

Dude, get out of my head.

You have just been slayin the opposition in here.

skywalker said:

kenkamken said:

This is really sad and pathetic. I wonder why we're all even still here? Whatever was left of our hero is lost in some labryinthe perhaps never to be seen again. If he does resurface out of this shell of his former self, who is even going to care? Wake up.

Don't know about you, but my hero (or as I just call him, Prince) always did/does whatever the funk he wants.

This is the same guy who ditched the "we are the world" recording session, fired Jimmy and Terry for missing a flight, fines band members, etc.

Are you/were you really a Prince fan because of what a nice dude he is/was? Are you thinking of Tom Hanks, maybe?

All I am saying is: Prince is the same as his former self. Were you not around in the 80's?

Also, he is WELL with in his legal rights. How do people not see that?

[Edited 11/15/12 16:37pm]

no prince has no legal right .. i could paint a picture of prince right now .. call it "a picture of prince" .. sell it on tshirts and calenders .. why? because I painted it .. prince did nothing .. he is a subject just like a bowl of fruit or the sunset ... he is a part of the world and he has no right to say who can do what with what they create .. best i can tell .. Troy made everything from scratch .. no prince involvement .. Troy can do whatever the hell he wants with his art .. prince is just jealous cuz Troy will now get more press than his crappy new crapfest single

Ohhh here's more!

http://music.cbc.ca/#/blo...s-art-doll

http://www.contactmusic.c...st_3374999

http://news.msn.com/pop-c...s-artist-1

http://exclaim.ca/News/pr...te_project

http://www.tumblr.com/tag...urple-rain

http://blogs.citypages.co...reator.php

http://board.okayplayer.c...7&page=

http://www.i4u.com/2012/1...troy-gua-s

http://www.flavorwire.com...rt-project

ohh wow tv

http://www.mynews3.com/co...fB1dw.cspx

http://www.fox23.com/ente...fB1dw.cspx

http://www.kget.com/enter...fB1dw.cspx

http://www.knvn.com/enter...fB1dw.cspx

Bad press for Prince generated by fans.

And now we don't even want to buy his latest single, cause it's so crap. I feel sorry for the little guy, but maybe he's a little outta space?

He's been way out in space for ages.

Anyone else think there might be a case for taking P to court?

He's been impersonating Prince in the studio for more than 20 odd years.

Rolling Stone Magazine - Italy http://translate.google.c...CCUQ7gEwAQ

Wow it's getting worse, bad timing to collide with Superconductor release and his own sonically dull single release

Makes me feel bad since I hate both singles, but Prince is a cold man! It's bad and dull times to be a fan at the moment. I need a break!

Fonkyman said:

He's been way out in space for ages.

Anyone else think there might be a case for taking P to court?

He's been impersonating Prince in the studio for more than 20 odd years.

The negative reviews are also due to his actions of shutting down people. He's not only shutting down fan projects, he's also shutting down fans in general to keep them in control. Another reason why fans are not getting excited anymore or even hyping up his mediocre releases. On the contrary, he's alienating folks and causing all this negativity. It wouldn't be half bad, if his latest output was really great, but rock and roll affair could be nominated as the worst single released this year by any artist. Now it makes one wonder who is he releasing all these things for? I don't know what he's thinking, lol!

[Edited 11/15/12 18:42pm]

Chiquetet said:

purplecrack said:

Copyrighted logos misused, and copyrighted artwork reproduced (scanned and printed) cannot be propped up as "art".

Can you give a specific example of a copyrighted artwork that was reproduced (scanned and printed) as part of the "Le Petit Prince" project?

The illustrated face from the inner sleeve of the Purple Rain LP also used on official shirts and in the "When Doves Cry " video among other sources.

[Edited 11/15/12 18:45pm]

TrevorAyer said:

no prince has no legal right .. i could paint a picture of prince right now .. call it "a picture of prince" .. sell it on tshirts and calenders .. why? because I painted it .. prince did nothing .. he is a subject just like a bowl of fruit or the sunset ... he is a part of the world and he has no right to say who can do what with what they create .. best i can tell .. Troy made everything from scratch .. no prince involvement .. Troy can do whatever the hell he wants with his art .. prince is just jealous cuz Troy will now get more press than his crappy new crapfest single

As long as your picture of Prince doesn't look like much Prince(aka contain his likeness) doesn't have his trademarked logos, you'd be fine.

purplecrack said:

Chiquetet said:

Can you give a specific example of a copyrighted artwork that was reproduced (scanned and printed) as part of the "Le Petit Prince" project?

The illustrated face from the inner sleeve of the Purple Rain LP also used on official shirts and in the "When Doves Cry " video among other sources.

[Edited 11/15/12 18:45pm]

Troy caused this trouble by selling merchandise. He's entitled to reproduce Prince art and exhibit his own art, but he can't make profit of this. He should never have sold anything, I think this was his mistake. Besides, Prince is a small man, he may have gone crazy about a depiction of a petit small Prince. Funny!

OzlemUcucu said:

purplecrack said:

The illustrated face from the inner sleeve of the Purple Rain LP also used on official shirts and in the "When Doves Cry " video among other sources.

[Edited 11/15/12 18:45pm]

Troy caused this trouble by selling merchandise. He's entitled to reproduce Prince art and exhibit his own art, but he can't make profit of this. He should never have sold anything, I think this was his mistake. Besides, Prince is a small man, he may have gone crazy about a depiction of a petit small Prince. Funny!

Exactly.

skywalker said:

OzlemUcucu said:

Troy caused this trouble by selling merchandise. He's entitled to reproduce Prince art and exhibit his own art, but he can't make profit of this. He should never have sold anything, I think this was his mistake. Besides, Prince is a small man, he may have gone crazy about a depiction of a petit small Prince. Funny!

Exactly.

Shame really, cause we could have told him. I know he merchanised these things cause people asked for stuff, and he was willing to share with the community, but Prince don't want nobody to make profit off fan community. If you look at it that way, maybe Prince is not such a bad guy.

I find it very funny that the "tyranny big Prince" is after "tiny doll Prince" ass. Maybe he didn't like the depiction of his nude ass?

OzlemUcucu said:

skywalker said:

Exactly.

Shame really, cause we could have told him. I know he merchanised these things cause people asked for stuff, and he was willing to share with the community, but Prince don't want nobody to make profit off fan community. If you look at it that way, maybe Prince is not such a bad guy.

I find it very funny that the "tyranny big Prince" is after "tiny doll Prince" ass. Maybe he didn't like the depiction of his nude ass?

Maybe it's that someone was essentially (no matter the intention or level of craftsmanship) was making of Prince Barbie dolls...and selling related merchandise.

As I alluded to earlier, if Prince wanted Barbie dolls of himself...he probably would have struck a deal with Mattel and gotten paid for it.

[Edited 11/15/12 19:14pm]

skywalker said:

OzlemUcucu said:

Shame really, cause we could have told him. I know he merchanised these things cause people asked for stuff, and he was willing to share with the community, but Prince don't want nobody to make profit off fan community. If you look at it that way, maybe Prince is not such a bad guy.

I find it very funny that the "tyranny big Prince" is after "tiny doll Prince" ass. Maybe he didn't like the depiction of his nude ass?

Maybe it's that someone was essentially (no matter the intention or level of craftsmanship) was making of Prince Barbie dolls...and selling related merchandise.

As I alluded to earlier, if Prince wanted Barbie dolls of himself...he probably would have struck a deal with Mattel and gotten paid for it.

[Edited 11/15/12 19:14pm]

No, I don't think Prince cares about the doll. Prince only cares about anybody making profit off fan community. Prince does not know Troy and his intentions, nor does he probably care that Troy is a fan, and he created this doll for himself of admiration for Prince.

The only thing Prince cares is that no money has to be made. He also don't want professional fansites created to look like it's done by his camp and or promoted as such.. He shut down those, as you all know.

He should do something against those bootleggers that sell those stupid stuff for hundreds of cash on ebay, now that is what I would love to disappear, cause this shit is so nasty.

This is how I look at it.

Prince laid himself to rest in 1993. That's when the music, the persona, everything that made me a fan, went away. I think Prince wasn't a fan of himself either.

THIS GUY BELOW, looks and sounds like Prince, But I'm not a fan of his work and managing Prince's legacy. I had to learn to just let it/him go.

luv4u said:

Ohhh here's more!

http://music.cbc.ca/#/blo...s-art-doll

http://www.contactmusic.c...st_3374999

http://news.msn.com/pop-c...s-artist-1

http://exclaim.ca/News/pr...te_project

http://www.tumblr.com/tag...urple-rain

http://blogs.citypages.co...reator.php

http://board.okayplayer.c...7&page=

http://www.i4u.com/2012/1...troy-gua-s

http://www.flavorwire.com...rt-project

ohh wow tv

http://www.mynews3.com/co...fB1dw.cspx

http://www.fox23.com/ente...fB1dw.cspx

http://www.kget.com/enter...fB1dw.cspx

http://www.knvn.com/enter...fB1dw.cspx

YES!

G3000 said:

This is how I look at it.

Prince laid himself to rest in 1993. That's when the music, the persona, everything that made me a fan, went away. I think Prince wasn't a fan of himself either.

THIS GUY BELOW, looks and sounds like Prince, But I'm not a fan of his work and managing Prince's legacy. I had to learn to just let it/him go.

Whatever.

Prince 1993 and prior was a WAAAAAY nastier mf than the guy below. He was Mr. "Don't look him in the eyes" and all that. Again, no one remembers tales of Prince's bitchiness from the 80's?

OzlemUcucu said:

skywalker said:

Maybe it's that someone was essentially (no matter the intention or level of craftsmanship) was making of Prince Barbie dolls...and selling related merchandise.

As I alluded to earlier, if Prince wanted Barbie dolls of himself...he probably would have struck a deal with Mattel and gotten paid for it.

[Edited 11/15/12 19:14pm]

The only thing Prince cares is that no money has to be made. He also don't want professional fansites created to look like it's done by his camp and or promoted as such.. He shut down those, as you all know.

I agree. Look at is this way though..Troy's stuff is good enough and used all the signature Prince fonts/clothes/iconography that IT looks official.

As you said, Prince prolly doesn't want it looking like something coming from him officially...and it kinda did. And it was for $$$.

Damn short man syndrome kicking in P.?

'dre

skywalker said:

OzlemUcucu said:

The only thing Prince cares is that no money has to be made. He also don't want professional fansites created to look like it's done by his camp and or promoted as such.. He shut down those, as you all know.

I agree. Look at is this way though..Troy's stuff is good enough and used all the signature Prince fonts/clothes/iconography that IT looks official.

As you said, Prince prolly doesn't want it looking like something coming from him officially...and it kinda did. And it was for $$$.

the material even looks better than prince s official stuff

DreZone said:

Damn short man syndrome kicking in P.?

'dre

One could be getting that idea indeed.

If mr P were paying his stuff on time, keeping his side of CONtracts, fullfilling all of his markets, etc and mr Dollmaker would be reaping the daily grands of his labor then yes.

But now the case is quite different.

Where is my (legal) Montreux DVD?

Where is my (legal) 21 nights DVD?

Where is my (legal) 20ten DVD?

Where is my (legal) 2011 (welcome to America Europe whatever) DVD?

You get the idea, although I am not even terribly fond of video material.

Also this shows that there is no person in charge of his PR, or do they think that any publicity is good?

Same was true for his bills and contracts, so was mr P bored when he chose to have a C&D letter sent?

purplecrack said:

Chiquetet said:

Can you give a specific example of a copyrighted artwork that was reproduced (scanned and printed) as part of the "Le Petit Prince" project?

The illustrated face from the inner sleeve of the Purple Rain LP also used on official shirts and in the "When Doves Cry " video among other sources.

[Edited 11/15/12 18:45pm]

Look again.

Nothing in Troy's artwork has been scanned and/or printed from Prince's work. It has all been created from scratch. Every single backdrop/image/etc... is clearly different when you put them side by side, including the illustrated face.

But the point is, you don't put them side by side, which is the beauty of it. On first glance, for example, it looks like the 'Planet Earth' shot is just LPP on the normal backdrop of the album cover, but it's not. The planets are different, the earth is different and the letters in the background say "LPP".

If he were a musician, and he was wanting to use these images on an album cover, I think that would be rightfully shot down very quickly - it would be like someone drawing a McDonalds 'M' from scratch and then starting a fast food chain called "McDaniels". It would almost certainly confuse customers and that definitely could take money away from Prince.

But this is an artistic project and the stuff that he's selling goes directly into funding what must be an increasingly costly undertaking. There is no way known that anyone is going to say, "Hmmm...I've got $20 to spend - will I buy 'Purple Rain' or an LPP calendar? Oh, dang it, I'll get the calendar!"

Prince is not losing a cent from Troy selling enough merchandise to keep the project going.

No photos, no scanned images. Everything from scratch. Artwork.

I wouldn't be at all surprised if - assuming he even knows about it - Prince has been told that someone is putting his image or his artwork on calendars, etc... Maybe if he knew the real story, he'd reconsider. Maybe not, but who knows?

It's just such a shame.

luv4u said:

Ohhh here's more!

http://music.cbc.ca/#/blo...s-art-doll

http://www.contactmusic.c...st_3374999

http://news.msn.com/pop-c...s-artist-1

http://exclaim.ca/News/pr...te_project

http://www.tumblr.com/tag...urple-rain

http://blogs.citypages.co...reator.php

http://board.okayplayer.c...7&page=

http://www.i4u.com/2012/1...troy-gua-s

http://www.flavorwire.com...rt-project

ohh wow tv

http://www.mynews3.com/co...fB1dw.cspx

http://www.fox23.com/ente...fB1dw.cspx

http://www.kget.com/enter...fB1dw.cspx

http://www.knvn.com/enter...fB1dw.cspx

The more exposure the better. Hopefully he gets really pissed and is inspired to record a song in response.

Chiquetet said:

If he were a musician, and he was wanting to use these images on an album cover, I think that would be rightfully shot down very quickly - it would be like someone drawing a McDonalds 'M' from scratch and then starting a fast food chain called "McDaniels". It would almost certainly confuse customers and that definitely could take money away from Prince.

You just explained the whole thing/reason for Prince's people putting a halt to it.

But this is an artistic project and the stuff that he's selling goes directly into funding what must be an increasingly costly undertaking.

If Troy is making money, it doesn't matter what he uses it for. When Prince rips you off for $70+ bucks for his website, do you care that it goes back into his making music?

There is no way known that anyone is going to say, "Hmmm...I've got $20 to spend - will I buy 'Purple Rain' or an LPP calendar? Oh, dang it, I'll get the calendar!"

Really? I think that's exactly the issue.

As a Prince fan, I would have faced a decision next week to spend my the last of my fun money on one of Troy's calendars, or on an imported CD single of "Rock N Roll Love Affair". Now, the choice has been made clear to me.

Get it? If there is a Prince product on the market, Prince wants to get paid for it. Make no mistake about it, Troy's dolls are art, but once he started marketing/selling merchandise it became a Prince product.

To me, this thing is much about perceptions:

The same issues of ownership of Prince's sound/image/likeness that caused him to go to war with WB and "get free", are the same issues of ownership that causes Prince to shutdown Troy.

Basically, Prince thinks he is the only one that should be able to make money from Prince products.

Since one is a big bad corporation (faceless and easy to demonize), and one is a enthusicastic fan (whom we all can relate to), Prince looks like a hero/inspiration in one scenario and a petty asshole in the other.

Yet, it is the same principle that guides Prince (Prince's lawyers) in both cases.

Prince reserves the legal right to be the only one making money from Prince products-his music, likeness, iconography, etc.

G3000 said:

This is how I look at it.

Prince laid himself to rest in 1993. That's when the music, the persona, everything that made me a fan, went away. I think Prince wasn't a fan of himself either.

THIS GUY BELOW, looks and sounds like Prince, But I'm not a fan of his work and managing Prince's legacy. I had to learn to just let it/him go.

PurpleJedi said:

G3000 said:

This is how I look at it.

Prince laid himself to rest in 1993. That's when the music, the persona, everything that made me a fan, went away. I think Prince wasn't a fan of himself either.

THIS GUY BELOW, looks and sounds like Prince, But I'm not a fan of his work and managing Prince's legacy. I had to learn to just let it/him go.

It looks different to me. The new Prince can't stand himself. He distanced himself from the dude before, but if he was not happy before, he's less happy these days. He doesn't care anymore about being an inspiration. I don't even think he cares about making innovative music. I think he is enttitled to his decision.