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Reply #90 posted 10/15/09 9:59am

Deadflow3r

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jcurley said:

ernestsewell said:

People don't hate Prince. I don't hate Prince. But when an artist sets a standard for themselves, then fails to meet it....therein lies the problem.


I totally agree with you but don't you feel that Prince suffers this issue more than others. I kknow you can argue that maybe his original standard was higher than others and so has higher to fall. For example I do not have the Lotus album but i have heard Dance4me etc and this sounds like he is trying to recapture a sound that made him famous. I dont hear it as a cynical ploy to get sales just Prince conceiding to doing the pop that people (he feels) want from him. Yet critically this is deemed as weak and lacking. Yet contrary to most peoples complaints on here is for once doing his job as a recording artist. However much Prince can be a pain in the arse I do feel sorry for him as he really is in a lose lose position. Something unique from Prince and he is too obscure, something too immediate and he is a dried up self parody



I hate it when artists become a parody of themselves; it;s grotesque and sad. I'd rather him go out in the "to thy own self be true" mode and at least be doing stuff that he feels passionate about. IMO Lotusflow3r was an attempt to appeal to his old fans and I didn't feel the passion behind it. TRC was rejected by many but it DID clearly reflect where he was at musically and emotionally at that time in his life.
There came a time when the risk of remaining tight in the bud was more painful than the risk it took to blossom. Anais Nin.
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Reply #91 posted 10/15/09 11:05am

Bohemian67

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BartVanHemelen said:

Bohemian67 said:

Good post Emancipationlover. Question. Why should Prince tour more? Hate to bring MJ into this but he hadn't toured since 1997. He bought out Invincible which was brilliant but never toured. Had nothing to do with the music. Bart if you care to discover why MJ didn't tour listen to his YT videos. He hated it!! He was forced on camera to say "he loved touring." Off camera he said it killed him, it was tiring etc etc. Look what happened while preparing for This is it.


Are you guys NUTS? BLIND? LIVING UNDER A ROCK? You might have noticed that Prince HAS toured in the past 15 years -- except most of the time he couldn't be arsed to play his NEW music and instead he played music he recorded while he was a "SLAVE".

Now, call me nuts but if I was Prince and I thought my new music was just as good or better than the stuff I'd recorded 10/20 YEARS AGO, I'd play the NEW music, not the same ole crap. BUT PRINCE DIDN'T DO THAT.

Ain't that a bitch: Prince had a choice and instead of playing his super-duper new music (something he did do in 1983, 1984, 1985, 1986, 1987, 1988, 1994, 1995), he played OLD music. Not only that, most of the songs he released post-1995 have only been played a HANDFUL of times. So not even "occasionally", not even "every now and then", no they have been performed only RARELY.

Call me crazy, but if I were Prince and I thought my new music, which I recorded "while being free", is just as good as the old stuff, you're gonna hear it. Repeatedly. Don't like it? "You ain't gots da funk." Except THIS DID NOT HAPPEN. Ghee, I wonder why?


Bart van Hemelen. Whenever I see your post I just skip. I see you've quoted mine here though. I still haven't read what you say and have no plans to do so because there is only one message you leave on the board. And that is.

AND I WILL STRIKE DOWN UPON THEE with great vengeance and furious anger...those who attempt to poison and destroy my brothers and you WILL KNOW... MY NAME IS.....

Fill in the blank. razz
[Edited 10/15/09 11:05am]
[Edited 10/15/09 11:06am]
"Free URself, B the best that U can B, 3rd Apartment from the Sun, nothing left to fear" Prince Rogers Nelson - Forever in my Life -
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Reply #92 posted 10/15/09 11:09am

Bohemian67

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Well there might be gripes still about lotusflower but he sold out his concerts pretty quickly. The French interviewed afterward used words such as "extraordiaire, geniaal, tres tres funky" etc etc etc.
"Free URself, B the best that U can B, 3rd Apartment from the Sun, nothing left to fear" Prince Rogers Nelson - Forever in my Life -
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Reply #93 posted 10/15/09 12:21pm

meow85

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ernestsewell said:

People don't hate Prince. I don't hate Prince. But when an artist sets a standard for themselves, then fails to meet it....therein lies the problem.

And there we have it.
"A Watcher scoffs at gravity!"
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Reply #94 posted 10/15/09 12:23pm

meow85

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Joyinrepatition said:

whodknee said:

Ahh! What do the French know about music anyway? talk to the hand

biggrin



yeahthat all this from a nation who eat snails and frogs legs feeling ill

Hey man, snails is tasty eats.
"A Watcher scoffs at gravity!"
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Reply #95 posted 10/15/09 12:26pm

meow85

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JayJai said:

falloff
U ppl do realise that this will be debated till the end of time cause not everyone has the same tastes?
I'm not a fan of heavy rock so there are some songs on Lotusflow3r that I don't like, but there are some I like too.
That's just how it is...different strokes for different folk.

Let's see if this thread comes to a unanimous decision hmm

There's no heavy rock sound on the new discs...confuse

Did we buy the same album?
"A Watcher scoffs at gravity!"
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Reply #96 posted 10/18/09 12:47pm

eireboy34

Kinda regretting starting this thread!!!! confused confused
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Reply #97 posted 10/18/09 12:52pm

Imago

Dayclear said:

Opinions are like assholes, everybody's got one.

Yes but only you are talented enough to consistently talk out of yours. hug
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Reply #98 posted 10/18/09 1:22pm

violetblues

Opinions are like assholes, And a celebrity such as Prince, will of course have a huge following of assholes. More assholes than anyone even a gay porn star know what to do with.

I don't know which is the worse asshole, The ones bitching about the quality of the music, or the ones bitching about someone bitching about the quality.

...whatever the case i don't like that tired "asshole" analogy in the least, lets have a moratorium on it for a while. lol
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Reply #99 posted 10/18/09 1:34pm

Jeffiner

eireboy34 said:

Kinda regretting starting this thread!!!! confused confused


Yeah... right! You LOVE it! Admit it, go on, go on ..... lol hug
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Reply #100 posted 10/18/09 3:34pm

murph

1725topp said:

BartVanHemelen said:

Most sane fans still regard these concerts as the return of the Prince from the 1980s


So, I guess the insane fans would be those of us who liked The Symbol Album and roll our eyes every time we hear, "He's back" from wherever he was supposed to have been? Besides, my point is that Prince has a history of not playing killer songs when they are first released, and then playing them later, such as "Adore," which was only played at the aftershows for the SOTT Tour and as a brief snippet during the LoveSexy Tour, but found its way into the set list years later. There are some songs that are about a particular message and some songs about a particular mood, which tends to be more about creating something in the studio. Yet, Musicology songs were featured on the tour and 3121 and Planet Earth songs have shown up on other tours and been played on television to promote the albums so I would say that he's played them. My point is that he seems to think or know that most of the folk in attendance have come with a set list, and depending on his mood he will placate them.



He hates his former company, not his music. I never said that he does not like his old work. Why would he not play his older songs? When he is singing them live, he is making all the cash, which may be the greatest revenge of all. It's not like he's sending a check to WB after every live performance. Maybe you should learn to read slowly as well.

BartVanHemelen said:

So why can't you admit that all evidence points to Prince not caring for them?


Because it does not. There are a lot of reasons why certain songs get played live and some don't. Your logic means that Prince is saying, "I wrote these songs, I recorded these songs, I offered them for sale as a part of my legacy, but I don't like them." Maybe if he was tied to a long-term recoding contract, your theory would hold water. But since he records when he wants to record and tours when he wants to tour, there is no reason for him to write, record, and sell songs that he doesn't like. Now you could counter my point by asserting that he knows that no matter what he records and sells he’ll make a lot of money because there are plenty of Kook-Aid drinkers who will purchase anything with his name on it. Yet, if I’m willing to admit that his websites are terrible, that his photo/poetry book was uninteresting to me (even if I do like Indigo Nights), that the opening of the Nude Tour is my least favorite opening to a live show because I hate house music (I love everything after the house music ends), that the only song from Bria’s album that I have coupled with Lotusflow3r/MPLS is "Elixer," that most of the bootleg studio songs that I’ve heard do not move me (I’ve collected bootlegs since 1988), and that Prince has missed a great opportunity by not releasing more live audio and video, I could surely admit if I was not moved by his music or a particular release. His work does not sound uninspired to me, and you have not provided enough evidence to show that he doesn’t care for them.

However, even if the doesn’t care for Lotusflow3r/MPLS, there are a lot of songs that people like that the artist did not particularly like. Tina Turner did not initially like "What’s Love Got to Do with It," L. L. Cool J didn’t like "Going Back to Cali" or "I Need Love," and there are many other examples. As an artist, I can tell you that artists are often amazed as to what your audience will like. Sometimes, the artist is thinking, "I’mma kill’em with this," and the work is completely ignored. Then, other times, the artist thinks that the work is a throw-away piece, but it finds an audience, much like Louie Armstrong getting a hit with "Hello Dolly," a song that he recorded and forgot until he was on the road and fans were requesting it. So, even if you are right that Prince may not care for his latest production as much as his earlier work, it does not mean that the work lacks quality. Besides, it would be difficult for him or a Prince fan to like anything more than "Purple Rain."

As an adult, I don’t need Prince to blow my mind like he did when I was 14. I just want solid work, and Lotusflow3r/MPLS, in my opinion, is solid work with moments of Prince genius. "Dreamer," "Colonized Mind," "Feel Better, Feel Good, Feel Wonderful," "Dance 4 Me," and "Old Skool Company" have great energy and move me. He if wasn’t inspired or moved when he wrote them, it simply means that 70% of Prince pleases me more than 100% of what’s on today’s radio, so all I need him to be is 70%. But not liking his latest songs as much as he he likes his older songs does not mean that he does not like his latest songs at all, and it does not prove that he is uninspired. It simply means that with age one's style chagnes as one's priorities change. If fifty year old Prince was just writing "Head," "P-Control," "Days O Wild," or "Face Down," all songs that I love, I'd think that he was trying to hard to remain young, not that he was inspired or like those songs.



Bart...I think you need to quit while you are ahead...This post ^^^^ sums it up pretty well....This is what heppens when someone responds to your obsessive act with common sense and a level headed view of things...

You Bart are the other end of the spectrum of the Purple Kool-Aid drinkers who proclaim that everything Prince does is great and never criticizes the man for some of his head scratching actions towards the fans...You are a chronic complainer who has become a mere joke....Your every move can be telegraphed....It's kind of silly, really.
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Reply #101 posted 10/18/09 3:45pm

bsk3601

murph said:

You Bart are the other end of the spectrum of the Purple Kool-Aid drinkers who proclaim that everything Prince does is great and never criticizes the man for some of his head scratching actions towards the fans...You are a chronic complainer who has become a mere joke....Your every move can be telegraphed....It's kind of silly, really.


Cosign! and he's not the only one like this, murph... whistling There's more than a few of these "other-end-of-the-spectrum" fanatics...
In Bart's defense, I at least find his posts entertaining. In a mistermaxxx kinda way lol
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Reply #102 posted 10/18/09 6:39pm

mzsadii

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virginie74 said:

Since when my taste in music are influenced by other's opinions ?

The french press can say whatever they want, I like the three albums, all different.


yeahthat
Prince's Sarah
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Reply #103 posted 10/18/09 7:33pm

HonestMan13

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eireboy34 said:

In today's Journal du Dimanche newspaper, the accompanying magazine Femina has a go at Prince.

In their Tops/Flops section Prince is criticised for repeating himself.

A rough translation summary:

"Prince has aged well but his music hasn't. On the triple album, at best he repeats himself (badly).Prince is no longer charming".


It's hardly high-brow stuff but I just thought I'd let you know. smile


Did they specify which of his 20 some odd albums he was duplicating? It comes across as vague.
When eye go 2 a Prince concert or related event it's all heart up in the house but when eye log onto this site and the miasma of bitchiness is completely overwhelming!
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Reply #104 posted 10/18/09 7:37pm

HonestMan13

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BartVanHemelen said:

Joyinrepatition said:




yeahthat all this from a nation who eat snails and frogs legs feeling ill


People who dare to be adventurous in their eating habits -- how will they survive? Oh no, they seem to enjoy great meals!

I guess you prefer a nation that gorges itself on processed "food"? You do know that the French have a far healthier diet than Americans, right?


They also put a repetitive toddler at the top of the charts a few years back!

nuts
When eye go 2 a Prince concert or related event it's all heart up in the house but when eye log onto this site and the miasma of bitchiness is completely overwhelming!
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Reply #105 posted 10/19/09 7:56pm

murph

bsk3601 said:

murph said:

You Bart are the other end of the spectrum of the Purple Kool-Aid drinkers who proclaim that everything Prince does is great and never criticizes the man for some of his head scratching actions towards the fans...You are a chronic complainer who has become a mere joke....Your every move can be telegraphed....It's kind of silly, really.


Cosign! and he's not the only one like this, murph... whistling There's more than a few of these "other-end-of-the-spectrum" fanatics...
In Bart's defense, I at least find his posts entertaining. In a mistermaxxx kinda way lol


I don't find it entertainment at all...In fact, I find it obsessive and tired....At least with Maxxx, he was a funny muthafucka in terms of the method to his madness when it comes to most of his posts...You know somewhere there was a tongue and cheek quality in Maxxx's rants...

With Bart, there's just bitterness and lunacy...

The thing with dude is he gives sane, level headed Prince fans who have truly had problems with Prince in recent years (from the Midget's head scratching business moves such as the disasterous LotusFlower site to his battles with the fan sites) a bad name...He and a few others of his obsessive ilk make this site an unbearable drag...


A few times, I have taken up for Bart against some of the criticism he has received in the past from some of the more looney FAMS...But over the last few years he has gone beyond the call of duty in his quest to become the Org's mascot wet rag....

It's no longer entertaining or funny....It's just fucking disturbing.....
[Edited 10/19/09 19:56pm]
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Reply #106 posted 10/20/09 6:06am

purplehippieon
the1

BartVanHemelen said:

Bohemian67 said:

Good post Emancipationlover. Question. Why should Prince tour more? Hate to bring MJ into this but he hadn't toured since 1997. He bought out Invincible which was brilliant but never toured. Had nothing to do with the music. Bart if you care to discover why MJ didn't tour listen to his YT videos. He hated it!! He was forced on camera to say "he loved touring." Off camera he said it killed him, it was tiring etc etc. Look what happened while preparing for This is it.


Are you guys NUTS? BLIND? LIVING UNDER A ROCK? You might have noticed that Prince HAS toured in the past 15 years -- except most of the time he couldn't be arsed to play his NEW music and instead he played music he recorded while he was a "SLAVE".

Now, call me nuts but if I was Prince and I thought my new music was just as good or better than the stuff I'd recorded 10/20 YEARS AGO, I'd play the NEW music, not the same ole crap. BUT PRINCE DIDN'T DO THAT.

Ain't that a bitch: Prince had a choice and instead of playing his super-duper new music (something he did do in 1983, 1984, 1985, 1986, 1987, 1988, 1994, 1995), he played OLD music. Not only that, most of the songs he released post-1995 have only been played a HANDFUL of times. So not even "occasionally", not even "every now and then", no they have been performed only RARELY.

Call me crazy, but if I were Prince and I thought my new music, which I recorded "while being free", is just as good as the old stuff, you're gonna hear it. Repeatedly. Don't like it? "You ain't gots da funk." Except THIS DID NOT HAPPEN. Ghee, I wonder why?

Prince hasn't been getting any serious airplay since 1994 in most parts of the world. I notice that he's recently been doing concerts in places/venues in Europe where he hasn't played before or has rarely played. In those circumstances I think it's only fair for the typical concert-goer to expect him to play a lot of popular stuff, which just so happens to be stuff that is, for the most part, from his 80s catalogue.
If Prince would ever play a concert in my hometown (Reykjavik, Iceland) where he hasn't played before, I think 90% of the concert-goers would be pissed off if he didn't play Kiss or Purple Rain. I'm not saying Prince should only do greatest-hits shows.. I like the fact that he's bringing out some older album tracks along with newer songs and the hits but I don't think it's realistic for him to do gigs with only new stuff (like he did on the Gold Experience tour)... the only places he could do those types of sets would be where his hardcore fan base is strongest (some cities in the US - like Detroit for instance - and the Netherlands).
Like I said, I don't think he should JUST do the hits, but I think the mix between hits and album tracks/new songs should vary depending on what type of crowd he's playing to.
[Edited 10/20/09 6:11am]
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Reply #107 posted 10/20/09 11:47pm

WatchThemFall

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The only thing Prince has done that I found exciting in recent times was that one-off "PFunk", ironically an attack on his fans.

Remember the cover of Musicology, that looked like it had been made in Microsoft Paint in about ten minutes? That just about sums up Prince in the 00's.
Personally . I think we are all Boring with No Lives cause all we do is talk about Prince,Criticize and Gossip. I need a Horny Man is what I Need and probably so do most of yas. We are Sexually Frustrated what we R... Amen..!!! - zelaire
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Reply #108 posted 10/21/09 6:14am

vivid

ernestsewell said:

mushmackalenta said:



I didn't think you would retract it.

I still pity you.


HAHAHAHA Ridiculous on two counts. 1) the whole pity/feel sorry defensive "I'm butt hurt cuz someone doesn't like the Prince album I like" demeanor. Totally ridiculous attitude for you to cop, but understandable when dealing with ass kissers.

2) You blindly letting someone spoon feed you a less-than flavorful meal of mediocre music for the past few years. Tsk tsk. Has your musical taste buds really diminished that much?



My my - You're really quite unpleasant, aren't you?
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Reply #109 posted 10/21/09 6:23am

HonestMan13

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vivid said:

ernestsewell said:


2) You blindly letting someone spoon feed you a less-than flavorful meal of mediocre music for the past few years. Tsk tsk. Has your musical taste buds really diminished that much?



My my - You're really quite unpleasant, aren't you?


Yeah he is. He seems to forget that he's been eating the same
"less-than flavorful meal of mediocre music for the past few years." The rest of us on here just don't crap it out in vicious posts or snide responses to others!
When eye go 2 a Prince concert or related event it's all heart up in the house but when eye log onto this site and the miasma of bitchiness is completely overwhelming!
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Reply #110 posted 10/21/09 7:13am

purplecam

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yawn
I'm not a fan of "old Prince". I'm not a fan of "new Prince". I'm just a fan of Prince. Simple as that
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Reply #111 posted 10/21/09 9:19am

Jeffiner

WatchThemFall said:

The only thing Prince has done that I found exciting in recent times was that one-off "PFunk", ironically an attack on his fans.

Remember the cover of Musicology, that looked like it had been made in Microsoft Paint in about ten minutes? That just about sums up Prince in the 00's.


Hmmm... I think I might agree with you there, that's definitely the most exciting thing I've heard / seen from Prince since I saw him at the O2 / Indigo2, and best song (apart from my beloved 'The Dance') in a long time, yes definitely agree!! It really had bite, seemed spontaneous and from the heart (with feeling eek) and it rocked! Oooh... controversial though! wink

Em, also... I haven't read all of this thread, so I'm not quite sure what I'm in the middle of ... confused
[Edited 10/21/09 10:27am]
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Reply #112 posted 10/21/09 9:28am

bigd74

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ernestsewell said:

People don't hate Prince. I don't hate Prince. But when an artist sets a standard for themselves, then fails to meet it....therein lies the problem.


i know where you're coming from but his prime was 20 years ago isn't it hard to better yourself 20 years on from your best, i mean who has bettered their best 20 years down the line, P's a different person now, back then he was young freaky and angry now he's middle aged, give him a break eh! i'm sure if he thought he could be better he would be.

cool
She Believed in Fairytales and Princes, He Believed the voices coming from his stereo

If I Said You Had A Beautiful Body Would You Hold It Against Me?
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Reply #113 posted 10/21/09 9:30am

bigd74

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HatrinaHaterwitz said:

Imago said:

I didn't think Lotusflow3r was Prince repeating himself at all.
Though, I don't think it was a departure from the past, it still doesn't quite sound like any of his previous records--3121 coming the closest.

MPLSound did sound like his first 3 records in parts, but still sounded fresh, if not mindblowing.

Overall, I thought lotusflow3r and MPLSound were his best efforts this decade.


eek Damn that's sad!


Ok then what in your opinion is his best albums of the 00's?

cool
She Believed in Fairytales and Princes, He Believed the voices coming from his stereo

If I Said You Had A Beautiful Body Would You Hold It Against Me?
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Reply #114 posted 10/21/09 9:55am

vainandy

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Dayclear said:

Opinions are like assholes, everybody's got one.


And I've got a big one! lol
Andy is a four letter word.
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Reply #115 posted 10/21/09 10:04am

purplecam

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vainandy said:



And I've got a big one! lol

Yo, TMI and this is a gay man talking.
I'm not a fan of "old Prince". I'm not a fan of "new Prince". I'm just a fan of Prince. Simple as that
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Reply #116 posted 10/21/09 10:44am

vainandy

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purplecam said:

vainandy said:



And I've got a big one! lol

Yo, TMI and this is a gay man talking.


I was referring to my opinion which can be very assholish when it needs to be.
Andy is a four letter word.
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Reply #117 posted 10/21/09 11:09am

purplecam

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vainandy said:



I was referring to my opinion which can be very assholish when it needs to be.

Oh, thank goodness! lol
I'm not a fan of "old Prince". I'm not a fan of "new Prince". I'm just a fan of Prince. Simple as that
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Reply #118 posted 10/21/09 11:38am

GetAwayFromMe

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Deadflow3r said:

jcurley said:



I totally agree with you but don't you feel that Prince suffers this issue more than others. I kknow you can argue that maybe his original standard was higher than others and so has higher to fall. For example I do not have the Lotus album but i have heard Dance4me etc and this sounds like he is trying to recapture a sound that made him famous. I dont hear it as a cynical ploy to get sales just Prince conceiding to doing the pop that people (he feels) want from him. Yet critically this is deemed as weak and lacking. Yet contrary to most peoples complaints on here is for once doing his job as a recording artist. However much Prince can be a pain in the arse I do feel sorry for him as he really is in a lose lose position. Something unique from Prince and he is too obscure, something too immediate and he is a dried up self parody



I hate it when artists become a parody of themselves; it;s grotesque and sad. I'd rather him go out in the "to thy own self be true" mode and at least be doing stuff that he feels passionate about. IMO Lotusflow3r was an attempt to appeal to his old fans and I didn't feel the passion behind it. TRC was rejected by many but it DID clearly reflect where he was at musically and emotionally at that time in his life.



Yup! He phoned that shit in for sure!! Contrived and boring was the new album. neutral

I don't even listen to it anymore. I heard Controversy the other day on the radio, and found myself turning that up!
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Reply #119 posted 10/21/09 12:56pm

ForbiddenFruit

If Prince would ever play a concert in my hometown (Reykjavik, Iceland) where he hasn't played before, I think 90% of the concert-goers would be pissed off if he didn't play Kiss or Purple Rain.

Like I said, I don't think he should JUST do the hits, but I think the mix between hits and album tracks/new songs should vary depending on what type of crowd he's playing to.
[Edited 10/20/09 6:11am]
[/quote]

i'm sure the people in reykjavik would have loved the diamonds and pearls tour - the last time he supported his new album worldwide (he played everthing except money don't matter).
+ he played 2 unknown songs (damn u, sexy mf).
why? because he believed in his new songs, in his new band, his new style, etc.

i say it again: bart van hemelen is right!
prince even plays 1999 again, that's ridiculous.

he was the most exciting musician on earth - now he is boring.

and: his new stuff is so bad, that his old stuff isn't shining as it used to. prince is maybe just a guy who had a few real good albums but failed to stay on top.
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