http://www.bbc.co.uk/bbct...sets.shtml
For the record: BBC 3 is only available in the UK with a set-top box (http://freeview.co.uk/) HOWEVER BBC 1 and BBC 2 regularly broadcast some of the BBC 3 programs late at night some days after they've aired on BBC3. Check for instance websites like http://www.onthebox.com/ for program schedules.

Do ya'll think hes as rich as we think he is?? I wonder if hes made a gain or a loss on NPGMC as I run a similar thing myself
[This message was edited Fri May 9 18:26:03 PDT 2003 by cloud9mission]

Definitely a gain. And i'm sure that NPGMC subscription has risen considerably since the ONA tour.

I do not see how he cannot be rich or near bankruptcy. How could someone walk away from such a record deal if this were the case-integrity very rarely wins over survival.How could he afford to buy that house in Spain?
I do not see how they could actually calculate his wealth-nobody in the industry has evr controlled so much of their own product-from recording studio to producer-apart from the distribution royalties of Warner no artist would see a bigger percent take of a CD than Prince. A group would surely have to sell 20 millionalbums to see waht Prince would earn on five million. Even in the Forbes list of 1992 Prince was ahead of U2 on $50 million. I can see that he would not have as much in a current account as say Madonna because these people do not spend their money on music-Prince's overheads for Paisley Park must be massive and this is why lack of money worries me-it also seems an injustice in terms of those that if they deserve such wealth then it goes to the likes of Madonna-though at times interesting as never really had any distinctive talent beyond being Madonna. I think in real terms he must have earned more money-more tours, more albums and controlling the whole record surely must historically have added up to more wages-I can see he has wasted shed loads-but surely even prince would not put his very existence in jeopardy? Prince could not exist in an uncontrolled environment and to achieve this Louis xiv isolation must require a large reserve of cash.

oh shit i was interviewed on camera about this...can someone tape it for me and get me the copy? I am in London, without cable...

BartVanHemelen said:

I had a feeling Mayte and Prince's split had little to do with how controlling Prince was, but it was more about his financial situations and his religious views. There is no way a woman would let another woman who is allegedly sleeping with her husband live in her house for four years before she decides enough is enough. Mayte has gotten what she deserves, and that is nothing.

there is NO overhead on NPGMC.. he doesn't have to press anything.. everything is recorded.then linked directly from a master tape.. to his computer to make it digital..then transfered to us..

the only cost is the electric bill at paisley park.. to run his recording studio.

as for Money.. Prince on Emanicapation & Crystal ball he made $24 Million alone.

BUT he did get divorced.. but we just heard that mayte got the house in Spain.

Prince is loaded NOW!! maybe they were talking about in the Mid 1980's or something.. maybe thats what they ment.

Prince OWNS all his music now he records,his tour and Merch.. how in the hell can you be broke?

NPGMC (no overhead) $100 about per person
ONA Tour $50 plus per ticket
Emancipation/Crystal ball $24 Million
New Power Soul $3 Million bought house in spain
*plus other albums since 1996 (he bought house in canada)

HE is the record company.. the ONLY overhead is keeping the lights on at paisley park.. he records for free..the only cost is the electric bill!

~NOW is Prince put ALL his money in World Com Stock ..then he is broke.

**Probably this article is talking about 1985 when Prince opened Paisley Park,was starting a record label & doing Movies.. (they did bring up "film" Prince hasn't done wone of those for about 10 years and he was still on Warner Bros)
[This message was edited Sat May 10 11:33:52 PDT 2003 by locoarts]

How's this for something to talk about...None of you know anything about the current state of Prince's finances. You may hope he isn't near bankruptcy, you may hope he is making a profit on the NPGMC, but that doesn't mean he is or isn't. Get over yourselves and don't project your hopefulness on what is empirically accurate.

locoarts said:

Hilarious. Do you think recording is free? He has to pay technicians, musicians, plus there's the overhead of Paisley Park.

And do you think hosting a website is free? Or the PROPRIETARY download-system that firm developed? Or the bandwidth?

locoarts said:

Maybe in Monopoly money. I'm convinced CB was a disaster, and Emancipation sold relatively little. He might have gotten a lot of money from each copy, but if they don't sell plenty of copies, that's irrelevant.

locoarts said:

UTTERLY wrong. How come no business in Minneapolis wants to deal with PP? Because they DON'T pay their bills. Gee, why woudl that be?

justin10 said:

Hilarious. How about doing some RESEARCH, huh?

http://groups.google.com/...%404ax.com

justin10 said:

And when has Prince last sold 5 million? Or 1 million? Or 500,000?

justin10 said:

That was then, back when he had a huge hit album & tour -- this is 2003.

My point was you do not earn money like that without investing it-I would imagine that was why Diamonds and Pearls was written in the first place-for commercial success. I still cannot think of many artists that were not paying producers and writers a share of the profit -I can think of a few but in the main Prince was quite unique in this regard. Your reply is very arrogant-i am not a moron that thinks Prince is still earning that now. My point is that I cannot imagine even Prince doing what he is doing now if he could not afford to. I am under no illusions of prince's position.I think Crystal ball did provide Prince with a large income-it was a surprise to him also. You are not the only person who knows what they are talking about. I do notneed to do any research-I do not talk from the hip and justify Prince as my own personal Jesus. Prince gave Emancipation money to charity. I cannot visualise that Prince is any worse state than he was six years ago, so why do things like that then, when he was in the midst of a very precarious future. You are very rude and should not assume that people are not giving a reasoned argument just because they are on this site.

BartVanHemelen said:

if the man is a lier thats on him.. but he said ALL this in interviews.

BUT I can't see how you can't be rich if you have really no over head.. he said the only cost of recording basically is paying the electric bill.

equiptment is all free.. companies give stuff to recording studios/artist all the time to promote "they are using our stuff"..

Prince is loaded!! NOW like I said before.. he is doesn't know how to invest and got screwed by World Com.. and lost a ton to Mayte in a divorce..

BUT as a musican.. the dude is rich as all hell

Emanipation cost what? $30 (at first)
Crystal Ball cost what? $40 ( at first..about??)
ONA Live cost what? $50 (at first..about)
NPGMC cost $100
Celebration is what $80 -100 bucks

Prince's core audience is what about 120,000 fans.. Everyone doesnt buy everything of course.. but he is making about $4 Million on each product. (about)

Plus 3 Tours since 1996 and he owns his Merch.

NPG Records owns all this.. Prince is NPG Records.

1. Learn to quote.

2. Stop guessing, start RESEARCHING. Most of what you say is based on flimsy guesswork.

locoarts said:

But the FACT is: he DOES NOT.

locoarts said:

Are you a complete idiot? PP is NOT a regular recording studio. How many interns are working at PP? NONE -- if there were, we'd be knee high in leaked unreleased songs.

locoarts said:

And Prince never lies, right? Take out the tape of the Oprah interview and start counting lies.

locoarts said:

Baloney. It isn't just about cost, but also about RETURN ON INVESTMENT.

locoarts said:

They were still selling leftovers from the limited edition of 100,000 CB at a UK record fair a couple of years ago for next to nothing, just to get rid of them. Just keeping them stored was costing way too much.

locoarts said:

FACT: there's dozens of PROVEN cases where Prince took credit for stuff that wasn't his work.

locoarts said:

Baloney.

locoarts said:

Because he's full of himself.

locoarts said:

Look, dufus, Prince doesn't do endorsements. And the FACT is that he didn't pay a local guitar maker for his precious guitar -- the guy had to sue Prince to get his money.

locoarts said:

How dumb can you be? The prices of those things haven been documented well enough. But what you keep forgetting is that those are STORE prices. You have to deduct their profit margins for one, and then there's Prince's costs. CB must have cost him tons, considering his 1-800 number spent months dealing with all the hassle, the set came in a special round box, etc. There's a reason he changed his tunes about it not appearing in stores -- hell, they held back the shipping of the pre-ordered sets until the deal with BestBuy et al was signed.

To this date you can get tons of Emancipation copies for next to no money, because EMI got stuck with tons of unsold copies -- that puts that "the album went double platinum" crap into perspective, doesn't it?

locoarts said:

Utter BS. TRC sold what -- 150,000 TOPS (I'm being very generous here). Please explain to me how he made $4 million on that. Prince makes far more money each year from his back catalogue (and I'm convinced even that income is diminishing each year) and his song writing (but ONLY his 1980s songs, the money he makes form his 1990s/noughties music is neglectable).

Back in 1995 there was a huge piece in a Minneapolis paper of Prince's money problems, and just looking at what happened since then as far as money is concerned, things can't have improved.

BartVanHemelen said:[quote]1. Learn to quote.
Who are you-do you hate prince or something. I think my earlier points are quite valid. The point is that earnings in the past surely cannot have been spent-there must be some investment. Also trying to block the greatest hits the other year-why would he do that if he cannot afford to-coz he would make royalties out of this. unless he is completely insane which I think you would probably argue-he must be able to afford to make this rash choices. you are wrong about CB-it was the success of this that spurred Prince down the internet path. I am in the u.k and it was really successful on the indie charts-the mark up on something with no packaging must surely yield high margims ROI as you would prefer. Also when he screwed up the deal with Arista he reportedly walked away with $11 million dollars-this helped the demiseof Clive Davis. the ultimate point is we know p is a pain when it comes to making wise business choices but surely he can only make these coz he can afford to-indulgence rquires a lot of money. As for the TRC those sales are N.America alone international sales must be at least double this outside of its internet release. In France P seems to be all the rage.Where are you writing from America?

:I: was interviewed about this too...

Let's see how they interpret my approach...

'dre

DreZone said:

they said that they'd edited you out for fear of having to make copyright payments to Lenny Kravitz !

If you pay attention to Alex Hahn's book, he makes a ver good point (some of the time anyway!). After the Symbol album and Act ! and Act !! tours, Warners would not put out a NEW Prince album. He had, what was to become, the Come album, plus lots of others songs, ready for release. Most record companies give an allowance to recording artists which they take back out of the profits. Prince paid to make his own albums and then Warners wouldn't release them. Then he made the videos to go with the songs. He made the Beautiful Experience "film". The Undertaker film was made and eventually released in a much shorter form. Prince paid for all this to be made. Warners wouldn't release them, so Prince made no money on them. Emancipation was made without a release deal with a record company... Not cheap...In the ONA concert at Hammersmith, in the guitary sit-down bit, Prince made reference to the fact that everyone thought he was rich. But admitted his situation is now better than it has been for a while.He may have made a lot of money in the past, when sales slowed and Warners wouldn't release his newest music, he was spending more than he earned.Maybe Slave was the right thing to srawl on his face!

Every1 whos got FreeView or can see BBC3 HAS GOT 2 WATCH THIS PROGRAM...

Ive seen 'Jackos Millions', 'Bowies Millions' and a few others on the series and its all fascinating 2 see how these huge stars spend their money...

And the researchers in this program are goood.

Ive been waiting along time 4 this unfortunately I cant tape the BBC3 showing of this program but I will when it comes on TV incase any1 wants 2 copy it.

And btw, Dre, sorry 2 burst yr bubble dude, but ive seen many of these docu's on stars "millions" and they dont show fans being interviewed.
Incase if that was what U meant.

[This message was edited Mon May 12 11:01:53 PDT 2003 by SexLovely]

SexLovely said:

Ah well, shit happens man! U should have been at the party anyway, U missed a great night!

'dre
[This message was edited Mon May 12 12:54:51 PDT 2003 by DreZone]

I have to give Bart the props. Prince hasn't sold much records since a decade, those are the main incomes. Of course PP is a moneyeater, don't forget there is a 10 million loan on it to build, I don't know what the costs were to rebuild and refurnish it a couple of times.

What about equiping three studio's with the latest devellopments on material, isn't free. Stores won't give it for free to Prince. Prince is not a big artist in their eyes anymore. Of course he still has money, but he ain't that rich as a current pop star or well selling band like the peppers. Creating the NPGMC infrastructure with their billing- selling- creating- and support departments ain't cheap, that can easily cost a couple of tons a year, bandwidth as well ain't cheap for 12000 users.

But what the hell do we care if he is rich or not, I'm for the music and let the man bring out a good cd for instance.

been reading with interest the above comments, would just make a few of my own:

Bart - however right or wrong your assumptions are - you need to treat people with some respect or are you just going for the immature route of trying to stir people up?

Fact - Prince is rich, richer than most average people that is. In the course of his career - he has sold a shed load of albums and singles, and yes he does save money where other artists spend it by producing it himself and more recently releasing it himself. And then there are the tours, merchandise and the small matter of all thinsg Purple Rain - movie, video release etc. he has a regular income from his publishing rights too.

But of course he spends money too - liftsyle stuff, equipment, houses, women, friends, overheards, paying back advances etc. That said the NPG Music Club is relatively quite cheap - allow up to a generous £100K for site development and maintainence/bandwidth a year - then their is the fulfilment side of things - which again based on a more realistic hardcore fan base of around 200,000 doesn't require that much work to handle (however much they make it seem like it does) - I expect the fed ex bill probably costs more than the packing and stuffing of the goods.

If he was short of cash - he could easily allow his songs be used in commercials, he could give some commercial songs to some film soundtracks (and perhaps even have a hit), he could DVD release the stockpiles of video footage, he can tour as he does he could play a few festivals (and get his strret cred back), he could do an MTV unplugged style performance of his hits and release it as a record, he could even take on a producer and really go for a mainstream commercial record. I'm sure there is a lot of other things too, that I am unaware of.

The other observation would make is why should prince tell us what he earns or is worth - isn't that his private business?

And finally - to find out about Prince's millions - all we have to do is wait until Sunday (if you live in the uk that is)

harveya said:[quote]If you pay attention to Alex Hahn's book, ...(snip)quote]

Actually, Alex was interviewed for this program so it may well get mentioned on the show.

DreZone said:

Aarrrggghh!!! Stoppit!!!

I know i missed a great party but it wasnt my fault.
It was my mums fault, she begged me not 2 go 2 London by myself and stay with JimmyNothing cuz she was worried...

...and I gave in.

THIS November tho man...I'll Be There.

mattosgood said:

Start telling that to those that shoot of their mouths based on stuff they make up. I'll start respecting people when they put in the time and effort to investigate instead of making stuff up based on nothing.

mattosgood said:

Plus credit-card handling, CRM, shipping of actual items, etc.

mattosgood said:

You didn't see LRC in that ad?

mattosgood said:

Get a clue: who'd take them. Realisticly: IF moviemakers wanted to use a particular song, they need both WB and Prince to sign on the line (because they'd want to use the hit song, and not some lame Larry Graham-approved, Kirk Johnson-arranged cover version). And then I'm sure Prince would demand far too much money.

mattosgood said:

Have you ever taken interest in Prince? Really? Have you ever looked at how this guy does his deals?

mattosgood said:

Well, considering he brings up the topic in just about any post-1995 interview...

harveya said:

It's amazing how some people manage to be completely clueless. Have you actually READ the book, instead of skimming it?

The way you say it, it's like WB is some big bad evil corp, whereas in reality it is Prince who has unrealistic expectations and who doesn't get that flooding the market with product -- especially mediocre product -- is simply unrealistic. Quality not quantity.

justin10 said:

swiftyweb said:

I have seen the MJ and Elton episodes of this. It is a very cheap and cheesy look into accounts. What they do is take into acount sales of CD's and merchandise, any payments recieved for contracts etc and then subtract and law suit costs, any habit costs and any extravigant costs. I am sure that the result is anything but acurate, these programs tend to be more amusing than informative. However, I remember reading in the Times once that in the mid 90's prince's finances where rather depleted and he was facing bankruptcy. True or not, I dare not speculate.

You guys are all sad. Who cares if Prince is rolling in the cash or not, it's really none of our business. So long as he has enough to keep the music flowing, we all should be greatful.

Heres the times when its on BBC 3 in the next week,dont assume it will be shown on BBC1 or BBC2 though anytime soon,they don't show that much BBC3 stuff late at night anymore:

18/05 : 8pm and 12.30am
20/05 : 2am
23/05 : 9pm and 2.30am

locoarts said:

I agree with you though it is a little easy to say that the only overhead Prince has is the electric bill from Paisley. How much do you think it costs to go on tour? How much do you think his own guitartech is being paid per WEEK?
I think you shouldn't underestimate the costs that come with the tour and the staff he needs to arrange it as such.
I don't think he is bankrupt though... but I don't think he gets all profit and has no expenses. Far from that.