funkbabyandthebabysitters said:

does anyone know if the song dream factory features wendy and lisa? i know on princevault it says its only susannah on backing vocals, but i wondered if they were involved at all. it seems like something they would be, to me, it just sounds like they were involved.

I wouldn't be suprised if more were involved on this one.
That the Revolution was singing chanting the performing little bits of it on the Parade tours/shows, I wouldn't doubt it.

Sounds like more than Prince & Susannah singing 'This is what it's like in the Dream Factory woooow'

funkbabyandthebabysitters said:

Wendy's slightly snobbish and deluded comments on changes to the band post 85 in the possessed book are quite revealing. She thought they were going from the Beatles (lol) to an 'overblown rnb band' I do wonder if prince also had reservations about letting his music get too influenced by two women much more into pop/rock than rnb/funk [Edited 11/30/20 0:55am]

lol OK

but if you were a Prince fan in that 1982-1986 period, you would agree. It was more about the MANIA, and it was in that direction.

why would he? In 1997 he wrote a song called In This Bed I Scream dedicated to them

also who said they were more into pop/rock? Wendy was more into Rhythm guitar playing, I don't get what you are trying to convey here. None of that is true

funkbabyandthebabysitters said:

Fair enough. I did a lol cos the Beatles were self contained and a BAND. The rev were a prince band, I.e. led by him, not a democracy. I guess I was working on the premise that with the 86 tour, prince was going both left and more trad rnb at the same time. And let's be real, wendy n lisa were highly able and broad minded,but their heart was more joni than James. Thats what made the band work, why they made so many brilliant songs with prince, but if you look at black album and lovesexy, he was going for a more groove based thing, less about melody. [Edited 11/30/20 7:38am]

She was talking about the hysteria and the mass cult following. New Breed Fan Club. Not the band format.

.

Wendy fell in love with Prince music when she heard Soft n Wet, so I don't know about that. She also loved Hip Hop.

.

Prince was also more Joni than James

.

Yes, Sheila E said she didn't like the music direction in the 88-89 period. She said there was no melody.

Genesia said:

funkbabyandthebabysitters said:

OldFriends4Sale said: apparently susanna got him into led zeppelin Either way, were led zeppelin really psychedelic? I never thought of them as being that so prince was wrong there :p

Source?

Did a bit of googling and there's this reference on princevault


http://www.princevault.com/index.php?title=Call_Of_The_Wild

"Susannah Melvoin had prompted Prince to listen to some music by British rock band Led Zeppelin"

Which frankly is ambigious, e.g.:

"Listen to these"

"Oh that old band? I used to listen to them in high school, it's been years, but ok lets put them on"

OldFriends4Sale said:

funkbabyandthebabysitters said:

OldFriends4Sale said:

She was talking about the hysteria and the mass cult following. New Breed Fan Club. Not the band format.

.

Wendy fell in love with Prince music when she heard Soft n Wet, so I don't know about that. She also loved Hip Hop.

.

Prince was also more Joni than James

.

Yes, Sheila E said she didn't like the music direction in the 88-89 period. She said there was no melody.

No she was talking about the band structure . If it was the mania, what would being an 'overblown rnb band' have to do with that?? Tbh I get that disappointment too, the idea of settling for tradition (big rnb band format) rather than trying new things (which the Beatles did in their peak period)

No she wasn't, she was talking about the mania. Unless she was in the band to know how they functioned, she wouldn't be able to compare. Prince & the Revolution ruled the world, like the Beatles.

Exactly the band formation had nothing to do with it. Of course, nothing done on the Parade tour was "RnB" comparison, she was talking about the focus on dancing, and the run through, over the deeper presentation of the music.

Can you look at the Parade tour run and see an 'RnB' set?

1. Around The World In A Day
2. Christopher Tracy's Parade
3. New Position
4. I Wonder U
5. Raspberry Beret
6. Alexa de Paris
7. Controversy
8. Mutiny/Dream Factory
9. Anotherloverholeinyohead
11. How Much Is That Doggie In The Window?
12. Automatic
13. D.M.S.R
14. The Dance Electric
15. Under the Cherry Moon
16. Pop Life
17. Girls & Boys
18. Life Can Be So Nice
19 .Purple Rain
20. A Love Bizarre
21 .Kiss
22 .Mountains

No she wasn't, she was talking about the mania. Unless she was in the band to know how they functioned, she wouldn't be able to compare. Prince & the Revolution ruled the world, like the Beatles.

Exactly the band formation had nothing to do with it. Of course, nothing done on the Parade tour was "RnB" comparison, she was talking about the focus on dancing, and the run through, over the deeper presentation of the music.

Can you look at the Parade tour run and see an 'RnB' set?

lol at you being so insistent that she was talking about the mania.

unless she wasnt in the band to know how they worked, she cant comment? honestly? you dont think there was enough written about the beatles by the late 80s, the most famous band in the world, to know how they worked? LOL. pretty sure she understood.

the songs werent 100% RNB but its pretty clear, if you read alan or eric leeds, or any critics of the time, to know the 86 tour was more R&B in both presentation and sound.

it was horn based - no prince band before was.

it was a much more expansive band, like the big rnb bands of the 70s were.

the 84 band (not including the encores) were much more contained, it was a smaller unit, like most rock bands were. up to 86, princes bands were small.

so the comment was clearly about what kind of band it was turning into, what kind of show they were presenting, NOT the fame or the mania.

idk why you are denying what is so obvious here.

The problem is we only ever hear what they gave to or did for him and not the other way around or them getting way more credit for certain things then what it really was. You really think a black kid from mpls with a jazz musician father never heard jazz? or a person from the midwest never heard the beatles or joni mitchell? Most of their contributions were remixes at best to stuff that already existed. Now whether they were good or not depends on the listener or who you like or what kinda music you prefer.

Music is a young man's sport. Once you get to a certain age or a place in life, you're going to be less creative as you were in your younger years. He also wasn't having the same experiences as he did as a young adult...cause that's how life works. That doesnt't meant he wasn't still making good music. H just wasn't cutting edge or quote unquote innovating anymore and that's ok. Prince's music was ALWAYS art despite the purpose and regardless of whether or not you liked it.

tab32792 said:

The problem is we only ever hear what they gave to or did for him and not the other way around or them getting way more credit for certain things then what it really was. You really think a black kid from mpls with a jazz musician father never heard jazz? or a person from the midwest never heard the beatles or joni mitchell? Most of their contributions were remixes at best to stuff that already existed. Now whether they were good or not depends on the listener or who you like or what kinda music you prefer.

Music is a young man's sport. Once you get to a certain age or a place in life, you're going to be less creative as you were in your younger years. He also wasn't having the same experiences as he did as a young adult...cause that's how life works. That doesnt't meant he wasn't still making good music. H just wasn't cutting edge or quote unquote innovating anymore and that's ok. Prince's music was ALWAYS art despite the purpose and regardless of whether or not you liked it.

That isn't true. They never said Prince never heard of jazz. They said they took him to a jazz club. Very different. Not to mention if anyone understands the relationship Prince had with his father, it wasn't the 'hey son come sit with me and let me teach you/show you my life' Prince said himself his father would not let him come see him perform and Prince had to sneak out one time to see him.
.
Also Prince's father would not let him touch his piano nor taught him any of his skill.
.
The relationship with John L and the Kid was a bit true to life.
And his mother became more strict in listening to music in the home when he stayed with them.
Remember now that Prince really only had a short time of living with his family after they split. After a point Prince was living with Andre, Morris, sometimes Susan Moonsie's family etc

funkbabyandthebabysitters said:

No she wasn't, she was talking about the mania. Unless she was in the band to know how they functioned, she wouldn't be able to compare. Prince & the Revolution ruled the world, like the Beatles.

Exactly the band formation had nothing to do with it. Of course, nothing done on the Parade tour was "RnB" comparison, she was talking about the focus on dancing, and the run through, over the deeper presentation of the music.

Can you look at the Parade tour run and see an 'RnB' set?

lol at you being so insistent that she was talking about the mania.

unless she wasnt in the band to know how they worked, she cant comment? honestly? you dont think there was enough written about the beatles by the late 80s, the most famous band in the world, to know how they worked? LOL. pretty sure she understood.

the songs werent 100% RNB but its pretty clear, if you read alan or eric leeds, or any critics of the time, to know the 86 tour was more R&B in both presentation and sound.

it was horn based - no prince band before was.

it was a much more expansive band, like the big rnb bands of the 70s were.

the 84 band (not including the encores) were much more contained, it was a smaller unit, like most rock bands were. up to 86, princes bands were small.

so the comment was clearly about what kind of band it was turning into, what kind of show they were presenting, NOT the fame or the mania.

idk why you are denying what is so obvious here.

Post the quote

If you were present and following Prince in 1984-85 and realize what was happening you would understand she was talking about the mania and the creative scene that WAS happening.

wilmer said:

SantanaMaitreya said:

wilmer said:

Wendy and Lisa enriched Prince's vision just as Dez and Eric. Some of these experiments yielded great tunes, others not so great. But Prince also hipped Wendy and Lisa to the funk. So, I guess it was a symbiotic relationship. However, Prince transcended this period, albeit with mixed results, while Wendy and Lisa, well, they sorta tanked

Not only Wendy & Lisa. Morris Day, Brownmark, Appolonia, you name them... None of them had much success without Prince. W&L's first two albums were quite succesful in Europe, Waterfall, Lolly Lolly and Are You My Baby were hits. But a lot of that was because people remembered them from the Revolution. But it also proves that the influence went both ways: without Prince, W&L would never have been as funky as they were on Fruit at the Bottom. And the most succesful Prince protegé of them all, Sheila E, would never even have thought of making solo albums if it wasn't for Prince. [Edited 12/6/20 8:57am]

Sheila Escovedo was not a protégé; she was a successful musician with her own career long before she ever met Prince.

purplethunder3121 said:

SantanaMaitreya said:

wilmer said: Not only Wendy & Lisa. Morris Day, Brownmark, Appolonia, you name them... None of them had much success without Prince. W&L's first two albums were quite succesful in Europe, Waterfall, Lolly Lolly and Are You My Baby were hits. But a lot of that was because people remembered them from the Revolution. But it also proves that the influence went both ways: without Prince, W&L would never have been as funky as they were on Fruit at the Bottom. And the most succesful Prince protegé of them all, Sheila E, would never even have thought of making solo albums if it wasn't for Prince. [Edited 12/6/20 8:57am]

Sheila Escovedo was not a protégé; she was a successful musician with her own career long before she ever met Prince.

Well technically she was a protege. She was Sheila Escovedo before 1984. And Sheila E dressing as Prince styled her, made her up to resemble him, and doing Prince music under his direction, look, sound, label etc

Yes she was a musician before Prince. If she just did a song or two with/by Prince then, like Sheanna Easton it would be different. But from 1984-1989 she was his protege.

SantanaMaitreya said:

wilmer said:

Wendy and Lisa enriched Prince's vision just as Dez and Eric. Some of these experiments yielded great tunes, others not so great. But Prince also hipped Wendy and Lisa to the funk. So, I guess it was a symbiotic relationship. However, Prince transcended this period, albeit with mixed results, while Wendy and Lisa, well, they sorta tanked

Not only Wendy & Lisa. Morris Day, Brownmark, Appolonia, you name them... None of them had much success without Prince. W&L's first two albums were quite succesful in Europe, Waterfall, Lolly Lolly and Are You My Baby were hits. But a lot of that was because people remembered them from the Revolution. But it also proves that the influence went both ways: without Prince, W&L would never have been as funky as they were on Fruit at the Bottom. And the most succesful Prince protegé of them all, Sheila E, would never even have thought of making solo albums if it wasn't for Prince. [Edited 12/6/20 8:57am]

I disagree, Wendy and Lisa have won awards for their work. Soundtracks and movie scores. They are very successful. They never wanted to be frontmen overall. I think everyone whose been in a band or group have taken a step out front to do a song, album or two. New Edition. They all did an album outside of the group. But their success was with New Edition (accept for Bobby Brown)

I think Morris had a pretty succesfully run for a bit, with the sitcome roles and continuation as a an entertainer. Maybe he didn't want huge success, but Morris is living good. Andre Cymone had huge success as a producer for Jody Whatley. Jimmy Jam and Terry Lewis were having success outside of Prince while with Prince, and when they left it took off as producers.

Apollonia was never an technical protege, Prince knew she was only signing on to full fill the movie role contract. Vanity on the other hand, might not have been a HUGE move/acting star, but she had more longterm success than Prince.

Yes the magic was Prince tapping into the individuals and exuding that synergy. But as you see, after 1987 that never happened again, with any other proteges and Prince.

tab32792 said:

The problem is we only ever hear what they gave to or did for him and not the other way around or them getting way more credit for certain things then what it really was. You really think a black kid from mpls with a jazz musician father never heard jazz? or a person from the midwest never heard the beatles or joni mitchell? Most of their contributions were remixes at best to stuff that already existed. Now whether they were good or not depends on the listener or who you like or what kinda music you prefer.

That's so off base, and unfortunately, so are most of the frustrations with them.


Wendy fully credits Prince with how her playing style clicked for her.

Both W & L gush about how genius they thought he was, they owned the records, and they were fans.

Let's be real though, how do you have two record industry heiress types in your band that group up with celebrities just hanging around, and you're not open to their ideas, and you don't get exposed to the vast privileged musical upbringing they had? Seriously. How do you think that makes Prince sound?

He did some of his most experimentic music with that band or immediately after...maybe give Prince credit for who he put together then? He was just leaving his childhood friends band, he could have worked with anyone, and he didn't pick the best players, so maybe he knew what he was doing and picked people who inspired him to push the envelop? Lisa's thing was playing textureds and weird ethereal fills. He liked it, he knew how to add that to what he'd started doing already..and then knew how to give him clay to mold. He would jam and give his band a lot of freedom...and we've heard "on the downbeat, no not that one, try another....not that one either...that's not ours....keep that going, "E"......where are my horns?".

As for turning someone on to music. Come on, it was a big deal to buy a record and these girls had access to 1 of the 3 biggest catalogs of the era, and every new record they wanted. It's in their blood. You might know the Beatles, or some other popular band, but then someone comes along and really plays it for you, and really opens you up to it in a new way. Maybe you know the hits, but you don't know Rubber Soul.

Yeah some white girls with money in LA might have got excited about different music than Prince when they went into a Tower Records on tour...and yeah, Prince had the depth to hang out with his girlfriend and her sister and pick up on some of it because it was music he felt inspired by. Kind of insulting to Prince to think otherwise. Also insulting to think the period Prince was inspired by people around him and new music when he made Parade or ATWIAD. He had some ideas cooking long before he met W & L but these are people he spent time with...like, 4 members of the W&L family worked on ATWIAD, how is it even a discussion? If the made the beat for Mountains, it was informed by Prince and what they thought Prince liked, and it used Prince's own sounds....but they're still musicians composing elements of a song in that case.

[Edited 12/6/20 19:51pm]

I see this all of sudden revisionist history of Wendy & Lisa as a part of today's very "Woman Powered", "Girl Powered", "LGBTQ", "Representationalism" centered media...mixed in with the fact that Prince is dead, and his vault is generating sales for The Estate.

I'm not trying to be cynical or Anti-Wendy&Lisa here.

Wendy & Lisa come from a very connected white families within the Los Angeles Music Community.

Susannah worked for David Geffen for god's sake, and was auditioning to sing for Quincy Jones before she decamped to Minneapolis, and all things Prince, following her sister and Lisa.

I respect W&L (and Susannah), but I absolutely LOATHE their post April 21, 2016 version of their relationship with Prince. Almost as much as I loathe Sheila's version of events.

These are all talented people and they were in Prince's camp for a reason.

But for them to act like they showed Prince how to use a knife and a fork, and Miles Davis, and all of this other stuff like he was just some ghetto savant, who wasn't playing with his own image by employing them in the first place...just makes me want to vomit.

I also can't stand looking at "The Revolution", minus Prince doing their "T.G.I.F." version of their time in Prince's employ.

Prince was very prolific during the 80's, I'm not trying to diminish the contributions of any of these musicians, but the way that the Sign O' The Times SDE version was rolled out, as "The Lost Prince & The Revolution" album, born of this 3 headed monster that was Prince, W&L is just obnoxious.

Again...these are two very well connected women from L.A., that grew up surrounded by the music industry. Does their existence/contribution make for better "copy" for all the magazines, newspapers, etc. to run with THEIR CUDDLY "Prince as E.T.", version on EVERY reissue coming within the scope of their employ? To ME, it looks like it., because mainly I was a Prince fan before Wendy and Lisa were "a thing", I was a fan of Wendy and Lisa after they left, and I can guarantee you...98% of these W&L Johnny Come Lately's are "I'm With Her" carpetbaggers who need to attach this sort of petty "represenatationalism" all over everything in sight (think of the "Live Love Laugh" sign) so that they can see that this to is a safe space, and they are free to spend their money and revise history IN SPITE OF the Jill Jones-es, the Sheila E.'s-es, that were providing the same sort of feminine energy for Prince before, during and after Wendy & Lisa's time of employment.

Or how about the influence that Morris, Andre & Dez had on Prince?

It's a miserably cheap deflection from a true Icons talent focusing on just a period during his rise and reign as a Pop Star. Prince is more complex than these kinds of Jane Goodall puff pieces that they can't seem to stop finding themselves in the middle of, with the help of the estate, The Current, and every other writer who can see the money train that surrounds the Purple Rain era.

ButcherDog said:

I see this all of sudden revisionist history of Wendy & Lisa as a part of today's very "Woman Powered", "Girl Powered", "LGBTQ", "Representationalism" centered media...mixed in with the fact that Prince is dead, and his vault is generating sales for The Estate.

I'm not trying to be cynical or Anti-Wendy&Lisa here.

Wendy & Lisa come from a very connected white families within the Los Angeles Music Community.

Susannah worked for David Geffen for god's sake, and was auditioning to sing for Quincy Jones before she decamped to Minneapolis, and all things Prince, following her sister and Lisa.

I respect W&L (and Susannah), but I absolutely LOATHE their post April 21, 2016 version of their relationship with Prince. Almost as much as I loathe Sheila's version of events.

These are all talented people and they were in Prince's camp for a reason.

But for them to act like they showed Prince how to use a knife and a fork, and Miles Davis, and all of this other stuff like he was just some ghetto savant, who wasn't playing with his own image by employing them in the first place...just makes me want to vomit.

I also can't stand looking at "The Revolution", minus Prince doing their "T.G.I.F." version of their time in Prince's employ.

Prince was very prolific during the 80's, I'm not trying to diminish the contributions of any of these musicians, but the way that the Sign O' The Times SDE version was rolled out, as "The Lost Prince & The Revolution" album, born of this 3 headed monster that was Prince, W&L is just obnoxious.

Again...these are two very well connected women from L.A., that grew up surrounded by the music industry. Does their existence/contribution make for better "copy" for all the magazines, newspapers, etc. to run with THEIR CUDDLY "Prince as E.T.", version on EVERY reissue coming within the scope of their employ? To ME, it looks like it., because mainly I was a Prince fan before Wendy and Lisa were "a thing", I was a fan of Wendy and Lisa after they left, and I can guarantee you...98% of these W&L Johnny Come Lately's are "I'm With Her" carpetbaggers who need to attach this sort of petty "represenatationalism" all over everything in sight (think of the "Live Love Laugh" sign) so that they can see that this to is a safe space, and they are free to spend their money and revise history IN SPITE OF the Jill Jones-es, the Sheila E.'s-es, that were providing the same sort of feminine energy for Prince before, during and after Wendy & Lisa's time of employment.

Or how about the influence that Morris, Andre & Dez had on Prince?

It's a miserably cheap deflection from a true Icons talent focusing on just a period during his rise and reign as a Pop Star. Prince is more complex than these kinds of Jane Goodall puff pieces that they can't seem to stop finding themselves in the middle of, with the help of the estate, The Current, and every other writer who can see the money train that surrounds the Purple Rain era.

ButcherDog said:

I see this all of sudden revisionist history of Wendy & Lisa as a part of today's very "Woman Powered", "Girl Powered", "LGBTQ", "Representationalism" centered media...mixed in with the fact that Prince is dead, and his vault is generating sales for The Estate.

I'm not trying to be cynical or Anti-Wendy&Lisa here.

Wendy & Lisa come from a very connected white families within the Los Angeles Music Community.

Susannah worked for David Geffen for god's sake, and was auditioning to sing for Quincy Jones before she decamped to Minneapolis, and all things Prince, following her sister and Lisa.

I respect W&L (and Susannah), but I absolutely LOATHE their post April 21, 2016 version of their relationship with Prince. Almost as much as I loathe Sheila's version of events.

These are all talented people and they were in Prince's camp for a reason.

But for them to act like they showed Prince how to use a knife and a fork, and Miles Davis, and all of this other stuff like he was just some ghetto savant, who wasn't playing with his own image by employing them in the first place...just makes me want to vomit.

I also can't stand looking at "The Revolution", minus Prince doing their "T.G.I.F." version of their time in Prince's employ.

Prince was very prolific during the 80's, I'm not trying to diminish the contributions of any of these musicians, but the way that the Sign O' The Times SDE version was rolled out, as "The Lost Prince & The Revolution" album, born of this 3 headed monster that was Prince, W&L is just obnoxious.

Again...these are two very well connected women from L.A., that grew up surrounded by the music industry. Does their existence/contribution make for better "copy" for all the magazines, newspapers, etc. to run with THEIR CUDDLY "Prince as E.T.", version on EVERY reissue coming within the scope of their employ? To ME, it looks like it., because mainly I was a Prince fan before Wendy and Lisa were "a thing", I was a fan of Wendy and Lisa after they left, and I can guarantee you...98% of these W&L Johnny Come Lately's are "I'm With Her" carpetbaggers who need to attach this sort of petty "represenatationalism" all over everything in sight (think of the "Live Love Laugh" sign) so that they can see that this to is a safe space, and they are free to spend their money and revise history IN SPITE OF the Jill Jones-es, the Sheila E.'s-es, that were providing the same sort of feminine energy for Prince before, during and after Wendy & Lisa's time of employment.

Or how about the influence that Morris, Andre & Dez had on Prince?

It's a miserably cheap deflection from a true Icons talent focusing on just a period during his rise and reign as a Pop Star. Prince is more complex than these kinds of Jane Goodall puff pieces that they can't seem to stop finding themselves in the middle of, with the help of the estate, The Current, and every other writer who can see the money train that surrounds the Purple Rain era.

Huh? W&L's version of Prince has pretty much stayed the same post 2016 as it was before that, albeit they're now a bit freer to talk about him than they were before. And they were doing "Girl Powered", "LGBTQ", "Representationalism" centered music in the late 80s.

People have been venerating them, and people have been bitching and moaning about them getting too much credit since, what, 1984?

I do agree, as I said earlier in this thread, that they were two very well connected young musicians and Prince was not, and that should not be ignored.

As for Morris, Andre, Dez, Jill etc. name a person in the fan community who doesn't want to hear their perspective.

jaawwnn said:

ButcherDog said:

I see this all of sudden revisionist history of Wendy & Lisa as a part of today's very "Woman Powered", "Girl Powered", "LGBTQ", "Representationalism" centered media...mixed in with the fact that Prince is dead, and his vault is generating sales for The Estate.

I'm not trying to be cynical or Anti-Wendy&Lisa here.

Wendy & Lisa come from a very connected white families within the Los Angeles Music Community.

Susannah worked for David Geffen for god's sake, and was auditioning to sing for Quincy Jones before she decamped to Minneapolis, and all things Prince, following her sister and Lisa.

I respect W&L (and Susannah), but I absolutely LOATHE their post April 21, 2016 version of their relationship with Prince. Almost as much as I loathe Sheila's version of events.

These are all talented people and they were in Prince's camp for a reason.

But for them to act like they showed Prince how to use a knife and a fork, and Miles Davis, and all of this other stuff like he was just some ghetto savant, who wasn't playing with his own image by employing them in the first place...just makes me want to vomit.

I also can't stand looking at "The Revolution", minus Prince doing their "T.G.I.F." version of their time in Prince's employ.

Prince was very prolific during the 80's, I'm not trying to diminish the contributions of any of these musicians, but the way that the Sign O' The Times SDE version was rolled out, as "The Lost Prince & The Revolution" album, born of this 3 headed monster that was Prince, W&L is just obnoxious.

Again...these are two very well connected women from L.A., that grew up surrounded by the music industry. Does their existence/contribution make for better "copy" for all the magazines, newspapers, etc. to run with THEIR CUDDLY "Prince as E.T.", version on EVERY reissue coming within the scope of their employ? To ME, it looks like it., because mainly I was a Prince fan before Wendy and Lisa were "a thing", I was a fan of Wendy and Lisa after they left, and I can guarantee you...98% of these W&L Johnny Come Lately's are "I'm With Her" carpetbaggers who need to attach this sort of petty "represenatationalism" all over everything in sight (think of the "Live Love Laugh" sign) so that they can see that this to is a safe space, and they are free to spend their money and revise history IN SPITE OF the Jill Jones-es, the Sheila E.'s-es, that were providing the same sort of feminine energy for Prince before, during and after Wendy & Lisa's time of employment.

Or how about the influence that Morris, Andre & Dez had on Prince?

It's a miserably cheap deflection from a true Icons talent focusing on just a period during his rise and reign as a Pop Star. Prince is more complex than these kinds of Jane Goodall puff pieces that they can't seem to stop finding themselves in the middle of, with the help of the estate, The Current, and every other writer who can see the money train that surrounds the Purple Rain era.

Huh? W&L's version of Prince has pretty much stayed the same post 2016 as it was before that, albeit they're now a bit freer to talk about him than they were before. And they were doing "Girl Powered", "LGBTQ", "Representationalism" centered music in the late 80s.

People have been venerating them, and people have been bitching and moaning about them getting too much credit since, what, 1984?

I do agree, as I said earlier in this thread, that they were two very well connected young musicians and Prince was not, and that should not be ignored.

As for Morris, Andre, Dez, Jill etc. name a person in the fan community who doesn't want to hear their perspective.

What are you talking about, W&L weren't "out" in the 80's.

You can't assume anything isn't "showbiz" in the Prince world, until you hear differently.

Until W&L came out in the late 90's, I never knew they were LGBTQ.

I thought that Eroica jumped the gun on Sheryl Crow's Tuesday Night Music Club big time, and is tremendously slept on.

jaawwnn said:

Genesia said:

Source?

Did a bit of googling and there's this reference on princevault


http://www.princevault.com/index.php?title=Call_Of_The_Wild

"Susannah Melvoin had prompted Prince to listen to some music by British rock band Led Zeppelin"

Which frankly is ambigious, e.g.:

"Listen to these"

"Oh that old band? I used to listen to them in high school, it's been years, but ok lets put them on"

That is EXACTLY how I envision that conversation.

Genesia said:

jaawwnn said:

Did a bit of googling and there's this reference on princevault


http://www.princevault.com/index.php?title=Call_Of_The_Wild

"Susannah Melvoin had prompted Prince to listen to some music by British rock band Led Zeppelin"

Which frankly is ambigious, e.g.:

"Listen to these"

"Oh that old band? I used to listen to them in high school, it's been years, but ok lets put them on"

That is EXACTLY how I envision that conversation.

Yeah, that sounds about right... I remember kids dissing the Beatles when Elton John came out with his version of "Lucy In The Sky With Diamonds." That old band?! Elton does it so much better!

But are the questions starting to get a little mixed here?

To the peripheral (to this thread) question of what P may have thought of Led Zeppelin, we have a limited indication from that 1985 Rolling Stone quote noted upthread:

"How do you feel about people calling the record 'psychedelic'?

I don’t mind that, because that was the only period in recent history that delivered songs and colors. Led Zeppelin, for example, would make you feel differently on each song."

https://www.rollingstone.com/music/music-news/prince-talks-the-silence-is-broken-58812/

It's only one quote, but that particular quote suggests some admiration for Led Zeppelin.

wilmer said:

while Wendy and Lisa, well, they sorta tanked

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Sure, buddy.

OldFriends4Sale said:

I disagree, Wendy and Lisa have won awards for their work. Soundtracks and movie scores. They are very successful.

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Also worked with Joni Mitchell and Grace Jones and plenty other artists.

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