OldFriends4Sale said:

ChocolateBox3121 said:

Where were ALL of U when Denise "Vanity" Matthews was broke and sick? When she really needed your support & help U were NOWHERE to be found. Seems too little too late to me.Smh

Hey. You don't know what people did.

People have lives as well. and dealing with suffering death sicknesses of their own/families.

You don't know peoples financial situations or life situations.

And again you don't know what people have done.

Do not, I repeat, Do Not, turn this thread into your own personal vindictive attack.

You just RE-joined the org (allegedly) this month.

Blaming people for Denise Matthews death is pathetic.

[Edited 2/20/18 11:00am]

Denise kisses Prince on the cheek at the 1985 AMA's. I love how Wendy held Prince's hand. I also love what Prince said here:

.

"Life means death without adventure. Adventure only comes to those who are willing to be daring and take chances."

.

https://www.youtube.com/w...9ErTK3n8NE

Denise I'm so sorry that I didn't keep my promise with U. I know U were a lil angry with me about it. But know that my heart was in the right place. I miss U and Prince so much. But I feel at peace to know U two are back together again . Please find it in your to 4give me.

ChocolateBox3121 said:

Denise I'm so sorry that I didn't keep my promise with U. I know U were a lil angry with me about it. But know that my heart was in the right place. I miss U and Prince so much. But I feel at peace to know U two are back together again . Please find it in your to 4give me.

peace be with you Chocolate.

rip P and D

cloveringold85 said:

Denise kisses Prince on the cheek at the 1985 AMA's. I love how Wendy held Prince's hand. I also love what Prince said here:

.

"Life means death without adventure. Adventure only comes to those who are willing to be daring and take chances."

.

https://www.youtube.com/w...9ErTK3n8NE

That was a wonderful night. Purple was the color. Erotic City citizens all came out

It was so great to be able sit at home and watch that all happen on tv. the good days

Toban said:

OldFriends4Sale said:

cloveringold85 said:

Denise kisses Prince on the cheek at the 1985 AMA's. I love how Wendy held Prince's hand. I also love what Prince said here:

.

"Life means death without adventure. Adventure only comes to those who are willing to be daring and take chances."

.

https://www.youtube.com/w...9ErTK3n8NE

That was a wonderful night. Purple was the color. Erotic City citizens all came out

It was so great to be able sit at home and watch that all happen on tv. the good days

.

Yes, it sure was! I remember watching it too and had goosebumps!

.

Interesting how Denise presented award to Prince because they were split-up by that time. I read somewhere that Prince had a nervous breakdown after Denise left him....do you know if this is true?

cloveringold85 said:

OldFriends4Sale said:

That was a wonderful night. Purple was the color. Erotic City citizens all came out

It was so great to be able sit at home and watch that all happen on tv. the good days

.

Yes, it sure was! I remember watching it too and had goosebumps!

.

Interesting how Denise presented award to Prince because they were split-up by that time. I read somewhere that Prince had a nervous breakdown after Denise left him....do you know if this is true?

Had that show on my Prince VHS tape lol

No, I haven't heard that before. I know that had to be a little stressful for the movie, and under stress he must have been in. And then waiting for the reviews with Apollonia laying under a table, that was heavy on him. But I never heard about a breakdown after Denise left him.

purplegirl00 said:

Toban said:

Thank You

.

I don’t know what I would have done.

I don’t know what I would have become.

Life has been a thief that seemed to always take from me,

and though life is short

sometimes the days can be so long.

.

… battered, bruised, scarred, confused

you have kissed every ache

your touch has healed my faith

when this life had me shook to my core…

having you I don’t want for anything more.

.

Thank You for being who You are.

Thank You for traveling with me this far.

Thank You for whatever it is in me You see.

But most of all… Thank U

4 loving me.

.

.

I miss You so much Sis

.

Thank you for sharing this pic with us including Denise's letters and poems. The poem you shared up above is touching. Did you write it or was it Denise's?

The write is mine.

To state the obvious Denise inspired and mused many. Evidently a virtue that few were immune...

Toban said:

purplegirl00 said:

Thank you for sharing this pic with us including Denise's letters and poems. The poem you shared up above is touching. Did you write it or was it Denise's?

The write is mine.

To state the obvious Denise inspired and mused many. Evidently a virtue that few were immune...

Denise touched so many- first as Vanity musing with the beauty she was blessed with and her charming personality. Then later affecting the masses with her humilty, caring, wisdom, and faith in Jesus. I did not have the fortune to meet her, but based on everything I've read, no one left the same after their encounter with her.

*

Your poem is truly heartfelt. If I may, did you write this after her passing or prior?

It's easy to imagine how she moved the artistic people closest to her, inspiring poems like this one you wrote. Also, I think of the many songs Prince wrote about her/ their connection.

Another great find by Mandragone Vanity Interview https://www.youtube.com/c...azH7bop6UA

[Edited 2/23/18 20:28pm]

purplegirl00 said:

Toban said:

The write is mine.

To state the obvious Denise inspired and mused many. Evidently a virtue that few were immune...

Denise touched so many- first as Vanity musing with the beauty she was blessed with and her charming personality. Then later affecting the masses with her humilty, caring, wisdom, and faith in Jesus. I did not have the fortune to meet her, but based on everything I've read, no one left the same after their encounter with her.

*

Your poem is truly heartfelt. If I may, did you write this after her passing or prior?

It's easy to imagine how she moved the artistic people closest to her, inspiring poems like this one you wrote. Also, I think of the many songs Prince wrote about her/ their connection.

For a few reasons and for one very significant reason it should be no surprise that Denise, as an archetype (woman), often found her way into my writes. During inspired moments Denise’s image had a tendency to invade, supersede and even overwrite memory. She reminded me too much of why I fell in love with her sister, so much so to a point where I finally had to say something to her and admit why I had continued to keep my distance.

That’s my excuse and I’m sticking to it.

.

Poetry was one of many of our shared interest. Both DeBorah and Denise read me well and they always seemed to find that deeper meaning in my lyrics and poetry that I was not willing to disclose or otherwise openly express. They also had a similar manner of speech, a unique hyperbaton syntax or play on words that really made you think.

This poem was written in 2008 or 2009. I remember discussing it with her at the time regarding keeping its ambiguity, in that the poem also felt like a prayer.

.

I do not foresee her influence fading anytime soon. In fact, quite the opposite.

I have many of her notes and sermons

this is a rough draft of something Denise wrote 3 years ago tomorrow.

.

Toban said:

purplegirl00 said:

Denise touched so many- first as Vanity musing with the beauty she was blessed with and her charming personality. Then later affecting the masses with her humilty, caring, wisdom, and faith in Jesus. I did not have the fortune to meet her, but based on everything I've read, no one left the same after their encounter with her.

*

Your poem is truly heartfelt. If I may, did you write this after her passing or prior?

It's easy to imagine how she moved the artistic people closest to her, inspiring poems like this one you wrote. Also, I think of the many songs Prince wrote about her/ their connection.

For a few reasons and for one very significant reason it should be no surprise that Denise, as an archetype (woman), often found her way into my writes. During inspired moments Denise’s image had a tendency to invade, supersede and even overwrite memory. She reminded me too much of why I fell in love with her sister, so much so to a point where I finally had to say something to her and admit why I had continued to keep my distance.

That’s my excuse and I’m sticking to it.

.

Poetry was one of many of our shared interest. Both DeBorah and Denise read me well and they always seemed to find that deeper meaning in my lyrics and poetry that I was not willing to disclose or otherwise openly express. They also had a similar manner of speech, a unique hyperbaton syntax or play on words that really made you think.

This poem was written in 2008 or 2009. I remember discussing it with her at the time regarding keeping its ambiguity, in that the poem also felt like a prayer.

.

I do not foresee her influence fading anytime soon. In fact, quite the opposite.

I'm sure it was easy to fall for Denise. If she and Deborah were so similar as you have described, it was wise and appropriate of you to keep distance.

*

I could tell Denise was a deep in her expression based on some of the excerpts I read from "Blame it On Vanity". There was so much in the small tidbits I read. The pictures of the poems you shared with us last year or the year before were also abstract and deeply spiritual.

*

Your poem did sound like a prayer, thanksgiving. Thank you for telling us the background on it.

*

Denise's legacy and influence will only expand as we learn more. Speaking of learning more, will Denise's unpublished memoir be released? I know you mentioned some possibilities a few months back, but I wondered if that was still a consideration for you and/or DeBorah (or anyone else)?

Toban said:

I have many of her notes and sermons

this is a rough draft of something Denise wrote 3 years ago tomorrow.

.

i have heard this song ”SAY SOMETHING I’M GIVING UP ON YOU” the truth is, the words truly saddened me upon hearing and here is why...and so i changed them..”Say something "I WON’T" GIVE UP ON YOU”...it is a terrible thing to give up on anyone that is sick, lonesome or depressed or even dying. We certainly wouldn’t wish that on ourselves right! This is why we love our Jesus, This is why we pray ALOUD...instead of look over friends and family at the peak of their death and stand by with vain regrets, tears and hands shaking with no hope in ur own breath...'WE NEED JESUS BEFORE WE DIE”..for their is no death bed repentance written and u are greatly mistaken concerning the thief on the cross were forgiven by Jesus HE WAS GOD IN THE FLESH, THEY WERE FORGIVEN RIGHT THERE however after that Jesus thru the Holyghost gave us commandments to obey after He lrft this earth lifted up into the heavens in Acts 1 Jesus gave those commandments to the Apostles and the FIRST one was that we “REPENT AND BE BAPTISED IN THE NAME OF JESUS CHRIST FOR THE REMISSION OF OUR SINS AND WE SHALL RECIEVE THE GIFT OF THE HOLYGHOST - EVIDENCE OF THIS IS WE WILL SPEAK WITH TONGUES AND BE A WITNESS OF CHRIST IN LOUR LIFE .. don’t u want Heaven rather than hell..i am talking to those that have a seed of faith...where are you going, either OR... u make that decision, if u are really looking for Christ then run after Him with all your Heart, ask Him for Pastors that truly love Him for real..Acknowledge Him in everything you do and He will direct ur path..really He that seeks Him will find Him amen!

Come fall in love with Jesus so He can save you, and u will have the body of Christ on your side to pray for you when times get rough. Moments of silence as the world calls it doesn’t work when we live in PRACTISING sin...God answers prayers to when we repent which means to turn from this wicked world and come back to Him. Let Jesus comfort you in ALL times of trouble..Jesus really does answer our prayers, it has got to be the most powerful miracle of all that when you talk to Him.... He answers back...We will fly one day, and reach the stars...i am so happy.. i feel like i am flying right now..i love you all and i will pray for you..SAY SOMETHING I WON’T GIVE UP ON YOU....LUVD

Whoa.. this is powerful. I love how she took the message in this sad, hopeless song (which brings me to tears), and made into something we should be looking towards- Jesus.

Thank you for sharing this with us!

Does anyone know who this person next to Vanity is, I know this was taken at a Prince show in 1986 (Vanity is wearing one of Prince's outfits) http://forevervanity.tumb...anity-1986

Goddess4Real said:

Does anyone know who this person next to Vanity is, I know this was taken at a Prince show in 1986 (Vanity is wearing one of Prince's outfits) http://forevervanity.tumb...anity-1986

Yes... Audra

The Sixx Era

Yes, even she believes the pic is from 86.

She works about 1/2 mile of a house I've been remodeling since December.

Toban said:

Goddess4Real said:

Does anyone know who this person next to Vanity is, I know this was taken at a Prince show in 1986 (Vanity is wearing one of Prince's outfits) http://forevervanity.tumb...anity-1986

Yes... Audra

The Sixx Era

Yes, even she believes the pic is from 86.

She works about 1/2 mile of a house I've been remodeling since December.

Thanks

purplegirl00 said:

Toban said:

For a few reasons and for one very significant reason it should be no surprise that Denise, as an archetype (woman), often found her way into my writes. During inspired moments Denise’s image had a tendency to invade, supersede and even overwrite memory. She reminded me too much of why I fell in love with her sister, so much so to a point where I finally had to say something to her and admit why I had continued to keep my distance.

That’s my excuse and I’m sticking to it.

.

Poetry was one of many of our shared interest. Both DeBorah and Denise read me well and they always seemed to find that deeper meaning in my lyrics and poetry that I was not willing to disclose or otherwise openly express. They also had a similar manner of speech, a unique hyperbaton syntax or play on words that really made you think.

This poem was written in 2008 or 2009. I remember discussing it with her at the time regarding keeping its ambiguity, in that the poem also felt like a prayer.

.

I do not foresee her influence fading anytime soon. In fact, quite the opposite.

I'm sure it was easy to fall for Denise. If she and Deborah were so similar as you have described, it was wise and appropriate of you to keep distance.

*

I could tell Denise was a deep in her expression based on some of the excerpts I read from "Blame it On Vanity". There was so much in the small tidbits I read. The pictures of the poems you shared with us last year or the year before were also abstract and deeply spiritual.

*

Your poem did sound like a prayer, thanksgiving. Thank you for telling us the background on it.

*

Denise's legacy and influence will only expand as we learn more. Speaking of learning more, will Denise's unpublished memoir be released? I know you mentioned some possibilities a few months back, but I wondered if that was still a consideration for you and/or DeBorah (or anyone else)?

I imagine it would be very easy to fall for Denise, however that was not what I meant.

.

Telling Denise that sometimes it was difficult to be around her because I had been in love with her sister and that I still loved her sister, had mostly to do with loss.

We had first separated in 1999 and it was my anger and frustration over where I believed DeBorah and I should have been with our sons as a family that sometimes made it difficult to be around Denise. It was not her fault and it was not fair to her, but Denise almost always reminded me of DeBorah, and sometimes it was a painful reminder.

I was the only family in the area and made it a point to be there when she needed me, however there are many things that I regret not making the time to do with her due to past memories.

.

I was there, I witnessed and I knew depth of their connection. I knew what Denise had ask of her and what DeBorah had been willing to do for her regarding her health, her marriage and agreeing to carry a child. I did not like hearing Denise speak badly of her sister where I was concerned, which is what actually initiated my finally having to say something.

.

How similar they were, how and why they could communicated without speaking even over the phone revealed more to me about their childhood then they could have ever explained; and technically neither one ever did.

Having them both in the same room was like having either one in Stereo. Our sons were always freaked out by how alike they were.

.

.

Denise’s musing influence on my poetry, the bulk of which was written from 2008 to 2011, that was due to my beginning to see a lot of Denise from 2001 through 2006, and the fact that the person (woman of interest) whom had encouraged me to begin writing again, who mused me most and collaborated with me, and whom had initially invited me to the poetry group we were part of, that person chose not to reveal themselves to me for those 3 years; and never has over the past 10 years.

.

Talk about your Strange Relations, eh?

During those 3 years I can’t honestly say that Denise was the catalyst that inspired any particular write. It’s that as a romantic poet, visually, her manner, my memory and image of her fit well with most of what I was writing at the time. The poem “I Wrote Her” is just one example of my utilizing Denise’s character, and even channeling Prince when I wrote “Melancholy.”

.

In answering each question, in the telling of each story it is with difficulty that I force myself to compartmentalize various aspects of my relationships to Denise in order to be able to speak candidly or write objectively about her, instead of just desperately wanting everyone to see what I saw, and to know and remember her as I did by attempting to fill up pages with only what I found to be so amazing about her.

It is a fine line that is not so well define to see her through my eyes.

In my eyes as a poet, in my eyes a friend, in my eyes as In-Law relations makes everything said relative, if not Freudian. Critiques of which I do understand.

.

Honestly I don’t feel the need to take such liberties in the telling of her incredible journey and life story. It would be exhausting trying to hide, deny, explain, justify and analytically attempt to balance my personal experiences and memory of her against the decades of sensationalized marketing, the publicity, escapades and salacious history of her celebrity persona as Vanity, that was created, advertised and that has been and will be forever promoted by the legend of Prince.

.

DeBorah and I were talking about talking yesterday. After reminiscing a bit and even discussing some of the subjects like the Org, Mark’s book, the cufflinks and jewelry she continue to make for him, Audra, Prince’s calls to check on Denise, the night Denise was calling about his son etc.… we decided we should hang out like we use to back in the day, and discuss what we want to do with Denise’s things, including her art, signed poetry and her memoirs, which DeBorah has not yet read. So for now I’ll leave it until then and to her to decide.

Toban said:

purplegirl00 said:

I'm sure it was easy to fall for Denise. If she and Deborah were so similar as you have described, it was wise and appropriate of you to keep distance.

*

I could tell Denise was a deep in her expression based on some of the excerpts I read from "Blame it On Vanity". There was so much in the small tidbits I read. The pictures of the poems you shared with us last year or the year before were also abstract and deeply spiritual.

*

Your poem did sound like a prayer, thanksgiving. Thank you for telling us the background on it.

*

Denise's legacy and influence will only expand as we learn more. Speaking of learning more, will Denise's unpublished memoir be released? I know you mentioned some possibilities a few months back, but I wondered if that was still a consideration for you and/or DeBorah (or anyone else)?

I imagine it would be very easy to fall for Denise, however that was not what I meant.

.

Telling Denise that sometimes it was difficult to be around her because I had been in love with her sister and that I still loved her sister, had mostly to do with loss.

We had first separated in 1999 and it was my anger and frustration over where I believed DeBorah and I should have been with our sons as a family that sometimes made it difficult to be around Denise. It was not her fault and it was not fair to her, but Denise almost always reminded me of DeBorah, and sometimes it was a painful reminder.

I was the only family in the area and made it a point to be there when she needed me, however there are many things that I regret not making the time to do with her due to past memories.

.

I was there, I witnessed and I knew depth of their connection. I knew what Denise had ask of her and what DeBorah had been willing to do for her regarding her health, her marriage and agreeing to carry a child. I did not like hearing Denise speak badly of her sister where I was concerned, which is what actually initiated my finally having to say something.

.

How similar they were, how and why they could communicated without speaking even over the phone revealed more to me about their childhood then they could have ever explained; and technically neither one ever did.

Having them both in the same room was like having either one in Stereo. Our sons were always freaked out by how alike they were.

.

.

Denise’s musing influence on my poetry, the bulk of which was written from 2008 to 2011, that was due to my beginning to see a lot of Denise from 2001 through 2006, and the fact that the person (woman of interest) whom had encouraged me to begin writing again, who mused me most and collaborated with me, and whom had initially invited me to the poetry group we were part of, that person chose not to reveal themselves to me for those 3 years; and never has over the past 10 years.

.

Talk about your Strange Relations, eh?

During those 3 years I can’t honestly say that Denise was the catalyst that inspired any particular write. It’s that as a romantic poet, visually, her manner, my memory and image of her fit well with most of what I was writing at the time. The poem “I Wrote Her” is just one example of my utilizing Denise’s character, and even channeling Prince when I wrote “Melancholy.”

.

In answering each question, in the telling of each story it is with difficulty that I force myself to compartmentalize various aspects of my relationships to Denise in order to be able to speak candidly or write objectively about her, instead of just desperately wanting everyone to see what I saw, and to know and remember her as I did by attempting to fill up pages with only what I found to be so amazing about her.

It is a fine line that is not so well define to see her through my eyes.

In my eyes as a poet, in my eyes a friend, in my eyes as In-Law relations makes everything said relative, if not Freudian. Critiques of which I do understand.

.

Honestly I don’t feel the need to take such liberties in the telling of her incredible journey and life story. It would be exhausting trying to hide, deny, explain, justify and analytically attempt to balance my personal experiences and memory of her against the decades of sensationalized marketing, the publicity, escapades and salacious history of her celebrity persona as Vanity, that was created, advertised and that has been and will be forever promoted by the legend of Prince.

.

DeBorah and I were talking about talking yesterday. After reminiscing a bit and even discussing some of the subjects like the Org, Mark’s book, the cufflinks and jewelry she continue to make for him, Audra, Prince’s calls to check on Denise, the night Denise was calling about his son etc.… we decided we should hang out like we use to back in the day, and discuss what we want to do with Denise’s things, including her art, signed poetry and her memoirs, which DeBorah has not yet read. So for now I’ll leave it until then and to her to decide.

Thank you for your reply Toban. Please accept my apology as I assumed different than what you explained up above in regards to the reason for keeping your distance from Denise and finally having to tell her as to why. I drew a premature conclusion and I appreciate your explanation which makes sense. I could see why being around Denise with your sons would've been, at times, a painful reminder of DeBorah as you explained how similar she and Denise were.

.

As you said in an earlier post, Denise mused many. I can see her fitting into the muse of a romantic poem or song, even if she didn't originally muse the writer. Not many can do that. I can see it being difficult expressing thoughts in artform with the unique position you were in with her, without raising eyebrows or receiving judgment.

.

Denise led a fascinating life as Vanity, Denise, and the Evangelist. I get that you might not feel qualified to tell her story, share her memoirs. That's understandable. However, I do hope that DeBorah would seriously consider it as many of us want to know. More importantly it would be a loving tribute to continue her legacy. Denise left items in yours (and her) care for a reason.

.

You said that she "continued making jewelry and cufflinks for him"- was this back in the 80's only or in recent years too? It's good to hear that Prince was checking on Denise and she on him in the 90's, especially since both were going through some difficult life situations and transitions during those years.

Goddess4Real said:

Prince Nelson. Retweeted

Prince Nelson.‏ @BestPrincevids 8 Aug 2017

Look at Vanity making sure nobody talking shit about her man.

Never knew she was offerred a part in "The Color Purple". Probably the part of Squeak, which ended up being played by Rae Dong Chong. Amazing the number of singers who were offerred a part in the film and most turned it down.

kitbradley said:

Goddess4Real said:

Prince Nelson. Retweeted

Prince Nelson.‏ @BestPrincevids 8 Aug 2017

Look at Vanity making sure nobody talking shit about her man.

Never knew she was offerred a part in "The Color Purple". Probably the part of Squeak, which ended up being played by Rae Dong Chong. Amazing the number of singers who were offerred a part in the film and most turned it down.

Could have been the part of"Sug". Tina Turner turned it down.

OldFriends4Sale said:

ChocolateBox3121 said:

kitbradley said:

Never knew she was offerred a part in "The Color Purple". Probably the part of Squeak, which ended up being played by Rae Dong Chong. Amazing the number of singers who were offerred a part in the film and most turned it down.

Could have been the part of"Sug". Tina Turner turned it down.

I love the fact Denise never run around bragging about her past and who she knew and what she knew.

.

For me it is not matter what she was offered in the movie- the fact she was at least offered. Interesting peeps always try to belittle her as a no talent. She had a legitimate career after V6.She was not hanging onto Prince to make her money or further her career.

[Edited 3/4/18 7:38am]