mediumdry said:

Vashtix said:

whenever we have discussion abiut Jill someone always tries to make her out to be angry or loony.

I wonder why. It wouldn't be that she acts angry or loony, right?

Nothing looney about telling what you know to be true. It would be looney to say nothing.

Look like Morris Hayes is backing her up about this song being written in 82 per his twitter.

The old :she is just a crazy women routine does not always work"

-------

laurarichardson said:

Jill has the right to express herself. In her case her voice should not be ridiculed or silenced because it is not in agreement with others.
I keep saying that Prince worked with many people and some I don't care for but no matter their voices should not be
silenced and that includes Jill's.
She should not be labeled with such derogatory names such as loony and angry.
Her place as part of the Purple Kingdom should not be dismissed or discounted for whatever reason.
Like it or not she wss there before, during and after some others. She needs inclusion in the narrative of his legacy because she was there.
Any exclusion whether deliberate or a honest mistake lessens the project in my opinion.
To me no matter if you like peeps or not if they were there they cannot be erased.
[Edited 6/29/17 12:59pm]

Drfunk talks about this on his new podcast..interesting to learn that P was engaged to bria 😶

Strawberrylova123 said:

Drfunk talks about this on his new podcast..interesting to learn that P was engaged to bria 😶

oh were they?

I was hearing a bit during that time that she was in it for marriage not for an album

OldFriends4Sale said:

Let me correct myself, dfunk said that prince gave "another girl/boy to bria as a wedding gift, manuela was upset because p gave her that song as a wedding gift

Dr funk spilling the tea

I'm so glad Jill Jones cleared that up. I also like how outspoken she is. For too long, too many fans were saying Prince wrote 'The Beautiful Ones' and other songs for Susannah, only to find out that wasn't true. I'd rather believe one of Prince's band members or known, close associate than a fan.

2elijah said:

I'm so glad Jill Jones cleared that up. I also like how outspoken she is. For too long, too many fans were saying Prince wrote 'The Beautiful Ones' and other songs for Susannah, only to find out that wasn't true. I'd rather believe one of Prince's band members or known, close associate than a fan.

Wonderful Ass was talked about since the early 2000s in ALex Hahns Book where he quotes Susan Rogers talking about Vanity & Prince.
This is nothing knew... gurl you better brush up on your Purple Music 101 lol

.

But the information about the Beautiful Ones, came from Prince's camp not fans

Strawberrylova123 said:

OldFriends4Sale said:

oh were they?

I was hearing a bit during that time that she was in it for marriage not for an album

Let me correct myself, dfunk said that prince gave "another girl/boy to bria as a wedding gift, manuela was upset because p gave her that song as a wedding gift

Ahhh

Well thank U for that. So that song is pretty old. 2003ish

Thanks 4 sharing

LOL I unlike Laurarichardson has the book

CatB said:

OldFriends4Sale said:

What did he say Laurarichardson? Post the quote? You don't even have the quote

Are U serious? Now I have to translate it from German to English

Girls go sit down lol

If you need help with that - I speak German

endiadj said:

Wait, there were actually women who would choose Miko over Prince? Prince was threatened by Miko? Why?

Yes, and not only Miko.

2elijah said:

I'm so glad Jill Jones cleared that up. I also like how outspoken she is. For too long, too many fans were saying Prince wrote 'The Beautiful Ones' and other songs for Susannah, only to find out that wasn't true. I'd rather believe one of Prince's band members or known, close associate than a fan.

It was a surprise for Prince to even speak on TBOs but sweet just the same, especially at the Piano and Mic concert and who would have imagined Prince would not even be here soon after so it was a gift in a way. He gifted us in farewell tour so to speak. Prince himself busted the myths.

OldFriends4Sale said:

I was referring to the many fans over the years, on Prince fan sites, including this one, who said TBO was written for Susannah. My point is, I'd rather accept that the truth or clarification of such claims, from former band members/close associates, who were personal friends or worked with him. That's all. No biggy.

Some of Prince's thoughts on what song was written about who...(Ebony magazine Dec 2015)

SoulAlive said:

petalthecat said:

Do u ever get the feeling that P told several ladies in his life that he'd written a song for them. Maybe this is how the confusion arose. It's like the ultimate romantic gesture.

Very good point.Prince was a player back then.He told these ladies what they wanted to hear

yes,darling....this song is about you....I wrote it right after we made love last night...you mean everything to me

and then a few days later,he tells the same thing to the next woman he sleeps with

Yep, I think he did that a lot!

laurarichardson said:

Did u not read the part where I said I was neutral? Hardly Melvoin worship!!! FYI I place Jill much higher than Susannah. Ur argument became invalid when u pulled out the race card. WTF. I can barely remember stuff from 1983 I'm not senile..I think. I think some of u should check ur JJ worship and have a unbiased debate. Or is it just a race thing?

petalthecat said:

laurarichardson said:

---Do you think she is senile and cannot remember what she saw with her own eye? Why are the bi-racial women telling lies or having a faulty memory and Susanna the rigthous one? Do you have any idea how that looks? As far as songs are concerned Jill has said she has a log, Vanity according to her brother had a diary, letters, and a book. Eric Leeds claims he has log of the songs he played on so when he starts bitching because he did not credit is he going to be treated as a looney too. Some of you need to check your Melvoin worship. [Edited 6/29/17 5:27am]

Did u not read the part where I said I was neutral? Hardly Melvoin worship!!! FYI I place Jill much higher than Susannah. Ur argument became invalid when u pulled out the race card. WTF. I can barely remember stuff from 1983 I'm not senile..I think. I think some of u should check ur JJ worship and have a unbiased debate. Or is it just a race thing?

Maybe you do not have Melvoin worship but some others do. Race does not invalid issues because

some needs to explain why so much hate toward the women of color in Prince's life.

Jill said she has a log and she provided her copy of at least one of the songs that she is singing on so she is not just going off of memory. If you and others are ingnoring this fact what could be the reason for doing so.

And that means you are incapable of lies? Also it means when it was discussed on this board those people were lying also. Everybody is telling lies except you. Okay

OldFriends4Sale said:

LOL I unlike Laurarichardson has the book

CatB said:

Yes, and not only Miko.

Strawberrylova123 said:

OldFriends4Sale said:

oh were they?

I was hearing a bit during that time that she was in it for marriage not for an album

Let me correct myself, dfunk said that prince gave "another girl/boy to bria as a wedding gift, manuela was upset because p gave her that song as a wedding gift

Where does Dr. Funk say this at?

He said the song was written for M2 has a anniversity gift and later placed on Bria's album. He did not say anything about Bria and Prince being engaged and he was trying to say that if Prince would give a anniversity giff song to another artist then mabye he did the same thing with "Wonderful Ass" which could be true but still does not change the fact that the song was handed to Vanity before he even met Susannannah.

Also why would he not put the song on Bria's album as he was no longer married to M2 and she did try to take him to the cleaners in the divorce.

Who would be happy about a divorce and the fall out from it. It is called moving on.

U R incapable of quoting things from stuff you don't have.

U send me a link in German and say 'look I don't speak German and you probably don't either but her is my proof... i german'

laurarichardson said:

And that means you are incapable of lies? Also it means when it was discussed on this board those people were lying also. Everybody is telling lies except you. Okay

OldFriends4Sale said:

LOL I unlike Laurarichardson has the book

laurarichardson said:

It is called moving on.

.

ah.. like from Vanity to Susannah? I listened to the original Wonderful Ass. Sounded like it was about Vanity. Then I listened to the Purple Rain Deluxe version of it. Sounded like someone had moved on.

laurarichardson said:[quote]

Strawberrylova123 said:

OldFriends4Sale said:

oh were they?

I was hearing a bit during that time that she was in it for marriage not for an album

Let me correct myself, dfunk said that prince gave "another girl/boy to bria as a wedding gift, manuela was upset because p gave her that song as a wedding gift

Where does Dr. Funk say this at?

He said the song was written for M2 has a anniversity gift and later placed on Bria's album. He did not say anything about Bria and Prince being engaged and he was trying to say that if Prince would give a anniversity giff song to another artist then mabye he did the same thing with "Wonderful Ass" which could be true but still does not change the fact that the song was handed to Vanity before he even met Susannannah.

Also why would he not put the song on Bria's album as he was no longer married to M2 and she did try to take him to the cleaners in the divorce.

Who would be happy about a divorce and the fall out from it. It is called moving on.

.
[Edited 6/30/17 8:59am]

luvgirl said:

That book was straight up bias!!! No one had not a nice thing to say about Vanity.

Strawberrylova123 said:

Wow. Yes I knew they were in love and serious. Her sister said she had never seen her so in love. Wonder what happened. Dr. Funk, time to tell us more. Please. Us girls need a little romance to keep us goin right now.

Strawberrylova123 said:[quote]

laurarichardson said:

Oh for gosh sakes people, get your facts straight before just pulling something out your butt. You had me all excited for a good romance story there.
SHEESH.

Double post
[Edited 7/1/17 7:40am]

PennyPurple said:

I don't think this is the case.
I believe Prince always had very strong feelings for women and often some of the same language (words) inside his mind for that.
So he'd write a song for one girl and really mean that and feel that
Then later he'd really feel the same way about another girl and the same words and even same music maybe,would come back into his head.

OldFriends4Sale said:

Denise Matthews would not want us discussing Wonderful A$$..
Neither would Prince We Can F--k... We still bypass them, and that's on us...

You say Prince was reducing her to having a wonderful A$$. On the surface yes, but deeper, I say it's a song built on the virtue of resentment that Categorizes the lack of trust in their relationship - Showcasing one of the reasons (And it wasn't her butt, lol,) why Prince wasn't able to dissolve the affair even though the loss of security in her. However, with the reverb lyrics, she gives back as good as she gets in the song..."You think my friends are my bedmate" reverb "But you sleep around all the time..."

Susan Rogers assessment of Vanity was based on her opinion, therefore her judgement was insulting. With that opinion she helped to relegate Vanity to the author's and the reader's perception of an annoying and abrasive unhinged nymphomanic. If that's not insulting...

Many Orgers perception of Vanity seems to be colored only by the book Possessed and the quotes you provided. Roy Bennett: "There was no way to have a close relationship with her; she wasn't that kind of person." My perception of her in the era with Prince, does not run along the same lines as the book Possessed. Based on some inaccurate information already proven to be false, it's a book I don't hold in high regards or take as authority on Vanity's time with Prince. I've gathered a more realistic outlook based on different resources, weighing them in contrast to what Denise said...(Prince and her were very close) what Prince said... (he loved her deeply) what Jill Jones said... (Vanity suffered extreme jealously) what Dez Dickerson said about how the band felt towards her and what may have influenced how the Bennett's felt about her... "There was also interpersonal tension in Vanity 6 camp. Brenda Bennett and Vanity did not get along at all. On one occasion, it came to physical violence." Nothing is black and white. There are those grey areas. We'd be back and forth for days if I start to get into them all.. No, I won't pretend that Vanity was an angel, she was damaged from her past and she and Prince were too much alike, but I'm not buying that she was the Pariah "Possessed" made her out to be either. Denise Matthews said, she did not become an avid drug user until after Prince.

At any rate, I personally think Lisa was only speaking in terms of that specific recording, not the lyrics to the song being about Susannah. Those are some volatile lyrics. Exactly the cusp of what Prince and Vanity were going through in their volatile relationship.
[Edited 7/1/17 9:03am]

luvgirl said:

OldFriends4Sale said:

Luvgirl, you aren't looking at this clearly.
.
Susan Rogers did not say anything insulting about Vanity.
Just look at the lyrics to the song. Prince is evaluating her and reducing her to having a wonderful ass. Yes playful and tongue in cheek, but it is what it is. And Vanity was not in a good place. Let's not act like Vanity was 'stable' she was using Coccaine. As I said before, if Denise Matthews was alive today, what would she say if questioned about the song?

.

There is no suspicion. Lisa was not talking about credit, she was just recapping the energy and fun around working on the song. Remember she worked on it and song with Prince. And she again never highlighted Susannah as the focal point. She said PRINCE had a nice butt, and she and Prince were talking about their girlfriends (Wendy & Susannah's) butts. No where did she say it was all about Susannah's Butt.

Denise Matthews would not want us discussing Wonderful A$$.. Neither would Prince We Can F--k... We still bypass them, and that's on us... You say Prince was reducing her to having a wonderful A$$. On the surface yes, but deeper, I say it's a song built on the virtue of resentment that Categorizes the lack of trust in their relationship - Showcasing one of the reasons (And it wasn't her butt, lol,) why Prince wasn't able to dissolve the affair even though the loss of security in her. However, with the reverb lyrics, she gives back as good as she gets in the song..."You think my friends are my bedmate" reverb "But you sleep around all the time..." Susan Rogers assessment of Vanity was based on her opinion, therefore her judgement was insulting. With that opinion she helped to relegate Vanity to the author's and the reader's perception of an annoying and abrasive unhinged nymphomanic. If that's not insulting... Many Orgers perception of Vanity seems to be colored only by the book Possessed and the quotes you provided. Roy Bennett: "There was no way to have a close relationship with her; she wasn't that kind of person." My perception of her in the era with Prince, does not run along the same lines as the book Possessed. Based on some inaccurate information already proven to be false, it's a book I don't hold in high regards or take as authority on Vanity's time with Prince. I've gathered a more realistic outlook based on different resources, weighing them in contrast to what Denise said...(Prince and her were very close) what Prince said... (he loved her deeply) what Jill Jones said... (Vanity suffered extreme jealously) what Dez Dickerson said about how the band felt towards her and what may have influenced how the Bennett's felt about her... "There was also interpersonal tension in Vanity 6 camp. Brenda Bennett and Vanity did not get along at all. On one occasion, it came to physical violence." Nothing is black and white. There are those grey areas. We'd be back and forth for days if I start to get into them all.. No, I won't pretend that Vanity was an angel, she was damaged from her past and she and Prince were too much alike, but I'm not buying that she was the Pariah "Possessed" made her out to be either. Denise Matthews said, she did not become an avid drug user until after Prince. At any rate, I personally think Lisa was only speaking in terms of that specific recording, not the lyrics to the song being about Susannah. Those are some volatile lyrics. Exactly the cusp of what Prince and Vanity were going through in their volatile relationship. [Edited 7/1/17 9:03am]

I know, that is why I said it, no reason for other people to get so upset about it or take to arms about it. We can discuss it, but the declarations by some as if Denise Matthews would care

.

Yes, I don't mean reducing her in a bad way. The song is about evaluating how this woman thinks or views him and even with all those complications ... which are more his complications ... she still has a wonderful ass

I also read those lyrics and they can easily transfer from one relationship to another(especially during the 1980-1988 period) because I feel the 'evaluation' was more about Prince and closer to a reality about him, than about the woman/Vanity.

.

Just because it was based on her opinion, as you and I are giving opinions, doesn't make it insulting(especially just because we might disagree with it) Sadly (Blame It On)Vanity had a lot of issues including drug abuse.

I remember being in the middle of a wonder Prince & Vanity 6(1981-1983) era thread in 2016 when we got the news she passed away. http://prince.org/msg/7/421124

.

I've never seen Vanity in a bad way and definately not as a Pariah. Even reading and liking the book I never walked away with that image of Vanity.

.

I agree, and agree and agree again that Lisa was talking from that time of the recording time. Jill and no one else needed to take it out of context.

OldFriends4Sale said:

I wonder if anyone will ask her to clarify better? I'm sure she knows what's being said at this point. Might be best to clear up what she meant so the whole thing doesn't come off so suspect. Jill Jones speaking out and now Morris Hayes.
[Edited 7/1/17 17:12pm]

luvgirl said:

OldFriends4Sale said:

I know, that is why I said it, no reason for other people to get so upset about it or take to arms about it. We can discuss it, but the declarations by some as if Denise Matthews would care

.

Yes, I don't mean reducing her in a bad way. The song is about evaluating how this woman thinks or views him and even with all those complications ... which are more his complications ... she still has a wonderful ass

I also read those lyrics and they can easily transfer from one relationship to another(especially during the 1980-1988 period) because I feel the 'evaluation' was more about Prince and closer to a reality about him, than about the woman/Vanity.

.

Just because it was based on her opinion, as you and I are giving opinions, doesn't make it insulting(especially just because we might disagree with it) Sadly (Blame It On)Vanity had a lot of issues including drug abuse.

I remember being in the middle of a wonder Prince & Vanity 6(1981-1983) era thread in 2016 when we got the news she passed away. http://prince.org/msg/7/421124

.

I've never seen Vanity in a bad way and definately not as a Pariah. Even reading and liking the book I never walked away with that image of Vanity.

.

I agree, and agree and agree again that Lisa was talking from that time of the recording time. Jill and no one else needed to take it out of context.

I wonder if anyone will ask her to clarify better? I'm sure she knows what's being said at this point. Might be best to clear up what she meant so the whole thing doesn't come off so suspect. Jill Jones speaking out and now Morris Hayes. [Edited 7/1/17 17:12pm]

They should just ask her themselves. She was there. Most people don't want clarity though. If they did they would just ask.