OldFriends4Sale said:

wavesofbliss said:

I'm not talking about in latter years.

Can U post your posts outside of the box?

sure.

You've given me plenty to think about.

I think it's because I've read SOO many stories about Prince being mean, unfair, and cruel - especially in relation to W&L leaving (they wanted to leave, he felt betrayed, and to get back at them he had them finish the tour only to fire them at the end so that it would be on HIS terms), that I did genuinely wonder if it was some huge, immature fight.

TrivialPursuit said:

It's hyperbole to say he turned his back on them. It wasn't some huge falling out. Sure there was friction and arguments and disagreements, but not everyone is 12 years old and stomps off in a tantrum because they have a verbal kerfuffle with someone.

Prince worked on a W&L song just a few years after the end of The Revolution, and they eventually worked on a few songs for him. I think it's always a misnomer to assume that when people leave the band or whatever, that there is instant hatred and resentment. There isn't.

I used to think that. One thing I've learned, since the internet age and connecting with band members, etc., is that al of these folks mostly stayed friends. They became friends and a family that they never expected. Frankly, I see Brownmark having a bigger riff with Prince in 1986 than W&L did. His low pay, being put behind those three dingalings onstage, etc. He didn't even thank Prince on his first record (W&L did, so did Bobby, and Fink). He was upset for a while, and rightly so, but things eventually came back around.

The Brits, Tavis, 2000 Celebration, "In This Bed.." - there's a lot of Revolution interaction with Prince, and at that point, it's all good. I think Prince regretted how he dealt with W&L sometimes, because he was still human. He wasn't as "I don't look back" as he might have confessed in public. He never cut ties with anyone.

Footnote: He did get upset at the 'fancy lesbian' comment though, whcih I thought was hysterical.

Interesting, I always read the reality checkers were W&L and Alan.

TrivialPursuit said:

There is actually something poetic about his relationship with Wendy. He had a certain swagger and bravado on stage that no one ever matched. Off stage, Wendy had her own bravado 24/7. She was always what he was in the spotlight. We know Prince was funny and had a sense of humor. Her pulling his armpit hairs in the studio, even after he said to stop, certainly has to land on the side of affection, considering there was no blow up when it happened. (The story is in DMSR.)

Sometimes I wonder if he wasn't a little afraid of her. The one thing I loved about Purple Rain was Wendy telling him off, and being the mouth piece. Lisa talked to Wendy, mostly. But Wendy stood in front and faced The Kid down. That was obviously an element in real life, too. The only other person to really give The Kid a reality check was Bobby Z, and that lends to him being the older brother in the band, as he's been described. It's a bit like when you pick on someone, just to see if they can take it, or give it back, instead of cower. I do that, and if someone gives it back - they have my respect more than those who tuck tail and run.

With Wendy, if anyone was ever a reflection of Prince in certain ways, it was Wendy Melvoin. Not 100%, but a good deal of the time.

later on Prince would talk about how he would always change the bands up when dealing with this issue. But he actually never did it until 1986

Gayle Chapman left replaced by Lisa
Andre Cymone left replaced by BrownMark

Dez Dickerson left replaced by Wendy Melvoin

BrownMark Wendy & Lisa (were leaving) replaced by Levi Seacer, Miko Weaver & Boni Boyer

* Bobby Z replaced by Sheila E

* Jerome Benton replaced by Cat (people always forget this firing of a key long time connection to Prince)

so up till this point, people who were in his life and camp for a good period of time were leaving on their own. Then in 1990 he talked about how 'if everyone left he would be all alone'.

Atlanta Bliss retired

Eric Leeds...

then Sheila E was replaced (Prince wanted her to do a 4th solo album) she left

Cat Glover left (replaced by? Robin Powers? the Game Boyz? Mayte? Diamonds & Pearls?)

Boni Boyer left replaced by Rosie Gaines

Dr Fink replaced

Miko Weaver replaced

‘We tell Prince we love him all the time,” says Wendy. “He always gets all embarrassed and doesn’t know what to say. We tell him to tell us the same thing so he goes, ‘Uh, okay, yeah, I love you too.’ It’s silly, us all being so intense about it and swooning over each other, but it’s meaningful. Not that the rest of the band doesn’t understand Prince — they do. We’re just a bit more spiritual with him.” -1986

craft6 said:

You've given me plenty to think about.

I think it's because I've read SOO many stories about Prince being mean, unfair, and cruel - especially in relation to W&L leaving (they wanted to leave, he felt betrayed, and to get back at them he had them finish the tour only to fire them at the end so that it would be on HIS terms), that I did genuinely wonder if it was some huge, immature fight.

TrivialPursuit said:

It's hyperbole to say he turned his back on them. It wasn't some huge falling out. Sure there was friction and arguments and disagreements, but not everyone is 12 years old and stomps off in a tantrum because they have a verbal kerfuffle with someone.

Prince worked on a W&L song just a few years after the end of The Revolution, and they eventually worked on a few songs for him. I think it's always a misnomer to assume that when people leave the band or whatever, that there is instant hatred and resentment. There isn't.

I used to think that. One thing I've learned, since the internet age and connecting with band members, etc., is that al of these folks mostly stayed friends. They became friends and a family that they never expected. Frankly, I see Brownmark having a bigger riff with Prince in 1986 than W&L did. His low pay, being put behind those three dingalings onstage, etc. He didn't even thank Prince on his first record (W&L did, so did Bobby, and Fink). He was upset for a while, and rightly so, but things eventually came back around.

The Brits, Tavis, 2000 Celebration, "In This Bed.." - there's a lot of Revolution interaction with Prince, and at that point, it's all good. I think Prince regretted how he dealt with W&L sometimes, because he was still human. He wasn't as "I don't look back" as he might have confessed in public. He never cut ties with anyone.

Footnote: He did get upset at the 'fancy lesbian' comment though, whcih I thought was hysterical.

so, from what i'm reading is wendy/lisa wanted to quit in the middle of the parade tour? if true, i'd be pissed too. you compromise the band, prince, his reputation and everyone's money in doing so. of course he would feel betrayed by them at the time.

endiadj said:

so, from what i'm reading is wendy/lisa wanted to quit in the middle of the parade tour? if true, i'd be pissed too. you compromise the band, prince, his reputation and everyone's money in doing so. of course he would feel betrayed by them at the time.

I believe it was near the end. into the Japanese leg of the tour.

so they couldn't just fulfill their obligation and then have a big sit with prince afterwards? would've been the better thing to do.

I wonder why we haven't heard from tha Rev since their touring announcement.

endiadj said:

so they couldn't just fulfill their obligation and then have a big sit with prince afterwards? would've been the better thing to do.

obviously a little more happening...

OldFriends4Sale said:

but they came back and finished it, so it was something they were obviously willing to deal once prince basically begged them to stay. it just was an unprofessional move on their part and prince had a right to feel betrayed.

luv2tha99s said:

I wonder why we haven't heard from tha Rev since their touring announcement.

Probably taking their time, preparing.

OldFriends4Sale said:

I'm not talking about in latter years.
more of a joke than anything
Paisley Park wasn't a money maker, people got shifted around 2 paisley park their role diminished, then they are gone...
I'll post something Alan said about that when I get home

any luck finding those quotes from Alan Leeds. I was under the impression that ppl just wanted out of the crazy tour schedule and so they went to admin. but AL had always been on the admin. side of things.

It may be this one: http://prince.org/msg/7/171968

wavesofbliss said:

OldFriends4Sale said:

I'm not talking about in latter years.
more of a joke than anything
Paisley Park wasn't a money maker, people got shifted around 2 paisley park their role diminished, then they are gone...
I'll post something Alan said about that when I get home

any luck finding those quotes from Alan Leeds. I was under the impression that ppl just wanted out of the crazy tour schedule and so they went to admin. but AL had always been on the admin. side of things.

You're right, it is hyperbole.

I was just thinking about him not only telling Wendy to reject her sexuality and religion but also sending Wendy and Lisa notices from his legal team telling them to stop talking about their time with them. They even said they felt it was unfair since that was part of their history too.

I should've said I felt he could've been a better friend/person in those instances. I was going to ask why not sit them down and talk through their issues instead of writing a song but that would be me assuming they didn't, so nevermind.

TrivialPursuit said:

It's hyperbole to say he turned his back on them. It wasn't some huge falling out. Sure there was friction and arguments and disagreements, but not everyone is 12 years old and stomps off in a tantrum because they have a verbal kerfuffle with someone.

Prince worked on a W&L song just a few years after the end of The Revolution, and they eventually worked on a few songs for him. I think it's always a misnomer to assume that when people leave the band or whatever, that there is instant hatred and resentment. There isn't.

I used to think that. One thing I've learned, since the internet age and connecting with band members, etc., is that al of these folks mostly stayed friends. They became friends and a family that they never expected. Frankly, I see Brownmark having a bigger riff with Prince in 1986 than W&L did. His low pay, being put behind those three dingalings onstage, etc. He didn't even thank Prince on his first record (W&L did, so did Bobby, and Fink). He was upset for a while, and rightly so, but things eventually came back around.

The Brits, Tavis, 2000 Celebration, "In This Bed.." - there's a lot of Revolution interaction with Prince, and at that point, it's all good. I think Prince regretted how he dealt with W&L sometimes, because he was still human. He wasn't as "I don't look back" as he might have confessed in public. He never cut ties with anyone.

Footnote: He did get upset at the 'fancy lesbian' comment though, whcih I thought was hysterical.