beachy said:

30yearfan said:

Hey Beachy, I got a question about the white snake. The guy in the video said that Prince gave Vanity the snake backstage at the American music awards, but he also said that it was the night the Vanity met MC. Hammer. That could not have been 1985 because MC Hammer did not come out until I believe 1989 or 1990. Prince got a big award during the 1990 AMA's so I'm wondering if that is when she got the snake. This would have them still connected as the 1990's began. Just curious.

That would be cool and maybe it is but I think it was in 85. wiki had mc hammer becoming active in 85 and an album out in 86 although he didn't become mainstream til 88. I think Prince gave her the white snake because her album was called Wild Animal (just a guess, kind of a congratulations present maybe), also it symbolized the penis. He was doing the same thing like when he put her orgasm on Come IMO. lol. that night was the night instead of singing on MJ's charity record he went to a restaurant with Jill Jones and had a bustup, with 2 bodyguards arrested. I think he was actually a really nervous scared guy in the face of all the publicity.

That could be true. I just wonder though because everything that Prince did in 1985 got major press. I wonder how he could give her a gift like that without the press getting wind of it. Everybody back then was always watching both Prince and Vanity. By 1990 rap had become a thing and Prince was not as in the press as he was during the Purple Rain whirlwind. Just a thought.

beachy said:

cng89 said:

Question, Y'all! A picture post on V's Facebook has me going crazy. She reference's Prince's song Strange Relationship on a picture of her and Prince. I believe that song came out in 87 so was that a period where she was with Sixx and Prince was trying to get her back? It seems like that song was about her. Beachy, you have all the tea so help me, LOL!

hey can you post a link? lol this sounds delicious

https://www.facebook.com/...mp;theater

I hope I did that right.

cng89 said:

Question, Y'all! A picture post on V's Facebook has me going crazy. She reference's Prince's song Strange Relationship on a picture of her and Prince. I believe that song came out in 87 so was that a period where she was with Sixx and Prince was trying to get her back? It seems like that song was about her. Beachy, you have all the tea so help me, LOL!

Strange Relationship was originally recorded in spring-summer 1982. So yes, I think it is about her. He remixed it in late Oct-early Nov 1986, then it went into Sign O' Times album that was released 31 March 1987.

[Edited 5/26/16 18:44pm]

SunnyGirl8 said:

Vashtix said:

I missed that he went to funeral;

It would appear more than just going to the funeral, the funeral was delayed so he could finalise the Aust & NZ leg of his tour. I believe the Oakland gigs the day after funeral were only set up a couple of days before. For that timing to be going on, you'd assume he would be in the loop with a wide variety of things to do with Denise.

That was my thinking as well as far as the timing goes with his concerts.

The thing is I am pretty sure he knew she was having problems, but the guy had walled his emotions over that day his father would not let him come home. He said it was the last time he ever cried. I don't think he had great access to his emotions except through music, and that became a strength that helped him become a star. But he was pretty thoughtful of other people going through loss. My guess is he was aware she was going through a bad period and their mutual friends kept him informed. But it was a surprise to everyone when she passed. MC Hammer had just been to church with her Saturday night when all of a sudden she was in the hospital the next day and he was very surprised.

[Edited 5/26/16 18:51pm]

SunnyGirl8 said:

Vashtix said:

I missed that he went to funeral;

It would appear more than just going to the funeral, the funeral was delayed so he could finalise the Aust & NZ leg of his tour. I believe the Oakland gigs the day after funeral were only set up a couple of days before. For that timing to be going on, you'd assume he would be in the loop with a wide variety of things to do with Denise.

Where did you see this as I haven't heard that before?

SunnyGirl8 said:

cng89 said:

Question, Y'all! A picture post on V's Facebook has me going crazy. She reference's Prince's song Strange Relationship on a picture of her and Prince. I believe that song came out in 87 so was that a period where she was with Sixx and Prince was trying to get her back? It seems like that song was about her. Beachy, you have all the tea so help me, LOL!

Strange Relationship was originally recorded in spring-summer 1982. So yes, I think it is about her. He remixed it in late Oct-early Nov 1986, then it went into Sign O' Times album that was released 31 March 1987.

[Edited 5/26/16 18:44pm]

I wonder why he released it THAT late?

cng89 said:

30yearfan said:

beachy said:

That would be cool and maybe it is but I think it was in 85. wiki had mc hammer becoming active in 85 and an album out in 86 although he didn't become mainstream til 88. I think Prince gave her the white snake because her album was called Wild Animal (just a guess, kind of a congratulations present maybe), also it symbolized the penis. He was doing the same thing like when he put her orgasm on Come IMO. lol. that night was the night instead of singing on MJ's charity record he went to a restaurant with Jill Jones and had a bustup, with 2 bodyguards arrested. I think he was actually a really nervous scared guy in the face of all the publicity.

That could be true. I just wonder though because everything that Prince did in 1985 got major press. I wonder how he could give her a gift like that without the press getting wind of it. Everybody back then was always watching both Prince and Vanity. By 1990 rap had become a thing and Prince was not as in the press as he was during the Purple Rain whirlwind. Just a thought.

the guy said it happened backstage, so could have been in a dressing room.

Goddess4Real said:

Here again is the article where Vargas Sieloff his said Prince attended Vanity's funeral and looked frail http://www.ocregister.com...argas.html

Thank you for the link

Hate reading he was frail

Hate reading he had to leave due to no privacy

cng89 said:

SunnyGirl8 said:

Strange Relationship was originally recorded in spring-summer 1982. So yes, I think it is about her. He remixed it in late Oct-early Nov 1986, then it went into Sign O' Times album that was released 31 March 1987.

[Edited 5/26/16 18:44pm]

I wonder why he released it THAT late?

early nov 86 - also when he recorded Adore

beachy said:

cng89 said:

I wonder why he released it THAT late?

early nov 86 - also when he recorded Adore

Chills are coming again

I can't shake them

kellyna said:

SunnyGirl8 said:

It would appear more than just going to the funeral, the funeral was delayed so he could finalise the Aust & NZ leg of his tour. I believe the Oakland gigs the day after funeral were only set up a couple of days before. For that timing to be going on, you'd assume he would be in the loop with a wide variety of things to do with Denise.

Where did you see this as I haven't heard that before?

It's not something that's been published. It's a logical assumption. Why else would you hold off someones funeral for two weeks? She died in mid-February (I think it was 15th? but 16th in Austraiia) on the first night of his tour in Australia. His finished his tour of Aust & NZ in Perth on 25th February. Given the time zones and distance to be travelled, it looks like the funeral lines up perfectly with the end of the tour. Her funeral didn't happen until Sat 27th February in Oakland. They set up the Oakland concert for the Sun 28th Feb only about 24th? (it was a really short time frame before the gig). And the concerts at the end of that week on Fri 4th March only went on sale in the couple of days before hand. The remaining concerts for California, New York, Canada, Altanta were all scheduled at relatively short notice.

And it must have been devastating for him having her die when he was so far away. I assume that he knew she was ill but thought he could go on tour for a couple of weeks and be closer to home if she took a turn. Apparently, she passed really quickly and again given the time zones and distance, even if he'd wanted to throw in the tour and go to her, it's unlikely he could have made it back in time to see her anyway.

[Edited 5/26/16 19:10pm]

cng89 said:

SunnyGirl8 said:

Strange Relationship was originally recorded in spring-summer 1982. So yes, I think it is about her. He remixed it in late Oct-early Nov 1986, then it went into Sign O' Times album that was released 31 March 1987.

[Edited 5/26/16 18:44pm]

I wonder why he released it THAT late?

kellyna said:

beachy said:

During the 80s all the main women around Prince were strong. Cat. Vanity, Sheila, Susannah, Kim.

From 1990 they were young and moldable.

I think he changed. First, UTCM and GB were failures. Second, he discovered he didn't own his masters and got into a war with WB. Third, music taste changed to hip hop / rap which to me is already much less for strong women, almost misogynistic some would say. To some extent he followed that trend. To go from Lovesexy tour to Nude tour, if you watch them, says alot.

.

I personally don't think Vanity and Prince had contact lately, or if they did it was bittersweet romance or firm and maybe awkward friendship. I think her death brought the latent feelings of how much he loved her to the surface. And that is what we saw in the P&M concerts. I think he believed they would be together again in the next life, and I believe it too. they had some kind of 'deal' to work through in this life, which as we now know, is a kind of 'Parade.'

.

The only loose end I personally have now is the secret he was going to reveal in GB.

I was thinking about this last night. I'm so curious as to how much contact they might have had or not had over the last year of Denise's life. We've guessed that he managed to kind of keep tabs on her and they had mutual friends (Shiela E, Apples etc) which might also have given him some second-hand news about her and her health. I wonder did he follow her on Facebook or other social media. I remember her saying in that 2007 interview that she would love to see him face to face and would leave it up to God to supernaturally make it happen. She mentioned in that interview that they spoke from time to time.

But did he know just how sick she was when she got that last diagnosis (that we discussed earlier in the thread). I posted how I saw some medical expert talk about it after Denise's death and he had said that once people are diagnosed with it, they rarely survive more than about 6 months (which was about how long she lasted).

For some reason, based on Prince's emotional reaction when he got the news while in Australia, i got the sense that her death had surprised him - that he hadn't expected it to happen. That while he knew that she was continually battling health issues, he might have assumed that she would once again beat the odds and live for years and years more. And one of the reasons he might have been so emotional is that he didn't really get the chance to say goodbye to her and to tell her just how much she meant to him and continued to mean to him.

I also wondered about the program at Denise's memorial service. We know that Prince was there for most of it and sat up in the balcony. What must he have thought when he read that line about "her not feeling worthy of love?" Would it make him sad and full of regret that maybe in the end she didn't realize how much he had loved her because he always expressed himself through his music instead of telling her these things to her face?

There's nothing worse than losing someone you love and feeling like things were unresolved or left unsaid between you. And if he hadn't seen her in person in years, he might also have felt badly about that as well.

I wonder what was going through him. I am sure it had to have been incredibly painful to read that program. Then to see all the beautiful pictures of her.

cng89 said:

beachy said:

hey can you post a link? lol this sounds delicious

https://www.facebook.com/...mp;theater

I hope I did that right.

she DID say it was an intense love/hate relationship lol. so yeah. it fits.

beachy said:

SunnyGirl8 said:

It would appear more than just going to the funeral, the funeral was delayed so he could finalise the Aust & NZ leg of his tour. I believe the Oakland gigs the day after funeral were only set up a couple of days before. For that timing to be going on, you'd assume he would be in the loop with a wide variety of things to do with Denise.

That was my thinking as well as far as the timing goes with his concerts.

The thing is I am pretty sure he knew she was having problems, but the guy had walled his emotions over that day his father would not let him come home. He said it was the last time he ever cried. I don't think he had great access to his emotions except through music, and that became a strength that helped him become a star. But he was pretty thoughtful of other people going through loss. My guess is he was aware she was going through a bad period and their mutual friends kept him informed. But it was a surprise to everyone when she passed. MC Hammer had just been to church with her Saturday night when all of a sudden she was in the hospital the next day and he was very surprised.

[Edited 5/26/16 18:51pm]

Yes well that was my point, he knew that she had health problems but he was truly surprised by what seemed like her "sudden death" and that partly accounts for why he was so emotional when he got the news in Australia. Also why I surmised that there may have been things left unsaid and it may also have been some time since he had talked to her in any kind of meaningful way.

wizardtelly said:

beachy said:

Is that Vanity talking about Prince? Can you post a link?

Here beachy and friends/ https://m.facebook.com/ph...;source=43 My eyes are not dry this evening at all. I'm so sad, but yet so very happy because it was true all along. Their story never died.

SunnyGirl8 said:

kellyna said:

Where did you see this as I haven't heard that before?

It's not something that's been published. It's a logical assumption. Why else would you hold off someones funeral for two weeks? She died in mid-February (I think it was 15th? but 16th in Austraiia) on the first night of his tour in Australia. His tour of Aust & NZ and completed on Perth on 25th February. Given the time zones and distance to be travelled, it looks like the funeral lines up perfectly with the end of the tour. Her funeral didn't happen until Sat 27th February in Oakland. They set up the Oakland concert for the Sun 28th Feb only about 24th? (it was a really short time frame before the gig). And the concerts at the end of that week on Fri 4th March only went on sale in the couple of days before hand. The remaining concerts for California,New York, Canada, Altanta were all scheduled at relatively short notice.

And it must have been devastating for him having her die when he was so far away. I assume that he knew she was ill but thought he could go on tour for a couple of weeks and be closer to home if she took a turn. Apparently, she passed really quickly and again given the time zones and distance, even if he'd wanted to throw in the tour and go to her, it's unlikely he could have made it back in time to see her anyway.

Oh okay so it's not fact you just assuming that was the case. Maybe but as it was a memorial service (not a funeral) it's not uncommon to organize those a few weeks after someone has died. I can imagine Prince wanting to make plans to attend if possible, but I doubt they would organize the whole service around his schedule. Plus all of the concerts in his Piano / Microphone tour were made at the last moment (confirmed only a few days or a week ahead). He played two dates in Toronto and it was announced just a couple of days beforehand.

kellyna said:

SunnyGirl8 said:

It's not something that's been published. It's a logical assumption. Why else would you hold off someones funeral for two weeks? She died in mid-February (I think it was 15th? but 16th in Austraiia) on the first night of his tour in Australia. His tour of Aust & NZ and completed on Perth on 25th February. Given the time zones and distance to be travelled, it looks like the funeral lines up perfectly with the end of the tour. Her funeral didn't happen until Sat 27th February in Oakland. They set up the Oakland concert for the Sun 28th Feb only about 24th? (it was a really short time frame before the gig). And the concerts at the end of that week on Fri 4th March only went on sale in the couple of days before hand. The remaining concerts for California,New York, Canada, Altanta were all scheduled at relatively short notice.

And it must have been devastating for him having her die when he was so far away. I assume that he knew she was ill but thought he could go on tour for a couple of weeks and be closer to home if she took a turn. Apparently, she passed really quickly and again given the time zones and distance, even if he'd wanted to throw in the tour and go to her, it's unlikely he could have made it back in time to see her anyway.

Oh okay so it's not fact you just assuming that was the case. Maybe but as it was a memorial service (not a funeral) it's not uncommon to organize those a few weeks after someone has died. I can imagine Prince wanting to make plans to attend if possible, but I doubt they would organize the whole service around his schedule. Plus all of the concerts in his Piano / Microphone tour were made at the last moment (confirmed only a few days or a week ahead). He played two dates in Toronto and it was announced just a couple of days beforehand.

But the Australia & NZ dates were fixed and sold before she died - 16th to 25th February. It would have been very expensive for him to cancel those gigs - it's not the same as rescheduling in your home country like he did with the one gig in Atlanta.

It just looks like it was lined up and he was taken into consideration. As Denise's Pastor? said in the press, the love of Denise's life was Prince. I can't imagine them scheduling the funeral in a way so he couldn't attend. And they made it a closed service apparently because they thought he could be there and they didn't want a problem with fans.

SunnyGirl8 said:

kellyna said:

Where did you see this as I haven't heard that before?

It's not something that's been published. It's a logical assumption. Why else would you hold off someones funeral for two weeks? She died in mid-February (I think it was 15th? but 16th in Austraiia) on the first night of his tour in Australia. His finished his tour of Aust & NZ in Perth on 25th February. Given the time zones and distance to be travelled, it looks like the funeral lines up perfectly with the end of the tour. Her funeral didn't happen until Sat 27th February in Oakland. They set up the Oakland concert for the Sun 28th Feb only about 24th? (it was a really short time frame before the gig). And the concerts at the end of that week on Fri 4th March only went on sale in the couple of days before hand. The remaining concerts for California, New York, Canada, Altanta were all scheduled at relatively short notice.

And it must have been devastating for him having her die when he was so far away. I assume that he knew she was ill but thought he could go on tour for a couple of weeks and be closer to home if she took a turn. Apparently, she passed really quickly and again given the time zones and distance, even if he'd wanted to throw in the tour and go to her, it's unlikely he could have made it back in time to see her anyway.

[Edited 5/26/16 19:10pm]

I read that she went into the hospital and died like the next day. He wouldn't have been able to make it to be by her side.

purplegirl00 said:

SunnyGirl8 said:

It's not something that's been published. It's a logical assumption. Why else would you hold off someones funeral for two weeks? She died in mid-February (I think it was 15th? but 16th in Austraiia) on the first night of his tour in Australia. His finished his tour of Aust & NZ in Perth on 25th February. Given the time zones and distance to be travelled, it looks like the funeral lines up perfectly with the end of the tour. Her funeral didn't happen until Sat 27th February in Oakland. They set up the Oakland concert for the Sun 28th Feb only about 24th? (it was a really short time frame before the gig). And the concerts at the end of that week on Fri 4th March only went on sale in the couple of days before hand. The remaining concerts for California, New York, Canada, Altanta were all scheduled at relatively short notice.

And it must have been devastating for him having her die when he was so far away. I assume that he knew she was ill but thought he could go on tour for a couple of weeks and be closer to home if she took a turn. Apparently, she passed really quickly and again given the time zones and distance, even if he'd wanted to throw in the tour and go to her, it's unlikely he could have made it back in time to see her anyway.

[Edited 5/26/16 19:10pm]

I read that she went into the hospital and died like the next day. He wouldn't have been able to make it to be by her side.

I know it's just awful I've had friends in that exact scenario and it really screws you up.

SunnyGirl8 said:

kellyna said:

Oh okay so it's not fact you just assuming that was the case. Maybe but as it was a memorial service (not a funeral) it's not uncommon to organize those a few weeks after someone has died. I can imagine Prince wanting to make plans to attend if possible, but I doubt they would organize the whole service around his schedule. Plus all of the concerts in his Piano / Microphone tour were made at the last moment (confirmed only a few days or a week ahead). He played two dates in Toronto and it was announced just a couple of days beforehand.

But the Australia & NZ dates were fixed and sold before she died - 16th to 25th February. It would have been very expensive for him to cancel those gigs - it's not the same as rescheduling in your home country like he did with the one gig in Atlanta.

It just looks like it was lined up and he was taken into consideration. As Denise's Pastor? said in the press, the love of Denise's life was Prince. I can't imagine them scheduling the funeral in a way so he couldn't attend. And they made it a closed service apparently because they thought he could be there and they didn't want a problem with fans.

Well yes I can see why you're thinking that's what happened. If Prince expressed an interest in attending the service, it might account for the timing and for the fact that initially it was open to the public, but then later closed to them. Probably also why Prince sat in the balcony as they / he didn't people showing up to see him instead of coming to honour Denise.

SunnyGirl8 said:

kellyna said:

Oh okay so it's not fact you just assuming that was the case. Maybe but as it was a memorial service (not a funeral) it's not uncommon to organize those a few weeks after someone has died. I can imagine Prince wanting to make plans to attend if possible, but I doubt they would organize the whole service around his schedule. Plus all of the concerts in his Piano / Microphone tour were made at the last moment (confirmed only a few days or a week ahead). He played two dates in Toronto and it was announced just a couple of days beforehand.

But the Australia & NZ dates were fixed and sold before she died - 16th to 25th February. It would have been very expensive for him to cancel those gigs - it's not the same as rescheduling in your home country like he did with the one gig in Atlanta.

It just looks like it was lined up and he was taken into consideration. As Denise's Pastor? said in the press, the love of Denise's life was Prince. I can't imagine them scheduling the funeral in a way so he couldn't attend. And they made it a closed service apparently because they thought he could be there and they didn't want a problem with fans.

yeah i think they accomodated him, and since he would be back in a few weeks, it was not a terribly hard thing to do. And he organized his schedule around it as far as coming almost directly there from Australia. then staying to do a few concerts while he was there. Then they announced it would be private memorial a few days before so strangers could not get in. Guess even the guests they let in couldn't resist asking for selfies.

kellyna said:

SunnyGirl8 said:

But the Australia & NZ dates were fixed and sold before she died - 16th to 25th February. It would have been very expensive for him to cancel those gigs - it's not the same as rescheduling in your home country like he did with the one gig in Atlanta.

It just looks like it was lined up and he was taken into consideration. As Denise's Pastor? said in the press, the love of Denise's life was Prince. I can't imagine them scheduling the funeral in a way so he couldn't attend. And they made it a closed service apparently because they thought he could be there and they didn't want a problem with fans.

Well yes I can see why you're thinking that's what happened. If Prince expressed an interest in attending the service, it might account for the timing and for the fact that initially it was open to the public, but then later closed to them. Probably also why Prince sat in the balcony as they / he didn't people showing up to see him instead of coming to honour Denise.

I'm sure I read an article prior to the service stating that Prince was the reason why it went from open to closed. I think it was one of the local papers for Oakland area and her Pastor was talking about it.

ok for anybody who is tired of crying and wants to LOL I got a real great video of Prince in 1980 wearing black suspenders and a zebra bikini.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wd45L_kWnCg

Okay I have a question about Prince's music (just cause we've been talking about various songs on this thread). I have never used Tidido before and I see where you can sign up and listen to music - but it is just to listen to on your computer? You can't download it or add it an IPOD etc is that correct?

cardinal said:

cng89 said:

Listen, I almost stroked out trying to get into that Denise, Mayte and Sheila stuff, lol but I can see what you are saying. He was different in his later years for sure but in your opinion do you think he and Denise would have ever had another chance if he took a step away from the music business and just live life? I mean, he lived in Minnesota where no one bothered him. He wasn't famous Prince to them there. Do you think they could have made it work?

interesting question. i guess its always up to both parties as to whether something can work. even if he was willing to walk away from music (an idea which is inconceivable to me since he claimed in 2014 he WAS music), there are always so many other things in play in a relationship. past baggage, trust issues, etc etc and they both had plenty of bags. also, i wonder if their christianity was on the same page. not sure if her faith and jw matched, and their faith was very important to each of them. and to your question about the music biz....i can't imagine him having any quality life without it...it seemed to be the one constant in his life other than God. so if he could step away and wanted to perhaps they would have had a shot, but i can't imagine him being able or wanting to step away from music. it was part of his being. and she seemed to be against that lifestyle in any way. a total impasse unfortunately.

You know, God and music seemed to have a hold on him more than people and relationships. They were like an obsession to him and that is probably why his relationships failed so many times.

Vashtix said:

beachy said:

early nov 86 - also when he recorded Adore

Chills are coming again

I can't shake them

This is getting crazy! I just can't shake this right here. Everything is beginning to add up. I am literally shaking!

beachy said:

cng89 said:

I wonder why he released it THAT late?

early nov 86 - also when he recorded Adore

OMG! This is the look on my face right now.......

cng89 said:

cardinal said:

cng89 said: interesting question. i guess its always up to both parties as to whether something can work. even if he was willing to walk away from music (an idea which is inconceivable to me since he claimed in 2014 he WAS music), there are always so many other things in play in a relationship. past baggage, trust issues, etc etc and they both had plenty of bags. also, i wonder if their christianity was on the same page. not sure if her faith and jw matched, and their faith was very important to each of them. and to your question about the music biz....i can't imagine him having any quality life without it...it seemed to be the one constant in his life other than God. so if he could step away and wanted to perhaps they would have had a shot, but i can't imagine him being able or wanting to step away from music. it was part of his being. and she seemed to be against that lifestyle in any way. a total impasse unfortunately.

You know, God and music seemed to have a hold on him more than people and relationships. They were like an obsession to him and that is probably why his relationships failed so many times.

You know I'm not sure whether he was living in Minnesota that much over the years. I read that PP was shut from 1996 - 2006? I'm assuming that was to the public and he still did stuff there. I know in the around 2009 he was living out in LA and recording in LA. I have no idea where he was living at the time of his death