I have seen The Time open for Prince on the Controversy and 1999 tours in person more than once. I even met the Time during this period. I have loved them ever since. They were brilliant but I hardly saw where they ever upstaged Prince. Assuming that Prince actually believed they would has always been rumored to be the reason for taking the Time off the bill in some cities - and with good reason: they certainly gave Prince a run for the money. That 1999 show that Prince did was ground breaking as far I am concerned. A true one man tour de force that set him apart from the rest of the world for the first time - as the 1999 album did. It is a seemingly rare opinion but I feel entitled to it as I was there to witness it.

[Edited 10/27/11 20:37pm]

I wasn't alive back then, but what other reason would Prince have fo taking The Time off the shows? Did he want to do a longer show in those cities? Was the headliner scared of his openong act?

It's happened before I believe with MC Hammer and another group.

Given how Prince typically treats his proteges, this doesn't surprise me. I think that The Time was getting much more recognition than any other opening act was getting at the time, so in that regard they surpassed Prince's expectations. I think the message was, "Prince is great, but don't get to the show late and miss The Time." Again given Prince's track record, I can see how he felt threatened, even if there was no real reason for him to be.

Unfortunately they dont pose any threat to Prince today given that Leno performance. They had to spike that semi weak Trendin with an excerpt from Cool and the peguin awkwardly placed at the beginning before they started singing. And just how fat is Jam and Jellybean now? Oh well, everyone looked sharp and I still love them.

runawayslave said:

Unfortunately they dont pose any threat to Prince today given that Leno performance. They had to spike that semi weak Trendin with an excerpt from Cool and the peguin awkwardly placed at the beginning before they started singing. And just how fat is Jam and Jellybean now? Oh well, everyone looked sharp and I still love them.

Prince, you're on the org now?

They had to be doing something right for Prince to pull them off the show in those major cities, judging from the two shows I've seen from the 1999 tour (Houston-82 leg/Homecoming-83 leg) I can see why Prince was worried about them upstaging him.

runawayslave said:

I have seen The Time open for Prince on the Controversy and 1999 tours in person more than once. I even met the Time during this period. I have loved them ever since. They were brilliant but I hardly saw where they ever upstaged Prince. Assuming that Prince actually believed they would has always been rumored to be the reason for taking the Time off the bill in some cities - and with good reason: they certainly gave Prince a run for the money. That 1999 show that Prince did was ground breaking as far I am concerned. A true one man tour de force that set him apart from the rest of the world for the first time - as the 1999 album did. It is a seemingly rare opinion but I feel entitled to it as I was there to witness it.

[Edited 10/27/11 20:37pm]

Back then, Prince's shows tended to be alittle rambling - especially Controversy. And as much as I loved the Revolution, they just weren't as tight as the Time.

I think thie bigger reason they may have gotten a better crowd reaction is that their music was like a party, where Prince's was more like a show.

Yep. They did. I saw them during those shows too. All along the East Coast. The crowd was more into teh R&B vibe of the Time for one. Also- they worked more as a unit, it was much tighter than Prince's show. Plus they were set up as stars all within the group. People knew their names. That didn't really happen with the Revolution for a lot of people until Purple Rain. It was - that dude in the mask, the chick playing keys, Prince, that dude on bass, the guy with the rock guitar. Of course I knew who they were and schooled people...but they knew Morris, Jesse, Jerome, Jimmy Jam, Terry, Jellybean and Monte.

runawayslave said:

Unfortunately they dont pose any threat to Prince today given that Leno performance. They had to spike that semi weak Trendin with an excerpt from Cool and the peguin awkwardly placed at the beginning before they started singing. And just how fat is Jam and Jellybean now? Oh well, everyone looked sharp and I still love them.

Just how four years old do you have to be to make a comment on peoples weight instead of just commenting on the performance? I saw Prince do some lame appearances on Leno as well (I didn't catch the Time tonight I had to work). Should those weak showings be my barometer of his performing level and should I comment on his height?

Sorry if I offended any five year olds.

PurpleChi said:

Given how Prince typically treats his proteges, this doesn't surprise me. I think that The Time was getting much more recognition than any other opening act was getting at the time, so in that regard they surpassed Prince's expectations. I think the message was, "Prince is great, but don't get to the show late and miss The Time." Again given Prince's track record, I can see how he felt threatened, even if there was no real reason for him to be.

Prince was so paranoid and insecure back then.He saw the rave reviews that the Time were getting and he felt threatened.Notice that,on subsequent tours,he either didn't have an opening act at all or he toured with acts that weren't a threat.

Zannaloaf said:

runawayslave said:

Unfortunately they dont pose any threat to Prince today given that Leno performance. They had to spike that semi weak Trendin with an excerpt from Cool and the peguin awkwardly placed at the beginning before they started singing. And just how fat is Jam and Jellybean now? Oh well, everyone looked sharp and I still love them.

Just how four years old do you have to be to make a comment on peoples weight instead of just commenting on the performance? I saw Prince do some lame appearances on Leno as well (I didn't catch the Time tonight I had to work). Should those weak showings be my barometer of his performing level and should I comment on his height?

Take it personally if you must. You are nobody to me so insults only make you look like a crying child that someone called a name on the schoolyard. Jam and Bean looked huge and how they look is part of the show. Every performer in the world is subject to be judged on how they look as much - or sometimes more - than they are on their performance - sorry, that is just how the world is so accept it or not, its the truth.

runawayslave said:

Zannaloaf said:

Just how four years old do you have to be to make a comment on peoples weight instead of just commenting on the performance? I saw Prince do some lame appearances on Leno as well (I didn't catch the Time tonight I had to work). Should those weak showings be my barometer of his performing level and should I comment on his height?

Take it personally if you must. You are nobody to me so insults only make you look like a crying child that someone called a name on the schoolyard. Jam and Bean looked huge and how they look is part of the show. Every performer in the world is subject to be judged on how they look as much - or sometimes more - than they are on their performance - sorry, that is just how the world is so accept it or not, its the truth.

Really, is this Prince?

Seriously, no matter the appearance, Prince has always gravitated toward talented band members. He's had several vocalists (on his most recent tour) who weren't the 'pencil thin' Barbie types.

If the music is on and the performance is tight, what's it really matter??

jwashin4 said:

runawayslave said:

Take it personally if you must. You are nobody to me so insults only make you look like a crying child that someone called a name on the schoolyard. Jam and Bean looked huge and how they look is part of the show. Every performer in the world is subject to be judged on how they look as much - or sometimes more - than they are on their performance - sorry, that is just how the world is so accept it or not, its the truth.

Really, is this Prince?

Seriously, no matter the appearance, Prince has always gravitated toward talented band members. He's had several vocalists (on his most recent tour) who weren't the 'pencil thin' Barbie types.

If the music is on and the performance is tight, what's it really matter??

I never said there was anything wrong with them being fat. I loved that Rosie was huge - one of my all time fav Prince band members. I met here in the MGM during the show Prince and the Time did there in around the new year 1999. SHe was beautiful and sweet. I commented on their size since it has been a while since they were seen on national TV and they looked bigger than ever. THough I bagged that performance, I didnt say they were disgusting fat slobs. If they had lost a great deal of weight and it was a remarkable difference, people would have noticed that as well. Really no need for all the excitement and hyper sensitivity.

More about EGO than reality.

runawayslave said:

Zannaloaf said:

Just how four years old do you have to be to make a comment on peoples weight instead of just commenting on the performance? I saw Prince do some lame appearances on Leno as well (I didn't catch the Time tonight I had to work). Should those weak showings be my barometer of his performing level and should I comment on his height?

Take it personally if you must. You are nobody to me so insults only make you look like a crying child that someone called a name on the schoolyard. Jam and Bean looked huge and how they look is part of the show. Every performer in the world is subject to be judged on how they look as much - or sometimes more - than they are on their performance - sorry, that is just how the world is so accept it or not, its the truth.

Did you complain when Prince had Rosie Gaines in his band? What about Boni Boyer? As I recall,those ladies weren't exactly skinny.Were you criticizing their weight?

runawayslave said:

Zannaloaf said:

Just how four years old do you have to be to make a comment on peoples weight instead of just commenting on the performance? I saw Prince do some lame appearances on Leno as well (I didn't catch the Time tonight I had to work). Should those weak showings be my barometer of his performing level and should I comment on his height?

Take it personally if you must. You are nobody to me so insults only make you look like a crying child that someone called a name on the schoolyard. Jam and Bean looked huge and how they look is part of the show. Every performer in the world is subject to be judged on how they look as much - or sometimes more - than they are on their performance - sorry, that is just how the world is so accept it or not, its the truth.

...I didn't in any way take it personally. I was making a point about your ragging on the performance and how you maintaned that it is a clear indicator of their current level of playing. Then you went on to gripe about the weight of band members and I adressed that point and your juvenile attitude towards it. Period. I have no idea how you think I took it personally other than to make the post in response to yours. The fact that you *think* I took it personally says sometihng about you methinks.

And no - not every performer is judged on their looks. I listen to many artists that aren't video perfect, and it in no way shape or form ruins the music. 80% of jazz musicians certainly don't work their look and can play to sold out arena's in Japan. You are propping up a fairly American (and spreading) view of music that is intrinsic to pop but not all forms of music. Many places in this world still care about talent and not size, ethnicity or looks.

From your online personality I am happy to be a nobody to you.

SoulAlive said:

runawayslave said:

Take it personally if you must. You are nobody to me so insults only make you look like a crying child that someone called a name on the schoolyard. Jam and Bean looked huge and how they look is part of the show. Every performer in the world is subject to be judged on how they look as much - or sometimes more - than they are on their performance - sorry, that is just how the world is so accept it or not, its the truth.

Did you complain when Prince had Rosie Gaines in his band? What about Boni Boyer? As I recall,those ladies weren't exactly skinny.Were you criticizing their weight?

Didnt criticize Jam or Bean either. Take it personal if you must - I live in the real world.

Zannaloaf said:

runawayslave said:

Take it personally if you must. You are nobody to me so insults only make you look like a crying child that someone called a name on the schoolyard. Jam and Bean looked huge and how they look is part of the show. Every performer in the world is subject to be judged on how they look as much - or sometimes more - than they are on their performance - sorry, that is just how the world is so accept it or not, its the truth.

...I didn't in any way take it personally. I was making a point about your ragging on the performance and how you maintaned that it is a clear indicator of their current level of playing. Then you went on to gripe about the weight of band members and I adressed that point and your juvenile attitude towards it. Period. I have no idea how you think I took it personally other than to make the post in response to yours. The fact that you *think* I took it personally says sometihng about you methinks.

And no - not every performer is judged on their looks. I listen to many artists that aren't video perfect, and it in no way shape or form ruins the music. 80% of jazz musicians certainly don't work their look and can play to sold out arena's in Japan. You are propping up a fairly American (and spreading) view of music that is intrinsic to pop but not all forms of music. Many places in this world still care about talent and not size, ethnicity or looks.

From your online personality I am happy to be a nobody to you.

Going to have to start asking for fare if you are going to ride my jock like this:lol:

runawayslave said:

Zannaloaf said:

...I didn't in any way take it personally. I was making a point about your ragging on the performance and how you maintaned that it is a clear indicator of their current level of playing. Then you went on to gripe about the weight of band members and I adressed that point and your juvenile attitude towards it. Period. I have no idea how you think I took it personally other than to make the post in response to yours. The fact that you *think* I took it personally says sometihng about you methinks.

And no - not every performer is judged on their looks. I listen to many artists that aren't video perfect, and it in no way shape or form ruins the music. 80% of jazz musicians certainly don't work their look and can play to sold out arena's in Japan. You are propping up a fairly American (and spreading) view of music that is intrinsic to pop but not all forms of music. Many places in this world still care about talent and not size, ethnicity or looks.

From your online personality I am happy to be a nobody to you.

Going to have to start asking for fare if you are going to ride my jock like this:lol:

runawayslave said:

SoulAlive said:

Did you complain when Prince had Rosie Gaines in his band? What about Boni Boyer? As I recall,those ladies weren't exactly skinny.Were you criticizing their weight?

Didnt criticize Jam or Bean either. Take it personal if you must - I live in the real world.

Just you mentioning something about how big they've supposedly gotten IS a not-so-subtle criticism of their look, as if it had ANYTHING to do with their talent or how great the band is as a whole. It was just an unnecessary comment; much like it would be if you brought up Boni's weight whenever speaking of the SOTT/Lovesexy band or Rosie's weight when talking about the old NPG (both of which you HAVEN'T done).

And, NO ONE'S taking anything you say as personal. Trust me on that. So, you can stop saying it as some sort of insult.

i can only go by the footage i have of the 1999 tour and various cd's i have of this tour and i even looked at prince's set during the 1999 tour. there is a thing called maturity and confidence on stage and even tho prince had confidence, u could just tell from the way he held the mic out 2 the audience at his hip then later in other tours it was more arms level. that being said, when u look at the time's performance during the 1999 tour and listen 2 the crowds reactions 2 the music and their stage show, yes u can tell they rocked it out harder than prince did on several nights. one can chalk it up 2 a off night but i highly doubt due 2 the material done on that tour that it's not hard 2 see why fans an critics might have had a higher appreciation for the time than prince at the time. if u have footage of the time during the 1999 tour, just look at the ending of their show where they came out from behind their instruments 2 the sound of a clock in the background striking poses and how the crowd went NUTS

runawayslave said:

I have seen The Time open for Prince on the Controversy and 1999 tours in person more than once. I even met the Time during this period. I have loved them ever since. They were brilliant but I hardly saw where they ever upstaged Prince. Assuming that Prince actually believed they would has always been rumored to be the reason for taking the Time off the bill in some cities - and with good reason: they certainly gave Prince a run for the money. That 1999 show that Prince did was ground breaking as far I am concerned. A true one man tour de force that set him apart from the rest of the world for the first time - as the 1999 album did. It is a seemingly rare opinion but I feel entitled to it as I was there to witness it.

[Edited 10/27/11 20:37pm]

I think it depended on the city that the concert was being held. I saw Prince, the Time and Zapp/Roger during I believe was the Controversy tour.

I went with a group of girls... and I knew lots of kids going to that concert. Most of us went to see the Time... so naturally the Time stole the show.

Prince was more rock... and our audience was more on the RB genre. When it came to Funk... the time was it.

They changed urban fashion. Believe this... teen boys wearing baggy pants, zoot suits, brim hats, stacy Adams shoes... all The Time.

The fact that many of these fashion styles were spelled out in the lyrics of very popular songs helped spread it's popularity.

Nobody dressed like Prince, unless they were going to a costume party. Nobody wore the puffy sleeve pirate shirts.

But my boyfriend at the time went to the Goodwill, looking specifically baggy pants/suits. He had to have a long white coat like Morris wore in PR.

The Time was the SHYT back in the day. Whether they wrote the songs or not. Temptations were the shyt in their day... and they didn't write their own music. Aretha Franklin as well, she didn't write all of her big hits.

I appreciate lyrists.... truthful I do. I always give Prince props because he had so much talent and creativity that he wrote hits for other people.

But don't think that the Time wasn't the Shyt... because they were/are.

When I went to see Vanity6, The Time and Prince in concert, I went to mainly see The Time. The Time had a strong appeal with the R&B crowd.

jwashin4 said:

runawayslave said:

I have seen The Time open for Prince on the Controversy and 1999 tours in person more than once. I even met the Time during this period. I have loved them ever since. They were brilliant but I hardly saw where they ever upstaged Prince. Assuming that Prince actually believed they would has always been rumored to be the reason for taking the Time off the bill in some cities - and with good reason: they certainly gave Prince a run for the money. That 1999 show that Prince did was ground breaking as far I am concerned. A true one man tour de force that set him apart from the rest of the world for the first time - as the 1999 album did. It is a seemingly rare opinion but I feel entitled to it as I was there to witness it.

[Edited 10/27/11 20:37pm]

Back then, Prince's shows tended to be alittle rambling - especially Controversy. And as much as I loved the Revolution, they just weren't as tight as the Time.

I think thie bigger reason they may have gotten a better crowd reaction is that their music was like a party, where Prince's was more like a show.

Interesting you said "their music" which was actually Prince's music since he wrote it.

Astasheiks said:

jwashin4 said:

Back then, Prince's shows tended to be alittle rambling - especially Controversy. And as much as I loved the Revolution, they just weren't as tight as the Time.

I think thie bigger reason they may have gotten a better crowd reaction is that their music was like a party, where Prince's was more like a show.

Interesting you said "their music" which was actually Prince's music since he wrote it.

Well, Prince wasn't on stage playing the music, was he? (except for that one time )

People loved The Time live. They brought a vibe of musical comradery that Prince and The Revolution just didn't have. Prince's music was good but live, his show and what The Time did were completely different.

Astasheiks said:

jwashin4 said:

Back then, Prince's shows tended to be alittle rambling - especially Controversy. And as much as I loved the Revolution, they just weren't as tight as the Time.

I think thie bigger reason they may have gotten a better crowd reaction is that their music was like a party, where Prince's was more like a show.

Interesting you said "their music" which was actually Prince's music since he wrote it.

yes he may have written the music/lyrics whatever, but here is just my personal opinion on that, everytme i have heard someone else doing a beatles tune, i like their version over the beatles. now it's not 2 say that john or paul wrote terrible songs, i just liked another interpetation of said music. now this theory also has a flipside when it comes 2 prince. there are many songs he has written 4 other artists or sometimes has had his songs covered, i can't stand sinead's version of nothing compares 2 u, yet i love chaka khan's version of i feel for u better than princes.

so in the end it's not about who wrote the tune it's about presentation of that material and the time did their thing

BlaqueKnight said:

Astasheiks said:

Interesting you said "their music" which was actually Prince's music since he wrote it.

Well, Prince wasn't on stage playing the music, was he? (except for that one time )

People loved The Time live. They brought a vibe of musical comradery that Prince and The Revolution just didn't have. Prince's music was good but live, his show and what The Time did were completely different.

and the fact that they got dropped off the bill in major markets testifies 2 how powerful they are live. u didn't see vanity get dropped and in the documentary they speak on that and how people were coming 2 the shows 2 see the time and were disappointed that they got dropped from the bill

prodigalfan said:

The Time was the SHYT back in the day. Whether they wrote the songs or not. Temptations were the shyt in their day... and they didn't write their own music. Aretha Franklin as well, she didn't write all of her big hits.

EXCELLENT point!

from rick james wiki

"He followed this success with Fire It Up, and headlined his first tour in support of the album, which saw then rising funk-pop artist Prince opening for him. James' cordial relationship with Prince during the tour strained after Prince, according to James, stole all bits from his act to hype the audience. He got so fed up with this that he canceled the rest of the tour."