EverlastingNow said:

Why does Bobby get a "Prince made him do it it" pass and not Kirk? Both were chosen by P and surely following exact directions so any issues lay with the bandleader himself. Same goes for those hating on Tony M, Prince requested him to rap on the songs.

Agreed.

They might be talented in their own right (although the albums they released would seem to disprove that theory) .

EverlastingNow said:

Why does Bobby get a "Prince made him do it it" pass and not Kirk? Both were chosen by P and surely following exact directions so any issues lay with the bandleader himself. Same goes for those hating on Tony M, Prince requested him to rap on the songs.

they added a certain dynamic to prince and his music that has been missing ever since. BESIDES, if they were shit like so many say then do you really think that Meshell, Seal, or Neil would agree? (or Prince for that matter)
[This message was edited Fri Feb 21 8:54:42 PST 2003 by IAM]


and just too add to the kirky j / bobby z thing: i feel that kirk and tony were the worst things that ever happened to prince. the absolute, without a doubt worst. ever.
[This message was edited Fri Feb 21 8:57:39 PST 2003 by IAM]

I think they fit where He was at the time.Prince wanted to Create his Own Sly&The Family Stone&they came along at the right time IMHO.I think they Challenged Him&Felt He Respected what they Brought to the table.but make no Mistake about it Prince Pimped that Image for His Own gain but Got more Creative Game from Association with Jimmy Jam,Terry Lewis,Dez,Andre,Morris,Vanity&Jesse Johnson IMHO.

I have always thought i was alone on this subject. I thought Dez Dickerson had more influence than both of them put together.

What the fuck did Wendy and Lisa do to make them so special? Okay, where to start. Let's start with Lisa, Prince was in love with her voice and that became obvious when he used her so much on Controversy and 1999. Then once Dez left the band in came Wendy with an excitement and musical diversity that only Lisa had in common with her. People make the big mistake by just reading the album covers and saying "Wendy and Lisa only wrote a couple of songs, they didn't do that much." The one thing that people seem to miss is the INFLUENCE they had on Prince's music. How is it that during the years they were with Prince the Vault was overflowing with some amazing material. How many of the Vault classics were recorded AFTER they left? They pushed Prince, and they had something that no other Prince band members have ever had, his 100% TRUST. Now, have any of you ever heard Rhonda say "Prince sent me this song to finish."? Think about that for a minute, Prince, the biggest control freak in the world actually sent Wendy and Lisa skeleton songs and TRUSTED they would finish them to his level of perfection. That right there is enough to make them "special". But let me also add that they introduced Prince to classical music in a big way, all of a sudden he had a bigger selection of colors to choose from. And Susan Rodgers who was actually there said "Wendy and Lisa thought of things that Prince never would have thought of on his own." And they also did something that no one else ever did, they told Prince NO! "You've done that already, put it away." Any study of Prince's music will show you that there's only a hand full of musicians that challenged Prince, Wendy and Lisa, Eric Leeds and Sheila E. He actually would push himself in new directions to challenge them, and in turn we all would benefit. So many people are just so impressed with the 95 NPG, and I seen that band live and they deserve all the credit in the world, but they were a great live band, they didn't push Prince's music into new directions. The Revolution actually GREW with Prince, they came up from he bottom with him and together they made a Revolution in Prince's music that no other band has been able to touch. Did Wendy and Lisa make Prince as some people have put it? No. They didn't. They brought out a level of creativity in him that has yet to be matched by anyone. And did Prince make Wendy and Lisa? No. He introduced the world to them, but they are amazing musicians in their own rights. Any one of their albums will show you that. If anyone really wants to understand their influence, go listen to Eroica, then go listen to New Power Soul or Rave and you'll see what's missing. I will say that the Rainbow Children was brilliant and the latest version of the NPG is awesome, but let's see what they can do together in the studio.

One of the things that fasinate me about this subject is that some tend to think that Prince's success and music for that matter started with Wendy and Lisa. I understand that a lot of people here got into Prince during the Wendy and Lisa years. This is a person who can (and has) sit by himself with an acoustic guitar and write great songs. Great writers are influenced by people and things around them at the time sure, but to almost credit Prince's success with the fact that Wendy and Lisa were in the band is just crazy.
I loved Lisa's piano and keyboard playing and yes at times she had Prince's back singing background vocals live. I also loved what Andre brought to the stage but Wendy's guitar playing has never me impressed at all. The whole Wendy and Lisa thing was all part of the image that Prince wanted at that time. I'm not saying that they didn't contribute but, Prince was Prince and successful I might add long before the combination of Wendy and Lisa. The huge commercializm came after the movie Purple Rain. 1999 was a hit album and no one credited Lisa Coleman with Prince's success then. IMO, the Lisa and Wendy thing came because it worked commercially at the time. Someone asked earlier, what happened to the funk? Wendy and Lisa happened to the funk.

EverlastingNow said:

Interesting observation but I don't agree. If ever you get a chance to be on the Minneapolis music scene, you will find out that a lot of musicians hold classical music as some sort of bariometer inwhich to measure how good you are musically. Don't ever think that Wendy and Lisa introduced Prince to classical music. As an artist, your musical pallett is endless. For example, listen to the arrangement in the song "Baby" on the first album. Where did Wendy and Lisa come in there? I think people have confused the fact that Wendy and Lisa were allowed sometimes to express themselves on Prince's albums with them being the sole reason for his success. And with that I don't agree.

Muziqmkr said:

Susan Rodgers "Wendy and Lisa introduced a whole new sound to Prince's music, a lot of that came from their classical background. He would just sit there and listen to stuff they brought in for hours." And if you read what I said I never once said that they were the sole reason for Prince's sucess, but they sure helped him create a Revolution in the music world though.

And if they are so great, where are the masterpeices in their career? Since they escaped the oppression of Prince, they should have made some great records.

they both attended Hollywood High and were the daughters of some famous Hollywood/producers or something rather...but those two things ain't that special so I guess nothing

Well their mediocrity has been weel documented since leaving Prince. Like so many former Prince collaborators, they all claim that Prince took something from them while they were together and then strikeon their own to realize greatness that never comes.

Being white girls has alot to do with their overrated status. Also Wendy's father holds a place of prominence in the music industry that has surely helped her get into places she didnt really deserve.

And if they are so great, where are the masterpeices in their career? Since they escaped the oppression of Prince, they should have made some great records.

And let's face it: every band that Prince has had since the Revolution has been better. ell , you canttell me that Wendy was better than Dez on guitar.

EverlastingNow said: