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Printablelickerdipper said: Anji said: I can see what you're saying with regards to bringing their classical/different influences upon Prince's music. However, the question remains how much of the Revolution's musical success did they actually contribute to? I do believe they were the central piece in The Revolution. Bobby Z was the worst drummer in Prince's career (yes, even worst than Kirky J ... don't you think?). Dr. Fink was cool, but I guess he fits better in the pre-ATWIAD sound. Wendy & Lisa added THAT flavour in things like "Raspberry Beret", "Manic Monday", "Take Me With You", most of "Parade"... They were songwritters, probably the band members that most contributed adding ideas and arrangements of all Prince's bands. Perhaps it's just my impression and I'm wrong, but I appreciate them for all that. By far the most untalented musician in Prince band history would have to be Kirk Johnson...that guy was a total hack. How the hell do you have a puny sound when your playing with a drum machine...His sound was so wimpy. Bobby Z wasn't bad at all, he's pretty solid (played with a track to sometimes) but he had a pretty heavy sound. Wendy & Lisa weren't the most talented muscians to play with Prince, but I think they were the smartest(creative/daring) & I think It made Prince think even more outside the box. I think he ALMOST saw them as equals. I love thsoe girls. nero | |
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BinaryJustin said: Hmmm... Well you can't make a sandwich without putting the interesting bit within two pieces of bread.
The bread isn't the most tasty bit, but it adds something to the whole - it takes longer to chew and digest. I think that Wendy & Lisa were the bread. Susannah could possibly have been classed as the mayo. Interesting you should say that. A few weeks ago on UK TV W+L were talking about Prince and Wendy said "Prince was the cook and we were the spice." | |
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Anji said: Savannah said: They were... "a group"... the core of the Revolution.
Its all been nothing but a puppet show ever since.. They may have been the core of the Revolution but were they pivotal in making his Revolution days a musical success? To me, they always seemed to be just like anyone else who had contributed musical ideas that Prince either used or didn't. Nothing more, nothing less. It just seems people talk about their contribution in elevated terms, especially Wendy's. It also seems, she does make a point of doing this herself. What happened? You're right success in another story. I really miss Lisa and her style... | |
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Doesn't anyone remember the interview with Prince when he was filming UTCM, where he said something along the lines of "I'm writing more songs now that I've got help from the girls, the girls meaning Lisa and Wendy"?
So, obviously, they must have had some positive influence on his creativity at the time. | |
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Supernova said: lickerdipper said: They might be over appreciated by some fans, but the girls had their merit. They were talented musicians with TOTALLY different backgrounds from Prince's. They contributed with lots of influences that Prince would probably have never reach by himself ... They had a classical background that SURE added something to Prince's sound, and the influence remains today. Not to mention things like The Beatles or other white acts ...
I've heard this before, and I find it to be sort of ridiculous. Prince was born and raised in Minneapolis, a city that does not have a large percentage of Blacks. The Beatles are, and have always been ubiquitous, radio-wise/tv-wise/magazine-wise, etc. So were other White acts on the radio in a White dominated city. I do not believe that anyone in the United States needs someone to expose them to a group like the Beatles. We're talking The Beatles here; even brothas know who John, Paul, George and Ringo are/were. Of course the whole planet knows who the Beatles are! ... Even my next door neighbour knows. But I don't really think he might know what "A Day In The Life" is. No one can get everywhere. We all have our musical backgrounds and learn things from different sources, but we still miss something. I might be a James Brown expert but don't know anything about Frank Zappa, for instance. I'm sure that W&L's contribution bringing to Prince's attention new sources was very important. | |
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Sometimes it snows in April
Strange Relationship Mountains Joni The biggest band member roles in Purple Rain Wendys grin in the kiss video! The Only band members to appear on the Rolling Stones cover The Ladder Computer Blue Purple Rain Around the world in a day Raspberry Beret The first band members to act as spokespeople for Prince Did he collect an oscar with Bobby Z?! The first band members to get solo songs in concert Wendy used to conduct the band in the Parade tour The Dream Factory album! they are all over it, and SOTT. The only members Prince has publically asked back (in this bed) All My Dreams Prince admitted, he would half bake songs and let them finish them off. Is the water warm enough? . | |
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lickerdipper said: Supernova said: lickerdipper said: They might be over appreciated by some fans, but the girls had their merit. They were talented musicians with TOTALLY different backgrounds from Prince's. They contributed with lots of influences that Prince would probably have never reach by himself ... They had a classical background that SURE added something to Prince's sound, and the influence remains today. Not to mention things like The Beatles or other white acts ...
I've heard this before, and I find it to be sort of ridiculous. Prince was born and raised in Minneapolis, a city that does not have a large percentage of Blacks. The Beatles are, and have always been ubiquitous, radio-wise/tv-wise/magazine-wise, etc. So were other White acts on the radio in a White dominated city. I do not believe that anyone in the United States needs someone to expose them to a group like the Beatles. We're talking The Beatles here; even brothas know who John, Paul, George and Ringo are/were. Of course the whole planet knows who the Beatles are! ... Even my next door neighbour knows. But I don't really think he might know what "A Day In The Life" is. No one can get everywhere. We all have our musical backgrounds and learn things from different sources, but we still miss something. I might be a James Brown expert but don't know anything about Frank Zappa, for instance. I'm sure that W&L's contribution bringing to Prince's attention new sources was very important. I still have to disagree, because I don't see the logic to it. This mentality is akin to people inferring that Prince needed them to show him Beatles music that he himself would never have heard, or maybe even remotely curious about - and that's a silly presumption to make about a musician born, raised and still living in a place like Minnesota (at that time and now). It's like people say this to say he needed to be rescued from Black artists' music to find true inspiration, and that's INSULTING. I'm not saying this about music and musicians in general, I'm saying it about the Beatles, AND about someone in Prince's position. Most musicians are exposed to a few artists they may not have come to out of their own curiosity by other people, but you're talking about a song ("A Day In The Life") and a group that has been shoved down the throats of people around the world for 3 generations now. Serious musicians have a natural curiosity about other music in the first place, and they go to lengths that less serious musicians won't go to to satiate their curiosity. I'm sure Wendy & Lisa exposed him to other music, as I'm sure he probably did for them too. But I seriously doubt they HAD to expose a serious musician like Prince to the Beatles for him to be aware of their musical omnipresence. [This message was edited Tue Feb 11 12:22:16 PST 2003 by Supernova] This post not for the wimp contingent. All whiny wusses avert your eyes. | |
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From this thread, it's clear to me that Wendy and Lisa influenced him in many ways, musically, professionally and socially. It sounds like they were given opportunities to suggest ideas, work on tracks, lead the band and be frontmen, so to speak. it's clear that Prince wanted to be a star, and that Wendy & Lisa were clearly influential in helping him master his 'pop' sound. It also seems the chemistry that was going on during the Revolution days was heavily influenced by Prince's relationship with Susannah, and this fuelled the elements mentioned above with W&L.
What I'm left wondering is how the impact of their disabled relationship affected how future musicians and band members were to work with Prince? In other words, is it possible to think of another period in Prince's career that could result in such creative success? I'm not talking charts here, I'm talking Prince music. | |
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I think assuming Prince had little exposure to diverse sounds and musical insights prior to meeting Wendy and Lisa robs him of the genius that defines him. Certainly, Prince was influenced by the likes of a good many rock, punk, funk, 60s and 70s R&B and disco-era musicians. A simple look at his aesthetic, his attitude in lyrics and musical style of anything pre-Purple Rain suggests this. Still, mastery of certain popular musical styles and exposure to those forms that are more obscure are two different sides of the same coin. Having the daring and prowess to successfully incorporate those more murky influences into one’s future work is something else even further, and I DEFINITELY think the classically trained Wendy and Lisa were instrumental and unparalleled by any Prince cohorts before or since in “bringing in the arcane” and helping to bolster the scope of his artistic vision.
Just listen to the evolution of his music: I love the pre-Purple Rain canon. It’s funky, attitudinal, uniquely colored by Prince’s talent and sensibilities, but it’s definitely time-stamped by the popular sounds of the era – sort of a Clash-meets-Donna Summer-meets-Devo-meets-Rufus concoction. And its fairly stylistically unchanging at that. Take away Prince’s unique vocal stylings, and those instrumentals could easily be releases by a number of bands from Chic to Rick James on the funk/R&B side to Tom Tom Club or Blondie on the “blue-eyed funk”/rock/punk side. Prince’s sound was not unique, and with the exception surfacing only at the maturation of certain musical eccentricities and trademarks of 1999, it was easily duplicated. Interestingly enough, everyone WANTED to sound like Prince with the coming of the more collaborative Purple Rain, a totally new artistic plateau for Prince, which boasted both more pop sensibilities (catchier melodies, radio-friendliness, better production) AND superior musicianship (richer aural textures and orchestrations [the use of strings was maximized here], more sophisticated compositions, etc.) And look at the ground he treaded from ’83 to ’87: He’d touched upon everything from the instruments of the middle- and far east to the jazzy/retro/mod sounds and arrangements of Alexa de Paris and Crystal Ball to backmasking to even the prominent sound of brass, which earlier in his career he’d been quoted as saying he hated. I’m sorry, but while I think Prince has range, those influences came from somewhere. Furthermore, much has been circulated by a number of people around at the time about the parity with which Prince engaged Wendy and Lisa from a creative standpoint and the high level of input they brought to the table. I simply don’t think the corroborating stories are lies… and I’ve NEVER heard Prince, who displayed such creative proprietary awareness that he wrote “slave” on his face, mimicked his own assassination (complete with blood) on David Letterman and even changed his name in a struggle to emancipate himself from Warner Bros., refute ANY claims that Wendy and Lisa contributed greatly to his Revolution-era output. I find that interesting. SquirrelMeat offers a great array of credits to Wendy and Lisa (although I don’t think they can take the credit of introducing Prince to Joni’s works), and clearly even beyond the individual songs listed (to which I’d add Power Fantastic and, therefore, who knows just what extent of similar songs/sounds of that era), they offered so much more that was vital to Prince while they were around – enigma, the babe factor, the ethnic and gender diversity, etc. No one’s saying Wendy and Lisa did it all. And, of course, no one can divine whether Prince would have ventured into/mastered these things without meeting Wendy and Lisa. But the fact of the matter is, he did meet them, and he reached new heights while they were around. And after they left, while his scope of vision had been forever broadened, his work did transform (some say steadily degrade) with the coming and going of other musicians who, while some of them could play their asses off, weren’t as conceptually gifted. Ὅσον ζῇς φαίνου
μηδὲν ὅλως σὺ λυποῦ πρὸς ὀλίγον ἐστὶ τὸ ζῆν τὸ τέλος ὁ χρόνος ἀπαιτεῖ.” | |
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Anji said: From this thread, it's clear to me that Wendy and Lisa influenced him in many ways, musically, professionally and socially. It sounds like they were given opportunities to suggest ideas, work on tracks, lead the band and be frontmen, so to speak. it's clear that Prince wanted to be a star, and that Wendy & Lisa were clearly influential in helping him master his 'pop' sound. It also seems the chemistry that was going on during the Revolution days was heavily influenced by Prince's relationship with Susannah, and this fuelled the elements mentioned above with W&L.
What I'm left wondering is how the impact of their disabled relationship affected how future musicians and band members were to work with Prince? In other words, is it possible to think of another period in Prince's career that could result in such creative success? I'm not talking charts here, I'm talking Prince music. I dunno. I agree it'll be interesting to see where he goes. He finally again has a wonderfully able band where playing technique is regarded. But I wonder if anyone who now plays with him can command the power, creative vision and professional respect necessary to help Prince grow creatively. Ὅσον ζῇς φαίνου
μηδὲν ὅλως σὺ λυποῦ πρὸς ὀλίγον ἐστὶ τὸ ζῆν τὸ τέλος ὁ χρόνος ἀπαιτεῖ.” | |
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Lammastide said: I think assuming Prince had little exposure to diverse sounds and musical insights prior to meeting Wendy and Lisa robs him of the genius that defines him. Certainly, Prince was influenced by the likes of a good many rock, punk, funk, 60s and 70s R&B and disco-era musicians. A simple look at his aesthetic, his attitude in lyrics and musical style of anything pre-Purple Rain suggests this. Still, mastery of certain popular musical styles and exposure to those forms that are more obscure are two different sides of the same coin. Having the daring and prowess to successfully incorporate those more murky influences into one’s future work is something else even further, and I DEFINITELY think the classically trained Wendy and Lisa were instrumental and unparalleled by any Prince cohorts before or since in “bringing in the arcane” and helping to bolster the scope of his artistic vision.
Just listen to the evolution of his music: I love the pre-Purple Rain canon. It’s funky, attitudinal, uniquely colored by Prince’s talent and sensibilities, but it’s definitely time-stamped by the popular sounds of the era – sort of a Clash-meets-Donna Summer-meets-Devo-meets-Rufus concoction. And its fairly stylistically unchanging at that. Take away Prince’s unique vocal stylings, and those instrumentals could easily be releases by a number of bands from Chic to Rick James on the funk/R&B side to Tom Tom Club or Blondie on the “blue-eyed funk”/rock/punk side. Prince’s sound was not unique, and with the exception surfacing only at the maturation of certain musical eccentricities and trademarks of 1999, it was easily duplicated. Interestingly enough, everyone WANTED to sound like Prince with the coming of the more collaborative Purple Rain, a totally new artistic plateau for Prince, which boasted both more pop sensibilities (catchier melodies, radio-friendliness, better production) AND superior musicianship (richer aural textures and orchestrations [the use of strings was maximized here], more sophisticated compositions, etc.) And look at the ground he treaded from ’83 to ’87: He’d touched upon everything from the instruments of the middle- and far east to the jazzy/retro/mod sounds and arrangements of Alexa de Paris and Crystal Ball to backmasking to even the prominent sound of brass, which earlier in his career he’d been quoted as saying he hated. I’m sorry, but while I think Prince has range, those influences came from somewhere. Furthermore, much has been circulated by a number of people around at the time about the parity with which Prince engaged Wendy and Lisa from a creative standpoint and the high level of input they brought to the table. I simply don’t think the corroborating stories are lies… and I’ve NEVER heard Prince, who displayed such creative proprietary awareness that he wrote “slave” on his face, mimicked his own assassination (complete with blood) on David Letterman and even changed his name in a struggle to emancipate himself from Warner Bros., refute ANY claims that Wendy and Lisa contributed greatly to his Revolution-era output. I find that interesting. SquirrelMeat offers a great array of credits to Wendy and Lisa (although I don’t think they can take the credit of introducing Prince to Joni’s works), and clearly even beyond the individual songs listed (to which I’d add Power Fantastic and, therefore, who knows just what extent of similar songs/sounds of that era), they offered so much more that was vital to Prince while they were around – enigma, the babe factor, the ethnic and gender diversity, etc. No one’s saying Wendy and Lisa did it all. And, of course, no one can divine whether Prince would have ventured into/mastered these things without meeting Wendy and Lisa. But the fact of the matter is, he did meet them, and he reached new heights while they were around. And after they left, while his scope of vision had been forever broadened, his work did transform (some say steadily degrade) with the coming and going of other musicians who, while some of them could play their asses off, weren’t as conceptually gifted. wow. are u a professional writer? That was damned good. but look...not any one musician can do EVERYTHING (unless you're stevie wonder). There were things that Wendy and Lisa could see that Prince couldn't see. And there were things that Prince could see that Wendy and LIsa couldn't see, either. So they definately complemented each other. It wasn't a one side thing, it was definately two sided, I dont care what ANYONE says. | |
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Lammastide said: Anji said: From this thread, it's clear to me that Wendy and Lisa influenced him in many ways, musically, professionally and socially. It sounds like they were given opportunities to suggest ideas, work on tracks, lead the band and be frontmen, so to speak. it's clear that Prince wanted to be a star, and that Wendy & Lisa were clearly influential in helping him master his 'pop' sound. It also seems the chemistry that was going on during the Revolution days was heavily influenced by Prince's relationship with Susannah, and this fuelled the elements mentioned above with W&L.
What I'm left wondering is how the impact of their disabled relationship affected how future musicians and band members were to work with Prince? In other words, is it possible to think of another period in Prince's career that could result in such creative success? I'm not talking charts here, I'm talking Prince music. I dunno. I agree it'll be interesting to see where he goes. He finally again has a wonderfully able band where playing technique is regarded. But I wonder if anyone who now plays with him can command the power, creative vision and professional respect necessary to help Prince grow creatively. Exactly. Perhaps it's been over for quite some time now? | |
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I think that people underestimate the social impact that Wendy & Lisa had on his life, and subsequently his music.
I don't think he ever wanted to leave them - I really,really don't... I think that his relationship with Susannah was strained and working with her sister wasn't helping. You all know what its like if you've been in a relationship with friends of friends, friends of family members or the family members of friends. It can get messy because blood is always thicker than friendship... I think that he had to disband the Revolution because of internal friction - not for reasons of artistic development. Remember that the only time he smashed a guitar up on stage was the last show of the Parade tour. He was genuinely upset but he knew that he had to get out of the loop because whatever was going on must have been hurting everybody. He reached a peak of critical acclaim with Sign O' The Times but began to lose Susannah's love and Wendy & Lisa's friendship around 1987. The good reviews for the album and the tour must have seemed like a hollow victory without the love and support he once knew. I don't think its any accident that he recorded the Black Album around this point. The music was the complete antithesis of his records with the Revolution. Neither do I think it would be any surprise that he (reportedly) experimented with drugs around this point. I think that his motives around this point owe more to Wendy, Lisa and Susannah's disappearance than he would ever care to admit. | |
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Steve Fargnoli got "Jughead", Wendy & Lisa got "In This Bed Eye Scream" - Discuss...
In This Bed Eye Scream. 2 these walls I talk Tellin' 'em what I wasn't strong enough 2 say 2 these walls I talk Tellin' 'em how I cried the day U went away How do we ever lose communication? How do we ever lose each other's sound? Baby, if U wanna, we can fix the situation Maybe we can stop the rain from coming down Yeah In this bed I scream Lonely nights I lay awake thinking of U And if I'm cursed with a dream A thousand times I feel whatever I've put U through Tell me, how're we gonna put this back 2gether? How're we gonna think with the same mind? Knowing all along that life is so much better Living and loving 2gether all the time Living and loving In this bed I, in this bed I, in this bed I scream In this car I drive I'm looking 4 the road that leads back 2 the soul we shared With my very life I'd gladly be the body upon the cross we bear (Cross we bear) How do we ever lose communication? (How did we?) How do we ever lose each other's sound? (I don't know) Baby, if U wanna, we can fix the situation Maybe we can stop the rain from coming down Maybe we can't, maybe we can Stop the rain, stop the rain In this bed I, in this bed I, in this bed I scream I scream In this bed I scream and then there was "Song About" from Wendy & Lisa's first album which was of course a song about... Song About. It makes me wanna cry Thinking about you “Beautiful”, You said The way you shook your head So strange that no one stayed At the end of the parade this is just another song about it this is just another song about Standing next to me Imagine that it’s true You were singing songs About life or doom I was singing songs to you This is just another song about it This is just another song about I gave colors to you You’ve never seen You washed my heart With many dreams Dreams I’d never see The pain of my spirit The pain of my heart Don’t ever tell me to let it all go This is just another song about This is just another song about… Its all very, very sad... | |
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Justin, I agree. This is really sad if you put your mind back to those days but there have been many happy times for Prince since.
It's also quite interesting that Emancipation had so many personal songs yet seemingly failed to resonate with his core fans and critics. | |
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Lammastide said: Just listen to the evolution of his music: I love the pre-Purple Rain canon. It’s funky, attitudinal, uniquely colored by Prince’s talent and sensibilities, but it’s definitely time-stamped by the popular sounds of the era – sort of a Clash-meets-Donna Summer-meets-Devo-meets-Rufus concoction. And its fairly stylistically unchanging at that. Take away Prince’s unique vocal stylings, and those instrumentals could easily be releases by a number of bands from Chic to Rick James on the funk/R&B side to Tom Tom Club or Blondie on the “blue-eyed funk”/rock/punk side. Prince’s sound was not unique, and with the exception surfacing only at the maturation of certain musical eccentricities and trademarks of 1999, it was easily duplicated. sorry, but starting with Dirty Mind Prince's sound was definitely unique. Everybody didn't sound like that. | |
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Wolf said: sorry, but starting with Dirty Mind Prince's sound was definitely unique. Everybody didn't sound like that.
Yep - and which female collaborator first appeared on the Dirty Mind album? | |
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BinaryJustin said: Wolf said: sorry, but starting with Dirty Mind Prince's sound was definitely unique. Everybody didn't sound like that.
Yep - and which female collaborator first appeared on the Dirty Mind album?  | |
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BinaryJustin said: Wolf said: sorry, but starting with Dirty Mind Prince's sound was definitely unique. Everybody didn't sound like that.
Yep - and which female collaborator first appeared on the Dirty Mind album? Yes and we all know how huge a part Lisa Coleman had in that album which made her a 'collaborator'.  | |
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Wolf said: BinaryJustin said: Wolf said: sorry, but starting with Dirty Mind Prince's sound was definitely unique. Everybody didn't sound like that.
Yep - and which female collaborator first appeared on the Dirty Mind album? Yes and we all know how huge a part Lisa Coleman had in that album which made her a 'collaborator'. | |
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Wendy and Lisa do deserve credit. Their style does have it
own distinctive value. Has anyone heard Meshell N'degeocello's CD titled Bitter? Their style is all over and made that a classic. They played studio band -May this be Love -Bitter -Beautiful to name a few are master pieces Girl Brothers & Fruit at the Bottom, as well as their 1st Cd are very deserving of works of art. They just never arrived as Major artist. We all want a big hit again because
we want to relive the Hysteria & Pandemonium we experienced when Purple Rain was Hot. Actually, he doesn't care if it happens again or not. | |
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Wendy and Lisa are special because they actually had some input into Prince's music. They were female MUSICIANS that Prince respected as more than sex objects, like Sheila E. Wendy and Lisa changed Prince's sound considerably and to some degree helped to bring him massive success. They represented diverse influences not covered by other band members, making Prince's sound much more eclectic. I certainly think they deserve the credit and adulation they receive. They earned it. | |
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lickerdipper said: Anji said: I can see what you're saying with regards to bringing their classical/different influences upon Prince's music. However, the question remains how much of the Revolution's musical success did they actually contribute to? I do believe they were the central piece in The Revolution. Bobby Z was the worst drummer in Prince's career (yes, even worst than Kirky J ... don't you think?). Dr. Fink was cool, but I guess he fits better in the pre-ATWIAD sound. Wendy & Lisa added THAT flavour in things like "Raspberry Beret", "Manic Monday", "Take Me With You", most of "Parade"... They were songwritters, probably the band members that most contributed adding ideas and arrangements of all Prince's bands. Perhaps it's just my impression and I'm wrong, but I appreciate them for all that. Kirky J was the worst drummer Prince has ever had, he was the FIRST drummer to actually make Prince's live sound boring. People are always dogging Bobby Z. but as a drummer that man never got a moment of rest, he ALWAYS had to watch Prince for cues and Prince did A LOT more of them with the Revolution. What was Bobby supposed to do? Bust out a triplet in the middle of Delirious? C'mon people, Bobby played what Prince wanted him to play so get a clue. I seen Bobby on the Parade tour and believe me, he's a damn good drummer. | |
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What the fuck did Wendy and Lisa do to make them so special? Okay, where to start. Let's start with Lisa, Prince was in love with her voice and that became obvious when he used her so much on Controversy and 1999. Then once Dez left the band in came Wendy with an excitement and musical diversity that only Lisa had in common with her. People make the big mistake by just reading the album covers and saying "Wendy and Lisa only wrote a couple of songs, they didn't do that much." The one thing that people seem to miss is the INFLUENCE they had on Prince's music. How is it that during the years they were with Prince the Vault was overflowing with some amazing material. How many of the Vault classics were recorded AFTER they left? They pushed Prince, and they had something that no other Prince band members have ever had, his 100% TRUST. Now, have any of you ever heard Rhonda say "Prince sent me this song to finish."? Think about that for a minute, Prince, the biggest control freak in the world actually sent Wendy and Lisa skeleton songs and TRUSTED they would finish them to his level of perfection. That right there is enough to make them "special". But let me also add that they introduced Prince to classical music in a big way, all of a sudden he had a bigger selection of colors to choose from. And Susan Rodgers who was actually there said "Wendy and Lisa thought of things that Prince never would have thought of on his own." And they also did something that no one else ever did, they told Prince NO! "You've done that already, put it away." Any study of Prince's music will show you that there's only a hand full of musicians that challenged Prince, Wendy and Lisa, Eric Leeds and Sheila E. He actually would push himself in new directions to challenge them, and in turn we all would benefit. So many people are just so impressed with the 95 NPG, and I seen that band live and they deserve all the credit in the world, but they were a great live band, they didn't push Prince's music into new directions. The Revolution actually GREW with Prince, they came up from he bottom with him and together they made a Revolution in Prince's music that no other band has been able to touch. Did Wendy and Lisa make Prince as some people have put it? No. They didn't. They brought out a level of creativity in him that has yet to be matched by anyone. And did Prince make Wendy and Lisa? No. He introduced the world to them, but they are amazing musicians in their own rights. Any one of their albums will show you that. If anyone really wants to understand their influence, go listen to Eroica, then go listen to New Power Soul or Rave and you'll see what's missing. I will say that the Rainbow Children was brilliant and the latest version of the NPG is awesome, but let's see what they can do together in the studio. | |
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Actually, i believe the whole point of this thread can be answered with one question: "Which style of Prince do you prefer?".
Let's realistically look at this from an observer's point of view. To many Prince fans, their first experience of Prince began around the "Purple Rain Era". Let's face it, he did not have the popularity until the MOVIE Purple Rain. The media had main-streamed him through the production of the movie. Sure, he had gained fans with the 1999 album. But the movie really skyrocketed him. I also believe that these people expected his music to stay the same. Which is very unrealistic. Every eclectic artist (such as Prince), experiments with different sounds and styles. Prince seems to be deeply rooted in funk. I believe that this is his perfered style. And what a wonderful job he does with it. It really all depends upon your personal preference. Do you like plain hardcore funk or do you like it mixed with something else? To set the record straight, you also have to consider the musical background of Wendy and Lisa...seperately. Lisa was a classically trained pianist but, her influences and what she perfered to listen to were Rock and Blues (for those of you who did not know). Wendy was trained as a Jazz guitarist but her influences were Funk and Soul. She hated the Pop music of the 70's. So, if you break this apart, we see that Wendy and Prince had much more creatively in common than most people think. And, when you combine all of these influences you can create a unique sound. As I stated before in the past, this combination was magical in the 80's. IMO, I feel that it would not mesh in today's society. The combination of these styles would be incompatable. To prove my point, we see that Wendy's funk/soul/jazz combined with Lisa's classical/rock does not bode well on the masses. But when they isolate their styles, for example all Soul, it is much more appreciated. I also feel with Wendy and Lisa being so eclectic, it allows them to work well with many artists. Look at all the people that they have worked with: Doyle Bramhall II, Neil Finn, Joni Mitchel, Bonnie Raitt, Sheryl Crow, Meshell, etc... I also believe that the people who praise Wendy and Lisa AND but down Prince today, are the people who perfer that particular style of music. But the 80's is over. So is the 60' & the 70's...but I still miss the 2 Stevie's...Stevie Wonder and Stevie Ray Vaughn. Sometimes it's good to be mostalgic...just think of what would have happened to Motown if people didn't appreciate the music from that era... ____________________
I was here...I went there... Don't know where...and I don't care | |
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Yad said: Actually, i believe the whole point of this thread can be answered with one question: "Which style of Prince do you prefer?".
Let's realistically look at this from an observer's point of view. To many Prince fans, their first experience of Prince began around the "Purple Rain Era". Let's face it, he did not have the popularity until the MOVIE Purple Rain. The media had main-streamed him through the production of the movie. Sure, he had gained fans with the 1999 album. But the movie really skyrocketed him. I also believe that these people expected his music to stay the same. Which is very unrealistic. Every eclectic artist (such as Prince), experiments with different sounds and styles. Prince seems to be deeply rooted in funk. I believe that this is his perfered style. And what a wonderful job he does with it. It really all depends upon your personal preference. Do you like plain hardcore funk or do you like it mixed with something else? To set the record straight, you also have to consider the musical background of Wendy and Lisa...seperately. Lisa was a classically trained pianist but, her influences and what she perfered to listen to were Rock and Blues (for those of you who did not know). Wendy was trained as a Jazz guitarist but her influences were Funk and Soul. She hated the Pop music of the 70's. So, if you break this apart, we see that Wendy and Prince had much more creatively in common than most people think. And, when you combine all of these influences you can create a unique sound. As I stated before in the past, this combination was magical in the 80's. IMO, I feel that it would not mesh in today's society. The combination of these styles would be incompatable. To prove my point, we see that Wendy's funk/soul/jazz combined with Lisa's classical/rock does not bode well on the masses. But when they isolate their styles, for example all Soul, it is much more appreciated. I also feel with Wendy and Lisa being so eclectic, it allows them to work well with many artists. Look at all the people that they have worked with: Doyle Bramhall II, Neil Finn, Joni Mitchel, Bonnie Raitt, Sheryl Crow, Meshell, etc... I also believe that the people who praise Wendy and Lisa AND but down Prince today, are the people who perfer that particular style of music. But the 80's is over. So is the 60' & the 70's...but I still miss the 2 Stevie's...Stevie Wonder and Stevie Ray Vaughn. Sometimes it's good to be mostalgic...just think of what would have happened to Motown if people didn't appreciate the music from that era... Very well put Yad. I agree, I just don't like when people downplay Wendy and Lisa's role in Prince's music. And this is coming from someone who LOVES Prince's music but I just have a favorite period of music that was nothing short of magical. | |
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Anji said: A conversation here got me wondering what exactly did Wendy and Lisa actually do that singles them out as particularly central to Prince's music during the Revolution days. I don't hear the other musicians being talked about as much.
Looking back at the Purple Rain tour, for example, they just seem mediocre at best. I couldnt agree more. Wendy and Lisa are easily the most overrated Prince spinoffs ever. Jesse Johnson is probably the most underrated. Wendy's father is a big shot with the Academy that votes on the Grammys and I am sure that kind of juice helped herbefoer and after his stint with Prince. Lisa is her love buddy so she gets to go along for the ride. Its that simple | |
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MIAMIVICE said: Anji said: A conversation here got me wondering what exactly did Wendy and Lisa actually do that singles them out as particularly central to Prince's music during the Revolution days. I don't hear the other musicians being talked about as much.
Looking back at the Purple Rain tour, for example, they just seem mediocre at best. I couldnt agree more. Wendy and Lisa are easily the most overrated Prince spinoffs ever. Jesse Johnson is probably the most underrated. Wendy's father is a big shot with the Academy that votes on the Grammys and I am sure that kind of juice helped herbefoer and after his stint with Prince. Lisa is her love buddy so she gets to go along for the ride. Its that simple You must fall down A LOT!  | |
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EverlastingNow said: lickerdipper said: Anji said: I can see what you're saying with regards to bringing their classical/different influences upon Prince's music. However, the question remains how much of the Revolution's musical success did they actually contribute to? I do believe they were the central piece in The Revolution. Bobby Z was the worst drummer in Prince's career (yes, even worst than Kirky J ... don't you think?). Dr. Fink was cool, but I guess he fits better in the pre-ATWIAD sound. Wendy & Lisa added THAT flavour in things like "Raspberry Beret", "Manic Monday", "Take Me With You", most of "Parade"... They were songwritters, probably the band members that most contributed adding ideas and arrangements of all Prince's bands. Perhaps it's just my impression and I'm wrong, but I appreciate them for all that. Kirky J was the worst drummer Prince has ever had, he was the FIRST drummer to actually make Prince's live sound boring. People are always dogging Bobby Z. but as a drummer that man never got a moment of rest, he ALWAYS had to watch Prince for cues and Prince did A LOT more of them with the Revolution. What was Bobby supposed to do? Bust out a triplet in the middle of Delirious? C'mon people, Bobby played what Prince wanted him to play so get a clue. I seen Bobby on the Parade tour and believe me, he's a damn good drummer. Why does Bobby get a "Prince made him do it it" pass and not Kirk? Both were chosen by P and surely following exact directions so any issues lay with the bandleader himself. Same goes for those hating on Tony M, Prince requested him to rap on the songs. | |
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