purplenuts said:There is so much filler and just plain crap on VP that it is hard to place it above an entire decade of Prince. It definitely should have been one disc - the second one hardly has any fully realized songs on it and is weighed down with pretenious and overblown spoken word parts plus the most self serving fake interview I have ever heard. I love Jesse. I met him right after he released his first album. I have all the albums and some killer concerts. I went to see him with Teena Marie and Frankie Beverly back in the 80s. But I can only give him a C+ on VP. It cant stand up to 3121, PLanet Earth, or Lotusflow3r

Agreed, and I'm a huge Jesse fan. VP is good (would have been much better as a single disc), but if you compile the best moments from 3121, Lotus, Planet Earth and 20TEN, Prince is still lightyears ahead.

Only the title track, "Sheila Rae" and "1000 Watts of Funky" still get regular play from me from Jesse's album. There's a few others that I listen to every now and then. But I still listen to Prince's albums from the past decade all the time.

[Edited 3/4/11 7:54am]

Militant said:

purplenuts said:There is so much filler and just plain crap on VP that it is hard to place it above an entire decade of Prince. It definitely should have been one disc - the second one hardly has any fully realized songs on it and is weighed down with pretenious and overblown spoken word parts plus the most self serving fake interview I have ever heard. I love Jesse. I met him right after he released his first album. I have all the albums and some killer concerts. I went to see him with Teena Marie and Frankie Beverly back in the 80s. But I can only give him a C+ on VP. It cant stand up to 3121, PLanet Earth, or Lotusflow3r

Agreed, and I'm a huge Jesse fan. VP is good (would have been much better as a single disc), but if you compile the best moments from 3121, Lotus, Planet Earth and 20TEN, Prince is still lightyears ahead.

Only the title track, "Sheila Rae" and "1000 Watts of Funky" still get regular play from me from Jesse's album. There's a few others that I listen to every now and then. But I still listen to Prince's albums from the past decade all the time.

[Edited 3/4/11 7:54am]

Wow, I couldn't disagree more. VP is so much better than the swill Prince has released in the last decade and its not even close imo. VP is real music. The stuff Prince has released lately is uninspired Vegas music.

purplenuts said:

phonzarelli said:

By extension, there'd be no Prince without Andre Cymone letting him stay in his home giving him a foundation to develop his talent, Chris Moon helping him, Pepe Willie, etc. You can go on and on with it.

The Time were just as talented and at the time, accomplished in their own right. Prince provided them with material, but it's what they did with it that made the difference. If they wanted to, they could write great material without a lick of contribution from Prince. Flyte Tyme, Jesse, and the gang have written and performed on Time-related/affiliated material without Prince and have done fine.

[Edited 2/27/11 17:24pm]

Really? YOu think that is really the same thing?. Prince put the band together and created the music that made the Time. Pepe Willie, Chris Moon, and Andre Anderson didnt created Prince.

Understood. The point is that there is an interconnectedness to it all. Prince might have been the primary creative force, but no one is an island. There were many unacknowledged influences in the process. Now that they aren't around, it has become even more apparent.

I love Prince and everyone associated with his 80s-90s output, but I feel that the original post sounded a bit off as if the associated artists are nothing without Prince. That may have been true before they had their shot, but it isn't now.

Interesting viewpoint though!

This is what I understand about the whole Prince & The Time legacy. Prince didn't form The Time because he was trying to discover some unseen talent from the midwest & watch their careers soar. Prince & members of his band (i.e. Andre Cymone) wanted a band they could experiment & do music they didn't want their professional image to be associated with. The same purpose Vanity 6 was formed. Not to show off anyones individual talents...but to be used as a venue to try out some interesting music concepts. The Time was to be controlled by its masters from the start. Not to showcase talent comparable with the Purple One himself ( probably why Alexander O'neal spoke up and couldn't stick with the band). Taking them off headlining in major cities to keep them from upstaging their master's mojo was a business decision. It was all a business decision...checks were distributed, careers were made, & copyrights were written. All business. No one owes anyone anything.

phonzarelli said:

purplenuts said:

Really? YOu think that is really the same thing?. Prince put the band together and created the music that made the Time. Pepe Willie, Chris Moon, and Andre Anderson didnt created Prince.

Understood. The point is that there is an interconnectedness to it all. Prince might have been the primary creative force, but no one is an island. There were many unacknowledged influences in the process. Now that they aren't around, it has become even more apparent.

I love Prince and everyone associated with his 80s-90s output, but I feel that the original post sounded a bit off as if the associated artists are nothing without Prince. That may have been true before they had their shot, but it isn't now.

Interesting viewpoint though!

LinnLM1 said:

Militant said:

Agreed, and I'm a huge Jesse fan. VP is good (would have been much better as a single disc), but if you compile the best moments from 3121, Lotus, Planet Earth and 20TEN, Prince is still lightyears ahead.

Only the title track, "Sheila Rae" and "1000 Watts of Funky" still get regular play from me from Jesse's album. There's a few others that I listen to every now and then. But I still listen to Prince's albums from the past decade all the time.

[Edited 3/4/11 7:54am]

Wow, I couldn't disagree more. VP is so much better than the swill Prince has released in the last decade and its not even close imo. VP is real music. The stuff Prince has released lately is uninspired Vegas music.

Uninspired Vegas music - perfect description. Prince hasn't been lightyears ahead of anyone since the 90s. Most Prince fans are content just to get another Prince record and they don't care how it sounds as long as its him. They rationalize it and listen to it over and over until they like it, or at least until they are comfortably familiar with it. VP came along and smoked out most everything Prince has done in a long time. Prince has become a corny musical caricature of himself. He has made some great records in the past but most of what he does these days just seems like he's going through the motions.

BlaqueKnight said:

LinnLM1 said:

Wow, I couldn't disagree more. VP is so much better than the swill Prince has released in the last decade and its not even close imo. VP is real music. The stuff Prince has released lately is uninspired Vegas music.

Uninspired Vegas music - perfect description. Prince hasn't been lightyears ahead of anyone since the 90s. Most Prince fans are content just to get another Prince record and they don't care how it sounds as long as its him. They rationalize it and listen to it over and over until they like it, or at least until they are comfortably familiar with it. VP came along and smoked out most everything Prince has done in a long time. Prince has become a corny musical caricature of himself. He has made some great records in the past but most of what he does these days just seems like he's going through the motions.

Disagree completely. The highlights of 20TEN, Lotusflow3r and 3121 are up there with his best.

JESSE SPOKE THE TRUTH ABOUT WHAT HAPPENED, BUT ON THE SAME TOKEN HE WAS DOING THE SAME THING WITH HIS BAMD..DOGGING THEM OUT AND STUFF..JUST BEING A HIPPOCRITE.. I KNOW OF SOMEONE WHO HAD SOME EXPERIENCES WITH JESSE AND THEY WERNT PLEASANT.

I DONT EXPECT PRINCE TO BE PERFECT, BUT I EXPECT HIS FORMER BANDMATES TO LEARN FROM HIS MISTAKES.!!!!

Why is Blaqueknight always trying to revive this tired debate?

"Do yourself a favor"

Militant said:

BlaqueKnight said:

Uninspired Vegas music - perfect description. Prince hasn't been lightyears ahead of anyone since the 90s. Most Prince fans are content just to get another Prince record and they don't care how it sounds as long as its him. They rationalize it and listen to it over and over until they like it, or at least until they are comfortably familiar with it. VP came along and smoked out most everything Prince has done in a long time. Prince has become a corny musical caricature of himself. He has made some great records in the past but most of what he does these days just seems like he's going through the motions.

Disagree completely. The highlights of 20TEN, Lotusflow3r and 3121 are up there with his best.

Exactly!!!!!!!!! There are so many haters on this site that its pathetic.........

BlaqueKnight said:

All I know with regards to Jesse is

Verbal Penetration > Prince's last decade of records.

+1 Agreed!

[Edited 5/26/11 10:04am]

BlaqueKnight said:

All I know with regards to Jesse is

Verbal Penetration > Prince's last decade of records.

Agreed! My thoughts exactly.

Well after months of not lurking the on the org I've returned to see that nothing has changed around here. At least this this discussion hasn't degenerated to the point of personal attacks yet. Anyways many thanks to the op for getting the clip up. This interview is one of my favorites from Video Soul. It was great seeing again after nearly 25 years.

jimmiev1967 said:

JESSE SPOKE THE TRUTH ABOUT WHAT HAPPENED, BUT ON THE SAME TOKEN HE WAS DOING THE SAME THING WITH HIS BAMD..DOGGING THEM OUT AND STUFF..JUST BEING A HIPPOCRITE.. I KNOW OF SOMEONE WHO HAD SOME EXPERIENCES WITH JESSE AND THEY WERNT PLEASANT.

I DONT EXPECT PRINCE TO BE PERFECT, BUT I EXPECT HIS FORMER BANDMATES TO LEARN FROM HIS MISTAKES.!!!!

Oooooookay, would you like to give some examples of what you've heard?

Militant said:

BlaqueKnight said:

Uninspired Vegas music - perfect description. Prince hasn't been lightyears ahead of anyone since the 90s. Most Prince fans are content just to get another Prince record and they don't care how it sounds as long as its him. They rationalize it and listen to it over and over until they like it, or at least until they are comfortably familiar with it. VP came along and smoked out most everything Prince has done in a long time. Prince has become a corny musical caricature of himself. He has made some great records in the past but most of what he does these days just seems like he's going through the motions.

Disagree completely. The highlights of 20TEN, Lotusflow3r and 3121 are up there with his best.

Not flaming, but that's the point of Blaque's post, IMHO. P used to make solid works from opening to closing. Zero clunkers. Now, we get a gem or two scattered amongst generally okay material. I love P, but hey...

squirrelgrease said:

KCOOLMUZIQ said:

Whether Jesse who was very bitter 4 years wants 2 admit it or not. Prince was disciplining them. If it wasn't 4 his heavy hand & not letting them run wild back then. They wouldn't have became as successful as they eventually became individually. As talented as Jesse is. He was equally ungrateful...Prince was the master and they were the students. Deal with it. To this day Prince still holds all the cards to "The Time"......He will own there Masters 2. Because there his...

Is this an admission of a Prince apologist?

Seems to be.

minneapolisFunq said:

Why is Blaqueknight always trying to revive this tired debate?

"Do yourself a favor"

Why are you always on my nutsack, boy?

I didn't "revive" anything. I posted on a thread ONE DAY after the last post. I don't live on here like some people.

Chill out.

BlaqueKnight said:

minneapolisFunq said:

Why is Blaqueknight always trying to revive this tired debate?

"Do yourself a favor"

Why are you always on my nutsack, boy?

I didn't "revive" anything. I posted on a thread ONE DAY after the last post. I don't live on here like some people.

Chill out.

phonzarelli said:

Militant said:

Disagree completely. The highlights of 20TEN, Lotusflow3r and 3121 are up there with his best.

Not flaming, but that's the point of Blaque's post, IMHO. P used to make solid works from opening to closing. Zero clunkers. Now, we get a gem or two scattered amongst generally okay material. I love P, but hey...

Nah, that wasn't the point of his post, because if you wanna talk scattershot, the entire second disc of Jesse's album is basically unlistenable. It's full of ridiculous interludes which basically blather on about nothing, an entirely egotistical scripted "interview" which doesn't offer much insight into anything, and even a track of spoken "album credits". People bought the album to hear Jesse throw down with some killer songs, not to listen to astrological rants and such.

If you took away all of that stuff, there's ONE discs worth of actual songs on there, and at that point you've got a decent album - but it still isn't better than "3121" which for me, is solid from start to finish.

Militant said:

phonzarelli said:

Not flaming, but that's the point of Blaque's post, IMHO. P used to make solid works from opening to closing. Zero clunkers. Now, we get a gem or two scattered amongst generally okay material. I love P, but hey...

Nah, that wasn't the point of his post, because if you wanna talk scattershot, the entire second disc of Jesse's album is basically unlistenable. It's full of ridiculous interludes which basically blather on about nothing, an entirely egotistical scripted "interview" which doesn't offer much insight into anything, and even a track of spoken "album credits". People bought the album to hear Jesse throw down with some killer songs, not to listen to astrological rants and such.

If you took away all of that stuff, there's ONE discs worth of actual songs on there, and at that point you've got a decent album - but it still isn't better than "3121" which for me, is solid from start to finish.

I agree completely. It started out incredibly, but by the end it got boring.

Stuff like that interview and the spoken word credit part was just unnecessary and a lot of the songs on the 2nd disc were just downright dull.

If Jesse put some of the songs like Ali vs Frazier on the 1st Disc, it would've been perfect and the argument that Jesse's music is better than Prince's over the last decade would have a lot more weight to it.

lets just say that some of prince's personality the dictator side rubbed off on certain peeps as far a treating their employees.