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Printablejohnart said: I finally got this from a friend.
 
I had heard the stuff that had been put out through the site but I never listened to the album as an album in entirety. I've been listening to it for 2 days and it only makes me want to kick P's ass. To shelf this and put Bria forth. 
I actually think that in his long career, this was one of the protege projects that showed most promise. The public, not just us P-geeks, was actually getting a little familiar with her from the tv appearances. She stood chance at a fair debut. All I Want is U is still my favorite. Sunday in the Park, Holla & Shout, Kept Woman and Red Head Stepchild are all very solid songs and of course there's Beautiful, Loved & Blessed, which is a bit mediocre, but still a nice enough tune and had the nomination going for it. Even if the others sucked (which i don't think they do) that's still more quality music than a lot of new artists put out in one album. Closer 2 my Heart reminds me of Sheena's Cool Love. 
[Edited 2/2/10 11:39am] Bria Valente's album is a better overall record. The writing is better. The style of music on Bria's album is more commercially viable for Prince's fanbase (which isnt 16 year old girls anymore). Tamar was a poor man's Beyonce - and a dime a dozen stylistically. And lets face it - unless you are very unique, you have to be super fine to make it as a girl singer these days - and Tamar.... | |
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Brofie said: johnart said: I finally got this from a friend.
I had heard the stuff that had been put out through the site but I never listened to the album as an album in entirety. I've been listening to it for 2 days and it only makes me want to kick P's ass. To shelf this and put Bria forth.
I actually think that in his long career, this was one of the protege projects that showed most promise. The public, not just us P-geeks, was actually getting a little familiar with her from the tv appearances. She stood chance at a fair debut. All I Want is U is still my favorite. Sunday in the Park, Holla & Shout, Kept Woman and Red Head Stepchild are all very solid songs and of course there's Beautiful, Loved & Blessed, which is a bit mediocre, but still a nice enough tune and had the nomination going for it. Even if the others sucked (which i don't think they do) that's still more quality music than a lot of new artists put out in one album. Closer 2 my Heart reminds me of Sheena's Cool Love.
[Edited 2/2/10 11:39am] Bria Valente's album is a better overall record. The writing is better. The style of music on Bria's album is more commercially viable for Prince's fanbase (which isnt 16 year old girls anymore). Tamar was a poor man's Beyonce - and a dime a dozen stylistically. And lets face it - unless you are very unique, you have to be super fine to make it as a girl singer these days - and Tamar.... Who could possibly argue that Bria's album has been a commercial success. 
Let it fly on its own and let's see how many copies it sells. Especially since she, for whatever reasons, was not put in the public eye to perform and promote herself. Unfortunately, Prince dicked Tamar by pulling her release, so we'd never be able to see how well or poorly it might have done. So neither you nor I can say one way or the other with any degree of certainty. All we can do is speculate and state our individual tastes and observations. I find Bria Valente's album, overall to be forgettable. It peaks at average as does her vocal performance on it. There is at least diversity and range in Milk & Honey. Tamar holds her own in a few different styles and one can see her potential. You can't effectively use the term "poor man's Beyonce" to put down Tamar, while defending the biggest possible fail ever at cashing in on Sade's name. Even Prince realized this, didn't then come back and say something to the effect that he "mis-spoke" in her introduction? I'm sure that boosted Ms. Valente's confidence through the roof.
In all honesty, aside from the fact that she was to be in a group with Bey, that they are both black and curvy and sing...I don't find many similarities (stylistically) in Tamar and Beyonce. I can imagine/hear a lot of artists performing other's songs when I listen to music. That doesn't mean one is copying another, it just means they might both have the ability to do the material justice. And even if she were a poor man's Bey...so what? The charts are populated MOSTLY by poor-man versions of one artist/band or another. I also don't think the writing in Elixir is any stronger or more appealing to a Prince fanbase. I certainly wouldn't go by the response to it on this site to substantiate that as a fact. As far as songwriting (performance aside), I'd say they are both fairly even. Milk and Honey has music that is consistent with with the Prince/Tamar collaborations of the time. It also has lovely drama (All I Want is U) and even takes us (well, me) back to P's "popular" days with "Sunday in the Park", which has that "storybook" quality. It would've fit perfectly in one of Sheila's early albums.
For me, there is no journey to Elixir. I don't hate it, mind you. As a matter of fact I am listening to it now. I don't listen to albums I hate. But it's nothing more than glorified Prince muzak. It leaves the listener with little to discuss because it all sort of blends together. But truth be told, it's really unfair (to the ladies) pitting one album vs. the other. For the exception of "Kept Woman" (which I like pretty equally by both)they are completely different offerings. My initial comparison was based more on disappointment that he would not have given Tamar her shot and then thrown Elixir to the public. One artist proved herself prior/leading up to a release, where the other did not, or was not allowed...or whatever it is that happens in Prince la la land.. Whatever might have transpired between P and Tamar, she did the work and then he shut the door in her face at a crucial moment of her career. | |
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johnart said: Brofie said: Bria Valente's album is a better overall record. The writing is better. The style of music on Bria's album is more commercially viable for Prince's fanbase (which isnt 16 year old girls anymore). Tamar was a poor man's Beyonce - and a dime a dozen stylistically. And lets face it - unless you are very unique, you have to be super fine to make it as a girl singer these days - and Tamar.... Who could possibly argue that Bria's album has been a commercial success.
Let it fly on its own and let's see how many copies it sells. Especially since she, for whatever reasons, was not put in the public eye to perform and promote herself. Unfortunately, Prince dicked Tamar by pulling her release, so we'd never be able to see how well or poorly it might have done. So neither you nor I can say one way or the other with any degree of certainty. All we can do is speculate and state our individual tastes and observations. I find Bria Valente's album, overall to be forgettable. It peaks at average as does her vocal performance on it. There is at least diversity and range in Milk & Honey. Tamar holds her own in a few different styles and one can see her potential. You can't effectively use the term "poor man's Beyonce" to put down Tamar, while defending the biggest possible fail ever at cashing in on Sade's name. Even Prince realized this, didn't then come back and say something to the effect that he "mis-spoke" in her introduction? I'm sure that boosted Ms. Valente's confidence through the roof.
In all honesty, aside from the fact that she was to be in a group with Bey, that they are both black and curvy and sing...I don't find many similarities (stylistically) in Tamar and Beyonce. I can imagine/hear a lot of artists performing other's songs when I listen to music. That doesn't mean one is copying another, it just means they might both have the ability to do the material justice. And even if she were a poor man's Bey...so what? The charts are populated MOSTLY by poor-man versions of one artist/band or another. I also don't think the writing in Elixir is any stronger or more appealing to a Prince fanbase. I certainly wouldn't go by the response to it on this site to substantiate that as a fact. As far as songwriting (performance aside), I'd say they are both fairly even. Milk and Honey has music that is consistent with with the Prince/Tamar collaborations of the time. It also has lovely drama (All I Want is U) and even takes us (well, me) back to P's "popular" days with "Sunday in the Park", which has that "storybook" quality. It would've fit perfectly in one of Sheila's early albums.
For me, there is no journey to Elixir. I don't hate it, mind you. As a matter of fact I am listening to it now. I don't listen to albums I hate. But it's nothing more than glorified Prince muzak. It leaves the listener with little to discuss because it all sort of blends together. But truth be told, it's really unfair (to the ladies) pitting one album vs. the other. For the exception of "Kept Woman" (which I like pretty equally by both)they are completely different offerings. My initial comparison was based more on disappointment that he would not have given Tamar her shot and then thrown Elixir to the public. One artist proved herself prior/leading up to a release, where the other did not, or was not allowed...or whatever it is that happens in Prince la la land.. Whatever might have transpired between P and Tamar, she did the work and then he shut the door in her face at a crucial moment of her career. Read it again, Sparky. I did not comment on whether it was a commercial succes or not. I referred to the business decision to include that kind of music. But pontificate on - doesnt really matter if you got the reference to my post correct. | |
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Brofie said: johnart said: Who could possibly argue that Bria's album has been a commercial success.
Let it fly on its own and let's see how many copies it sells. Especially since she, for whatever reasons, was not put in the public eye to perform and promote herself. Unfortunately, Prince dicked Tamar by pulling her release, so we'd never be able to see how well or poorly it might have done. So neither you nor I can say one way or the other with any degree of certainty. All we can do is speculate and state our individual tastes and observations. I find Bria Valente's album, overall to be forgettable. It peaks at average as does her vocal performance on it. There is at least diversity and range in Milk & Honey. Tamar holds her own in a few different styles and one can see her potential. You can't effectively use the term "poor man's Beyonce" to put down Tamar, while defending the biggest possible fail ever at cashing in on Sade's name. Even Prince realized this, didn't then come back and say something to the effect that he "mis-spoke" in her introduction? I'm sure that boosted Ms. Valente's confidence through the roof.
In all honesty, aside from the fact that she was to be in a group with Bey, that they are both black and curvy and sing...I don't find many similarities (stylistically) in Tamar and Beyonce. I can imagine/hear a lot of artists performing other's songs when I listen to music. That doesn't mean one is copying another, it just means they might both have the ability to do the material justice. And even if she were a poor man's Bey...so what? The charts are populated MOSTLY by poor-man versions of one artist/band or another. I also don't think the writing in Elixir is any stronger or more appealing to a Prince fanbase. I certainly wouldn't go by the response to it on this site to substantiate that as a fact. As far as songwriting (performance aside), I'd say they are both fairly even. Milk and Honey has music that is consistent with with the Prince/Tamar collaborations of the time. It also has lovely drama (All I Want is U) and even takes us (well, me) back to P's "popular" days with "Sunday in the Park", which has that "storybook" quality. It would've fit perfectly in one of Sheila's early albums.
For me, there is no journey to Elixir. I don't hate it, mind you. As a matter of fact I am listening to it now. I don't listen to albums I hate. But it's nothing more than glorified Prince muzak. It leaves the listener with little to discuss because it all sort of blends together. But truth be told, it's really unfair (to the ladies) pitting one album vs. the other. For the exception of "Kept Woman" (which I like pretty equally by both)they are completely different offerings. My initial comparison was based more on disappointment that he would not have given Tamar her shot and then thrown Elixir to the public. One artist proved herself prior/leading up to a release, where the other did not, or was not allowed...or whatever it is that happens in Prince la la land.. Whatever might have transpired between P and Tamar, she did the work and then he shut the door in her face at a crucial moment of her career. Read it again, Sparky. I did not comment on whether it was a commercial succes or not. I referred to the business decision to include that kind of music. But pontificate on - doesnt really matter if you got the reference to my post correct. Umm..Sparky?? I thought I was having a discussion with you, what's with the condescending tone of your post? I know you didn't say Bria's album has been a commercial success. But it's a closely related and valid point of discussion when you are talking about the merit of a business decision. Unless you're trying to sabotage the artist or record company, the aim of any business decision in music is to sell and have commercial success. I can read and comprehend.  | |
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johnart said: I finally got this from a friend.
I had heard the stuff that had been put out through the site but I never listened to the album as an album in entirety. I've been listening to it for 2 days and it only makes me want to kick P's ass. To shelf this and put Bria forth.
I actually think that in his long career, this was one of the protege projects that showed most promise. The public, not just us P-geeks, was actually getting a little familiar with her from the tv appearances. She stood chance at a fair debut. All I Want is U is still my favorite. Sunday in the Park, Holla & Shout, Kept Woman and Red Head Stepchild are all very solid songs and of course there's Beautiful, Loved & Blessed, which is a bit mediocre, but still a nice enough tune and had the nomination going for it. Even if the others sucked (which i don't think they do) that's still more quality music than a lot of new artists put out in one album. Closer 2 my Heart reminds me of Sheena's Cool Love.
[Edited 2/2/10 11:39am]  Prince, in you I found a kindred spirit...Rest In Paradise. | |
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johnart said: I finally got this from a friend.
I had heard the stuff that had been put out through the site but I never listened to the album as an album in entirety. I've been listening to it for 2 days and it only makes me want to kick P's ass. To shelf this and put Bria forth.
] It would help if u had the FACTS. | |
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Graycap23 said: johnart said: I finally got this from a friend.
I had heard the stuff that had been put out through the site but I never listened to the album as an album in entirety. I've been listening to it for 2 days and it only makes me want to kick P's ass. To shelf this and put Bria forth.
] It would help if u had the FACTS. What would it help? It wouldn't change what I think of the album. I'm not saying this was shelved in order to put Bria's out in it's place. Fact: Milk & Honey was not released. Elixir was released. [Edited 2/6/10 16:16pm] | |
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