butter4yourmuffin said:

Jimmy Jam once said he would love to record another Time album. He was just waiting for Prince to come up with the songs. Jesse played with the Time a few months ago so I think all the guys would be into it if it was just a part-time thing.

mltijchr said:

I saw the Controversy tour and I wanted to see Time. And you are right they were DAYUM good! Most of the people I went to the concert with, wanted to see the Time. and "Girl" and "Gigolos get lonely too" were the big RB hits.

I agree when Jam and Lewis left, the Time just wasn't the same. They became more campy. I guess this is probably after Jesse left also.

prodigalfan said:[quote]

mltijchr said:

Alright now, you came up in here raising HELL.....and I LOVE it! Great post, very true, and very well said!

Wouldn't that have been a damn joke? No one could replace Morris' coolness as the front man, let alone St. Paul. He would have looked like a complete fool talking shit like Morris.

vainandy said:

Agreed.I can't believe that Prince was actually considering this

hey vainandy.. thanks for the props! I really wasn't trying to.. "go off" on this thread, but I suppose that in expressing my opinion it may have come out that way.. & it's cool to see someone else here who has a similar opinion on this topic.


as for butter4.. hm, I can honestly say that I did not take the breakup of The Time that hard. I was surprised when I 1st heard about it (years ago when it happened) because everyone kept saying that the group was still together..

it does still annoy me to some extent that prince broke up this group - because as I said The Time WAS SO FUNKY & SO TIGHT & they had so much attitude & I hate to say ANY really good group breakup - but I was far from needing any "therapy" or mood-altering medication or anything like that.

plus, I am a FIRM believer in "what goes around comes around". I very much do not wish anything bad on anybody, but when a person screws other people over, it eventually comes back to them. so IF prince has done anybody wrong in his life (& I'd be SHOCKED to learn that he hasn't) it's going to come back on him 1 day.. just like if I do someone wrong to someone it's eventually going to come back on me.


hell
NO, I am NOT a prince "faN" today - that fact could be a whole other thread. I am indeed quicker to criticize him than I am to give him props - but I definitely still acknowledge his amazing musicianship & his impact on popular music since the early 80s. even when I was a fan (1980-98), I never thought that prince was "perfect", that he could do no wrong.

really, today if someone asks me about prince I simply say that "I could not 'keep up' with him"..
which is in fact true. I can't, & frankly.. I don't want to.

fortunately, there are other singers/musicians/groups that I can still really get into - namely STEELY DAN. I listen to more jazz, I still listen to a decent amount of rock, as well as all the OLD SCHOOL FUNK that I grew up on & still love, & nice doses of country, acoustic & classical music.

then finally, when I'm in that type of mood.. I will definitely break out
DIRTY MIND or CONTROVERSY or 1999 (& live shows from those albums)
when I want to hear & remember how BAAAAAD prince USED to be.

mltijchr said:

Well, Prince has been fighting forever to get control of his masters to no avail. I'm sure that annoys him to no end. Maybe that's his bad karma.

mltijchr said:

-----
[/b], I am NOT a prince "faN" today - that fact could be a whole other thread. I am indeed quicker to criticize him than I am to give him props - but I definitely still acknowledge his amazing musicianship & his impact on popular music since the early 80s. even when I was a fan (1980-98), I never thought that prince was "perfect", that he could do no wrong.

really, today if someone asks me about prince I simply say that "I could not 'keep up' with him"..
which is in fact true. I can't, & frankly.. I don't want to.

-----
To bad for you. Looks like another former fan living in the 80's. (LOL)
Nobody thinks Prince is perfect. He is human just like anybody else but, at this point he is one of the G.O.A.T's. About a million people turned out to see him this year and that does not happen if you are not in the G.O.A.T realm.

As far as Karma is concerned. You must not be keeping up. That guy has been in hell the last couple of years or so. I would say that he has more than paid for some of this behavior. It looks like in some people's eyes no amount of punishment is enough (LOL)>

vainandy said:

Nobody has as much juice as Morris hands down at the end of the day let alone St. Paul eventhough he was cool eye candy for the ladies and that's it.

JesseDezz said:

okay somethings you SHOULD keep to yourself LOL

nammie said:

Well then, you sure wouldn't have wanted to see my uncles and I reenact the "Beat It" Video

Those nicknames he had were on the ball.
[Edited 4/30/05 0:35am]
[Edited 4/30/05 0:37am]

vainandy said:

Your knowledge of funk is pretty impressive as well VainAndy. You must be one of us "grown folks"

mltijchr said:[quote]this is a great thread,
& I am NOT saying that because it confirms what pisses me off about that little purple man - like the "back & forth" that's been happening here. I think BOTH "sides" have some points, but I am more sympathetic towards Jesse, because he CAN play guitar, & it did seem like he got the "short end" of more than 1 "stick"..


I remember reading in (I think it was) that prince book "Possessed", where Jesse apparently thought that initially, The Time was going to be about "Jesse & Morris", a sort of "Hall & Oates"-type set up, but then it ended up (rather understandibly) being more about Morris out front. so on 1 hand, whatever Jesse's motivations where, he still made the choice to be in The Time. if Jesse thought he couldn't "get along" with prince, it's hard to imagine that he could not have gotten out sooner if he really wanted to.


yet again, I put more of this on prince & the little JEALOUS, insecure "bitch" he was at that time. GRANTED, prince did "put together" the group, wrote all the songs & whatever, but he was WRONG to break up this band.

I will probably always be ANNOYED at prince for breaking up 1 of the FUNKIEST bands ever in The Time. I have said MANY TIMES here on the org: those of you who never saw The Time on the Controversy & 1999 tours..
YOU MISSED OUT.
those boys were SO bad.. SO funky.. SO tight.
prince HAD to break them up.
back in the day I was a HUGE prince fan, but after those shows on those tours, everybody was talking about The Time, NOT prince. as BIG a prince fan as I was then, I could understand what people were saying because The Time DID tear it up on stage, & they looked DAMN GOOD doing it.
so jealous bitch that he was, he had to break up the "monster" he had created.
prince erasing Jesse's solo on Jungle L


today, prince has the FUCKING NERVE to say
"oh The Time has always been my favorite band"

oh yeah???
were they his "favorite band" when he was not putting their name on the marquee of certain venues, for fear of them showing him up???

if they are his "favorite band", why hasn't prince used any of his “industry clout” to help them release a REAL “Time” album – something the group hasn’t done in FIFTEEN years..

OF COURSE it's VERY EASY for prince to now say that The Time-
rather "Morris Day & The Time"
(& people.. there IS a difference between the 2)
is his favorite group..
they are his favorite group because they are no longer a THREAT to him on stage or on vinyl. they were no longer a threat the moment he sent Jimmy & Terry packing. "Morris Day & The Time" can still bring some funk today,
but it's NOT the same as the "prime" Time of 1981-83.




Whew, that was a scathing post for real. But I cannot disagree with a single word.

37 and aging like wine.

vainandy said:

I figured you were around my age and were apart of the Old School Grown Folks Crew.

Hotlegs said:

Funny, I am also that same age, will turn 38 in July. I should've known since we agree on a lot about what is good music.

Well Awright!!! Let's hear it for da "grown folks".

First of all everyone, we have to remember that groups like Vanity 6, Apollonia 6, Sheila E AND The Time were all side projects that Prince came up with. He formed the groups, wrote the songs, played the instruments(on the first Time album at least) and fronted the money for the projects. These groups were an outlet for Prince to explore other types of music that he could not release on his albums. This being said, The Time knew this going in that Prince is in control and they were nothing more than musicians hired to play and perform Prince's music. If they wanted to have control and write their own songs and do their own thing, they should not have agreed to be a part of his side project. Lastly, we have never heard Prince's side. He did say in Rolling Stone back in 1990 that he did not fire Jam and Terry. Morris Day came to him and said "what would you do if you were in my shoes?" Being producers was NOT their job back then. They allowed something that was not their job to interfere with their REAL job. They missed a gig in Atlanta due to this. In our world, if you allow a "moonlighting" job to interfere with your REAL PAYING job, you would be FIRED too.

babynoz said:

TheDeacon said:

You have a valid point about Jam and Lewis deserving some discipline for missing the gig. It was probably messed up for those at the concert. I heard Prince was behind the curtain playing the instrument, and someone was on stage pretending to play. That is messed up! But I think it was Prince who fired them. I think he was very pissed that they allowed their own ambition to get in the way of his ambition. That being said, it was his group to break up. But I was very disappointed and couldn't believe that a group that was killing the charts and was as big as the Time was in 1983, 1984 would just disband just like that.
Too bad for us, because by that time there wasn't a lot of funky bands still making music. Funkadelics were at the start of their dry spell, I already talked about Kool and Gang, EWF were drying up after invading the disco market and disco disintegrating. There just wasn't a lot of bands that had that sound. We were just starting to get into the boy groups, New Edition, (no one played an instrument), and all of the knock off NE groups. We really haven't had a funk/ RB band since that they members could sing and play instruments. Am I forgetting someone?

TheDeacon said:

-----
I have only said this a dozen times on this board whenever this comes up.
Maybe P is an ass but, he was the boss and they all new that there would be a limited amount of money or control avalible when they signed on.

I just think no one likes to take responsibility for their own mistakes.

laurarichardson said:

Well, it was no mistake for Jam & Lewis, since they are the one Minneapolis act that has become a seperate entity from Prince that he had no control over. They have become established producers and regardless to how often they thank Prince, when it comes to the business decisions, unlike most others from the MN camp - they didn't need Prince's approval. There comes a time for some employees when they have to make decisions on what's better for themselves rather than what's best for the company. That's pretty much what they did. They took a risk. Of course, they didn't expect to get snowed in, but they valued what they were working on more than what Prince was doing. Some of the Prince minions on this site see this as betrayal, but its really a matter of doing what's best for you. Just because someone hooks you up doesn't mean you owe them a life of indentured servitude. They ourgrew Prince. Plain & simple.

BlaqueKnight said:

And to give an example of where "indentured servitude" gets you, take a look at Lewis's brother Jerome Bennet. Enough said.

BlaqueKnight said:

-----
But Jam and Lewis do act like it was mistake to hook up with Prince in the first place. They talked about their situation with him for about 15 years.

They got fired because they took a risk and it worked out for them. Why keep bitching about it.

BlaqueKnight said:

One of the biggest mistakes Prince ever made was trying to stop Jam and Lewis from writing and producing songs.They weren't really making alot of money in The Time (at one point,they were making only $200 a week).If Prince was smart,he would have signed them to a production deal with Paisley Park Records.His own acts (The Family,Apollonia 6,Mazarati,etc) could have used many of those big hits that Jam and Lewis gave to others.

BlaqueKnight said:

exACTly!

DavidEye said:

DOUBLE exACTly!

laurarichardson said:

They do? I've always heard them say they learned a lot from Prince.

sextonseven said:

-----
Not often. They spent more time dogging him. I noticed that they kind of slacked off in the last few years but I remebmer reading a lot of interviews they did in the late 80's to early 90's. They were having a good old time slamming P.

You don't have to ignore the truth just to disagree with me. (LOL)