I'm sitting here looking at the moderation style that is developing on the Org... I submit some tough as nails broad should be brought in to balance what I view as a moderation style that's way too male/jock. All the moderators are men in their twenties and early thirties... and it shows.

oow we might hate her

Christopher said:

So? Being a moderator isn't a popularity contest.

Aerogram said:

might? she'll be moderating won't she? moderating is an UNpopularity contest.

Val?

how funny...i was thinking the same thing...how interesting...

but seriously, when Kat moderated the wendy and lisa imusic forum there was never a dispute over it...she handles people in such an awesome way and i hope one day the guys here reach her level...

not a knock on anyone here...i think they are doing the best they can...but, theres always room to go.

Occasionally some of the moderators on here are major MARY's. Does that count? lol

Yeah! A woman could clean up this mess, no problem!

SkletonKee said:

It's not a knock from my part either. I know the moderators are trying to be as objective or as less subjective as they can, but their moderation does reflect their gender/background, just like it would come out in any other job.

RandomDuck said:

Or at least get a butch gay guy with a sensitive side like...well, like me.

Dauphin said:

I don't think Val wants the job, otherwise she would have it already.

.

Aaron said:

It's certainly not a job for the faint of heart. I try to remember that when I assess a moderator's work.

The only major benefit I could think of would be that the fragile male egos of some of the more insecure juvenile loudmouth male posters on the site would feel less threatened by a female moderator cleaning up their forum ego-jizz. When it's a male moderator, the macho thing kicks in with some people and they feel that the mod is pissing / spreading his scent all over their "territory" or something.

ian said:

but Ian..something tells me a female moderator wouldnt respond like you just did...using phrases like "fragile male ego", "juvenile loudnouth male posters", "ego-jizz"...dude, I can soo see you smacking your chest with fist when your typing this stuff out...

do you ever think about your writing style? just curious, cause at times it can have an air of arrogance, attitude and smug-ism... not that theres anything wrong with that, normally..but, as a moderator- it could turn people off....cha know?

once again, just waxing...waxing.....waxing.....




[This message was edited Thu Aug 29 8:29:55 PDT 2002 by SkletonKee]

SkletonKee said:

Haha well no doubt a woman (or really, any nicer person than myself!) would respond with more tact and subtlety.
I may come across as "smug" or "arrogant" at times but people who know me know I'm just having a laugh and I'm not the arrogant bastard you might think I am.

Anyway let's face it, if you're the person responsible for censoring posts, removing threads etc it's not exactly gonna make you mister popular either way.

To be honest at times I do find that you (SkletonKee) and others like Aerogram come across as being extremely arrogant at times in your posts, and it can really rub people up the wrong way. But what can you do? Communicating in pure text is never ideal. It often seems that some people equate "having an opinion" with "touching up little kiddies". It's just not right.
[This message was edited Thu Aug 29 8:58:36 PDT 2002 by ian]

ian said:

... there ya go proving my point. I think few of the regulars around here can be accused of having a small ego, so there's no point in singling out anyone. As for the "secure", "insecure" thing, that's even more of a give away than you realize, since manhood is often measured by how "secure" one appears. Several posters are more sensitive/emotional, and I think those that post intelligently should feel welcome... Last thing I'd want is a site full of IT types with short, technocratic views on everything.

OK Problem Solved...

They need a Lesbian Moderator!!!

How hard was that? They would get the job done and be sensitive to BOTH sexes.

Much Love,
LoLinex

Some women are too emotional. If I were to moderate and I had my period, I'd delete all of these mutha f'in threads just to be a bitch!!

ian said:

well, this i will say...effective moderators that dont stir up *more* issues for there site tend to remove all *opinions* will moderating...some go as far as to be completly annonymous...i still havent figured out why Ben slaps your guys names on the forum section, or why the moderation isnt done under the guise of "prince.org staff"...that way, the act of moderating is just that...and all personalities are removed...

but back to the use of language...i think i have to side with caution here...and since your right, the tone of ones message is hard to gadge you as a moderator have to take care and go to extremes so that you are not misinterpeted...but so far, thats seems to be something that you have refused to consider...your explanation, its just your personality...well, your personality shouldnt be shinning through when your moderating...

and finally, dont allow yourself to fall under the trap of pleasing some of the people some of the time...your goal as a moderator is to please *all the people*..just because some of the veterans are familiar with your personality, dont forget that this forum is a growing one and that you will have new visitors and guests flocking here everytime something new happens within the Prince community...Dont allow your self acknowledged "arrogance" to rush them people away..."FIRST IMPRESSIONS" are key here...

oh yeah, one more thing..as far as my writing style is concerned, I never asked for the job...i gave a lot of recommendations to Ben on how to improve the site and how and why the GD forum should be brought back..I thought it was laughable that *you* explained *you* were the reason that GD came back after my lenghty tips and debates with Matt and Ben..However, I never once offered my services as a moderator..why? because while my job allows me plenty of time to surf the net...(almost 24/7) i knew that the art of moderating takes a skill that I dont neccessarily have...And, like I politly informed you on the day of your announcement, neither did you...but, i must say...you are getting a lot (a lot) better with your responce...and i know its easier to give criticism and advice then to actually act on it..so my hats off to you for being productive and capable of listening...but i still think someone with a softer touch could bring a nicer balance...

ohhh...and btw: I guess my habit of dishing advice comes from my years and years of human resource/coaching/training and moderating (in real life) experience...

i just cant seem to shut-up..

I've suggested anonymous moderation as well... I really don't know why it should be personalized. If you had a moderator team made out of five people that would be known to be moderating, but that wouldn't be identified for each decision, it would save you all a lot of aggravation. It would also imply you consult each other, which wouldn't be such a bad idea for the more complicated situations.

SkletonKee said:

I've noticed! Part of the reason why I had difficulty communicating with you before was because you spoke to me like I'm behind a counter serving you fries.
[This message was edited Thu Aug 29 11:55:22 PDT 2002 by ian]

Aerogram said:

That's a good idea. But you'd see that the comments were written by a 20-something IT guy and see right through my disguise wouldn't you? Any other stereotypes you'd like to apply to me while you're here? I drink Guinness and like potatoes too, that ought to help

I do think anonymous moderation is a good idea though. However one of the reasons why I use my real name on this site is that I figure if you have opinions, you should have the balls to stand behind them and stick your name beside them. Rather than hide behind some anonymous, mysterious "Org Moderator" entity, I'm a person who people know and can speak with person to person if they wish. The personal touch and all that. If it doesn't work out, maybe anonymous moderation stuff is the way to go.

SkletonKee said:

Laugh all you like SK, it's true. I've been making proposals about changing the Org for over a year now. I've spoken to Ben on the telephone about it. When the GD Forum was pulled down, I was the one sending emails, putting together proposals, putting together moderator guidelines, and ultimately I'm the one giving up a fuckload of my time to moderate the site - it was never something I particularly wanted to do, I just wanted the site to be better and rather than just complain about it I tried to do something about it.

You do spend a lot of time helping out though SK - you submit a lot of "off topic" reports etc which is very helpful. But I'd still maintain that it's a lot easier to sit there and bitch than it is to get off your arse and do something. Which is what I'm trying to do. Not to be hero, or get a medal, or be "Mister Beloved All Powerful Moderator" but just to do what I can to try and improve things around here. Scoff all you like, but it's the truth.

Aerogram said:

Well the last thing I want is to have to moderate a site full of self-righteous, arrogant condescending over-opinionated pseudo-intellectuals that feel the need to see everyone they communicate with fit into their narrow categorized view of the world. But we can't have everything can we

Don't make assumptions about people you don't know Aero, it doesn't become you. You think I post like a 20-something male technocrat - well fine, that's exactly what I am. I write the way I write, and you'll have to get used to that I'm afraid. Or you can just continue sticking your nose in the air, putting inverted commas around everything you come across, and drown in your own cynicism and small mindedness.

Ian

(Edited to add smilies, does that help?)
[This message was edited Thu Aug 29 12:05:11 PDT 2002 by ian]

ian said:

Hey, I'm perfectly content to evoke those few stereotypes, which weren't specifically directed at you. If this site were moderated by a couple of translators or nurses, you'd see some of the "stereotypes" associated with these professions come out too...nothing to be ashamed of. It's called "background".

As for the "anonymous" idea, I'm glad you like it. Why do you have to do all this work alone? I think others could easily have been invited to pitch in and work under one ID, courage of opinion be damned. And no, I wasn't thinking I could be one of them, don't worry.

ian said:

Ian, you werent the only one...thats what I was laughing at...I too, and others, were communicating with Ben..didnt I point that out in my post? And I think other people are interested in helping out with the moderation so that you dont have to spend sooo much time on it...if its *that* big of a hassle for you..

scoffing? who's scoffing? and i have always helped out on in the forums..trying to get people to understand the nature of online forums...trying to teach them how to be better posters..i do this and get slammed for preaching "positivity" all the time...i guess you've never seen people make fun of me for it...so in my mind, I am doing a lot more then b*tching...sorry you see it that way...but then you yourself acknowledge otherwise in the above comments...

and im not even going to get into your responce to Aerogram...that responce was soo unneccessary and is indicative of the comments that you make that concerns me..."thick skin" is needed to be a moderator...are you ready to grow that skin?


ohh ohh ohh...just forgot...just waxing my views...
[This message was edited Thu Aug 29 12:35:51 PDT 2002 by SkletonKee]

ian said:

Oh yeah... I hate em too.

I was curious Ian as to how you were chosen as the new moderator? so from what I'm reading here...you inquiered about it or volunteered for it? (either way)
just wondering...I think your doin' a fine job of it

Aerogram just get over it!!! AHHH! Enough!