Tessa said:

i would respect this statement if it pertained to the issue at hand. we are not discussing the tone of the entire world wide web but moreso the nature of moderation and how one conducts themselves when doing such.


now, if you feel us mods should be allowed to express ourselves any ole way then say such. but just because someone see's an oppurtunity to change how things around here done doesnt mean they are in need of a life or that they are pondering "the org" way too much....

how are we ever going to evolve, change, recognize the status quo is working just fine if we dont discuss it?

DiamondGirl said:

it is what it is. we can each try to change it in our own small way, but expecting the rest of the world to wake up and put effort into something so undeserving and unnecessary is asking a bit much. sure, the org can be seen as a microcosm for the wider internet, or even society as a whole, but since when has sitting around complaining about how dire and dreary civilization is changed anything? yes, we all sometimes need it pointed out to us to remind ourselves that we really ought to be better. and for that, in a way, i commend Haystack for his post. but it's been this way since the beginning, even with the same complaints popping up over the years, it hasn't changed. it's gotten neither better nor worse. so hey, if you want it to be better, act better. just don't expect everyone else to jump on the wagon.

sosgemini said:

honestly, that's ever done. sit around and discuss it. if it made a damn bit of difference, there'd be no point in continuing to discuss it year in and year out.

Tessa said:

well, it does make a damn bit of difference..

seriously, i know that i take peoples views into consideration....and this is one thread....and to be honest this has been an issue that i have wanted to discuss for over a year now....so one thread in a one year time span doesnt come off as extreme to me?

however, i do feel the life of this conversation is dying out.....its been interesting and informative....

Tessa said:

So it's better to never say anything at all? Because Enigmoid said something, proactive discussion has been a result, which can lead to action. And there is nothing wrong with someone speaking about their observations and feelings regardless if you (people in general) feel that it's all for naught/que' sera sera. For someone with your attitude towards life and the net, I wonder why you even bothered to respond since you've seen, heard, and know the outcome of it all.

sosgemini said:

I'm not going to rehash what happened. We were both there.

As far as the poly stuff, I was surprised by how unkind people were (and continue to be. . .though I am no longer surprised, either by the unkindness or by the way this issue comes up EVERY TIME somebody has an issue with me NO MATTER WHAT that issue is regarding . . . talk about making it personal. . . ). But no, I wasn't "crapping" about it. Were you to actually go back and look at the thread, I think you'd find my overall tone would have best been described as 'bemused.'

Newbies are often disrespectful of the communities they enter, including this one. Act like an idiot, get called on it, and hey, welcome to the org.

Enigmoid said:

I never expressed a "woe is me" sentiment on here, and I never referred to it as a "chore", so just as you said, don't assume. Several days ago on another thread I mentioned that moderating on here has been difficult because of the site freezing up, and other technical issues. Would you rather we didn't respond at all or make any attempt to explain things from our point of view as well?

If you're concerned about peoples attitudes on here, try holding yourself to the same standards you expect from moderators.
[Edited 4/25/05 5:30am]

That's the point. Why does Enigmoid owe respect to any of those that replied rudely to his/her post in the first place? Next, it will come down to who started it first and then we're in underoos, pulling each other's hair and crying over who's turn is next to play with the toy.

Neither party should have to tolerate such nastiness. That's why it's adult to give a basic level of respect to all in the first place; to avoid senseless mud-slinging.

Enigmoid took the time to construct a thorough and careful post concerning bad attitudes. It was immediately and thoughtlessly shat on by a mod, with a bad attitude. How ironic. This thread alone validates Enigmoid's claim.

Enigmoid, and others on this side of the debate, have been instructed to "get over it," and have been labeled as "fragile." When Dansa was berated by Enigmoid, instead of receiving the same treatment, people were quick to come to her defense and insist personal attacks cease. Why can't she get over it and toughen up?

Because neither party deserves that kind of disrespect, hence the reason respect should be given to all in the first place...to avoid mud-slinging wars.

But then I guess some never tire of "I know you are, but what am I?"

I may be new to this cite, but I'm not new to life. Ad hominem attacks are like a boring tennis match. What a waste of time and energy, not to mention an insult to the intelligence of all of those involved. Bypass it all by dropping the unruly attitudes, I say.

By the way, who'll fess up to deleting my post(s)?

while some of you all are patting each other on the back with one hand and casting stones with the other, know that there are others of us who know better.

this thread has gone out of control. it's all bile and scab picking.

if you wanna look out for the poor, disenfranchised intraweb newbie, then do it. i do. new people orgnote me all the time with wacky questions, and i answer 'em, and i answer 'em respectfully and five minutes later i forget all about it. no big whoop.

we mods don't hold a monopoly on how this site is shaped. look at the top of this page. it says ONLINE FAN COMMUNITY. every person who posted on this thread is a part of that community. with every post, you help to shape this site. every person on here is empowered to contribute to the personality of the org. everyone.

for those of you who don't frequent this site anymore but are consumed with worry about the downtrodden newbies, ya got options. present yourself as a beacon for new folks. be someone who folks know to go to with questions, no matter how common or silly the question may be. get a reputation for being helpful. create positive change on here. it can be done. it has been done. it is being done now. add on to it. be a part of the solution.

or....you can log off. you can deactivate your account. you can wash your hands of this place and have one less gripe on your plate.

you've all made your complaints. dansa's an uber-hideous evil nasty monster from hell. we get it. great. thanks for the insights. so what are YOU going to do to now make the sun shine? i'm done listening to complaints on this thread. let's start seeing some improvements. it's easy to cast judgment. it takes effort to act out the ideals you find lacking.

i guess what i'm saying is, "put up or shut up".

but i mean that, of course, in the kindest way. especially to any newbies who may be reading this.

Anxiety said:

It's very simple, Anxiety, as u say.

Do U genuinely blieve a member of the MODERATING team should demonstrate a "FUCK 'EM" attitude 2 any member (new or otherwise)?

If the answer is NO, and Dansa is unwilling 2 change what is perceived as her nhospitable manner (n make no mistake about it, that is how she is perceived), then she should CONsider stepping down, no?

There's ur immediate SOLUTION.

love

Anji said:

i'm getting the distinct impression that this thread is not so much about how to make this site a welcoming environment for new users as much as it is simply an opportunity for folks to get out the rakes and pitchforks and have a nice, cozy virtual witchhunt.

so you all go ahead and enjoy yourselves. i've made several suggestions throughout this thread of how we can take initiatives to make this a more newbie-friendly site. unfortunately, none of them have to do with villainizing dansa, so i'm guessing my ideas will continue to be ignored.

"love" indeed.

i love alla ya, but quite frankly, some of you folks on this thread are grossing me out.

Anxiety, that's all good & well, but u didn't answer the ?uestion: Do U genuinely blieve a member of the MODERATING team should demonstrate a "FUCK 'EM" attitude 2 any member (new or otherwise)?

Eye don't blieve any1, least of all u, should b surprised that some1 who holds a "FUCK 'EM" attitude, especially a MODERATOR, feels they r on the receiving end of b ing "FUCKED BACK".

If such a response hurts, then those who perpetrate (or sanction) such hostility, should CONsider y it's b ing made. Others, of which many r new members, felt hurt 2. That might not make Dansa feel good (no doubt, she may just think "FUCK EM"), but that's the truth, ruth.

love

Anxiety said:

It's about attitude problems, not new persons.

Anxiety said:

See, here you're blowing sunshine up our asses. You're saying you approve of rude behavior and that if members don't like it, to attempt to balance it out with happy, hippy, syrupy love. I'm not buying what you're selling.

Anxiety said:

The last time I attempted to help someone, my post was deleted.

Anxiety said:

Nah, Dansa makes a perfect and convenient example due to her "fuck 'em" contribution. She helped prove the point of the post when she tossed out insults left and right.

Anxiety said:

This shit gets old too quickly. I'm going back to lurking and not posting. I'm sure that will create some sunshine on the org.

[hiatusmodeoff]

*le sigh*...it's one thing that it's a pity about the whole newbie thing, but it's another pity (and a larger one at that) to see a thread that's supposed to be an outlet for ideas to make the site better turn into the usual mudslinging, gossipy b.s. that most threads like this usually turn towards. a muthafucka can't speak of how to make the site better because there'll always be those who simply cannot let shit go, therefore the whole idea of "how could the org be better?" can't be solved or discussed, apparently. there've been tons of great ideas posted here, but yet n'still nobody's payin any sorta heed to what's being said; people cannot see the forest for the trees, it seems. i'm surprised this hadn't been locked sooner, to be honest.

once again: the org does not start/end with just us mods. it's all of us. this thread's a classic example of why and how this is so.

[/hiatusmodeon]