I was just thinking about the rules of this site and started to wonder about certain things like this segmnent:

"Don't create offensive, vulgar, obscene, threatening, abusive or excessively profane posts."

I can understand the "threatening" part and sort of the "abusive", but what exactly counts as being offensive, vulgar, obscene, or excessivly profane? I mean, 50 years ago it was considered obscene to show Elvis below the waist. So how are we to really know exactly what this means or by who's standards? Afterall, what may be offensive to some may not be to others. And are we to be punished for posting something that SOME may not be happy with?

I personally like to be a bit more raunchy in my threads and posts, and a fair amount of people enjoy that. But I never really know if what I write will be there the next day or if my account will still be active.

I guess it's really just a matter or opinion.


.
[Edited 1/6/05 8:09am]

I guess it's a matter of interpretation, depending on the venue. For example, if you started your own site at which people were allowed to post comments, you would probably define what is obscene based on your sensibilities and worldview; you may even bring some people on board who you feel share those sensibilities and worldview, and have them help you maintain that site should it become too much of an effort for you to maintain on your own.

I've visited certain sites where I felt their definition of "obscene" was different than mine. At first I felt like it was an infringement of my freedom of speech, then I realized the site was privately owned and, as such, the channels of communication were controlled by those to whom the site belongs. After that realization, I had to consider then if it was worth my time to spend time at a site that didn't reflect MY sensibilities.

My decision, ultimately? I post there when I have comments that I feel are relevant to that site's environment, as designed and maintained by its owners. Meanwhile, if I wanna post my thoughts carte blanche, I can always start a blog or my own site or something. Right?

one of these is easy...


obscene is anything that can get an individual in hot water with the h/r department at their work....

sexual harrasment is *not* about the act and all about intent....if someone visits prince.org knowing that there is objectional content on the site they can be fired for sexual harrasment..there for we err on the side of safety and do not allow anything that possibly can be perceived as objectional...

we will provide a link (for those who like it randy)..but we have to protect the site visitors somehow...
[Edited 1/5/05 21:07pm]

I love raunchy stuff as well. I think it's just people who frequent the site are already aware of the org rules and the nature of this site, and those new to the site wouldn't really anticipate hardcore porn or violence, etc... If I'm browsing the web at work, or around family or friends, I would expect a site like this to be safe to browse without some giant cooch popping up on the screen for example.

If I wanted gore, I could visit Ogrish. If I wanted porn, I could visit a site like Cumfiesta, etc... I think the request to not post obscene material is just out of convenience and consideration, to avoid embarassing people while they visit the site, or offending/disturbing them with strong content they may not have anticipated.

See, but since there are several moderators on this site, wouldn't they all have various ideas about what's offensive and what's not? I'm sure not everyone shares the same opinion on this matter, so it's hard for some of us to know what we can post and not post.

Like yesterday I posted a photo of a man being hit by a car. The photo wasn't gory at all, and who knows if it was even real? But it was snipped anyway. I don't see how that picture could be a threat. Maybe one would argue that some people here may have been in car accidets and the picture can bring bad memories. Well, what if I was attacked by kittens as a baby and everytime I see kittens I freak out? Should pictures of kittens be removed as well?

I see pictures posted all the time that could be considered offensive by at least a few people. Sometimes I see threads about hot women and such and the thread gets flooded with pictures of girls in bikinis, or sometimes nothing at all. Those could be considered to be a problem for someone at work, but they're allowed on this site, and a warning isn't necessarily included in the thread title.

So it's just tough to know what's what around here. The GD forum is flooded with all kinds of ridiculous threads and contain all kinds of bizarre pictures and comments. I'm sure a fair amount of them could be offensive to some. And if just one person is offended, does that mean snipping is required?

Maybe there should be an [i]Anything Goes[/b] forum, where people can just go nuts and post whatever they want. And before entering the forum, people understand that things may not be appropriate for them to see or discuss. I bet you that will become the most popular forum.

EvilWhiteMale said:

Most of the time, images that are not safe for work, are usually just converted to a link to the image with a brief warning, rather than completely snipping it. However, I noticed the car accident image was completely snipped; orgnote Anx and ask him about it. If you think an image your about to post might be offensive, just link to it instead and include a warning. It only takes a second to click the link, and avoids anyone, be it mods or orgers, giving you grief over it.

I've also suggested an "anything goes" forum as well, but there would be alot of details to work out, like how we would manage username who may have been banned from other forums, but only allowed in the Anything Goes forum, etc... It may be more work to implement than Ben would even be interested in doing.
[Edited 1/6/05 8:47am]

sosgemini said:

I still say that if you put NSFW in the title of your thread that should be enough. No need to ban using img tags when the header already says it's NSFW. Besides, when you're at work, you're supposed to be working. Merely visiting this site could get you in trouble.

JoweeCoco said:

not true.....some people are allowed net use...as a business owner i allow my staff the freedom to surf.....

and linking should be permitted.....didnt i say that? i thought i did...


ohh..i just got what the img tag thingie your talking about means.....good point..however, some people (including you) seem to use NSFW for any ole thread as an on going gag....each time you do that arent you watering down the importance of the disclaimer?
[Edited 1/6/05 13:50pm]

I think what is considered obscene or repulsive here has a lot to do with who's reading it and who posted it...also what subject it is. Like EWM said...there're a lot of posts on here that could be consdiered QUITE offensive to most women...but that is rarely the issue. on the contrary small comments (i.e. a simple post of "pussies") that would be absolutely no worse than a thread entitled "tits or ass?" and even less noticeable gets snipped. degrading women is a far lower offense on here than say what EWM said...a non-gorey pic of a guy getting hit (which wouldn't be considered inappropriate at any place of employment i konw of) Moreover what gets snipped is more frequently arguing and not obscenity unless it is complained about. I do know of a similar site with many similar people that would be good for such posts that are likely to be considered vulgar or obscene. It is password protected to prevent inappropriate viewing, and would be generally considered an NSFW area, so people would know that if that stuff is not acceptable at work they just shouldn't go there period. If the org would consider an "anything goes" section to be potentially too much extra work, perhaps they could encourage those posts to be made elsewehre....perhaps with a link from here to a thread if someoen felt like posting soemthign about it here...but none of the content woudl be visible here without entering the password there, so no danger of accidental viewing in an inappropriate atmosphere. cooperation can go al ong way in making everyone more happy.

OR, people can create their own web sites/blogs in which they can say or do whatever they want, carte blanche, 24/7, and they can moderate it (or not) to their heart's content. Sites like diaryland.com and blogger.com provide free blog space, and both of those sites and many others allow for guestbooks and comments from visitors...voila!

Anxiety said:

Yeah, but it would be cool for everyone who knows each other here to be able to really let loose with each other. I think it would be good to have just one forum where we don't have to worry about "offending" anyone. The forum wouldn't even need much moderation. Maybe just to keep an eye out for threats and such. But overall, it would keep all the hardcore stuff in one spot, and anyone who enters the forum must agree to go in at their own risk.

It could work.

EvilWhiteMale said:

it's an interesting idea, but riddle me this, batman: how would such a forum be beneficial for a web site for prince fans?

there could very well be a good answer to my question. i just don't know what that answer is.

Anxiety said:

Just as beneficial as GD forums, P&R forums, other artist forums, etc. None of these things have anything to do with Prince, but they're still part of the site and people enjoy them for various reasons.

But don't take my word for it, take a poll.

EvilWhiteMale said:

It may very well be popular. But then again, Ashlee Simpson and Linday Lohan both have multi-platinum albums on the charts right now, so I'm not exactly swayed by popularity these days.

EvilWhiteMale said:

see signature:

Also, what about the emoticon? Is it considered a flame if it's posted towards someone?

EvilWhiteMale said:

within certain context, yes...

sosgemini said:

what about these emoticon, posted for our use by the ORGgods? couldn't these be considered just a teensy bit 'vulgar' ??

XxAxX said:

my answer was in responce to if it could be considered a "flame"..not obscene...


good try.

sosgemini said:

ok

So many blurred lines.

EvilWhiteMale said:

yes and no....yes what can be considered obscene and/or offensive is objective..what isnt is the co-operation on the part of orgers to keep this site "enjoyable" for as many visitors as possible....if we run into a situation where a person is continually being a nuisance to a site participant or a moderator and isnt co-operating in better understanding site rules (and modifying behavior) then that person will end up having their account banned....
its really that simple....nobody (since i have been helping out and as far as i can tell) has ever been banned after one offense.....its either someone who ends up continually defying the rules or someone who starts antagonizing the moderator in retaliation..

the key here is to work *with* the moderator and not take the incident personal....

far to often people get combative and respond to moderation as such....site moderation is not percieved as authority but more so an option to protect ben's asset (his website)...unfortunalty i think we do a piss poor job of expressing that for the most part but then we arent given many oppurtunites to express it..(except when we are under fire...let me ask this, how many of you are effective at expressing intent after being chewed out at for an hour by your boss for making an error? its not constructive..)....thats the reason why we have up'd the threads asking for your opinion...but only a few people sincerely participate...(and thanks to those who do..it really really does help)..


at anyrate....i think the big key here is discussion..ask the mod who took action why....and thanks EvilWhitemale for asking this (in the right forum) and with the right tone...it can only help *all of us* better enjoy our visits here to this site...


stupidclarificationedit..
[Edited 1/8/05 21:05pm]

I still think there's a pins and needles issue around here. Some of us now have to be so careful with what we write that it feels very restrictive, even if we're not trying to start trouble. We have to think about how our posts are gonna be taken by everyone because while some people enjoy our posts, others love to protest. I personally feel like I'm on a permanent probation. And that sucks because I'm not the one who starts the trouble around here. I've just gotten busted for striking back.

And on that note, I think some slack should be given to those who get slapped for attacking the attackers. It's like a kid at school being jumped by a gang and then being punished for hitting back. The blame should go mostly towards those who start the shit, not to those who defend themselves. It's human nature to want to get back at those who wrong us. Running to the mods everytime is all well and good, but it's not easy to leave it at that.

EvilWhiteMale said:

i disagree 100% with your statement....we live every single day of our lives on pins and needles...we are not allowed to say whatever, whenever and however in reality and not within this forum...there are certain rules that must be followed everywhere...in reality and in virtuality....

and you know what, if you have created a persona as an "evil whatever" then you have to expect that your going to get a reaction...it has nothing to do with honesty and everything to do with how people "react".

and even if thats not true...even if honesty is the rule of law for which you live by then you should expect honesty in return...and if that honesty is in violation of site rules then report it.....because the only obligation, the only trade off/permition that you gave to express that honesty, is to follow prince.org (bens) website rules...plain, simple and honest.

anything beyond that would be dishonest, no?....

cause like

you said:

following that principle would go a long way to ease the feeling of permanent probation.



eeksedit....
[Edited 1/8/05 22:23pm]

Reporting people doesn't make much of a difference. I've been attacked by certain members over and over and over again, yet they continue on, despite my reports. I'm not the one who started the trouble, but I got banned for striking back.

But hey, whatever. There's really no sense in debating this cuz my opinion doesn't matter.

EvilWhiteMale said:

no, your opinion does matter...its always has...when you and Ubiguity were going at each other and i tried to broker a standstill you told me to ease up because you enjoyed the debate.....i listened then.

as i do now..

take comfort in the fact that i am enjoying my time in the prince: music and non-prince: music forums right now.....after personally being heartbroken over the presidential elections im just not having as much fun discussing politics....as each day passes i find myself feeling less and less burdened by the election campaign and anticipate getting back into the discussions and championing my causes..so dont think i (or anyone else) is out to get you.....i personally am not reviewing all of your new posts.....and to be honest we mods havent even discussed your return after it was agreed to bring you back...so feel free to say whatever you want..as long as its within site rules.....

just dont forget p&r forum is the only forum that stats "keep it friendly"..twice!!

learn your nemesis....understand your nemesis....but above all respect them.....


canihaveanymoreeditsonthisthreadimtiredandgoingtosleepgoodnightthankyougoodbyeevlishasleftthebuildingedit!!
[Edited 1/8/05 22:47pm]