Don't kill me. I'm starting to wonder are we perpetuating a music style that is becoming a relic? Like the blues. Yeah, there's folks that still do it, but, it's a small group and they all listen to it, recalling the "golden age".

And, well, the golden age of funk was sometime between 1971 and 1982? Maybe? I don't know. I'm in the middle of working on my first solo CD, and shoot, halfway thru it, I find myself second-guessing the musical direction. If I do a 100% funk record, (well, yeah, my idea of funk is diff than others, but you know what I mean) I'm wondering, is this thing going to become an interesting disc that maybe gets a little airplay and that's it?

So. I've been seriously listening to pop and college radio and mainstream music, not with the intention of selling out and following the next big thing, but, just out of interest - what are my options, commercially?

So sure, Dre 3000's record comes to mind. It owned the charts for what, 4 weeks? And dawg, it's definitely funky... but, almost to the point of being a novelty record - novelty in the since that, there ain't NOTHING else like it out there. (of course I'm being unfair by not including Big Boi's half of the contribution in this discussion, but that's straight up Hip Hop. Hip Hop is immensely succesfull as a movement right now, but it's just not me. I'm far too white to start rapping.)

Mainstream radio has consumed itself so now it's recycling classic hits of the NINETIES. (I swear. the big station here in atlanta's new slogan is "NEW MUSIC AND 90'S ALTERNATIVE!" as if its playing long-buried hits. I could cry) If it's not playing 90's classics, it's playing bands that are TRYING to sound like 90's bands, or, worse/better yet, the 80's new wave/punk wannabe bands. Awesome, and so depressing at the same time. Remember Sha Na Na? They were the only band in the 70's that did music from 2 decades prior, and nowaways, there's a whole frickin genre dedicated to 19 yr olds playing/looking like their dad's favorite band.

So what IS going on with, for lack of a better word, DANCE music? What IS new in it? Chemical Brothers/BT/Moby techno sample sludge? That stuff is 10 years old, and to begin dabbling in that is maybe worse than sounding like a Prince clone, because you're just reheating samples that most other folks have used.

What about Jazz Funk? Jam Bands? Plain Ol Pop?

I just wish there was a music movement that i could get excited about. Ever since alternagrunge came and went, it seems like the music scene has become more splintered and divided than the crowd at the last State of the Union address.

Just bummed. And venting. That's all.

Man, who knows anymore.

check out www.abstractlogix.com
There are some very interesting musical artists you may want to check out.
[This message was edited Thu Jan 22 11:21:38 PST 2004 by FrankAxtell]

Do what makes you feel good. That's all that matters. I hate labels, but Funk is very broad like you said. And saying that something is "funky" can be compliment or a put down. As in "Hey man, your shirt smells funky" or "Dude, that beat is funky!"

I understand your disappointment with that issue, Beau. Funk music did indeed die in the early 80's. But, funk is being resurrected into "New Funk" more and more. The problem here, is that no one wants to admit to being guilty of the funk! You know those genres you posted the other day from that electronic geneaology? All of those genres have artists that have funk. If you have the 2 and 4 with a back beat, you have some funk. Heck, you know that from your site!


The real issue is getting artists to believe in the funk, and that they have the funk in them.


Peace,
JD

Also, do you think most people think of Robert Palmer as "funk"?. Hell no. They think of him as being Mr. Businessman Pop. But, sho nuff, in the 70's, he really funked it up on that "Sneakin' Sally Through The Alley" lp. That one is awesome and real groove funky.


JD
[This message was edited Thu Jan 22 11:50:40 PST 2004 by Flashpointe]

Hey Otan!

I don't know bro'...

Funk ain't dead to me...it might smell a little funny but, you know...







Jshua

Very good points Jason - it's still funk but with a new candy flavored wrapper. I feel better already.

Great points y'all. Let me go get my silver-sparkle jumpsuit and high-heel sneakers out of the trash.

Otan, y'know I'm still listening to that live funk medley that you recorded in the fall and that's where it's at.

Then maybe mention to the audience to go check out some JBs or say if you want more come and talk to me afterward.

Live funk just can't be denied, it's infectious and people just have to shake their ass if the drummer's kickin' it with a funky bass line.

I've turned a ton of people on to funk who just didn't know how cool it was. Y'know fads come and go but good music never really dies. It sounds cliche but it's true just listen to all of these bastids covering 70's classic rock. IMO that music isn't really timeless but the cover is in the top of the charts.

Look at that Love, Power and Peace cd, it's a great example of a timeless piece of music. That sounds as good as the day it came out. Funk is like that to me, just timeless and I believe in the live show to teach and inspire.

Stay the course my friend and don't let the radio get you down. I haven't listened to the radio since 1995 and I don't miss it.

otan said:

Don't forget the Turban!

Radio sucks. Funk lives in the heart of us. It can never die. It can not be denied."what is a booty and how would I know if I'm shakin' it..."G. Clinton.

talmuzic said:

Wiser words have not been spoken.

Otan, I'd say keep with the funk. Perhaps blending elements of R&B and rap with it. As 4 the radio...I'd say switch the radio off, and make some funky music

Funk is dead only if u say it is. But the truth...it is beating like a heartbeat .,

Funk lives on as live music, not record sales and radio airplay.

The future is always with fusion.





NO, not jazz fusion necessarily...fuses any styles together to create something new. It's the only way anyone has created anything original.

mrdespues said:

Actually, THIS is EXACTLY what the French music scene is all about. Over here they have all genres just like UK/US music, but what's REALLY popular with the kids playing in garage bands is as you said, the FUSION of differenct styles. Personally, I think this has been done before many times in the UK and US, but has never really caught on.



I'm really hoping for a funk revolution like you Otan, but I really believe it's going to come unexpectedly. Since Sly and then Funkadelic, you had bands that would be created, with the SOLE INTENTION OF CREATING THE FUNK. As we all know, this led to many instances of FALSIFIED-FUNK...and DISCO was eventually born. You really can't push for a true funk revolution, because you wont just get the record companies cashing in on it with their plastic monkeys, you'll be getting the likes of Coldplay dishing out 'token' funk.

I really believe that if there's to be any form of funk revolution (or ANY revolution for that matter!), it will be underground, ELUSIVE, and even EXCLUSIVE...exclusively true to the funk. You have these underground acts nowadays, but there's no network, and no common agenda. And that common agenda? To remain TRUE to the funk, and FREE from the EXPLOITATION of music...to remain exclusive, and separate from the exploitation of major record companies. This is not to say that companies are OUT...but the current system as we all know and hate it for, should be.

And what is funk? We're not talking about a style of music here are we...come on? We're talking 'feeling' and 'attitude'. I bet when Robert Johnson first sung They're Red Hot, he never thought the attitude would catch on, and JB's first ever "UGMPHH!" was never designed to sell records, in the same way that Cameo's cod-piece, and "OW!" were - this is not to say Cameo wasn't true to the funk!...its just that if funk is ever forced to re-evolve into a 'style', you risk another cliché/disco phenomenom!



Sorry guys, this is something I've been thinking about a lot lately as well...

...and...

...I just get a bit...

...emotional.

Sometimes. *choke*


Funk Revolution Edit: To reiterate my "you can't push for a funk revolution" skit...I believe that you can't 'create' the funk, but that funk comes from within all of us, like soul, and some people can tap into it better than others. Therefore, the sad truth is that if the population in the 21st century ain't feeling the funk, then a major revolution ain't gonna happen. They will feel the funk when they are ready, no one can force them (although it'd be interesting to see how Andre3000 fares). But there ARE funky people among us! And if they are TRUE to the funk then they WILL hear the beat of the funk revolution, however underground/elusive or exclusive it may be!


[This message was edited Fri Jan 23 2:13:47 PST 2004 by Taureau]

I understand what you're saying Tau, cousin of T'Pau.

My constant fear is that I'm like one of those deadhead hippies in love beads and tie-dyes who just doesn't understand how absolutely stuck in 1971 he really is...

I'll be funky, but, to the crowd, am I just some loser holding on to a fun but tired music style? Remember that swing movement that lasted 4 weeks back in 1995? There's still a couple of swing bands that I look at and just can't help but think, "dude, let it go."

But that's me, I'm an nihilistic egotistical bastard.

otan said:

otan said:

You gotta do what you feel man. Shit, look at me... I'm stuck in the 80s...

Give a little bit of heart and soul...

Style is one thing. Yeah, those guys do seem kinda lame doing the swing thing, dressing up in costume every day. I mean, what about the people who aren't even in a band, they just dress like that AND buy old cars.

Music is something different. If it moves you, it will move someone else. I think problems could stem from forcing all your music to be categorized as funk. It can be funk-y and still venture into other territories and sound good and/ or new.

It's like with all this 80s comeback stuff... I really don't want the 80s to "comeback". What I want is more synths and guitars together AND more people who write their music being promoted instead of this pop-tart bullshit. So it's not the style, see? It's the MUSIC.



Word.

hectim said:

I would agree with that!

the radio I listen to while I am working is B98.5. anyone in Atlanta will know right off what kind of stuff they play. They play alot of eighties and middle of the road pop music. I love the old pop/rock/funk...Unfortunately, it's the best radio I can find to get me through a work day. Most people would wonder why I am not listening to hip flop radio but real music has left the airwaves a long time ago.

music is math.
and math is infinate.

I guess it's all about one's aproach to it.

If you aproach a song in emulalating what's already been done, then your only trying to resurect what's already out there. Fusing different styles can lead to a new sound though. So you can mix some addition with some subtraction.

My point is that if music is the composition of notes played and FUNK is the concentration of the notes NOT played, then you still have infinate possibilities to work with. How it's percieved by the public and it's success is all up to the package you create for it and the marketing of a product and has nothing to do with music.

So you have to make that decision: Product or Craft?
And which one do you want to nourish?

Where to begin?
I was never too good at math, so getting re-schooled would be a good start for me. Kinda like graduating from basic math and moving into algerbra but with music. Most people are going to "get" pop/country over jazz because it's the basic math they can understand. (4/4)

Flipside / Most musicians are broke. The latest statistics show that the average full time musician makes 20,000 (US) per year. If you have a family, forgetaboutit. You'd make more working at minimum wadge.

So do you want to be successful as a musician (knowledge) or as a product salesman (money)?



...
[This message was edited Sat Jan 24 8:52:19 PST 2004 by NFO]

Just a thought: What makes Led Zeppelin's "D'yer Mak'er" hipper than NCYNC's "Bye Bye Bye"?

Lyricly, both songs are cheese, but the arrangements make the songs very different.

D'yer Mak'er
Oh oh oh oh oh oh
You don't have to go oh oh oh oh oh
You don't have to go oh oh oh oh oh
Baby please don't go.

Ay ay ay ay ay ay
All those tears I cry ay ay ay ay ay
All those tears I cry ay ay ay ay ay
Baby please don't go.

*CHORUS

When I read the letter you wrote, it made me mad mad mad
When I read the news that it brought me, t made me sad sad sad.
But I still love you so, I can't let you go
I love you- ooh baby I love you.

Oh oh oh oh oh oh
Every breath I take oh oh oh oh oh
Every move I make oh oh oh oh oh
Baby please don't go.

Ay ay ay ay ay ay
You hurt me to my soul ay ay ay ay ay
You hurt me to my soul ay ay ay ay ay
Darling please don't go.

CHORUS
Oh oh oh oh oh oh
You don't have to go oh oh oh oh oh
You don't have to go oh oh oh oh oh
(Baby please don't go)







Bye, Bye, Bye
Bye, Bye ,Bye I'm/ doing this tonight
You're/ probably gonna start a fight
I/ know this can't be right
Hey baby come on
I/ loved you endlessly
When/ you weren't there for me
So/ now it's time to leave
And make it alone
I know that I can't take no more
It ain't no lie
I wanna see you out that door
Baby, bye, bye, bye (bye, bye)

CHORUS

Don't wanna be a fool for you
Just another player in your game for two
You may hate me
But it ain't no lie
Baby, Bye, bye, bye (bye, bye)
Don't really wanna make it tough
I just wanna tell you that I had enough
Might sound crazy
But it ain't no lie
Bye, bye bye (bye)

You/ just hit me with the truth
Now/ girl you're more than welcome to
So/ give me one good reason
Baby, come on.
I/ lived for you and me
And/ now I've really come to see
That/ life would be much better
Once you're gone

I know that I can't take no more
It ain't no lie
I wanna see you out that door
Baby, bye bye bye

CHORUS

BRIDGE:
I'm giving up I know for sure
I don't wanna be the reason for your love no more
Bye, bye
I'm checking out
I'm signing off
I don't wanna be the loser
And I've had enough


I don't wanna be a fool
In this game for two
So I'm leaving you behind
bye, bye, bye
I don't wanna make it tough (make it tough )
But I had enough
(bye, bye)
And it ain't no lie

bye, bye
Don't wanna be a fool for you
Just another player in your game for two
Don't wanna be your fool
But it ain't no lie
Baby, bye, bye, bye (bye, bye)
Don't really wanna make it tough
I just wanna tell you that I've had enough
It may sound crazy
but it ain't no lie
Baby, bye, bye, bye (bye, bye)


When you read the lyrics to both of these songs, you want to laugh out loud! But one of them comes across as very innovative. Musically that is.
[This message was edited Sat Jan 24 10:00:07 PST 2004 by NFO]

Some people might say that was Blasphemy!

Side Note: If your wife/partner ever reffered to you as "minute-man", sing either song to yourself or out loud during sex and you will have the stamina of a MASTER!

Ancient chinese secret.

Back on topic note: Sometimes switching from a minor key to major key can make a huge difference in your song.

Music is timeless, but emulating and genres can date it.

Funk is alive and it lives in the hearts of numerous funk fans and artists all over the world! FUNK WILL NEVER DIE!!!

And it's my believe that the funk will have a comeback within 2 or 3 years, so you just keep on recording and playing the funk, bro!

NFO said:

Nice one, I'll try that!

I agree with what you've just said, but I ain't good at maths, that's why I'm trying to use this computer to get some drum beats going!



Funkaholic: Nice to see ya man! Hope all is going cool! Yeah I too think things will funk up, uncosciously, in the music world soon. What with the drabness and sorrow that being dished out by many at the top (Coldplay, Radiohead etc.), and the forced crap by those at the bottom (ANY nu-metal), funk just HAS to be reborn again!

Funk is innovative.
Sticking with that formula (consentration of notes not played) will give you infinate possibilities in composing.

For some reason, Soundgarden's "bad motorfinger" comes to mind. It was labled grunge, but what made that album so different was the funk influence in the rythem. Some people call it "cut-time". But those grooves were funk in my book.

When do we get to hear this album?