Speaking of radio ...

I just watched the webcast from Steve Jobs and there will be a new version of i-Tunes with something called pod-cast.

So all these millions of iPods sold over the last couple of years will have radio tuners to pod-casts that will be open to everyone to create and distribute to ALL iPod owners. You can even have an idenity image associated with your radio cast.

Pretty cool stuff.

otan said:

I know they are, and that is not the way that it ever should have been, nor did the pioneers of broadcasting intend that to happen. We should not only take back the airwaves for the public, but we should influence legislation to do so, and learn to NEVER allow that to happen to the internet.

otan said:

Once again, these things should NOT be happening and we should be infuriated and empowering ourselves and others with the knowledge and encouragement to propose legislation that will make music and the airwaves free from corporate control. It is not fair that you, I, and the rest of us have to resort to going through rituals of filling out a life history survey, waiting a million years, and pressuring/begging some other mere human being to play your song on public radio, let alone private radio, where you have to have huge amounts of cash to do anything. There shouldn't be a music "business"- the only "business" that music should be about is the individuals who create the art being compensated for and having ownership of their works, end of list. Whether it is in a community like the NFO or just some dude with a washboard, we should all be artistically equal and have equal access to outlets of expression.

I guess I'm just a big ol' hippy, but I still believe in peace, love and equality.

I dunno man - there's a balance in there somewhere. Because as soon as the government disallows private organizations to run the radio, then, that means the GOVERNMENT will run the radio, and you'll have all the free radio you want - BBC1, BBC2, BBC3 or BBC4. Pick one.

Me, personally, I think everything is where it should be. If you want to be an artist, you really have to bust your ass to be heard, because right next door is somebody who just saw a video and downloaded a demo version of HomeStudio5 and recorded their way cool awesome hit, and tomorrow they'll forget about it and go back to playing videogames. I'm more comitted than that. You're more comitted than that.

All the hoops to jump through are there to help separate the serious artists from the "hey that looks cool" artists. Same thing goes right here. Do you remember the folks who'll pop in, post a link to their song, and never come back to the org? Same kind of philosophy... commit yourself to your craft, love your art, and, unfortunately, sink your own money into your art, and THEN people will start to play your crap. That's why I'm in a real studio now instead of continuing to do demos. Radio stations will play this new record, whereas they'll hear my home-studio stuff and, unless they know me or REALLY REALLY like the stuff, they wont play it.

Why?

Because on the very next CD they play, the one AFTER mine, they'll hear what may be a not-as-great song, but the artist took the time and money to put something together that looks and sounds more professional. If they've only got 3 hours for their radio show, and they've got 10 hours of CDs hoping to get played, which one do you think they'll play? Amatuer Hour, or Money Talks?

otan said:

But what's the priority? Money or art? You can truly only serve one or the other. Money and art don't mix. If the quest is to be known or be a "star", then the purpose defeats itself. If the quest is to simply express and be heard while enjoying what you do, then being compensated isn't a bad thing. But, if everyone follows what you call "procedure" and puts forth what executives deem as "quality" or "professional", then it becomes mechanical, non artistic, and purposeless. That also puts average Joe's who have great talent with limited funds in a creative bind, because we can't afford studio time. Money and art don't mix. If a person has money, and the studio is where the person wants to spend money, more power to them. But a guy like me has to pay bills first.

The airwaves must be made public and controlled directly by the public as a cooperative- (not the "government" as you said). And if that can't happen, we at least have the NFO. But, if the thinking of "what is, is, and always will be" is the accepted normal attitude, then the NFO is in vain, because it would be about money and not art. I prefer art over money, and any musician should.

I mean, there really has to be a shift in thinking here, not just laws. Me and you (Beau) shouldn't have to pay big bucks to be heard by the public. In actuality, the equipment shouldn't cost as much as it does. But once again, the people who are selling the equipment and running the radio stations must change their thinking and begin respecting art before money. Without the love and respect for the art, the whole thing isn't even worth it.

I really have to differ with you JD. As utopian as it sounds, unfortunately, money and art have to mix. I totally agree that it sucks when you have other priorities as well, and your art is your passion. Only this year have I decided to go blow real money on my music.

I just turned FORTY, so, think about it.

20 years of writing, recording, performing, and I've never ever spent a dime on real studio recordings, CD pressings, whatever.

In all that time, I've gotten over 10 songs on the radio, 2 of my songs have been selected as the "hot track of the week" on the local radio show here, I had a song go to number one on the blues charts at mp3.com, (back when it supported indie artists) and I've had a band that's won awards, contests, you name it. I've been interviewed on two different radio stations about my band/my music.

I have felt just like you - hey, wouldn't it be great to have my music - my art - succeed on it's own without corporate sponsorship, contracts, financial support beyond my own limited means, etc. And, to some degree, I've done pretty well at that level. And I'm telling you, you CAN get your stuff on the radio right now, as it is.

The problem is that you're asking your music to be directly compared to the previous song, and the next song. If both of those songs are a lot more polished - I'm just talking about the recording quality - forget the artistry, song integrity or whatever - if your song is played between two songs that have been more professionally produced, your song will pale in comparison. Period. That's not because of corporations or suits or trends in music being bent by the Man... it's because the listener makes these comparisons.

Additionally. Look at it from another angle.

Is it fair that you get airplay with your song, recorded in your bedroon on your 4- or 8-track recorder, when the next person has no car, no relationship, a barely-decent place to live, in the name of their art?

While you are wanting to make sacrifices for your craft, there are others who are living on the edge in order to get their CD produced in a recording studio. So, then, you tell me, whose record should they play, if the DJ is making the decision on sacrifices alone?

and here's my take (whether it was asked for or not. ) Kelly mentioned "podcasts" and this is like the radio shows Prince used to do only with independent artist producing whole shows. Then they have a web site and post it. Sound quality and what they are hearing right after your song all changes when you have a captive audience for 45 minutes and you control the in between the song chatter or effects or cool clips and sound bytes.

The point being I have understood what Beau has been saying about his studio stuff completely and I can't wait to hear the differences but things are changing as I type in how people take in music. Of course money has to be a part of it, it is an industry of its own. Radio will always be a part of the industry but I personally think now is the time for coming up with something that nobody has ever thought of in regards to formats and downloadable music.

The industry needs to change and while quality shouldn't suffer somebody is going to do it and the "podcast, IMO, is just the beginning of things to come in the way that we listen to music.

Nice to see you doing what you're doing!




Jshua

o.k. Beau, I like rump shaking mindless music as well. But, when I think of REAL music and musicians I think about Earth Wind And Fire, Chicago, Neil Diamond,Stevie Wonder,SRV, Lionel Richie, Phil Collins, The Carpenters, The Beatles, Joni Mitchell,.....These people gave us some great music that will last for centuries. Not because they made our booties shake. Because they made u think while u enjoyed a beatiful melody. This is what I meant by message in the music. I like all types of music, not just christian. Thanks Vina for clearing up my meaning about satanic verse and sinful being synonomous.

On the way home, I thought about this some more - so, I'll say this, and then, I swear, I'll shut up.

When you show up for a job interview, do you wear jeans and a t-shirt, and just expect them to hire you based on your abilities and job experience? Well, it would be great if you could, but in reality, you have to wear the suit, kiss the ass, and do what it takes to even the playing field between you and the other candidates.

When you go to college - do you show up and say, "I'm really good at what I do, so this education should be free"? No. You have to pay, or work really hard and go find scholarships. Rarely do they find you.

The music biz is the same way. Just to get your music heard, you have to level the playing field. Yes, there are many exceptions. Cody Chessnut's Headphone Masterpiece comes to mind. But those exceptions are far and few between - hence the name "exception". In most cases, any music you hear on mainstream radio cost the artist some time and or some money - and/or they had somebody else who was willing to put money into them to get them there.

It is just plain impossible to have a hit without money. Period. Even IF you were to go strictly through the internet, and were able to put your song on every web radio station out there, on every downloadable music source out there, you would still be up against artists who have gone into the studio.

Take garageband.com, or 15megsoffame.com, where you post your songs, people listen to them, rate them, and your art is recognized for what it is. Say your music and your message transcended the limited production quality - you will still have to hump it pretty hard to excel over mediocre songs with high production qualities.

Back to the college comparison. I went to design school because I knew I was a good designer, but on my own, I could only go so far. At some point, I decided that I had to go WAY into debt to become a more successful designer, and it paid off. It's not a matter of playing the game, it's a matter of polishing my art until I can walk into any room full of competitors and say, "I have the talent and I have the product. You have a product and that's all." Bam.

And Tal - I just saw your post - Stevie Wonder - "Boogie On Reggae Woman" where's the deep meaning there?

For every amazing artist you provide that has integrity, I can give you a song by them that lacks integrity and says, "oh bust it all, let's just jam about boy meets girl". I dig the message music, but I tire of an artist that can't stoop below that.

And the sinful message - you are sterotyping the music, still. You're saying, if the lyric doesn't give praise to the higher power, it is sinful? Because, again, looking at the Billboard top 20, I don't know how many of the songs actually contain lyrics that break any of the 10 commandments, or break any moral codes, (except the extreme right, which apparently opposes rock, just because...) Back to my initial statement - a song about "nobody understands me and I'm angry" - that's not a sin, is it? A song about "girl you are fine and we should go dancing" - does that constitute a sin?

Sure, the end result may be an implied sin...

or two, if he's lucky...

OH COME ON! I KID I KID!!

Unfortuately, I don't have a clue about the lyrics on the top 15. Never heard any of those songs. I AM OLD DAGNABBIT.

this is why i dont post.

i guess i dont see the point in critiquing people's music.

i come here to enjoy it - share it - and leave it at that.

the general public can access all the music they want on the internet - including yours and mine.

the internet has been a public forum for ages - but because of the strength of the illusion of mass media - and that U have to be on radio to be called successful - we still have people thinking its true.

its not.

there r plenty ways to make money - thru music - and other ways.

the problem is our lack of imagination.






we can sing about whatever we like - but only music that reveals something of the truth of the heaven in us - is called divine art - and no - it doesnt ask for money.


when u drink of the water of life freely - everything u truly need comes to you.




Jason is using his music as a politic - a spiritual politic.

I applaud that.

At least it has a purpose higher than " what can i do now to prove im really cool "

.. as if we havent heard and seen enuff of that already.




peace,
PB

" time is art "

sacredwarrior said:

Agreed...

and when we realize that more people than ONE thinks are putting their heart, sprit, blood and soul into it--instead of beliving that its just being cool for the sake of being cool....

than one can elevate

1.618

Trees are made of wood.
[Edited 6/9/05 5:24am]

MMM mmm mmmm to ya'll

o.k. one more time I reiterate...I like all kinds of music but I particularly like music that says more than "let me in them drawers". Believe me when I say that there is a time for saying that, but not all day everyday. I agree with what Pilot Beacon said as well. Lastly, I am in no position to pick the twig out of your eye when I have this log in my own eye... & love.

Where else could this topic fit so appropriately but on a Prince site. For who in this world can successfully sing about both and have a huge following WORLDWIDE. Prince for sure, Van Morrison....

I bought Van’s hymns and if Prince put out a gospel album I’d buy it...but it certainly wouldn’t get as much play as the rest of his repertoire. And ask any Prince fan, probably very few were drawn to him over the song GOD. It’s a genre that can be limiting. And that’s the only choice you have to make. How much is too much.

Two kinds of successful Artists - all start out with the same passion, but each driven by different desires. And it’s only natural for an Artist to want to have their songs, their art, their writing acknowledged. It’s part of our make-up to be admired for what we think we do well. One hones the craft to be a Star to the masses; the others can enjoy a cultish audience that has every bit of chance as the other to find the ‘big’ opportunity. It’s just finding it.

I know Artists that have lost their edge, driven only by the $. They don’t make songs for the beauty of it any more, they don’t paint from within. They are merely churning out shit because they think that’s what people want to hear or they think that’s what people want to hang on their walls. Or in Beau's case...it's a chance to showcase some polish and also a the decrepid age of 40 have a finished project for Posterity.

Today, with technology allowing everyone a window, it is becoming more difficult to measure an audience because of fragmentation. Britney Spears, J-Lo, Jessica Simpson, etc. etc. aren’t drawing huge masses to radio really, because few are listening to radio. These manufactured, regurgitated whatevers are making their nut of the brainwashed - in merchandizing (perfume, clothing lines, handbags). So don’t look at radio as THE vehicle any longer. It’s NOT.

A couple of months ago, I mentioned an NFO pod cast. Not a single peep clicked.
Now Slave’s mentioned it again. I would think this to be a natural progression for NFO. A Pod cast. Wouldn’t it be interesting to create a show built around NFO’s artists, interspersed with commentary about the Artist, interviews with the Artist, what makes them tick....so Beau, tell us about your latest experience recording this new album...Vina, tell us how your recent retreat affects your music today. Funk, tell us where you were when you had to get down.

What better way to create some attention than to give each Artist a voice, a personality...something to connect the music to the listener. For we all know, it isn’t just Prince’s music that draws people in - it’s the man himself and what he’s all about. I think an NFO pod cast would bring some of you talented people to life.

First of all, let me thank many of you who see where I am coming from and respect me for what I do.

Secondly, let me thank you who disagree for being decent and understanding all the same.

However, I will continue to state my opinions that:

Money and art do not mix.

An independent artist with limited money cannot make it in the music business unless his message is deemed "cool" by the powers that be.

It costs way too much money for a regular Joe to have great equipment, and guys like Beau who bust their tail at the gigs shouldn't have to in order to get "recognized" by radio and labels- I remain utopian in that way, and until it gets to that point for all of us, I will keep fighting.


Thanks for your opinions, folks.

Your friend,
Jason

Red said:

this is why we love RED so much...good 2 hear from u.

Loved the music part of surrender it was awesome I wish you would have sang though instead of talked but I mean the talking vibe is what you were going for so I understand where you were coming from

good work!

JD, to some degree, your Utopia IS occurring, but just not at ground zero.

I read an article today that Los Lonely Boys recorded their album (with the single "Heaven") at Willie Nelson's recording studio, using some good equipment but cutting lots of corners due to the limited budget. In fact, reading the article, I'm thinking, "they used less gear than i'm using today" - so, then, while they definitely used a studio that's above ground level basement studios, they didn't make that record in L.A. at the Power Station or the Hit Factory.

Additionally, I read an article last week about Cake. After recording four or five records in big-league recording studios in L.A., they decided to do this new record at home, on Pro-Tools, using a Mac G3, (which is now 2 generations old. Most people will tell you that a G3 is too old to record with) and they did it themselves, no engineer, no producer.

In the interview they said "we got tired of paying tons of money watching an engineer who's mind was a million miles away, who was used to making hit records and didn't understand our vision" (about their stripped down sound) etc.

So it IS possible for the uncool unrich to put together something from almost nothing, which is at least more than you can say about the industry 15 years ago.

Red ...

Yep, I've been reading a lot about the pod cast. I remember you post, just haven't had time to keep up with apple's butt load of releases.

Now, I'm trying to figure out how to hook the phone through computer to record these type interviews.

NFO radio will be cool.

Great thread, y'all. A real education for me here.

I made a beat 4 U JD. Comin as soon as buy the convertor at LEAST by this next week!