And what have white people been doing to us every day of our existance here? We've been put down and put into catagories so that you can be looked upon as superior and you use all means that you can to justify it, for examples your bullish statistics and surveys. In the case of the song Family Name, you must not have LISTENED to the lyrics. It wasn't about calling out names, it was not being able to call out true names. Abe Lincoln, enlighten me about what had he done to warrant pride in Black people, and please don't give me the "he freed the slaves", because he didn't do it out of the kindness of his heart, he did it for political gain.
[This message was edited Fri May 23 19:14:16 PDT 2003 by CocoSweet]

whhhoooaaa there - wait a second, this aint about black and white at all...infact its not even about something taht involves Prince!!!

Prince is having a pop at the ENGLISH etc (which is quite ironic as he has taht song called xenophobia!!!) hes not saying anything about teh whites keeping black down etc,,its just psychos like Nupwrsoul trying to stir up racial hatred again (and succeeding too).

Please get off you high horses about how bad the blacks were treated years ago...you think that whites are proud of that? no but theres nothing that we can do to change the past. In the words of your MASTER 'letitgo'.

And lets not forget that Prince embraces those things that he now claims to hate...he drives around in BMWs,wears Italian silk etc etc...so where would Prince be now without Europe...but naked and hitching a lift!!!

Oh yeah, one other thing if you still wanna go down that road...when did you last see Prince dating a black girl?
[This message was edited Sat May 24 9:29:22 PDT 2003 by purpledoveuk]

rdhull said:

A "representation"???
damn, praising incest and praising the mind of a woman are 2 entirely different things.

And as for sister being hailed... NOT by me, nor have I ever seen someone do that here on the org.


Not by me and as it look likes like soon by nobody else--
[This message was edited Sat May 24 15:13:49 PDT 2003 by Abrazo]

purpledoveuk said:

Wow I must have hit a nerve, huh? I didn't stir anything that wasn't already in the pot, dig?

As I have said to Abrazo(who's not a racist) in private, I will state here: I liked it better when I didn't know what color any of you were. Whether Prince wanted his lyrics to be divisive or not, unfortunately that is the case. I wish he would address it, but in a way, he has by taking down those lyrics in the VS room. At least, that why I hope he took them down. I don't believe that every white person who takes offense with those lyrics is racist. I have a freind who happens to be white who took offense to Family Name and Avalanche lyrics and I know for a fact there isn't a racist bone in her body. I feel the same way I did when I read the lyrics to Avalanche, Family Name and Muse To The Pharaoh. By them being open to interpretation, it leaves them subject to be misunderstood. When some political figures say or write things that can be misconstrued as racist, anti-semite or whatever, they usually come forward to say something. Yes, I know Prince does or says what he wants and I am in no way trying to stifle his creativity but I think this whole situation is sad and needs to be addressed by him.

on a side note, i'd like to officially state that i fucking LOVE the song sister, in all its twisted glory. this song is where i learned that a blowjob didn't mean blow.

purpledoveuk said:

Oh lawd, let's not get into this again.



I know, God forbid if any other country/continent produced fabrics or cars.



Oh, I don't know maybe, his wife Mani!

Forgive my ignorance but I had no idea Prince's wife was black.

Nupwsoul - Im sure there are still many people who have a prejudice against blacks,asian,whites etc and no doubt tehre will be some people on here.

But what I really cant understand,and maybe I havent read the post properly, but I thought this just started out as people saying,quite reasonably, that they didnt find the lyrics 'appropriate' as it single out Europeans in a negative way...and its not as though it was a defensive attack (ie against slavery or black-haters) as Prince,as far as I know, has no connection with the Spanish Moors.

But then it seemed to quickly attract responses that accused whites of having a "Yes, dance nigga dance, sing nigga sing. Tha's all you were good for anyway" attitude.

My feeling was that I didnt think it was appropraite to isolate a good majorty of his fanbase with such an outright attack. Even if it wasnt meant in an offensive way that is beside the point..it was taken as offensive - therefore it is.

Mani isnt black!!!

fairlite said:

WRONG!! Oppression is as covert as ever...it has taken on a new guise and is STILL alive and kicking.

purpledoveuk, thank you for articulating my feelings on the matter. nupwrsoul, it was in response to one of my posts that you said the "sing nigga sing, dance nigga dance" comment or whatever it was, and it was hurtful and unfounded.

purpledoveuk said:

Prince's lyrics suggest a personal epiphany moreso than something historically exhaustive, and they're also romanticized. But what art isn't?

No doubt, the poem needs work -- perhaps somewhat for content and context, but moreso for artistry. (Hence the "incomplete" qualification.) Yet despite its provincial shortcomings, I'm actually glad to see Prince exploring his cultural roots in lieu of dancing around in a bikini and garter belt singing about being reincarnated as a dolphin.

Cultural self-actualization happens in phases. Just ask rapper KRS-ONE or research psychologist William Cross (do a Google search for his Nigresence model). At a point, it reaches a level tantamount to little more than cultural cheerleading (the justification of which is another matter), but the fruit of a successful journey can be illuminating both for a person and the people with whom he/she comes into contact. In the interim, the process can be slow and sometimes uncomfortable for those on the outside looking in, but importantly a person has every right to explore that part of himself, sometimes erring on the side of brashness, totally unapologetically. Prince is a big boy, and he's proven he can deal with his own consequences.

For those of you who don't like where Prince is, you're certainly free to jump ship. It's self-defeating to uphold him as a historical authority or ally to all of your political sensibilities, anyway. After all, he's only professed to be a talented artist... and not one who belongs to any one of us. From that standpoint, it might be interesting to stick around, though. Despite sometimes reaching to downright bizarre and offensive notions of race, nationalism, allegiance, etc., artists like Sun Ra and Richard Wagner, for example, offered wonderful legacies and terribly provocative work where personal politics met music.

Incidentally, Prince's strivings aren't nearly as fantastical as Sun Ra's or Wagner's. I think certain people should take a chill pill and simply let Prince find himself.

...And, by the way, the idea that NuPwrSoul is a psycho or racist is so amusing it gives me an erection.

Some of us really should find more mature ways to disagree.

It came from the deep to terrorise ur neighbourhood...it's...

THE THREAD THAT WON'T DIE

well I suppose that depends on how you define psycho - if it isnt a word to describe an obsessive and worryingly single minded person...then I apologise.

Anyway enuff of the name calling - hasnt this thread gone on long enuff now (says me...making it even longer )

Lammastide said:

I'M SAYIN...

Anyone who didn't know Prince was a total wack job, must be one themselves. Prince used to be an awesome musician, but without the good music, he's just a retard. And now his music isn't even good, so what's the point in giving him the time of day?

He's obviously been brainwashed by certain people, and now all he is is a puppet with a hand so far up his ass, he doesn't know who he is anymore.

My advice, appreciate who he used to be and stop wasting your money to support his bullshit. If he's ever gonna get the hint, he needs to see it from a massive amount of fans.

Ignore him, he just wants attention.

I was 16 in 1987 and dorming in a religious high school with strict rules forbidding "secular" music when I bought a "bootleg" radio - small enough to hide away but not big enough to actually tape off of the radio. I'd stay up until 2 or 3 am, just waiting for the local pop station to play "Sign O' The Times."

Already a "fan" for 4 years or so, SOTT changed me: It helped me broaden my view of the world and of music. It made me realize how much Prince was developing as an artist.

He was taking on heavy topics: AIDS,Gang Violence, Drug Abuse, Natural Disasters, Abortion/Infanticide, The "Star Wars" missile defense and A-Bomb fears...and he wasn't being preachy. He was just telling it like it was.

To quote a different Prince song:
"All good things they say never last"


Bluemoodz

i think i made this up when i was about 5 or summin.

My best lyrics ever.

Hey diddle diddle the cat did a piddle,
the cow jumped over the loo.
the little dog laughed to see the bum,
and the dish ran away with the poo.

im not into religion, but must say that some of the more recent stuff P is writing is becoming to religious for my liking.

But thats why we all have opinions and are able to express them. I just choose to ignore the stuff i dont like which may be nieve but i dont want to be preached to.

Delores said:

Amen Delores!

I might be a little late replying to this cuz this forum has been up a while now,... but I am still gonna.

I see where Prince is coming from, but I thought there was only one race? "The Human race?" I can still hear him in my mind where he says: "It don't matter if you're red, white, brown, yellow or green, there is only one race. the Human Race"

And now he is stating that Africans are better and that Europeans have done it all wrong? I agree that some people in this world are not handling things very well. But among these people is also the American President. So let's please focus on various people who are handling their business the wrong way, rather than sticking a lable on it with a RACE.

And I know what he is trying to say, but I am not liking it. I don't like how he is too PRO-black people and sounding too much ANTI-white people. If he is so PRO-human race, then just write lyrics about that. Love4oneanother. that is what it is,...right? Or did he change that name too? Into DissOneAnother?

Puh-lease. My stomach just started hurting. I agree with you Delores. Prince, my man, if you are reading this. I love you for your music,...so keep doing what you're good at... Make your music. And if you choose to write your songlyrics about History, please make sure you know all sides of the (hi)story.

(oh and please don't think I am ANTI-black, or against Africans or anything like that. Hell, don't give me a label at all.)

I just don't like to hear: "If this great African culture were alive 2day We’d b 400 years more advanced."

What is important now, is that WE ALL need to make this world a better place for ourselves and our children. I guess time is spent better on that goal, rather than to point fingers to the past. Cuz remember,... when pointing a finger in the other direction, three fingers are always pointing back at you....

Peace
[This message was edited Fri May 30 5:37:00 PDT 2003 by billyjackbitch]

If this great African culture were alive 2day We’d b 400 years more advanced, and tickets 2 see Prince would not b $75 4 the back row, and $125 4 the chance to wait in line 8 hours 4 the chance 2 b in the first 2 rows.

(Just wanted 2 poke a little fun, with all of this "serious" talk)

great prince, more over the top religous fervor just what i wanted to hear for funks sake.

jimipaisley said:

The mans just doing what hes always done, making music for himself. I cant imagine that his music is in the CD players of JWs around the world & now we cant relate to what hes on about anymore.

Good lawd, folks should be glad the person they spend so much time listening to has a real brain and the guts to speak even unpopular truths.
I'm thrilled he broke down some of the Moor/African stuff and can't wait to hear how he put it to music, assuming a release will follow on the site.
Sad how some resort to the "we're all the same/we're all African anyway'' argument when something seems to put black people and black history in a more truthful, positive light.
NuPwrSoul is on point, as usual.

I aint gonna argue...but none of the disagreements had anything to do with how the lyrics portrayed black people...it was about the way they portrayed a very select few.

Paradise4evr said:

Ras Kass--Nature of the Threat (1996)

theblueangel said:

Ras Kass is extremely homophobic, and his understanding of history is definitely warped. For the record, I disagree with most of the song.

However, he makes some good cultural critiques in it... especially about the relationship between Christianity and white oppression.

Prince's lyrics look 4th-grade compared to those IMHO.