just in case you didn't know, your membership will be renewed automatically. If you are not happy with the membership you have to cancel the account before the renewal date. I am so so disapointed. I am out.

I'll make that decision in 8 months from now. We still have 9 months left. We may not be seeing anything now but i still have faith that something good will come our way.
[Edited 5/27/09 20:25pm]

profratigan said:

i dont care what comes my way now...the fact he obviously doesn't care about it is enough for me.sporadic updates are not what i want...just a bit of consistency..even something once a week would have held my interest.

This sad excuse 4 a website won't be around in a year.

billyjackuoff said:

That's not something for us to worry about, it's really the concern of LotusFlow3r.com.

Making unauthorised charges to credit cards is very definitely illegal, just because they hold the CC details of members does not entitle them to use them.

It doesn't matter what 'automatic renewal' bullshit is written in their T&C's, it's still illegal to charge a CC without consent. Signing up for a one year membership does not give them consent to make further charges, it means that at the end of the year you either consent to a renewal, or your membership is not renewed. There's no such thing as automatic or assumed consent.

If the LotusFlow$r developers are still following things around here then they would do well to take some advice here and get their legal team on it. Prince likely won't be very happy if his latest online venture becomes the subject of multiple fraud investigations - which is exactly what will happen if illegal CC charges are made.

AsylumUtopia said:

If you agree to the terms and conditions when you sign up, then it is legal to charge your credit card again if that is, in fact, in their terms. That's why it's important to read all the fine print when signing up for something.

My AAA membership automatically renews every year. My card on file with Netflix gets automatically charged every month, as well as my newspaper subscription and monthly tea club. They never ask me, they just run the charge because it is what I agreed to to begin with. My agreement with the original terms was my consent for future charges.

Graycap23 said:

Brother man had good intentions..but his attention span is way too short to make something like this work. I hate to say it but we got hosed
[Edited 5/27/09 8:58am]

dustysgirl said:

Really? That surprises me. I guess it never occured to me that that might be the case, as I would never use a credit card for repeating charges. That's what direct debits are for. Any time I've paid by CC for a yearly membership to anything, there's always been a renewal process during which I must give my consent for another charge to be made (including the AA - our equivalent of the AAA).

In any event I don't think it'll be a problem because either

I'll cancel my membership on the last day, thus avoiding any hassle

or

LotusFlow3r,com is already flagged by Mastercard from their initial transaction, so I will be notified of any future attempted transactions and will have the opportunity to consent to them or deem them fraudulent.

But more than likely I won't have to worry about it because :

Graycap23 said

AsylumUtopia said:

Actually it does! The legally binding reason being...if you checked the box agreeing to it...you gave them your consent and agreed to their terms of service. So come march next year, they will have every right to charge anyone who checked that box and agreed to the TOS accordingly.

AsylumUtopia said:[quote]

dustysgirl said:

You probably will not be contacted in any way about the renewal. You will have to be aware of the date and make sure you either cancel your account or stay on. Many pay-for sites are like this.

superspaceboy said:[quote]

AsylumUtopia said:

Just a little FYI - they won't have to wait until the 24th of March to do it. Since the site is yearly and the exact date is so close to the end of the month, they will be able to make that charge anytime during the month of March.

You don't have to take my word on it, call your credit card companies and ask them.

superspaceboy said:

No, I will be. As I said LotusFlow3r.com is flagged. They cannot make further charges to my card without me first consenting to it.

AsylumUtopia said:

Is that the English AA? I'm a member and get charged automatically. They send me a letter in advance of the renewal, but I don't have to do anything for the charge to be made.

popgodazipa said:

The road to HELL is paved with good intentions!!!!

jstar69 said:

...and Rasinets

I would most definitely contact the LF administrators about your desire to not be automatically renewed ASAP. Let them know that you are also contacting your CC company as well. Get a confirmation email. These auto-renewals can be a pain to cancel, and who knows how long it will take for the LF admins to respond. You can always... I have a hard time saying this... re-subscribe in the future.

it's on my calendar. the first of the March... just in case. $77 is a lot of duckets to just let happen.

If you selected automatic renewal when you signed up, it will be automatically renewed. If you didn't, it won't! if you've changed your mind during the process - write LF. Jeeeeez - storms, teacups?

karryflower said:

Exactly! but I bet some people were all excited when they joined and can't remember (like with the T-shirt size pull down thing). Maybe site support can add a line oin the member account dashboard to say whether you are set for auto renewal or not.

TheEnglishGent said:

It's AA Ireland, which as far as I know is the same company. I assume they offer the same option here. I also assume that option was offered to me and I declined, although, my memory being as faultless as it is, I really have no idea. I must've though, as I don't get auto-renewed.

karryflower said:

I don't remember there being a choice, but again, that's just my wonderful memory. I had a look at the T&C's which read:

Automatic renewal is available for Lotusflow3r memberships. If automatic renewal is selected at purchase your credit card will be billed on an annual basis, unless you cancel automatic renewal prior to the renewal date by emailing sales@Lotusflow3r.

That being the case, faulty memory or no, I'm certain I wouldn't have signed up for auto-renewal.

Still though, it would be helpful if they just included that information on the 'personal dashboard' - there's plenty of room for additional info on there.


And as for storms, teacups?


Well, there's so much going on at LotusFlow$r that we have to make our entertainment somehow. And you know how much we love storms in teacups around here. Remember all the wailing and gnashing of teeth when the videos we're choppy - when the simple notion of pressing pause and waiting for it to buffer didn't seem to occur.

We like molehills too.

AsylumUtopia said:

To be honest, I can't remember what I selected either - but IF the site is still around come March 2010, I'll consider it then. If I get fed up with the site at some point I may contact LF to ensure that my account is not on automatic renewal. But as you point out, it's in the TnC's (which is also where I found it) - our accounts are not necessarily on automatic renewal. and if they were...well, they couldn't be without the customer's consent (exactly the same as with any other business that operates automatic renewal schemes). Is there a biscuit to go with that tea?


Oh, British Telecom does it too. it's not even an option with them when you sign up (but it is in the TnC's which you have to agree to when signing up). Instead they send out a letter a month or so before the renewal, giving the customer the option of opting out.
[Edited 5/28/09 4:17am]

karryflower said:

Excuse me! I know I'm a resident hater and was too cheap to just let Prince keep milking me and all but damn...didn't I say...



I try to be helpful and I'm ignored! I bet if I had said Prince is going to rip all of you mofos off next March, you'd have noticed that!

HatrinaHaterwitz said:[quote]

karryflower said:

Awww You're not ignored! But strictly speaking there IS an option to opt out...it's in the TnC's

"Automatic renewal is available for Lotusflow3r memberships. If automatic renewal is selected at purchase your credit card will be billed on an annual basis, unless you cancel automatic renewal prior to the renewal date by emailing sales@Lotusflow3r."

HatrinaHaterwitz said:

I wasn't ignoring you either. I read what you said and was going to respond saying that I didn't remember whether or not I was given the option. Then I sort of assumed that you were talking about checking a box agreeing to the T&C's (which of course we had to do), not one agreeing to auto-renewal.

Prince won't wait 'til next March, there'll be plenty of opportunities for him to rip us off between now and then. I'm guessing the next updates to the site will be '�Premium� material, which is available to purchase on a per-item basis.'

(btw I didn't put those question marks � around Premium - it was directly cut and pasted from the LotusFlow$r T&C's. I happen to agree with it though, whether or not any material to be made available to purchase on a per-item basis will actually be 'Premium' is questionable)

AsylumUtopia said:

LOL! You are aware that talk like that around here makes you a hater, right?

Welcome aboard!

.
[Edited 3/21/10 3:24am]

Billmenever said:

I don't know you but I sure do like your style! Your screen name is the bomb, your profile is a trip, your avatar is all kinds of wrong and you joined the Org on my birthday, seven years ago!

I'm HatrinaHaterwitz...it's so nice to finally meet you!
[Edited 5/28/09 7:41am]

profratigan said:

I was starting to think I was the only one who thought this way. Thank you for letting me I'm not the only one with this hope.