funkteer said:

I don't know that many people who'd pay good money for a service and then not be rude and condescending when a) they don't get what they paid for and b) they can demonstrate that the person responsible doesn't have a clue what they're doing and is potentially putting their master's revenue at risk (letting ppl download files direct without security) and potentially putting confidential information at risk.
But then others just say thanks and ask for more. And then others just give up and never come back. Takes all kinds.



A - people decrying bart sometimes exhibit the same behavior they say he has (being rude and condescending about someone), so pot, kettle, etc
B - he's factually correct, which at least is acknowleged by some. People can't prove him wrong, so they attack the style. Pretty weak discussion tactic, and on par with what they claim to not want in these forums.
C - when did the org turn itself into the official prince site? There is no "relationship" with prince going on here, just with other posters.
D - I'm like you, here for entertainment purposes, and bart's posts and assorted replies are usually way more entertaining that some purple spinning globe. And it's free! Honestly, which users do you remember, bart, or the sycophants who don't really have anything to say?



And for this specific thread, people can just read the first post for updates, no need to read through pages and pages looking for bart

kitkatau said:

Give me a break.

[Edited 3/28/09 23:22pm]

kitkatau said:

The others are probably ignorant, mostly un-critical and maybe not so persevering.
You A and B points are strong. These don't give you a right to be rude but at least to wonder why stuff hasn't improved since his previous sites.

And yes, we will remember Bart's comments and the lotusflow3r site events that caused them.

Bart is just stating the obvious: Who's fault will it be when all the links start to make way onto all the forums??

UPDATE: Un-f-ing-believable! The links to the files are completely unsecure and even someone that is not a complete techy (me) can find them by just searching around firefox!


[Edited 3/29/09 3:22am]

funkteer said:

Sure: http://www.youtube.com/wa...cUF3vGgwNc

I disagree COMPLETELY with most everything Bart has to say about Prince's music.

But as far as this site goes, he is VERY MUCH ON POINT. I think people need to rise above their emotional responses to Bart's condescending tone and mockery, and read exactly what he is saying.

If you're interested in Prince offering the best, being the best out there, then his people should take heed.

There are many problems still with this site technically and operationally.

The music is great, the Coachella vidoes (esp) are great, and the chance to get presale tickets to concerts are great. But those things don't cover up these major problems with the site.

TwiliteKid said:

No, they didn't. For the vast majority of months in the first year, the NPGMC did not fulfill the MINIMUM requirements it promised paying members. Exapmle: for one month all they gave was a lo-fi MP3 of TRC (granted, before it was released). In one other month they gave for instance an MP3 ripped from a cassette of an already released track.

The delivered product may not have been what people assumed they would get, but no one was ripped off.

TwiliteKid said:

I can't be arsed to look it up, maybe it was a later version of the NPGMC, but at one time Prince had a website that was locked off from the outside: you had to be a member to get beyond the front page. Stupid stupid stupid.

2elijah said:

Because I want him to BE BETTER. It's people like you that are PART OF THE PROBLEM, whereas it's people like me who get some sort of improvement. The same thing happened with NPGMC v1: people like you swallowed up all the nonsense from Prince's site, while people like me were bitching about crappy MP3s and crappy videos. Guess what happened? MP3s got replaced, ditto videos.

Do you think you'd see updates from Scott here if there wasn't a shitstorm pouring down on him? Why won't people like you WAKE UP and at least admit that people like me a) know what we're talking about and b) have provided ideas and suggestions that would lead to a vastly improved user experience? Why do you feel the need to oppose those fans who are working FOR you? Why are you so obsessed with ME and whether I'm a fan?

2elijah said:

No they're not, otherwise you would have listed them here. Go on, find proof. Should be easy, right?

2elijah said:

Oh for crying out loud, I barely spend time on the Org, it's just that now there's a new album & site coming out that I'm a bit more active. Hell, I probably would have posted just a handful of comments if the site had just been crap, but this is just a fortress of FAIL and Scott just keeps making things worse.

And if this place was like the NIN fan forum Echoing The Sound (and most fans were like the fans there), then I wouldn't even have needed to post any or my "rants",simply because other fans would have already done it. Oh, and Trent would have read those comments and acted upon them. Imagine that, an artist who cares about what his fans say!

But in Prince world I'm the big evil guy who hates Prince, yet some obsessed fan who's been banned from just about any fan forum gets invited to Prince's house. No, I'm not jealous, I don't wanna visit Prince in LA, but if I'd been there, you can bet your ass that either you wouldn't be looking at lotusflow3r.com like it is today, or you would have read a major story on how Prince behaved like a total ass to a fan who pointed out flaws in his website. Because I'm not the kind of fool who'd tell a reporter from the Huffington Post that "this night will change your life".

I wanted to respond to the problems with the Lotusflow3r website and the support team. Last Night at the LA concert I had the pleasure of meeting Scott and his collegue and they explained some of the issues that we as fans were having thru the site. Scott was very intersted in the issues and concerned about how people responded on this site about Prince. My husband and I spoke with them for quite sometime and I truly believe they are working very hard to fix everything. They didn't have to talk to me as long as they did, but they did and that has to account for something.

Nicewithav

kitkatau said:

I don't think that we don't have a right to point out the problems with the site. I have no idea what the ins and outs are of putting up a web site. All I am saying is that you can impress someone more with your genius, and your valid points without being rude. If you are a professional, write a professional critique or letter of concern. Maybe Prince will be impressed and he will hire you Bart .

NICEWITHAV said:

Might that include answering emails and fixing sales debacles? I think not.

1. I was able to download all three albums with ease through Firefox on Thursday. Two of the albums still needed tag help. Download the trial version of dBPowerAmp Music Converter from Download.com if you don't have anything to take care of that already (a lot of music players can do it).

2. I ponied up $80 additional dollars for two 1gb sticks of RAM on Wednesday. Thankfully, somebody alerted me to the not altogether clear sys req mention of 1gb of RAM being the minimum recommended. I had 512mb before, and could get the site to run, but it was wicked bad slow, and sometimes it just froze.

3. After installing just ONE of the new RAM sticks the site freakin' screams! The video globe is cool! Not a pain in the ass. The site is much easier to load and navigate, and it didn't stop me from doing other things on my PC at the same time. With 2gb installed everything is wonderful, I love my pc. Still really aggrivated that it wasn't made more clear that this was needed to begin with. And the videos still load sooooo sllllooooowwwwwlllllyyyyy that I haven't watched most of 'em. That's not your RAM, that's how they have the videos set up and how much bandwidth they have available. But the site does run indescribably better for me with joyous amounts of new RAM.

http://memoryten.com/ Great people, just call and ask questions if you don't know what you need. Then go back and order online because shipping is $1 per stick. I got mine in three days.

4. Hey Prince.org persons of authority and communicative abilities; would you please be so kind as to relay a message. I know that some people have received a message from support telling them that they've adjusted their t-shirt size because it was missed on sign-up. I however, have not. Could you please ask what we should do to best relay this request to them with the least amount of superfluous emailage? Many thanks if that's possible. Peas.

Sir.. that's ridiculous. You should NOT have to upgrade your PC just to visit a website. Wow.. If I were you, I'd be pissed. Seriously though...

This site is a gaudy, over-bloated piece of crap.

Cerebus said:

BartVanHemelen said:

Exactly, It's 2009 folks and they are sourcing many of the videos from VHS!!! and UNSECURE links to the 3 albums. That is just messed up. This is Prince! The greatest of all-time and P and his fans deserve the absolute best.

Cerebus said:

A fifth grader can tag MP3's, why can't someone in P's camp just tag the damn things so people don't have to screw around with having to tag the mp3s with artist/song/album???

realm said:

Indeed... from someone who's won awards and recognition for pioneering on the web, this website is a major step backwards.

It represents NO advancements in website design, interactivity, or functionality at all. At all. It makes no nods or accommodations to the increasingly mobile-only ways that people are accessing the web, offers no low-fi options, doesn't even provide mechanisms for inviting or encourage visitors through banners, and the list can go on and on.

It's almost like Prince does NOT want people coming to his site or subscribing. Oh well, I guess the upside is fewer people trying to get tickets???

NuPwrSoul said:

It's difficult placing an upside spin on it by saying its a POS and by being so you will get better tickets. I've been getting tickets my entire life by being early when they go on-sale.

IMO he just made the mistake of hiring the wrong guy for the job. Look at all the f-ups with the site. Where does the blame fall when someone gets hip to the links being unsecure and they spread to 1000's of forums??

Also you must wonder if the music that is P's isn't secure, just how secure is your credit card info?

ShadeoViolet said:

But that's no longer the point, is it? I paid $77 for a years membership. Unfortunately the site's launch was far less than stellar, but I'm still a member for a year. Also, a friend pointed out after the fact that if I had bothered to read the system requirements I would have seen they recommend 1GB RAM, minimum. It's not their fault that I didn't read the system requirements. The site runs great for me now - the only problem was MY lack of RAM. Last, I want to enjoy whatever happens with the site in the next year, as I know there will eventually be more content. Can't promise that I'll sign up again next year, yet.

Now was I mad at first? Yes. But I think I was pretty vocal about it, so there's no need to re-hash it. They've fixed some of the problems, they seem to be working on others, and a few are still being ignored. I will be watching (and waiting) to see what happens with that.

Strange how these problems pile up all of sudden especially whe things bgin 2 roll...

realm said:

I was being sarcastic with the tickets thing... but on the real, the best tickets I have ever gotten for a Prince show was through the NPGMC website. So I still consider it a plus.

Personally I think Prince suffers when he changes personnel as often as he does--he loses institutional history that could serve him well. Someone with the memory of the Tekadence fiasco would have seen some of these red flags up very early in the game. When Sam developed the NPGMC from NPGOnlineLTD he did so learning along the way until NPGMC was a pretty solid offering, and ticket sales handled very well.

The current webdesigners would have been well served consulting or even researching the prior issues that came up trying to design Prince's website, and could have avoided a lot of problems.

I don't expect Prince to be all up in the technical details... he offers a vision of what he wants and it's the responsibility of the designer to present the options with pluses/minuses for each option.

I have no idea if any of those things were done, so I am not going to place blame on any one party over the other.

We are where we are now... I'm a paid member, so it's in my interest for the site to continue to improve. With that in mind, the more issues that are flagged the better, if they're paying attention. And so far, they DO seem to be paying attention.

NuPwrSoul said:

Cool, yeah I agree. I think they got to pay attention, Scotts ass/reputation is on the block. Considering P complains about the internet being a black hole, it's laughable the above average porn site has better quality HD! video than P's own site.

Personally it felt like P lost interest over time at NPGMC and it was a void site. Not sure why?

As for whats going on now. I think it's terrible that the music isn't protected. Given P's stance on protecting his work. It's true what Bart said: you can easily find the direct links to the 3 different albums! Both formats. When they get in the wrong hands and spread to all the downloading forums, some heads may roll when it gets back to the P.

I haven't tried to find the direct links to the videos??? Is that possible Bart?

I received and email from "support" this evening letting me know that they changed the t-shirt size for me, and it included the word "apologies". Also, it's not a copied, form email, because I know what somebody else was told in theirs. Small gesture, yes - but it does go part of the way towards easing my negative feelings. The jury is still out on the website, though, so don't go slippin' now!

Support finally contacted me as well about my preferred t-shirt size.
I pleased that someone is addressing errors and complaints.

Cerebus said:

Yeah I just received a note too, confirming the size change. Not a form email either... they're trying. I give 'em credit for that.

Thing is that there's already been too many problems with that website.

- Difficulties with suscribing.
- Difficulties with downloading the albums.
- Difficulties with unzipping the albums.
- Difficulties with navigating inside the site.
- Difficulties with watching the videos (now they DO run properly but they just won't start & i have 2 releod the page, & type my login & password after each video in order 2 watch them one after the other!!!)
- Poor quality videos : Coacharella looks like a bootleg copy (but at least the sound is ok) & the Superbowl has only ONE speaker working, 4 chrissakes!!!
- & 2 make things worse : A poor choice of videos, with old promo videos that no one cares 4, TV shows that r widely circulating on every p2p, the same songs over & over again (2 "Purple Rain", 2 "Let's go crazy", 2 "Guitar": as if we didn't already have 100 versions of "Purple rain" & "Let's go crazy" anyway...) & only FIVE totally unreleased songs (including yet another version of "1999").

$77 ain't that much money, that's not the problem. The problem is that technically this is VERY unprofessionnal & that, knowing that Prince has a vault filled with unreleased songs & live recordings & footages, the choice of the content is HIGHLY disappointing 4 any fan.

2morrow'll b the end of the 1st week, i SINCERELY hope that we'll get additionnal videos or mp3's.

(& NO i'm no "hater", i've always supported Prince as a person & as an artist. it's just that this website's launch is nothing but a DISASTER!)

.
[Edited 3/30/09 1:41am]

AND ON TOP OF IT ALL!!!

I've just watched the Sacrifice of Victore & realized that it ain't complete: it lacks the end credits (& the Steeles song that goes with 'em).

BartVanHemelen said:

Whoa Dude, don't flatter yourself. I am not obsessed over you being a fan, I could careless about you actually. I commented to your post which I rarely do, because just like everyone else, you put your comments out there on a public forum for people to read and obviously respond to, so expect them to do that. I actually was very nice to you in asking the question, but obviously the question ticked off a sensitive nerve in you.
Funny though, how it seems you don't like others making assumptions about you, yet you're full of criticism of others. Carry on.
[Edited 3/30/09 13:18pm]

To Lotusflow3r web site people -

I don't know if it has been mentioned here (this is a long thread) and its just a small thing - can we have a "save to computer" Password and Username option please. For some of us its a real pain typing it in every time.

Any advice for getting round this - bring it on !


So far - although the colours are real pretty I am finding this site slow to load and clumsy
to navigate. It is time consuming which is frustrating. Music is good, Video's are fun but could U also identify the pictures other than with "View Image" even with just a number?

(I find the ball thing damn annoying but maybe thats just me )-

marks at present 3/10 but ...keep trying

L4OATheOriginal said:

Same here.I had no problems at all with the site at first.Now i cant listen 2 any track or watch any video without constant pauses.It takes the piss really that i paid £52 4 this & now i`m forced 2 go elsewhere on the web 2 access what should be on lotusflow3r.com.
However it`s still early days & i`m prepared 2 be patient.However until this is sorted i wont be reccommending the site 2 anybody.What with this & the less than positive reviews from the 3 shows on Saturday Prince must be a little peeved 2 say the least!!

Hold On 2 Ur Wigs!

The site designers are being interviewed on Joe Kelley, and it does sound like they've been making a strong effort over the last week to troubleshoot. For example, they indicated that they are going to make video content available in two different resolutions so that people with machines that can handle high-quality content can get it, and people with machines with lower specs or downloading can download something with less resolution (but easier to download).

You get a vibe of "accountability" from them, which I think is a good sign that the site will get better with time.