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Printablewellbeyond said: Aannastesia said: Club security at the front gate said he was confused about how the laminate thing worked and went to ask an NPGMC associate. She told him that there were no more free vip passes and that laminate or not I had to pay or not attend!!
To me, this pretty much sums it all up right here...poor communication and/or understanding between the HOB staff and the npgmc staff...and from only this statement, I'd say that the HOB staff was a bit more to blame than the npgmc since the guy at the front gate said he was "confused about how the laminate thing worked"...I mean, before you even go on the job and accept your first laminate that confusion should be nonexistent, and if there IS confusion in your mind then it's your responsibility to clear it up BEFORE you start...the HOB staff member obviously didn't put much importance into understanding the club rules, at least not by what Aanna wrote right here... The other thing that sticks out is this: "At the HOB, it was considered a seperate concert and not an afterparty."... If this is the case, then nothing within the rules about aftershows applies here...if it's treated like another seperate concert, then yeah, they can legally do it exactly like they do the presales--in which a certain number of seats to the HOB concert(not 'aftershow') are reserved for a member and one guest...once they're taken up, then you gotta fight with the rest of the people for a seat, no matter if you're a member or not... An apology from the npgmc for the confusion would have been great...a refund would have been next to impossible, however...and not because it's "Prince"(that's a weak excuse for some of you guys to use), but simply because providing a refund to a club member for something they may not have a legal responsibility for could open them up to all sorts of claims... . [This message was edited Sun May 5 0:58:49 PDT 2002 by wellbeyond] Aannastesia replies: "A rose by any other name will .....still have thorns." Regardless, if they wanted to call this an afterparty or a seperate show still doesn't address why some members and their guests were given members only perks while actual members had to ante up. I see it as the responsibility of the NPGMC to make sure all their members are taken care of equally. The staffers at the HOB were just doing their job as they would do any other night. What do they know of the NPGMC??? They should have recieved clear instruction from the staff of the NPGMC as to giving those with laminates VIP status. Ultimately, it was not the HOB who denied me admittance, in fact, dude even went the extra mile to seek out an NPGMC staffer in order to get clearance allowing him to let me in sans covercharge. It was the b*t*h staffer for the NPGMC that looked right at me as she told him, No more free admissions. As I attempted to politely protest, b*tch just did an about face and walked away ignoring me completely. HOB dude came back to the gate and apologized, told me he was just doing his job and that he has no authority on this. How can you expect the HOB to be responsible for anything that is NPGMC related??? HOB employees are responsible to the HOB. Their loyalty is to their employer, their assignment is to watch the doors of the club, their motivation is the making happy the dude/tte that signs their paycheck. The NPGMC is ,likewise ,responsible to their club members. Essentially, we as the members are the ones that ultimately sign the NPGMC staffers paychecks. It was their job to take care of their paying members, their job to make sure the doormen were understanding of membership priviledges. In my eyes, holding the HOB responsible for this mishap is paramount to, umm let's say ok..... a movie theatre denying enterance to a movie goer with a free pass to that theatre and then the pass holder complaining to the landlord that holds that theatres lease.  Life Sexy u all life Sexy u all | |
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Aannastesia said: "A rose by any other name will .....still have thorns."
Regardless, if they wanted to call this an afterparty or a seperate show still doesn't address why some members and their guests were given members only perks while actual members had to ante up. No different than me saying "why did some members and their guests get to buy their tickets early as where I had to wait until the general ticket sale??" when they run out of pre-sale seats...(which I think they said in one of their emails)...just like in every other concert(I think you're still having the mentality that it was an aftershow), the music club reserves a set number of seats that members and their guests can use...once they're used up, you're treated like any other non-member, plain and simple...every concert has been this way, and the concert at the HOB seems to have been handled in the exact same way. I see it as the responsibility of the NPGMC to make sure all their members are taken care of equally.
Do you still see it that way if there are members who can't buy tickets during the presale because they run out of presale seats??...If not, then you shouldn't be seeing the HOB situation any differently...if so, then you don't quite understand how the club presale tix work...lol The staffers at the HOB were just doing their job as they would do any other night. What do they know of the NPGMC???
Sorry, but you're making excuses for the HOB staff that they don't warrant, at least not from what you told us...the guy seemed "confused" and didn't bother to even get clarification until you showed up??...HELLO!!..lol...It's their responsibility to KNOW what's going on cuz it's their venue!!...It's their place!!...If ANY employee goes on duty not knowing what they're supposed to be doing, it's THEIR responsibility to let their supervisors KNOW they don't, not just shrug and say "whoops"... They should have recieved clear instruction from the staff of the NPGMC as to giving those with laminates VIP status.
You dont' know that they didn't...you assume they didn't, but they may have recieved clear and specific instruction, but just fucked it up anyway...happens ALL the time...remember when you thought I was calling you a hypocrite on the thread about hiring a hit man for Larry Graham??..lol...I thought I was being extremely clear, but you misunderstood me...as long as humans are working for both, misunderstandings will occur... Ultimately, it was not the HOB who denied me admittance, in fact, dude even went the extra mile to seek out an NPGMC staffer in order to get clearance allowing him to let me in sans covercharge. It was the b*t*h staffer for the NPGMC that looked right at me as she told him, No more free admissions.
It's not the b*t*h staffer at npgmc who sets the number of allowable club members in, though...it's the people who run the venues who do that...like I said, you're WAY too eager to write off the HOB's role in all of this...why??... As I attempted to politely protest, b*tch just did an about face and walked away ignoring me
completely. So is this a complaint about one woman's rudeness, or a complaint about what should and should not have happened concerning you paying??...If it's the former, you'll get no argument from me(although I doubt a woman's walking away from me without talking to me would cause me much aggrevation)...if it's the latter, then I think you're still missing the point... HOB dude came back to the gate and apologized, told me he was just doing his job and that he has no authority on this.
How can you expect the HOB to be responsible for anything that is NPGMC related??? Will try this again, and this is just from what the npgmc's emails said...This was NOT an aftershow, so fuck all the "aftershow policies"....this was a concert...so go with that...being a separate concert, it means that there will be a limited number of seats available as "perks" for club members to have access to...the number of seats was dictated FAR more by the HOB than by the staffers at the npgmc...hardly matters whether you want to believe it or not, it's the truth...read this part again from their email to you: "they allowed us 2 let in a specific amount of members 4 free, after that, we couldn't let in anymore."....Emphasis on "THEY", meaning the HOB set a specific amount to the number of members allowed, NOT the npgmc...so that's how the HOB can be "responsible for anything npgmc related"... HOB employees are responsible to the HOB. Their loyalty is to their employer, their assignment is to watch the doors of the club, their motivation is the making happy the dude/tte that signs their paycheck.
The NPGMC is ,likewise ,responsible to their club members. Essentially, we as the members are the ones that ultimately sign the NPGMC staffers paychecks. I like how the HOB employees are responsible to their employer, but the npgmc employees are responsible to us!..lol...  Why aren't the HOB employees responsible to the patrons of the HOB??..afterall, it's the partrons who ultimately sign their paychecks, too...
It was their job to take care of their paying members
And they did that... their job to make sure the doormen were understanding of membership priviledges.
And the DOORMAN'S job to make sure HE understood his duties, and to let someone KNOW if he didn't...your own post made it clear that when you got there, he was "confused" about the "laminate thing"...did he suddenly get confused right when YOU showed up, or was he confused ALL ALONG??...If he was, then why didn't he get that confusion cleared up??... Once again, you're bending over backwards to portray the HOB staff members as completely guilt free...why? In my eyes, holding the HOB responsible for this mishap is paramount to, umm let's say ok.....
a movie theatre denying enterance to a movie goer with a free pass to that theatre and then the pass holder complaining to the landlord that holds that theatres lease. ?????...lol..Um, no...it would be like complaining to the person who GAVE you the free pass that the theatre didn't let you in for free when they should have....I don't know about you, but I would be complaining to the manager of the theatre, NOT to the person who gave me the pass... | |
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I'm goin' to bed so I'll bottom-line this...lol
A) If the HOB show was a separate concert, then this is what the npgmc needed to do to stay consistent: Set aside a limited number of seats to be made available to members and their guests on a first-come, first-served basis...once those limited number of "seats" are snatched up, then any member who comes along afterwards will not be able to take advantage of that specific member perk...this is what they do during the presale...and this is what they did at the HOB. So to me, if the HOB show was a separate concert and not an aftershow, they did indeed stay consistent. B) If the HOB show was an aftershow, then this rule from the npgmc site applies: "Every afterparty will have it's own arrangements depending on the situation. But u must have the laminate 2 get member access 2 whatever is set up. Members can bring one guest with their laminate that can line up with them. However, while the member typically gets in free, the guest must pay the cover charge." To me, certain things stick out... 1) Every afterparty will have its own arrangement depending on the situation....Meaning? There is no "set standard" as to how member perks for after parties/aftershows are handed out or handled, or even what they will be. 2) You must have the member laminate to get access to whatever the set-up is on that night...Meaning? Having a laminate does NOT guarantee you'll get a member "perk", because there is no "set standard" as to what the perk will BE...but whatever that perk is, you won't be able to get it without your laminate. 3) Members can bring one guest with their laminate, but the guest will have to pay to get in....Meaning? The npgmc can/will only guarantee free entry to npgmc members--and that's not even guaranteed("the member typically gets in free")--so be prepared for your guest to have to pay the cover charge...and you might even have to as well. The confusion?..#1: "Every afterparty will have its own arrangement depending upon the situation"...that little ditty right there basically says "we can't tell you in advance what membership perks will be made available to you...all we can say is that there will be some type of membership perk in action." Was there a membership perk at the HOB?...Yep...the first "X"-number of members(and apparently their guests) will be allowed in for free...as long as you had the chance of being one of those "X"-number of members who showed up first, then the membership perk was indeed made available to you... The npgmc can't control whether or not you show up early enough to take advantage of the perk...they can only make the perk available...which they did. Truthfully, the npgmc didn't do anything wrong, or at least not anything illegal or unethical... While it would have been nice if they had shown more concern and empathy with your complaint, your first email to the npgmc wasn't about wanting clarification as to what happened...it was a request for a refund of your $50.00...so they responded in a more "legalese" way because of it, basically pointing out why they felt you weren't entitled to one. Anyway, you really wanted to know what we all thought(Title of your thread...lol)...so that's what I think... | |
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wellbeyond said:
?????...lol..Um, no...it would be like complaining to the person who GAVE you the free pass that the theatre didn't let you in for free when they should have....I don't know about you, but I would be complaining to the manager of the theatre, NOT to the person who gave me the pass... LOL...Ummm...you are a bit confused I did not say that the landlord was the one who gave out the free passes. I said: "In my eyes, holding the HOB responsible for this mishap is paramount to, umm let's say ok..... a movie theatre denying enterance to a movie goer with a free pass to that theatre and then the pass holder complaining to the landlord that holds that theatres lease. meaning that the free passes were given out as a promotion for their current showing and then not honored. ok let's try this.... you are issued a check ... you take it to the bank it is drawn on and they do not honor it... they tell you oh sorry ....we have given out enough of this guys money... hell we even gave money to the friends of this guy that weren't even issued a check .... so he has no more money to give to you.... 
do you fight with the bank or take it up with the person that issued you the check??? Life Sexy u all life Sexy u all | |
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Saxjedi said: Clearly they ower you a refund of $50 that you shouldn't have been charged. If they are claiming the charge was appropriate, well, what exactly is the value of membership again?
If a concert has a $50 ticket price, I don't think free admittance is a "perk" to which members are entitled. We only pay $100 for the membership... and that $100 is predominantly for the music we are to eventually receive. The free-soundcheck and free-afterparty perks were never intended to be of a $50 retail value scale. In that sense (based on the ticket prices), the HOB shows were concerts where Prince planned to play a "show"; they were not the spontaneous (and usually quite brief) afterparty performances for which members should have free access. By the way, if membership did entitle you to free admittance at shows like the ones at HOB... then these shows would simply cease to exist because the club could never break even. No Candy 4 Me | |
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The way I see it is HOB is going to only give NPG a percent of the capacity of the venue as comps.What is the capacity of HOB?
HOB had it wrong to let the members guest in free.Remember this is LA..how many celebs were able to access the club without paying? They keep a count, after the quota is filled, they start charging for the house. Your questions were answered by someone who wasn 't there, and doesn't work for HOB, and didn't have any control over HOB's policy. It was just rotten luck and HOB should refund you.They screwed up. my 2cents, ksda sky BanishedBrian said: Saxjedi said: Clearly they ower you a refund of $50 that you shouldn't have been charged. If they are claiming the charge was appropriate, well, what exactly is the value of membership again?
If a concert has a $50 ticket price, I don't think free admittance is a "perk" to which members are entitled. We only pay $100 for the membership... and that $100 is predominantly for the music we are to eventually receive. The free-soundcheck and free-afterparty perks were never intended to be of a $50 retail value scale. In that sense (based on the ticket prices), the HOB shows were concerts where Prince planned to play a "show"; they were not the spontaneous (and usually quite brief) afterparty performances for which members should have free access. By the way, if membership did entitle you to free admittance at shows like the ones at HOB... then these shows would simply cease to exist because the club could never break even. | |
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I think you're both right...yes, you deserved to get in free and the former npgmc members' guests should have paid.
But you're dealing with clubs, bars, nightclubs, etc which are normally being run by ignoramous bouncers, security guards, cokehead owners, etc who are about as educated as a melting icecube in the summertime. The npgmc spoke of a disclaimer saying all aftershows are subject to diff methods of screening who gets in and how. I've worked in many different clubs, bars, restaurants for over 17 yrs, They ALL have different policies, and NO ONE band or performer can tell them otherwise...they are private companies who can AND do things as they see fit, period. If you didn't know that before, know that now. And in the future the same (non)rules apply...expect the unexpected when it comes to whole nightclub experience as a whole--no matter WHAT band is playing or what music club you belong to, the nightclub makes the rules. | |
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mrchristian said: I think you're both right...yes, you deserved to get in free and the former npgmc members' guests should have paid.
But you're dealing with clubs, bars, nightclubs, etc which are normally being run by ignoramous bouncers, security guards, cokehead owners, etc who are about as educated as a melting icecube in the summertime. The npgmc spoke of a disclaimer saying all aftershows are subject to diff methods of screening who gets in and how. I've worked in many different clubs, bars, restaurants for over 17 yrs, They ALL have different policies, and NO ONE band or performer can tell them otherwise...they are private companies who can AND do things as they see fit, period. If you didn't know that before, know that now. And in the future the same (non)rules apply...expect the unexpected when it comes to whole nightclub experience as a whole--no matter WHAT band is playing or what music club you belong to, the nightclub makes the rules. The club doormen fucked up, but it's good to see the NPGMC members get their shame of the blame. A confused doorman and the club members who let their guests in free are the reason why the 300 NPGMC passes were used up on non-members. | |
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