Looks like the coming summer-concerts are 'planned'in the same way as over the last few years.

I would love to see a tour that has been thought of in advance: A decent 'theme'/focus with a stage set-up that fits to it. And also a tour schedule, tourbook/T-shirts with a schedule, you know, all of it.

Now it looks like promotors can book Prince, just as you would book a band for your wedding. That is the way these 'tours' are being set up.There is just no thought behind it.

I agree, it would be cool if he had a theme to his concerts and he actually invested some time in doing the best show possible, not only as a musician but as an overall entertainer. He can skip the dancing, because the little dancing he did in 2011, wasn't very good lol, but he should have some props or some type of stage set would be awesome.

Prince does things his own way. And his shows are the best shows possible-- musically the best. "he needs to have some props?" WTF? What does he need--to release white doves? He needs a stage set-- did you go to any of the W2A shows? Did you see the stage? It was awesome, perfect.

But people don't go to Prince shows to get a tee-shirt (though you can) or to take in a cheesy spectacle. People go to the shows to hear a profoundly gifted musician. I appreciate that he doesn't sell out to the mega-show, mega-tour thing. Instead, he's playing cool, unique festivals around Europe. That's awesome. And after seeing several of his shows--including a European jazz festival in 2011--I can't help but wonder if he opts to play these festivals because he enjoys it--and because he appreciates the music-loving, improv-loving audience.

Also, I'm under the impression that, at least with the W2A tour, he strategized the concerts with an eye to minimizing scalping possibilities (last minute announcement of concerts, steeply tiered ticket pricing). Dude has been doing his thing--and doing it well--for a long time, if its how he tours, how he makes records, how he plays, his view towards technology, how he puts his bands together, etc. He can do his shows--and anything-- however he wants to do 'em. Personally, I feel lucky when I have the chance to see him. I respect that he does things his own way.

madness said:

madness said:

Prince does things his own way. And his shows are the best shows possible-- musically the best. "he needs to have some props?" WTF? What does he need--to release white doves? He needs a stage set-- did you go to any of the W2A shows? Did you see the stage? It was awesome, perfect.

But people don't go to Prince shows to get a tee-shirt (though you can) or to take in a cheesy spectacle. People go to the shows to hear a profoundly gifted musician. I appreciate that he doesn't sell out to the mega-show, mega-tour thing. Instead, he's playing cool, unique festivals around Europe. That's awesome. And after seeing several of his shows--including a European jazz festival in 2011--I can't help but wonder if he opts to play these festivals because he enjoys it--and because he appreciates the music-loving, improv-loving audience.

Also, I'm under the impression that, at least with the W2A tour, he strategized the concerts with an eye to minimizing scalping possibilities (last minute announcement of concerts, steeply tiered ticket pricing). Dude has been doing his thing--and doing it well--for a long time, if its how he tours, how he makes records, how he plays, his view towards technology, how he puts his bands together, etc. He can do his shows--and anything-- however he wants to do 'em. Personally, I feel lucky when I have the chance to see him. I respect that he does things his own way.

I have seen two shows in London. The symbol stage (one could call a giant prop) is something completely different from the stage he uses in Europe these days/years. It is just a very simple set-up wich has been used for a couple of years. I've seen a few of those shows and i agree that prince can do whatever he wants and he does it in a great way. But in a way it is always the same. that's my point. and there is nothing wrong with a good stage set-up, now is there? Nobody will say the SOTT shows where cheesy.

He can do whatever he wants, I know, nothing wrong with that and if he comes around my neighborhood this year, no doubt i will attend a show. But I think it would even be better if it was thought over beforehand.

remko said:

Looks like the coming summer-concerts are 'planned'in the same way as over the last few years.

I would love to see a tour that has been thought of in advance: A decent 'theme'/focus with a stage set-up that fits to it. And also a tour schedule, tourbook/T-shirts with a schedule, you know, all of it.

Now it looks like promotors can book Prince, just as you would book a band for your wedding. That is the way these 'tours' are being set up.There is just no thought behind it.

i agree with you. It is hard to plan this way especially during the holiday season. but what surprises me is that montreux , smukfest and his gig in stockholm are announced pretty early.

And indeed there is just no thought behind it. Promotors surely want to do it otherwise i think but Prince can still get away with this as his gigs easily sell out. I can remember going to Italy in the autumn of 2011 to see him in Asago. When i got out of the plane i heard that he announced gigs in holland and antwerp just a few days ahead ....i talk about venues of 10000!!! He sold out within hours.... If i had known about this last minute concerts in my home country i would never have flown to Milano, as much as i like it...

[Edited 2/28/13 12:37pm]

[Edited 2/28/13 12:38pm]

gerhard12 said:

rafael said I can remember going to Italy in the autumn of 2011 to see him in Asago. It was in 2010 and Purple Rain on that day was it worth alone!!

haha...u were right and yes that version was the best i have seen from him...made a good video of it, better than the one circulating....pity not in hd....but yes, it was incredible....

GoldDolphin said:

madness said:

Prince does things his own way. And his shows are the best shows possible-- musically the best. "he needs to have some props?" WTF? What does he need--to release white doves? He needs a stage set-- did you go to any of the W2A shows? Did you see the stage? It was awesome, perfect.

But people don't go to Prince shows to get a tee-shirt (though you can) or to take in a cheesy spectacle. People go to the shows to hear a profoundly gifted musician. I appreciate that he doesn't sell out to the mega-show, mega-tour thing. Instead, he's playing cool, unique festivals around Europe. That's awesome. And after seeing several of his shows--including a European jazz festival in 2011--I can't help but wonder if he opts to play these festivals because he enjoys it--and because he appreciates the music-loving, improv-loving audience.

Also, I'm under the impression that, at least with the W2A tour, he strategized the concerts with an eye to minimizing scalping possibilities (last minute announcement of concerts, steeply tiered ticket pricing). Dude has been doing his thing--and doing it well--for a long time, if its how he tours, how he makes records, how he plays, his view towards technology, how he puts his bands together, etc. He can do his shows--and anything-- however he wants to do 'em. Personally, I feel lucky when I have the chance to see him. I respect that he does things his own way.

Nobody is saying he's gonna have white doves at his shows but perhaps a theme to his tours as for the concerts at the festivals here in Europe, it's good because the majority of people who attend festivals are young Cand don't know much about Prince and they discover he's a good musician. However it's also quite limiting for him since he can't play what he wants to but rather the hits the average person might know. I'm not even asking for no tee or anything like that, but he is an entertainer as well. But I forgot that you can't really give constructive criticism to Prince since he is flawless... The org is just too much at times...

Its not that Prince or any living being is flawless. The question is: to what extent to we demand that artists conform to "sell" their product? And by which standards? So if some young person does not know of his music, should Prince market himself to this audience? Or should he (or any artist) be able to make a choice regarding the extent to which they market themselves? Should all artists need to conform on one consumer expectaction? And really--isn't that antithetical to art itself? "its quite limiting for him"... it depends upon what he wants and how he defines success. Maybe he places a premium on good music, or God, or whatever he prioritizes... but not mass market saturation as an end it itself, perhaps. Some people probably don't get that. Not everyone has the same goals and objectives. And I think these differences are great. Otherwise, we'd have a boring cookie-cutter world.

madness said:

GoldDolphin said:

madness said: Nobody is saying he's gonna have white doves at his shows but perhaps a theme to his tours as for the concerts at the festivals here in Europe, it's good because the majority of people who attend festivals are young Cand don't know much about Prince and they discover he's a good musician. However it's also quite limiting for him since he can't play what he wants to but rather the hits the average person might know. I'm not even asking for no tee or anything like that, but he is an entertainer as well. But I forgot that you can't really give constructive criticism to Prince since he is flawless... The org is just too much at times...

Its not that Prince or any living being is flawless. The question is: to what extent to we demand that artists conform to "sell" their product? And by which standards? So if some young person does not know of his music, should Prince market himself to this audience? Or should he (or any artist) be able to make a choice regarding the extent to which they market themselves? Should all artists need to conform on one consumer expectaction? And really--isn't that antithetical to art itself? "its quite limiting for him"... it depends upon what he wants and how he defines success. Maybe he places a premium on good music, or God, or whatever he prioritizes... but not mass market saturation as an end it itself, perhaps. Some people probably don't get that. Not everyone has the same goals and objectives. And I think these differences are great. Otherwise, we'd have a boring cookie-cutter world.

Well knowing that Prince is a commerical artist and he wanted a recording contract when he was young instead of being an "unknown" talent or being a "local artist", we need to ask ourselves why he doesn't feel the need to sell his product anymore like he once did? Doing concerts at festivals is certainly a way of marketing himself to younger audiences and thus singing his old reportoire of songs, since those people attending the festivals know very little of his later works or even his music catalogue that well. It certainly depends on what type of artist you are, but like I said PRINCE is a commercial artist and not a Jazz or classic instrumentalist and hence his work is connected to something that is antithetical (because we don't truly know if his aim is to reach higher than just selling music or just for the sake of money), because it doesnt belong in the private spehere nor the room of music for musicians, but rather for everyone that can digest and pay for his ABA form music and thus still making him an artist that somehow is dependant on his audience to purchase and support his music. So while I don't know what his purpose is (musically that is) for these festivals, having a theme or a thread to your music, speaks volumes of your perspective on your music and your art, is a way of conveying a message, because he is not playing Purple Rain, Little Red Corvette, If I was Your Girlfriend etc to musicians but rather for casual people who have never heard him. (I'm a music student, so it's interesting for me to debate these things )

GoldDolphin said:

madness said:

Its not that Prince or any living being is flawless. The question is: to what extent to we demand that artists conform to "sell" their product? And by which standards? So if some young person does not know of his music, should Prince market himself to this audience? Or should he (or any artist) be able to make a choice regarding the extent to which they market themselves? Should all artists need to conform on one consumer expectaction? And really--isn't that antithetical to art itself? "its quite limiting for him"... it depends upon what he wants and how he defines success. Maybe he places a premium on good music, or God, or whatever he prioritizes... but not mass market saturation as an end it itself, perhaps. Some people probably don't get that. Not everyone has the same goals and objectives. And I think these differences are great. Otherwise, we'd have a boring cookie-cutter world.

Well knowing that Prince is a commerical artist and he wanted a recording contract when he was young instead of being an "unknown" talent or being a "local artist", we need to ask ourselves why he doesn't feel the need to sell his product anymore like he once did? Doing concerts at festivals is certainly a way of marketing himself to younger audiences and thus singing his old reportoire of songs, since those people attending the festivals know very little of his later works or even his music catalogue that well. It certainly depends on what type of artist you are, but like I said PRINCE is a commercial artist and not a Jazz or classic instrumentalist and hence his work is connected to something that is antithetical (because we don't truly know if his aim is to reach higher than just selling music or just for the sake of money), because it doesnt belong in the private spehere nor the room of music for musicians, but rather for everyone that can digest and pay for his ABA form music and thus still making him an artist that somehow is dependant on his audience to purchase and support his music. So while I don't know what his purpose is (musically that is) for these festivals, having a theme or a thread to your music, speaks volumes of your perspective on your music and your art, is a way of conveying a message, because he is not playing Purple Rain, Little Red Corvette, If I was Your Girlfriend etc to musicians but rather for casual people who have never heard him. (I'm a music student, so it's interesting for me to debate these things )

Hi GD! Yes, I appreciate this debate as well... I study quality markets and this idea of whether the consumer or producer (artist) constructs/determines quality is of great interest to me. You are right that Prince at one point was about the big contract, then after some experiences (i.e., Warner Bros) his view on that changed... also i think he had a lot of life experiences that maybe caused him to rethink some of his values and objectives. My personal opinion is that more diversity and creativity arises when we let artists/producers do their own thing. Sometimes these things work, sometimes they don't but--importantly--this depends on how one has defined success, and who is defining it. For all creative people, there is an inherent tension between the market and creative self-expression. For an idealist like myself, I appreciate when creative people can follow their muse/their inner genius, even if it leads them down a different road than others would choose to take (or a less commercial route). Definitely in the Purple Rain era Prince was straddling the line between commercialism and artistry, though he found success both in following some rules while intentionally breaking others (or at least pushing boundaries). Having seen Prince at the jazz festivals and in arenas, I'd have to say that he comes alive when he is improvizing, and jazz festivals allow him more room for self-expression. The man should play whatever shows he wants to, however he wants to. He spent his time doing the mega-tours. He's more than earned the right to play any types of shows he pleases.

[Edited 3/1/13 6:15am]

we need to ask ourselves why he doesn't feel the need to sell his product anymore like he once did?

Because he's old, famous and has a lot of money, would be my guess.

Long tours are really, really hard work.

To have the chance to keep a band together to do just a couple dozen dates a year in only the places you really want to be, that sounds like a nice life to me!

I understand the fans want a nice big tour like we had for Musicology, gives us something to rally around. Even when he's not in town it's fun to read the reports and see how things are moving. It's cool to see our favorite guy in the news, everybody talking about how great the shows are. Yeah it's fun.

But if he doesn't need to stay on the road for 3 months at a time and doesn't feel like it, why force it?

A real "tour" would be awesome. Having seen Parade, SOTT and Lovesexy I couldn't more than agree. An album with some kind of focus and theme, and a tour to go with it. Yes, please.

But Prince has lost the inner driving force to prove himself. He's old and full.

So the concerts nowadays are a lot about the $. Play for the highest bidder.

Selling music don't generate much money in the 2010's, so why bother with albums? Release a song every now and then instead.

[Edited 3/1/13 11:37am]

stein74 said:

madness said:

Prince does things his own way. And his shows are the best shows possible-- musically the best.

Uh, BIG NO. Do you have any kind of music knowledge? Since the day the Musicology tour ended, he has dumbed down and watered down the arrangements to multiple songs by playing similar chords and similar music for different songs. It's like he knows he spends less money on his bands than any other major artists.

You have to remember...this is a guy who has more unpaid bills than anybody in the business...he has given the shaft to company after company, and he is no different when it comes to his tours now.

Best shows possible? HA! There were some really nice moments on the Welcome 2 America shows, but since he has again cut back on his singing, letting the girls sing, you get less Prince. With watered down song arrangements, you get a less musically diverse show. He may have played 60 something different songs, but only around 10 were all that different, and many were just a little different. He did not spend 5 months in rehearsal teaching his Poorly paid band all those songs.

And another way to kill time? Just play a groove for several minutes, and take a great singer like Shelby, and pretty much instruct her to shout "Put Your Hands Up" at the top of her lungs for 3-5 minutes.

Ida was nice with her bass on Play That Funky Music, but if you notice, Prince wasn't really doing anything on that song...just dancing around a bit, as the groove got less funky...

"Mountains?" Prince whispering in the mic a few minutes....but the girls sang 90% of it.

Again, I'm pointing out the flaws in the show, not focusing on the awesome parts...simply because you had the nerve to say it was "Musically the best." That is worth a few hundered laughs...

Yes, there were some awesome moments:

If I Was Your Girlfriend, DMSR, Scandalous, Shh, Anotherloverholenyohead, Guitar....

If he played those six songs every night, I might take it easy on them, but .....

Too many times, he played the "Karaoke Set," NOT something a normal serious musician would do...

Can you imagine Miles Davis telling his band to go backstage while he played over backing tapes? Nope. Never woulda happend. James Brown? Nope.

[Edited 3/2/13 17:32pm]

Yes, I'd like a REAL tour and I'd also like him to change things up a bit, including not wasting setlist time singing covers and for him to get rid of that "sampler" towards the end and actually sing full versions of those songs.

Oh, and sing "Little Red Corvette" in it's original form instead of that stupid piano version.

stillwaiting said:

gerhard12 said:

rafael said: haha...u were right and yes that version was the best i have seen from him...made a good video of it, better than the one circulating....pity not in hd....but yes, it was incredible.... me too! but I hope for some hollandgigs this year, want to visit amsterdam for a long time and another melkweg would be great )

although i like amsterdam it is not recommendable to c an aftershow there...All at once everyone wants to get in...last time half of amsterdam got in and fans who wanted to attend couldnt get in anymore....not good. better visit some abroad countries, scandinavia f.e. People r less hysterical than over here.

SuperSoulFighter said:

Sometimes I read posts without paying much attention to who wrote them, but I always know when it's stillwaiting: your posts are as predictable as you accuse Prince of being. Have you seen the band member's paycheck? How do you know if they're poorly paid? Getting back on topic, we all know albums don't sell the way they used to, so a new concept album with a tour centered around that concept is unlikely to happen. Just put on the Sign o the Times vid again! And being from Holland, I've never seen the symbol stage and can live without it. The simple set up is fine with me. And I just know that he's going to give the Montreux fans something special. Never underestimate the man! And that's coming from someone who finds 3rdEyeGirl a total bore.

2 me it is not about getting an album and a concert tour. At this point in time his concerts are far more appealing than his new music. What i am asking for is more something of a new vibe to the shows. And that does not mean it has to be something like the wall wich will take a few years to eran the invested money back. not at all. It is not about props, a general reconcideration will do.

A standard tour would be nice based around a new double album.

I thought the Lovesexy Tour was quite innovative with the ever changing sets, the basketball playing, the bed hopping, the car etc etc but I guess he has grown up.

Just another opportunity to see him in the UK would be nice, as would a nice aftershow gig at the 02 Indigo which is still my most memorable musical event of all time.

YES!! A theme oriented female tour with Prince wearing more drag and miniskirts rocking out as a 4 female group(no horns, keyboards tec). They can be the new indigo girls!! The stage covered in pink and nice pretty roses or flowers. Princeah sporting his afro and sleep mask doing his best Florence(from Good Times) impersonation. Basiclally a strippted down Lovesexy tour without the props and big band. FEMALE POWER!!

rafael said:

although i like amsterdam it is not recommendable to c an aftershow there...All at once everyone wants to get in...last time half of amsterdam got in and fans who wanted to attend couldnt get in anymore....not good. better visit some abroad countries, scandinavia f.e. People r less hysterical than over here.

really? just saw some pics of people standing in an endless line last year to see the melkweg gigs , but didnt know they didnt got in all of them, hmm ...

maybe brussels is better, he always like to play there as

SuperSoulFighter said:

Sometimes I read posts without paying much attention to who wrote them, but I always know when it's stillwaiting: your posts are as predictable as you accuse Prince of being. Have you seen the band member's paycheck? How do you know if they're poorly paid? Getting back on topic, we all know albums don't sell the way they used to, so a new concept album with a tour centered around that concept is unlikely to happen. Just put on the Sign o the Times vid again! And being from Holland, I've never seen the symbol stage and can live without it. The simple set up is fine with me. And I just know that he's going to give the Montreux fans something special. Never underestimate the man! And that's coming from someone who finds 3rdEyeGirl a total bore.

he's going to give the Montreux fans something special supersoulfighter said...

that s for sure....hopefully compared to nor

brussels is the best...easy to get in...

madness said:

Good Lord you're an arrogant, ignorant asshole. Prince often transcends when he plays music and so can tuned-in listeners. Too bad your too busy being a miserable MF to enjoy good shit when you hear it. Have you ever heard him improvise on guitar?????? I don't know which shows you were at in 2011 (if any) but clearly you missed the experience Prince was delivering.

Your opinion. I didn't call you an asshole...but if I did I'm sorry. I went to 6 shows in 2011, and heard many more on bootleg. Nowhere near as good as ONA in 2002 or Musicology in 2004. Many of the best elements were copied from 2004, but Controversy was flat and more edited than in 2004. Shelby was contained most nights, but totally out of control with her shouting on other nights.

If Prince was Billy Ocean going on tour, maybe it would be acceptable....but some of these shows were just bland. Every show I went to had some amazing moments.

I really like how you over positive people think I am miserable if I can point out that the entire experience wasn't amazing. I'm sure your motivational posters on your wall that say Teamwork, Destiny, etc...say a lot more about you than you think.

Some people only talk about how great everything is

Some people only talk about hwo awful everything is

I like to tell the truth, and give strong opinions that I back up

Anything other than the truth from me is not gonna happen.

If 40% of a concert is wonderful, 35% is ok but 25% sucks....I will let my opinion be known...

Those complaining about my complaining ...ARE WORSE than my complaining in the first place.

If I really HATED 100% of the show I would not go....

But I'm not a pussy who is scared to even mention anything that wasn't right about a Prince show...

If he does some lame ass karaoke, or has Shelby shouting like a fool, I'm not gonna ignore it.

remko said:

SuperSoulFighter said:

Sometimes I read posts without paying much attention to who wrote them, but I always know when it's stillwaiting: your posts are as predictable as you accuse Prince of being. Have you seen the band member's paycheck? How do you know if they're poorly paid? Getting back on topic, we all know albums don't sell the way they used to, so a new concept album with a tour centered around that concept is unlikely to happen. Just put on the Sign o the Times vid again! And being from Holland, I've never seen the symbol stage and can live without it. The simple set up is fine with me. And I just know that he's going to give the Montreux fans something special. Never underestimate the man! And that's coming from someone who finds 3rdEyeGirl a total bore.

2 me it is not about getting an album and a concert tour. At this point in time his concerts are far more appealing than his new music. What i am asking for is more something of a new vibe to the shows. And that does not mean it has to be something like the wall wich will take a few years to eran the invested money back. not at all. It is not about props, a general reconcideration will do.

You are right, his music as of lately isn't as interesting as the concerts. But with this new band of his, I'm wondering if it will be good at all... He should def work on getting a new vibe to his shows and that's not a bad thing, like some may think it is. Everyone needs to develop and keep innovating within their craft or else it becomes stagnant. I don't think the people wanting props or a proper "idea" to his tours, are saying we want the type of the wall concert, but rather a well thought tour! That's all ...

[Edited 3/5/13 8:09am]