Update on VIP Tickets Complaint

Having been ignored by Ticketmaster, Messed around for a week by AEG we have now been in contact with AEG LIVE. The customer services there offered me another date with a VIP ticket - but there was a catch as it was for the bar, finger buffet & a £ 31.21 ticket location. Please do be aware that if they have offered you an alternative night that you know again where you are to be seated.

WE have now been offered a refund but at present we dont know if its the full amount.

AEG Live Contact was Julie Mann 0207 536 2600 or Maxinne 0207 536 1615Good luck and dont give in!![b]

FREEFALLIN said:

Hey can you please tell me why your comp[lainig about the vip tickets?

congratulations, it's heartening to know that they are getting round to dealing with this issue...

FREEFALLIN said:

Could anyone give me the MAILadres of AEG?I only got the address!I don not want tow ait untill it arrives from Holland!Thanks So much!I love to trie it again bu i can't go tolondon again..But it still...yes STILL feels so bad..I'm totally dissapointed....I still want to let my opinon counted....but than i need that mailaddress!

Going from previous posts, I think the address/contact that you need is:
Mr Joe Mead, Ticketing AEG Live, 25 Canada Square, Canary Wharf, London,E14 5LQ

Hope this helps

lisaf said:

Thanks! But i need the MAILaddress to be on time untill the 21 days are over.I am still doubting to go again....

Just got put on the refund list by Maxine at aeg-

reason- restricted view seating..


honestly, they have been all very friendly to me about solving problems, my only complaints about that would be 1. they have been a little slow for my tastes.
and 2. this shouldn't have happened in the first place. 3. legally ticketmaster should have dealt with it.

i don't know if this will help much but she acknowledged that prince barely used the back of the stage the first night, and that they didn't know the stage was going to be quite so high..

The main crux of my argument is that the back of the stage and some of the floor seats are not the "best seats" as promised and are rather more restricted view. Can i encourage ANYONE who is in similar postion- whilst bitching about their luck here,(as i have) to actually take time to write to aeg (specifically Julie Mann) and explain the situation, I hate to think any of you are feeling hard done by and not telling the people who can do something about it.

Be polite and friendly about the whole thing, think your arguments through and be firm. If what you got, was not what is described you should let them know because legally you are entitled to a refund/exchange.

a couple of us here have got results now, as long as you are not just ranting for the sake of it, there is no reason why you all shouldn't.

FREEFALLIN said:

When you say you got a refund, was that after you attended the VIP concert, or is this before you have attended the VIP show?

I've sent in my complaint to AEG Live at Canary Whary and Ticketmaster customer services 2 weeks ago after getting VIP seats in Block E1 on 11/08 which were behind the keyboards and drums at the back of the stage, we were in row C so the height of the stage made it difficult to see over and we couldn't see much of Prince when he was centre/front stage, certainly not the best seats in the house !!!

I've also complained about the aftershow, as that was completely a non entity after Indigo staff went down the line saying entertainment had been cancelled, we didn't even use the aftershow tickets and went back to our hotel.

glyn said:

thats good and important information. it backs up what i've mentioned before (perhaps on HQ if not here), in that you have a name at AEG who has confirmed that the seats are "not the best", as well as them confirming that they were unaware the stage was going to be so high (personally i don't think the stage is that high, it's fairly normal height for that type of event, so did they think he was going to be standing on milk crates or something?)

as i mentioned before, which is one of your points, ticketmaster has the legal responsibility to deal with these complaints, not AEG, so i suggest taking the steps i mentioned before (which are on HQ if you look) and you can say you want a refund as the seats were not the best and were a restricted view, and you weren't supplied with tickets as advertised at point of sale, and you can then state that AEG have confirmed they agree that they are not the best

and remember to always be polite and calm. you could also mention that you paid VIP prices, so expect VIP customer service, and not mucked about and delays

and if you get results, post back. remember to note all times and names etc when you call. and if you don't get lucky post back with more info so others can help you further

FREEFALLIN said:

I just phoned AEG on 0207 536 1615, they are going through a list now to contact people who complained, they just offerred me VIP package pre-show then a £31.21 ticket (they couldn't say where) for 20/09 gig.

Gotta check with work to see if I can make it as its a Thursday night and I gotta travel from Manchester.

Word of warning, they asked where I got this contact number from, I said Ticketmaster customer services gave it to me and said AEG are dealing with it, didn't want to drop anyone in it, so if you phone, might be worth saying the same....

ok, so i have been asked to be on the radio tomorrow, LIVE to talk about my experience. Being cabbed to the studio and all that jazz.


Thing is, my personal case has been pretty much resolved to my satisfaction (unless the amount of refund offered is not the full price) so if the definition of good radio is conflict there might not be any.

Apparently there will be a representative of "outside" who are apparently responsible for the vip packages there.(first time i have heard THAT name anywhere)


i don't want to go out in public as a symbol of the problem being solved when genuine problems still exist for other people.


ORG NOTE ME ASAP if you still have a problem...


has anyone specifically been told NO you can't have a refund? on what grounds? by whom?

glyn said:

Now your complaint has been resolved, are you still going on the radio tomorrow?

glyn said:

the main issue is TM have been dicking everyone about, and putting people off

you definately should attend, if you confirm to me that you will go, i'll give you something you can print and read, with a number of key points

btw, search my posts on HQ and here as most of it i've already posted, but i can cut and paste and summaries the main points

i would go on radio, but i got refunds, and i'm 500 miles away. TM customer service is far from vip, and only people who called numerous times got anywhere. AEG should not have had to deal with the complaints as they didn't provide the tickets to the end consumer, TM did, it's thier problem. they in turn should have dealt with AEG

Thanks for that!

I had restricted view too.

Will write to AEG & let you know the response.

glyn said:

There are still problems. I have emailed Five Live copies of the letters I sent to TM Customer Services and the MD of TM UK re the terrible VIP experience we received on 10th August. My friend has emailed them the letters she has sent, also to the above, re the VIP seats we have been allocated for 21st Sept. Julie Mann at AEG eventually offered to swap our seats for the 21st Sept but can only offer us more seats round the back of the stage. We have declined her offer. No refunds have been offered for either night. The other point that needs to be made is that TM are at this moment selling tickets in Block F2 as VIP and the 'very best seats in the venue' for £235 each. They clearly are not so why are they still selling them as such? Good luck for tomorrow!

glyn said:

AEG offerred me VIP pre-show and normal £31.21 tickets for 20/09.I said I would have to check with work, they are contacting me tommorrow.

As I am from Manchester I do not think I can attend the 20/09 due to work commitments, so I think I will ask for a refund, have they actually said they will offer a full refund for VIP package tickets ?

Can anyone tell us when the fivelive thing is going to be aired? I'd really like to hear this debate!

ecnirp98 said:

offering replacements instead of refunds when refunds are legally due is a very common offer in business and many customers fall for it. if your tv is broke you are entitled to a refund, but they will offer to repair or replace so they don't have to refund and lose business

in this case instead of refunding you £240 they give you another £31 ticket, and 3 drinks worth about £5 cost price, and food worth about £3. if they have acknowledged your complaint, you should thus be entitled to a refund, only it's TM who should be refunding, not AEG as you didn't buy anything from AEG and you have no dealings with AEG. you purchased from TM so it's up to them to sort it. AEG are offering this to avoid having to refund via TM. i'd push for the full refund, as you could then add another £10 and get a purple table suit, or buy a normal floor ticket for £31 and spend £200 on food and drink in the many bars in the o2 before the show

unique said:

I agree and I will be pushing for a refund, the problem is even if I am offerred another night, its £100's on travel/hotels etc plus time off work, so I think they are just trying to palm us off with the cheapest/easiest option at first, so I will be pushing for a refund.

As they are offerring compensation, it must mean that they aknowledge there is a problem with the VIP package that AEG/Ticketmaster are responsible for.

I agree Ticketmaster should be handling this, I verbally told ticketmaster this and included it in my letter to AEG/Ticketmaster, as the money was paid to ticketmaster, they are responsible for the goods/services provided and should supply a duty of care for the customer. They were adamant on the phone that is not the case and AEG are responsible, I told them I did not believe that was correct and it was a very poor response from a company such as ticketmaster who make £millions out of concerts/events, but there was no changing their stance...

I am pleasantly supprised we are getting movement from AEG to be honest, I expected they would try and refuse any refunds after the event !

If anyone actually gets or is promised a refund, please post the details, I would like to know what AEG are offerring, we are stronger if we stand together on this, Maxine who I spoke to said she had to employ someone to help to deal with this problem, so it shows our mass complaint letters worked and they are taking it seriously.
[Edited 8/28/07 11:18am]

Thank u 4 the info.

themellowone said:

I have already done a recorded interview but, if my boss agrees, will be going live on air at 10.30 am tomorrow - what a shambles. Must say AEG have offered me another VIP package for September - as a massive Prince fan, I am accepting the same but still going on air to confirm what actually happened on the night I went to VIP - 17th August.

spud80 said:

Think you should all try and tune in to Five Live tomorrow at 10.30 - could be interesting!!!!!

I’ll be tuning in for sure. I felt there was something rotten in the state of Ticketmaster UK and didn’t even consider buying VIP tickets but am supporting you every way. I am having a great time in London but am very discontent with how AEG & Ticketmaster are doing business (see my correspondence below). Why not make this a new item in the concert section: ‘BBC live broadcast about ticket sales 10.30 GMT’?

On July 20th I wrote to Ticketmaster UK:

Dear Sir/Madam,

As a long time member of Prince’s official fan club, the NPG Music Club, I was given the opportunity today to claim a password through Prince’s current website 3121.com with which I was able to buy floor tickets on your Ticketmaster website for his concerts in the O2 in London. Remarkably, not only former NPGMC members can buy the floor tickets with the fan club code, apparently, everybody who registers (for free) at 3121.com can.

Fact is, I already bought ‘best available’ tickets several weeks ago at Ticketmaster UK, online, for the 10th & 11th of August 2007, which turned out to be lower tier seats. Please change my current 8 lower tier tickets into floor seats in block F (1-3), the block you are selling at the moment ASAP.

Current orders:
- [...]/UK1, Friday, 10th August 2007, 4 x Prince, O2, London. Section [...], row [...], seats [...], price level 1, lower tier. Type O2 pass code. Total charge: 142,34 GBP.

- [...]/UK1, Saturday, 11th August 2007, 2 x Prince, O2, London. Section BK 112, row [...], seats [...], price level 1, lower tier. Type O2 pass code. Total charge: 72,92 GBP.

- [...]/UK1, Saturday, 11th August 2007, 2 x Prince, O2, London. Section BK 112, row [...], seats [...], price level 1, lower tier. Type O2 pass code. Total charge: 72,92 GBP.

Kind Regards,

Bob Blöte


[...]
The Netherlands
[...]


On the 23th of July Andrew Martin from Ticketmaster replied:

Dear Bob,

Thank you for your email.

Ticketmaster's policy is that once a booking has been confirmed, it cannot be exchanged or refunded unless the event is cancelled. This is made clear at the time of booking. Therefore, on this occasion, we are unfortunately unable to assist you with your request.

I apologise I am unable to assist you any further in this matter and assure you of our best intentions at all times.


On the 25th of July I replied:

Dear Andrew,

Thanks for your reply, however, I’m not satisfied with what your answer inclines. If you insist on denying me the ticket upgrade I see myself left with no other option than asking for advice at the British embassy in The Hague, the British Tourist Authority and British media like ‘Watchdog’ and the Dutch equivalents and send them the following written complaint:



Dear Sir / Madam,

As an admirer of the music of the popular music artist Prince I decided to obtain concert tickets at the ticket agency Ticketmaster for his upcoming European concerts in London. Prince’s European concerts this year will almost solely take place in London’s O2 arena.

As a customer I feel deceived by the British organisers (AEG - London) and ticket sellers (Ticketmaster UK Limited) of the concerts and I am asking your advice in how to handle the situation which is not only affecting me but lots of other European Prince fans travelling to London in August and September for the concerts.

The regular ticket sale started on Friday, May 11th (the day before a presale was held exclusively for O2 telephone customers living in the UK). Tickets were sold by Ticketmaster as ‘best available’ on a first come first served basis. Ticketmaster claimed a sell out in the media soon after but went on selling considerable amounts of tickets bit by bit for several of the 21 London concerts which often turned out to be better than the tickets sold at the start of the sale cumulating in a widespread notice that new tickets for the concerts would go on sale on Sunday July 15th. Ticketmaster sold ‘new’ tickets for all concerts from that day on. The seats were much better than many fans and regular concert goers had been buying earlier as ‘best available’. Then, on Friday the 20th of July Prince’s official website (www.3121.com), made it possible to obtain tickets at Ticketmaster even closer to the stage, also for the regular price, after registering at his site for free. Many fans bought new tickets for the 2nd or 3rd time (see for examples the Prince fan website www.housequake.com among others).
Ticketmaster is claiming that the tickets they sold initially were tickets ‘best available at the time’ (although the ‘at the time’ phrase was not mentioned at the moment of selling) and that the better tickets that became available later are tickets that re-entered the sale after customers didn’t claim them. But the tickets that became available later turned out to be complete blocks in the O2 Arena consisting of hundreds of clustered seats that were part of the seating plan from the start and not the occasional unpaid reservation to be offered for sale a second time.

Ticketmaster informed me that they are not inclined to upgrade my earlier bought tickets. Nor are they willing to refund tickets bought by customers who are dissatisfied after learning much better seats had become available after their purchase.

Any advice or mediation you are able to offer would be most appreciated.

Thanks in advance,

Bob Blöte

[...]
The Netherlands
[...]


The concert organiser is AEG:
AEG - London
25 Canada Square
Canary Wharf
London E14 5LQ
Tel.: (207) 536 26 00
Email: info@aegworldwide.co.uk
Web: http://www.aegworldwide.com

The ticket sellers are:
Ticketmaster UK Limited
48 Leicester Square
London WC2H 7LR
Tel.: 084 499999
Web: http://www.ticketmaster.co.uk


On the 25th of July Andrew Martin from Ticketmaster replied:

Dear Bob,

The terms and conditions of sale are stated on our website which you have agreed to when you booked. These terms are governed by English Law.

As bookings are made and altered, seats are selected and cancelled at random intervals for various reasons, e.g. the customer changes their mind before purchasing or their credit card will not allow payment. Therefore tickets will constantly appear and disappear. Please bear in mind that we have customers booking over the phones, through the website and at ticket centres so there is a great deal of activity on the system.

The tickets you purchased were the best at the time of your booking and unfortunately there is no guarantee that better seats would have been released later.


On the 25th of July I replied:

Dear Andrew,

I take your answer as an invitation to proceed with my actions announced in my previous reaction. But not before stating for the record that I doubt your last answer is an accurate reflection of the truth in this case. Many Prince tickets that became available weeks after the start of the sale are complete blocks in the O2 Arena consisting of hundreds of clustered seats (closer to the stage than previously sold tickets) that where part of the seating plan from the start (for example block F on the floor and block 111 on the lower tier) and not the occasional unpaid reservations to be offered for sale a second time.

Yours faithfully,

Bob Blöte


[...]
The Netherlands
[...]

On the 25th of July I sent the above written letter to BBC's 'Watchdog'

On the 27th of July I wrote to BBC's 'Watchdog':

Dear Sir / Madam,

In addition to my previous mail concerning the sales by Ticketmaster UK Limited for the Prince concerts in London’s O2 arena this summer I would like to draw your attention to the theory that is discussed on fan forum Prince.org (http://www.prince.org/msg/12/236224).

According to this theory Ticketmaster didn’t sell the most wanted floor seats, which are nearest to the stage, in their sales (except for a certain amount of so called VIP seats priced 235 GBP and the F-block for the fan club at the side of the floor). The suspicion is that all the remaining best seats are given to other Ticket brokers to sell for much more than face value and profits are split between Ticketmaster and the other sellers (see for example [...]). This way, and with the auctioning of tickets for prices far above face value on their own site, Ticketmaster might be keeping the scalping business in their own hand. But if the customer is better off by this alleged development is in my opinion at least questionable.
Fact: not one fan up to the moment of this writing responded on the request in the forum to confirm that they bought tickets for the face value price on the floor of the O2 Arena (except for the above mentioned VIP and fan club blocks).

I sincerely hope you are able to shed some light on this case. If the theory holds to be true I am very curious to know if this is a legal practice in the UK.

Kind regards,


Bob Blöte
[...]
The Netherlands
[...]


PS: In the meantime Dutch magazine Nieuwe Revu has caught on to this story (in print and online):
http://www.revu.nl/5829



On August 17th I received a two page reply by post from Ticketmaster dated August 14th in response to my complaints. As it is marked "Private and Confidential" I shall not quote or reprint the reaction but this is my reply sent on August 22nd by post:

Bob Blöte
[...]
The Netherlands
[...]

Ticketmaster UK Limited
Attn: [...]
[...]
PO Box 43
London WC2H 7BR
Verenigd Koninkrijk

[...], August 22nd 2007


Dear [...],

Thank you very much for your elaborate reply on my complaint regarding the recent Prince concert ticket sales by Ticketmaster UK, I do appreciate that.

As I understand from your letter, it is not Ticketmaster but concert organizer AEG that determines when and which seats will be made available through ticket agencies like Ticketmaster.

But the bottom line is that Ticketmaster UK is selling upper tier tickets in the O2 Arena as ‘best available’ to fans on the first day of sales and floor seats on the day of the concerts for AEG without specifying the term, for example like ‘best available at this time’ or stating something like ‘better seats might become available during the course of sales’. As you mentioned yourself you are aware that "[...]". So, after thoroughly reading your reply, I still call your ‘best available’ sale nothing less as a scam and feel you should be ashamed defending this shady business Ticketmaster UK runs for AEG as long as you are not open about it to your customers and specify the term ‘best available’ at the moment of sales.


Yours sincerely,

Bob Blöte

jillis said:

you are just wasting your time pursuing that route. the tickets were listed as "best available" and thats what you were offered, the other seats weren't available. and the promotor can distribute tickets for sale as and how they choose, so they can cream the best seats off and let other specialised agencies sell them for higher prices, and leave the remaining tickets to TM

this is a very different case to the VIP tix which were advertised along the lines of "the VERY BEST seats in the first 10 rows of the floor area", the key words being "the very best" rather than "best available"

in your case, you likely got "the best available" seats at time of purchase, but the issue here is that people purchased vip tix as "the very best seats" but were given seats at the rear of the stage, which are clearly not "the very best"

basically what TM have said to you is correct, and you have misunderstood the terms of sale. and when you start to "threaten" with the likes of "watchdog" you may as well write "please don't take my letter seriously, i'm a nutter" in big letters on the envelope as that makes it clear to them that you don't have a clue about the sale of goods act and consumer law

unique said:

I agree with you that VIP ticket buyers have even more to complain about then me and that it probably won’t do me any good but calling me a nutter for complaining about buying the worst tickets in the house on the first day of sales as best available while the best tickets in the house become available at the day of the show for the same price is not very supportive.

jillis said:

Thanks to everyones efforts, it seems as though people are now beginning to listen to the complaints, particularly with regard to VIP. If makes you feel better just to know that we are not being ignored and people are trying to resolve our problems. I am sure any future concerts will not have these problems.

As I've said all along, The VIP ticketers have a clear case based on mis-representation/false advertising and restrictive view.

I'm afaid those wanting to fight the "best available" and "fan club" seats don't have a legal leg to stand on.

There might be something in the "sub selling" area to pursuit, just because of the stink it would cause, but proving it is a very different matter.

jillis said:

i didn't call you a nutter, you again misunderstood something in writing. i think it's your misunderstandings or misreading of things that's the problem in your own personal circumstance, and thats the problem with many of the complaints, people haven't read terms properly and made inaccurate presumptions, which is muddying the waters and causing problems for others who are reading how people are being turned down refunds etc, when they have a completely different case which could be successful

well, i was on the radio.

Without having someone there from the promoters there present there was no debate and really, as far as i can tell, no story. After i explained i had got a refund, i was puzzled as to why they still wanted me to come in. but what the hell, i had nothing else to do this morning.

From what i could hear, i think everyone else asserted themselves pretty well..

i don't think i did anywhere near as good a job as i hoped, though i do hope the fact i got a refund offered to me actually makes some people who haven't got off their backsides to complain do so. one caller stated "we complain too much in this country" i think the real truth is that we don't complain accurately enough.

Aside from still selling crappy seats as VIP tickets(at least you have the option to turn them down) in my case Aeg have dealt with this amicably, and within 28 days as promised.

if you haven't complained Please take all the steps Unique has stated(who i must acknowledge is very sharp and gives very good advice) if what you got was not what you are promised you have a legal right to a refund. I would also say, simultaneously with dealing with ticket master, contact the people at AEG live who deal with this, because despite the dispute not legally being between you and them, they do seem to be dealing with it.