BanishedBrian said:

What does Mayte's dance company have to do with this? That dance company was a bunch of dance students stomping around to Prince music on stage in boots and hot pants. It was a waste of time and a money loser wherever it went.

YOU are the one who started this notion that particular cities "deserve" aftershows and extras. Go back and read your posts regarding your statements that Atlanta somehow "deserves" the extras they are getting.

BanishedBrian said:

According to a post from someone above, Atlanta has had 3 aftershows and (10) TEN shows since 1997.

As far as him not being able to sell out the small theaters in some cities, hey you have to give in order to receive. He hasn't been doing anything to nurture and form bonds with cities outside of his usual core group of cities. Why would Kansas City show Prince any love when he hasn't given them a reason to love him?

Batdance said:

Let me clarify then... no city "deserves" (i.e. has an entitlement) to any shows. Prince has played just about every place in the U.S. over the last few years... no place is "starving" for him to visit.

With respect to ATL... my point is not that they are owed a visit every year... the point is that Prince going back there is simply due to the fact that they constantly support him. If Milwaukee (or whatever city you are talking about... as you seem unwilling to name it) had the demand that some other cities have showed constantly since 1/97, then he'd go there more often.

If you want an example of why Prince plays certain places, check this out...

DC:
1/97--show sold out in 30 minutes
7/97--show was one of only a couple JOTY full arena sell-outs
4/98--show sold out in an hour... show the next day in Philly at the Electric Factory NEVER sold out.
So guess what? Philly got "dropped" from the places that Prince seems to frequent as much. NY, DC, ATL have been the most supportive East Coast cities... that's why he keeps going back. As soon as he starts playing to empty seats... that will stop. Whether he plays an aftershow depends mostly on his tour schedule, convenience, whether club has instruments ready, etc.

As far as the NPG Dance Company... of course that "matters". It was Prince's wife, Prince's music, and Prince obviously cared enough about to fund it and attend. So yeah, if Milwaukee (or whereever) didn't show for it... I'm sure Prince kept that in mind.
[This message was edited Sat Apr 13 18:40:03 PDT 2002 by BanishedBrian]

BanishedBrian said:

The tour schedule is done with the aftershows already pre-planned. If the intent is to have an aftershow in a certain city, extra time is placed in the schedule and a suitable club that is set up for performances is booked *ahead of time,* probably around the same time the actual show is booked.

That is why Los Angeles is scheduled the way it is. There are 2 days off before the shows and nothing scheduled afterward. The LA aftershow has probably already been booked at a club on April 20.

The issue is that the same cities keep getting the extras and perks. That helps to explain why some cities are Prince "hotspots" and others are not. Kansas City does not have any kind of special bond with Prince. He has done nothing to forge a relationship there the way he has with other cities. Again, he is not going to increase his fanbase and get more NPGMC memberships in Ohio, Wisconsin, Pennsylvania, etc. by giving all of the perks to the same cities like NY, Atlanta, and LA that always get the perks.

I am not going to keep addressing this dance company issue. It's an irrelevant red herring that you threw out there. There is no way to guess which cities would have sold out houses for a dance company show. Just because you claim you "would have" gone, that in no way means that the dance company would have sold out that city. Who even knows if this dance company *ever* sold out any house where it was booked..?

I agree. Prince should do everything we ask. Right we know what he is thinking.

I just did a Google search on the NPG Dance Company world tour. I couldn't find much, but I did find out that the dance company had its premier in the fall of 1997 at a theater in Detroit.

The company also performed shows in Rockford, Il. and Milwaukee, WI. Plans were discussed to bring the show to Chicago and NY but it wasn't clear from the search if that was ever done or not.

According to what I read, the dance company tour was unsuccessful due to bad reviews, lack of publicity, and high ticket prices.

Regarding Philadelphia: You mentioned that Philly has been removed from Prince's regular concert list. Well, while I was searching for info on the dance company, I came across an odd little item about Philly. It seems that in July 1997, Prince suffered cuts and bruises after a group of fans stormed the stage and mobbed him at an aftershow in Philadelphia. No one knows for sure, but that incident might help explain why he stopped going to Philly.

Batdance said:

That isn't always true. The afterparties/shows are often scheduled at the last minute. The one aftershow that Prince played in DC at the 9:30 Club was booked one day in advance of the show in '97... I don't think it's all as calculated as you think. The only reason he played was because they had instruments set up, a good stage, and a ton of fanatics jammed in there.

Larry Graham and Billy Sparks both said on Friday 3/29 in DC that they were still uncertain whether they'd have afterparties/shows after the Saturday and Sunday shows... but if you think they're liars that's your right.

Batdance said:

Oh really? And you think that word wouldn't leak out from staff at the club? My understanding is that the ATL aftershow was booked at the last minute, and that an e-mail went out to the club's mailing list the night of the show saying that Prince had booked a last minute appearance.

Maybe nothing is scheduled before or after because Prince actually has a life and wants to hang out in LA.

Batdance said:

Well, Prince had forged no "bond" with DC in 1997, but that didn't stop both his shows that year from selling out instantly. Could it be that Prince is popular in places like DC and ATL because those cities are much more diverse than KC? In DC, there are three R&B radio stations that have put Prince songs in regular rotation off of Emancipation, NPS and Rave... is that true in KC? Having attended a lot of shows in both MPLS and DC, I personally have noticed a HUGE difference in the atmosphere of the shows. When Prince plays in DC and brings out Doug E. Fresh, the crowd is chanting "six minutes..." In KC or MPLS, they'd most likely be saying "who is this guy?" Similarly, when Prince played Avalanche in DC, the crowd was overwhelming supportive. A crowd in KC is going to say "what the fuck?" to a song about how the white man is still holding the black man down. That may not be fair, but I'd bet it plays a part in his decision-making process.

As far as your point about increasing club size... the fact that Prince plays an aftershow somewhere is generally only cared about by "hardcore" fans that are already members. I think your gripe is more about a perceived "slight" that you feel than any real interest in making the club "work".

Batdance said:

Prince came to Philly twice to support Emancipation, once for NewPowerSoul, and did one Hit n' Run show. Can we at least wait until Prince *ends* the US leg of the tour before claiming he dropped Philly from the list? Geez...

It's not like NYC was immediately placed on the list this time around...
[This message was edited Sat Apr 13 23:05:48 PDT 2002 by Tran]

Tran said:

My comment regarding Philly was in response to a remark made by another person that Philly was dropped as one of Prince's regular concert stops. If you want to debate that issue, debate it with the person who raised the issue. Thanks.

BanishedBrian said:

You have your opinion on this issue; I have my opinion on this issue.

He is perfectly free to continue to play aftershows in the same cities and for the same people who have seen his aftershows for years. Or he can buy a map, expand his horizons, and play for some new groups of people who have not been given the opportunity to experience the aftershows.

He can keep giving the perks to the same cities as long as there is a clear understanding that he will never create any additional "hotspots" for his music if he does nothing to nurture relationships with cities outside his handful of 4-5 core areas.

$40 cover charge for aftershows doesn't go over big in smaller cities. After paying $85 each for concert tickets, Mr. and Mrs. Casual Fan from Iowa won't fork over another $40 for a Prince aftershow.

I saw Prince in concert in 2000 and in 2001. After the first show there was an afterparty at a club that was so packed you could hardly move. There was a long line of people waiting to get in. There was no performance. Everybody paid $20 a person and was packed like sardines in this club for about 2 hours before Prince showed up. He stayed for less than 10 minutes in a VIP area and then left the club.

After the second show, there was another afterparty with no performance at the same club. This time out there was no line waiting to get in. The club was only half full. People had wised up to the difference between an afterPARTY and an afterSHOW.

in terms of booking aftershows, it is my understanding from talking to folks who work at some of the clubs prince has played aftershows at, the bookings are made once prince and his people are in the town. he surveys the club that day to give his ok. some have been cancelled or rescheduled because when he sees the club, he nixes the whole deal.i think aftershows depend on a lot of factors, and the final decision is made the day of the show.

The Hit 'n Run tour was the tour that was supposed to be for the smaller cities. Prince was going to go to the small hamlets and play the hits for folks and re-introduce them to his music.

It's too bad the Hit 'n Run plan didn't work out the way it was supposed to.

The new tour, One Nite Alone, is not designed for smaller cities. His Abe Lincoln comments, references to racial issues, and not playing a lot of hits would not be well received in Backwater, Ohio.

Im gonna go completely on a limb and say something different as to why i believe prince gives Atlanta special love everytime he rolls through. I believe he gives special love mainly because of the majority of the concert goers in Atlanta are African-Americans. Now at first this may sound silly, but think about it. Prince has always been an international rockstar and alot of times, (being black) I hear friends and family complain that they cant get with Prince so much because of all that "rock music" that he sings. It's always important for artists to gain acceptance by his or her own people. When I go to see Meshell N'degeocello play she always remarks on how it's good to see so many beautiful black faces in the crowd. That's not to alienate the non black folk, but it's like a self-gratifying acceptance that you can do the music that you want to play and garner the love and admiration of your people. Jimi Hendrix wanted it, Meshell wants it, im sure Lenny and Prince must want it. Just imagine being a black hardcore rap star and your only fan base was all japanese for instance. You'd long for the love of your own and when you get it, you make sure they have the greatest time on the planet, because you are...and everyone is happy to return next time.

just my $.02.

mrbags

daysofwild said:

Mauve said:[quote]

daysofwild said:

I think that Prince sets the tone for the soundchecks. When he has been playing or rehearsing the band at the soundchecks, I believe the fams are respectful and appreciative. When he stops playing and people start talking that's when the content of the soundcheck can get out of hand.

The simple solution would have been for him to play instead of talk and then he wouldn't have had to worry about any negativity.

Batdance said:

Nobody said Philly got dropped as a stop, what I said was that it was dropped as a place that he frequents quite as often as places like ATL, DC and NY.

The overall point is that the reason he continues to frequent places like ATL and DC with multiple shows is because no matter how often he plays, he sells out. In Philly, the July '97 show at First Union, while having a very good crowd, did not sell out... and more importantly the spring 1998 show at the Electric Factory did not sell out. DC sold out the same dates... so I'm just explaining why he'd schedule 3 shows again in DC... there is still pent up demand. As soon as he saturates these markets, he'll visit slighly less often. It all comes down to supply and demand... that's why places like Milwaukee and KC don't deserve the same number of shows as places like DC, NY, ATL [i[and[/i]Philly. Nobody is dissing Philly... it's a very supportive city compared to the two others I just mentioned.

And Batdance... the incident you mentioned from Club Egypt in 1997 was a joke... the L41A website perpetrated that story to get publicity. Prince has no personal hostility towards Philly.

The overall point, i.e. that a more equitable distribution of perks should be considered instead of just automatically giving them to the same cities over and over has been made and forwarded through the appropriate channels for consideration.

BanishedBrian said:[quote]

RavedIn2 said:

That's me! Prince fan for 20 years and finally last year traveled to St. Paul for the Celebration 2001 and saw him live for the first time. And shall I mention that I also flew to LA in 1998 in great anticipation of seeing him live for the first time EVER with 11th row seats center and the show was cancelled only minutes before it was to start.

Yes, I live in Alaska. As much as I would enjoy all the "perks" that the spoiled cities get, I cannot complain, but instead be thankful for what I have...his music!

Is an aftershow going to really enhance your life THAT much to invest all this energy and time complaining about not having one? Lets be thankful for what we have and be thankful that you don't HAVE to fly cross country to see him in concert.

feelingroovy said:[quote]

BanishedBrian said:

Unfortunately, I allowed myself to be dragged into a silly debate with someone who was throwing red herrings into the mix regarding the NPG Dance Co, Bud Selig, The Twins, "undeserving" cities etc.

As I said before, I have now voiced my feelings and opinions on this issue through the appropriate channels with the people who are in a position to consider making changes to the status quo.

In closing, I will say that there are those in this world who are content to sit and watch others at the table receiving a feast while they are just happy to accept whatever crumbs may fall from the table in their direction. I am not that kind of person.

I don't want anybody's crumbs. I want my share of the feast.