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Reply #30 posted 05/12/20 8:55am

CherryMoon57

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He also said 'work from home if you can', 'avoid public transport' and 'use your common sense'.

Obviously if going to work means standing in a crowded tube or even being unable to social distance at work, it is best to stay at home. I understood this perfectly, shame others don't. The furlough scheme has even been extended for another 4 months, what more do people want?

But I guess that's what passive thinking is about: always waiting for someone to decide what to do so you can then reject all responsibilities and blame them if things go wrong. Had he continued the lockdown, people would have probably complained even more and accused the government of taking 'too much control'. And now he is giving people an option to use their common sense, with a margin of freedom, and everyone is feeling lost without their mummy telling them what to do.

Ah and let's not forget that those very people moaning over the lack of planning and (pre)caution are ironically the same ones who had mocked all those cautious 'germophobes' who hadn't waited for a governmental signal in order to distance themselves at the very beginning.

Covid-19 or not, people just need to adapt, use their common sense and most of all: grow up.

[Edited 5/12/20 10:16am]

"Darkness cannot drive out darkness, only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate, only love can do that." Martin Luther King Jr.
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Reply #31 posted 05/12/20 10:13am

DiminutiveRock
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CherryMoon57 said:

He also said 'work from home if you can', 'avoid social transports' and 'use your common sense'.

Obviously if going to work means standing in a crowded tube or even being unable to social distance at work, it is best to stay at home. I understood this perfectly, shame others don't. The furlough scheme has even been extended for another 4 months, what more do people want?

But I guess that's what passive thinking is about: always waiting for someone to decide what to do so you can then reject all responsibilities and blame them if things go wrong. Had he continued the lockdown, people would have probably complained even more and accused the government of taking 'too much control'. And now he is giving people an option to use their common sense, with a margin of freedom, and everyone is feeling lost without their mummy telling them what to do.

Ah and let's not forget that those very people moaning over the lack of planning and (pre)caution are ironically the same ones who had mocked all those cautious 'germophobes' who hadn't waited for a governmental signal in order to distance themselves at the very beginning.

Covid-19 or not, people just need to adapt, use their common sense and most of all: grow up.

...and some will die. Oh, well!


neutral

"His wretched incompetence and imbecility have weakened the country, delighted our adversaries and terrified our friends. Never in the annals of American history has a bigger failure and joke risen as high as the @realDonaldTrump" - S. Schmidt
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Reply #32 posted 05/12/20 10:19am

CherryMoon57

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And many broke the lockdown rules... I am guessing that was his fault too?

"Darkness cannot drive out darkness, only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate, only love can do that." Martin Luther King Jr.
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Reply #33 posted 05/12/20 10:22am

CherryMoon57

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2elijah said:

Definitely seems many there are not taking the virus seriously, because they’re not wearing masks or social distancing.

nod

"Darkness cannot drive out darkness, only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate, only love can do that." Martin Luther King Jr.
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Reply #34 posted 05/12/20 10:29am

DiminutiveRock
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CherryMoon57 said:

And many broke the lockdown rules... I am guessing that was his fault too?

If there is no strong urging or requirement/enforcement by government to do so, then yeah - it's a free for all over there = some will die.

"His wretched incompetence and imbecility have weakened the country, delighted our adversaries and terrified our friends. Never in the annals of American history has a bigger failure and joke risen as high as the @realDonaldTrump" - S. Schmidt
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Reply #35 posted 05/12/20 10:37am

Lianachan

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CherryMoon57 said:

And many broke the lockdown rules... I am guessing that was his fault too?


His fault for them being confusing to lots of people, and for them being inconsistently enforced, yes. Some people are always going to be arseholes, granted, but let’s not diminish the role government have to play when dealing with an emergency of this magnitude. The UK government stands out as having administered among the worst responses in the world.
"Anti-intellectualism has been a constant thread winding its way through our political and cultural life, nurtured by the false notion that democracy means that "my ignorance is just as good as your knowledge"" ~ Isaac Asimov
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Reply #36 posted 05/12/20 10:40am

CherryMoon57

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DiminutiveRocker said:

CherryMoon57 said:

And many broke the lockdown rules... I am guessing that was his fault too?

If there is no strong urging or requirement/enforcement by government to do so, then yeah - it's a free for all over there = some will die.

It's people's choice. They have the advice, if they don't take it, that's on them. Fair deal. Plus the lockdown rules were strict enough in my opinion. Many even took to the media as soon as the police started enforcing those rules. Covid-19 is not some unknown entity any longer. People need to be more responsible. Boris cannot physically take every single British citizen by the hand to show them what to do or write a script for every individual situation. That's physically impossible.

"Darkness cannot drive out darkness, only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate, only love can do that." Martin Luther King Jr.
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Reply #37 posted 05/12/20 10:49am

CherryMoon57

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Lianachan said:

CherryMoon57 said:

And many broke the lockdown rules... I am guessing that was his fault too?

His fault for them being confusing to lots of people, and for them being inconsistently enforced, yes. Some people are always going to be arseholes, granted, but let’s not diminish the role government have to play when dealing with an emergency of this magnitude. The UK government stands out as having administered among the worst responses in the world.

Things certainly didn't go smoothly in any of the countries impacted by Covid-19. But, out of interest, how would you have responded if you had been in charge? What would you have done differently/better?

"Darkness cannot drive out darkness, only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate, only love can do that." Martin Luther King Jr.
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Reply #38 posted 05/12/20 11:02am

Lianachan

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CherryMoon57 said:



Lianachan said:


CherryMoon57 said:

And many broke the lockdown rules... I am guessing that was his fault too?



His fault for them being confusing to lots of people, and for them being inconsistently enforced, yes. Some people are always going to be arseholes, granted, but let’s not diminish the role government have to play when dealing with an emergency of this magnitude. The UK government stands out as having administered among the worst responses in the world.

Things certainly didn't go smoothly in any of the countries impacted by Covid-19. But, out of interest, how would you have responded if you had been in charge? What would you have done differently/better?



Well, I’m not a politician so it’s not up to me (and well-could-YOU-do-better is an irrelevant logical fallacy*). However, I wouldn’t have spent decades asset-stripping the health service and selling bits of it to my chums. As soon as the virus appeared on the global stage I would have started to prepare for it, learning from the experiences of the countries it affected on its way in. I’d make sure my communications to the population were honest and clear, not propaganda and lies. I’d make sure all guidance for the population was clearly stated and unambiguous. None of that is unrealistic to expect a government to achieve. Look to Nicola Sturgeon’s press conferences and compare them with the UK gov ones for a close to home example.

Edited to add - * actually, not sure if that is a specific fallacy, but it’s certainly not a good discussion technique. However, don’t think that’s what your intention was and sorry if I gave that impression.
[Edited 5/12/20 11:18am]
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Reply #39 posted 05/12/20 11:06am

DiminutiveRock
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CherryMoon57 said:

DiminutiveRocker said:

If there is no strong urging or requirement/enforcement by government to do so, then yeah - it's a free for all over there = some will die.

It's people's choice. They have the advice, if they don't take it, that's on them. Fair deal. Plus the lockdown rules were strict enough in my opinion. Many even took to the media as soon as the police started enforcing those rules. Covid-19 is not some unknown entity any longer. People need to be more responsible. Boris cannot physically take every single British citizen by the hand to show them what to do or write a script for every individual situation. That's physically impossible.


He has no responsibility other than to "advise" ? The government has clearly not convinced the public of the danger. Yeah,so let them go ahead and get sick and spread the virus and infect their loved ones and die. Then the economy will be in tip top shape!

clapping well, done!




[Edited 5/12/20 11:54am]

"His wretched incompetence and imbecility have weakened the country, delighted our adversaries and terrified our friends. Never in the annals of American history has a bigger failure and joke risen as high as the @realDonaldTrump" - S. Schmidt
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Reply #40 posted 05/12/20 11:25am

Lianachan

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DiminutiveRocker said:



CherryMoon57 said:




DiminutiveRocker said:




If there is no strong urging or requirement/enforcement by government to do so, then yeah - it's a free for all over there = some will die.



It's people's choice. They have the advice, if they don't take it, that's on them. Fair deal. Plus the lockdown rules were strict enough in my opinion. Many even took to the media as soon as the police started enforcing those rules. Covid-19 is not some unknown entity any longer. People need to be more responsible. Boris cannot physically take every single British citizen by the hand to show them what to do or write a script for every individual situation. That's physically impossible.




He has no respobnsibiolity other than to "advise" ? The government has clearly not convinced the public of the danger. Yeah,so let them go ahead and get sick and spread the virus and infect their loved ones and die. Then the economy will be in tip top shape!



The whole change to “be alert” is an attempt to shift blame onto the population. If you get infected and die, it’s your own fault for not being sufficiently alert and certainly nothing to do with the wonderful government who tried their best.... Also, ambiguous advice about work and upcoming changes to furlough payments (being reduced) are designed to starve people back to work whether it’s safe or not. Note that generally it’ll be working class people who are unable to work from home due to the nature of their employment, while middle and upper class people are more likely to be able to work from home and stay relatively safe.
"Anti-intellectualism has been a constant thread winding its way through our political and cultural life, nurtured by the false notion that democracy means that "my ignorance is just as good as your knowledge"" ~ Isaac Asimov
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Reply #41 posted 05/12/20 11:26am

CherryMoon57

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Lianachan said:

CherryMoon57 said:

Things certainly didn't go smoothly in any of the countries impacted by Covid-19. But, out of interest, how would you have responded if you had been in charge? What would you have done differently/better?

Well, I’m not a politician so it’s not up to me (and well-could-YOU-do-better is an irrelevant logical fallacy). However, I wouldn’t have spent decades asset-stripping the health service and selling bits of it to my chums. As soon as the virus appeared on the global stage I would have started to prepare for it, learning from the experiences of the countries it affected on its way in. I’d make sure my communications to the population were honest and clear, not propaganda and lies. I’d make sure all guidance for the population was clearly stated and unambiguous. None of that is unrealistic to expect a government to achieve. Look to Nicola Sturgeon’s press conferences and compare them with the UK gov ones for a close to home example.

The spread of the virus started much later in Scotland (I think the first case was identified on March 1st compared to 31st of January in England) so the two nations are at different stages right now. I am sure that when the time comes, Nicola will too ease things up a little and decide where to take it from there based on how the virus evolves. I don't think there is anything unclear with what Boris said about using caution and common sense. Perhaps it is the concept of 'common sense' that people have a problem with here, I don't know.

"Darkness cannot drive out darkness, only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate, only love can do that." Martin Luther King Jr.
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Reply #42 posted 05/12/20 11:34am

Lianachan

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CherryMoon57 said:



Lianachan said:


CherryMoon57 said:


Things certainly didn't go smoothly in any of the countries impacted by Covid-19. But, out of interest, how would you have responded if you had been in charge? What would you have done differently/better?



Well, I’m not a politician so it’s not up to me (and well-could-YOU-do-better is an irrelevant logical fallacy). However, I wouldn’t have spent decades asset-stripping the health service and selling bits of it to my chums. As soon as the virus appeared on the global stage I would have started to prepare for it, learning from the experiences of the countries it affected on its way in. I’d make sure my communications to the population were honest and clear, not propaganda and lies. I’d make sure all guidance for the population was clearly stated and unambiguous. None of that is unrealistic to expect a government to achieve. Look to Nicola Sturgeon’s press conferences and compare them with the UK gov ones for a close to home example.

The spread of the virus started much later in Scotland (I think the first case was identified on March 1st compared to 31st of January in England) so the two nations are at different stages right now. I am sure that when the time comes, Nicola will too ease things up a little and decide where to take it from there based on how the virus evolves. I don't think there is anything unclear with what Boris said about using caution and common sense. Perhaps it is the concept of 'common sense' that people have a problem with here, I don't know.



My point is a comparison of the clarity of the messages being conveyed from government, not the specific actions actually being taken. Yes, Scotland is behind England in the spread of the virus - this is why we still have more rigorous measures in place. If you think BoJo was clear in his recent announcement then you’re in a vanishingly small minority judging by the response to it I’ve seen across all platforms,
"Anti-intellectualism has been a constant thread winding its way through our political and cultural life, nurtured by the false notion that democracy means that "my ignorance is just as good as your knowledge"" ~ Isaac Asimov
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Reply #43 posted 05/12/20 3:23pm

CherryMoon57

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Lianachan said:

CherryMoon57 said:

The spread of the virus started much later in Scotland (I think the first case was identified on March 1st compared to 31st of January in England) so the two nations are at different stages right now. I am sure that when the time comes, Nicola will too ease things up a little and decide where to take it from there based on how the virus evolves. I don't think there is anything unclear with what Boris said about using caution and common sense. Perhaps it is the concept of 'common sense' that people have a problem with here, I don't know.

My point is a comparison of the clarity of the messages being conveyed from government, not the specific actions actually being taken. Yes, Scotland is behind England in the spread of the virus - this is why we still have more rigorous measures in place. If you think BoJo was clear in his recent announcement then you’re in a vanishingly small minority judging by the response to it I’ve seen across all platforms,

A progressive easing up of the lockdown is not as straightforward a process to organise as the lockdown itself therefore it is very hard to draw a clear cut list of instructions. Boris' 'Stay at home' message during the lockdown was as clear as Nicola's is now and the social distancing rule of 2 meters currently still apply for everyone... Let's wait and see what Nicola comes up with when Scotland's easing up time comes, then compare the two.

"Darkness cannot drive out darkness, only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate, only love can do that." Martin Luther King Jr.
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Reply #44 posted 05/12/20 3:52pm

DiminutiveRock
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Lianachan said:

DiminutiveRocker said:


He has no respobnsibiolity other than to "advise" ? The government has clearly not convinced the public of the danger. Yeah,so let them go ahead and get sick and spread the virus and infect their loved ones and die. Then the economy will be in tip top shape!

The whole change to “be alert” is an attempt to shift blame onto the population. If you get infected and die, it’s your own fault for not being sufficiently alert and certainly nothing to do with the wonderful government who tried their best.... Also, ambiguous advice about work and upcoming changes to furlough payments (being reduced) are designed to starve people back to work whether it’s safe or not. Note that generally it’ll be working class people who are unable to work from home due to the nature of their employment, while middle and upper class people are more likely to be able to work from home and stay relatively safe.

Exactly ^

"His wretched incompetence and imbecility have weakened the country, delighted our adversaries and terrified our friends. Never in the annals of American history has a bigger failure and joke risen as high as the @realDonaldTrump" - S. Schmidt
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Reply #45 posted 05/12/20 8:46pm

maplenpg

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CherryMoon57 said:

He also said 'work from home if you can', 'avoid public transport' and 'use your common sense'.

Obviously if going to work means standing in a crowded tube or even being unable to social distance at work, it is best to stay at home. I understood this perfectly, shame others don't. The furlough scheme has even been extended for another 4 months, what more do people want?

But I guess that's what passive thinking is about: always waiting for someone to decide what to do so you can then reject all responsibilities and blame them if things go wrong. Had he continued the lockdown, people would have probably complained even more and accused the government of taking 'too much control'. And now he is giving people an option to use their common sense, with a margin of freedom, and everyone is feeling lost without their mummy telling them what to do.

Ah and let's not forget that those very people moaning over the lack of planning and (pre)caution are ironically the same ones who had mocked all those cautious 'germophobes' who hadn't waited for a governmental signal in order to distance themselves at the very beginning.

Covid-19 or not, people just need to adapt, use their common sense and most of all: grow up.

[Edited 5/12/20 10:16am]

Wouldn't we live in a paradise if it were as easy as this? Wouldn't it be lovely if employers listened to employees who said they didn't think it was safe to go back, and employers all just went, "Okay then"?

There have been already people pressured into working in unsafe environments, there has been throughout, not least in the NHS on the covid wards, and the response has been appalling. People have died because they have continued working. It is absolutely the case that more people will die when they go back to work, and it is absolutely the case that right now most of those will be working class in manual jobs. And that is not on the people for not using common sense.

And speaking of common sense, bringing an abstract concept into a set of rules cannot work. Ever.

[Edited 5/12/20 20:54pm]

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Reply #46 posted 05/12/20 8:50pm

maplenpg

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Lianachan said:

CherryMoon57 said:

And many broke the lockdown rules... I am guessing that was his fault too?

His fault for them being confusing to lots of people, and for them being inconsistently enforced, yes. Some people are always going to be arseholes, granted, but let’s not diminish the role government have to play when dealing with an emergency of this magnitude. The UK government stands out as having administered among the worst responses in the world.

This. The speech on Sunday was appalling. Even Tory ministers have said so. And I just can't start on our response which has been failure after failure.

#JusticeForShukri http://chng.it/B5mNKrDrzK
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Reply #47 posted 05/12/20 8:52pm

maplenpg

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CherryMoon57 said:

Lianachan said:

CherryMoon57 said: Well, I’m not a politician so it’s not up to me (and well-could-YOU-do-better is an irrelevant logical fallacy). However, I wouldn’t have spent decades asset-stripping the health service and selling bits of it to my chums. As soon as the virus appeared on the global stage I would have started to prepare for it, learning from the experiences of the countries it affected on its way in. I’d make sure my communications to the population were honest and clear, not propaganda and lies. I’d make sure all guidance for the population was clearly stated and unambiguous. None of that is unrealistic to expect a government to achieve. Look to Nicola Sturgeon’s press conferences and compare them with the UK gov ones for a close to home example.

The spread of the virus started much later in Scotland (I think the first case was identified on March 1st compared to 31st of January in England) so the two nations are at different stages right now. I am sure that when the time comes, Nicola will too ease things up a little and decide where to take it from there based on how the virus evolves. I don't think there is anything unclear with what Boris said about using caution and common sense. Perhaps it is the concept of 'common sense' that people have a problem with here, I don't know.

And we all went into lockdown together, which proves how late we were going into lockdown.

#JusticeForShukri http://chng.it/B5mNKrDrzK
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Reply #48 posted 05/12/20 8:58pm

maplenpg

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Lianachan said:

CherryMoon57 said:

The spread of the virus started much later in Scotland (I think the first case was identified on March 1st compared to 31st of January in England) so the two nations are at different stages right now. I am sure that when the time comes, Nicola will too ease things up a little and decide where to take it from there based on how the virus evolves. I don't think there is anything unclear with what Boris said about using caution and common sense. Perhaps it is the concept of 'common sense' that people have a problem with here, I don't know.

My point is a comparison of the clarity of the messages being conveyed from government, not the specific actions actually being taken. Yes, Scotland is behind England in the spread of the virus - this is why we still have more rigorous measures in place. If you think BoJo was clear in his recent announcement then you’re in a vanishingly small minority judging by the response to it I’ve seen across all platforms,

I think the best example of this is masks. NS said wear masks, BJ said do what you want, but if you want you can wear a mask, or not wear a mask, it's all common sense, it's up to you to decide.

All over Europe, free masks are being given out at stations, in bus stops and elsewhere. Why can we not at least give out free, disposable masks on public transport, and make it compulsary that people wear them? Same in shops.

[Edited 5/12/20 20:59pm]

#JusticeForShukri http://chng.it/B5mNKrDrzK
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Reply #49 posted 05/12/20 9:03pm

maplenpg

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Finally, I agree with Peter Bone (never thought I'd say it), but BJ broke all sorts of rules putting the new plan out in the public domain before it was debated. This is a must see watch as to why what he is doing right now is wrong. And he's a Tory, so it's not partisan.


https://twitter.com/Chann...9304017923

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Reply #50 posted 05/13/20 3:26am

CherryMoon57

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maplenpg said:

CherryMoon57 said:

He also said 'work from home if you can', 'avoid public transport' and 'use your common sense'.

Obviously if going to work means standing in a crowded tube or even being unable to social distance at work, it is best to stay at home. I understood this perfectly, shame others don't. The furlough scheme has even been extended for another 4 months, what more do people want?

But I guess that's what passive thinking is about: always waiting for someone to decide what to do so you can then reject all responsibilities and blame them if things go wrong. Had he continued the lockdown, people would have probably complained even more and accused the government of taking 'too much control'. And now he is giving people an option to use their common sense, with a margin of freedom, and everyone is feeling lost without their mummy telling them what to do.

Ah and let's not forget that those very people moaning over the lack of planning and (pre)caution are ironically the same ones who had mocked all those cautious 'germophobes' who hadn't waited for a governmental signal in order to distance themselves at the very beginning.

Covid-19 or not, people just need to adapt, use their common sense and most of all: grow up.

[Edited 5/12/20 10:16am]

Wouldn't we live in a paradise if it were as easy as this? Wouldn't it be lovely if employers listened to employees who said they didn't think it was safe to go back, and employers all just went, "Okay then"?

There have been already people pressured into working in unsafe environments, there has been throughout, not least in the NHS on the covid wards, and the response has been appalling. People have died because they have continued working. It is absolutely the case that more people will die when they go back to work, and it is absolutely the case that right now most of those will be working class in manual jobs. And that is not on the people for not using common sense.

And speaking of common sense, bringing an abstract concept into a set of rules cannot work. Ever.

[Edited 5/12/20 20:54pm]

The issue of employers putting pressure on employees despite them being unsafe (or even ill) at work is not new and has nothing to do with Boris Johnson's speech. I have experienced it and you have too. It's everyone's duty and responsibility to know and exercise their rights whenever necessary. That's simply called the law, not 'paradise' or an 'abstract concept'.

[Edited 5/13/20 3:41am]

"Darkness cannot drive out darkness, only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate, only love can do that." Martin Luther King Jr.
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Reply #51 posted 05/13/20 3:29am

CherryMoon57

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maplenpg said:

Lianachan said:

His fault for them being confusing to lots of people, and for them being inconsistently enforced, yes. Some people are always going to be arseholes, granted, but let’s not diminish the role government have to play when dealing with an emergency of this magnitude. The UK government stands out as having administered among the worst responses in the world.

This. The speech on Sunday was appalling. Even Tory ministers have said so. And I just can't start on our response which has been failure after failure.


Here is the simplified version of his speech for those who need it:


_112235255_stages_lockdown_alt_may11_-3x640-nc.png

[Edited 5/13/20 3:40am]

"Darkness cannot drive out darkness, only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate, only love can do that." Martin Luther King Jr.
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Reply #52 posted 05/13/20 3:36am

CherryMoon57

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maplenpg said:

Lianachan said:

CherryMoon57 said: My point is a comparison of the clarity of the messages being conveyed from government, not the specific actions actually being taken. Yes, Scotland is behind England in the spread of the virus - this is why we still have more rigorous measures in place. If you think BoJo was clear in his recent announcement then you’re in a vanishingly small minority judging by the response to it I’ve seen across all platforms,

I think the best example of this is masks. NS said wear masks, BJ said do what you want, but if you want you can wear a mask, or not wear a mask, it's all common sense, it's up to you to decide.

All over Europe, free masks are being given out at stations, in bus stops and elsewhere. Why can we not at least give out free, disposable masks on public transport, and make it compulsary that people wear them? Same in shops.

[Edited 5/12/20 20:59pm]

Because if they are free - and people being people - these masks will end up being scattered anywhere and everywhere, adding risks of spreading the virus further thus making places unsafe as well as causing environmental hazard. As is already happening in the US: https://edition.cnn.com/2...index.html

[Edited 5/13/20 3:38am]

"Darkness cannot drive out darkness, only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate, only love can do that." Martin Luther King Jr.
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Reply #53 posted 05/13/20 6:27am

maplenpg

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CherryMoon57 said:

maplenpg said:

Wouldn't we live in a paradise if it were as easy as this? Wouldn't it be lovely if employers listened to employees who said they didn't think it was safe to go back, and employers all just went, "Okay then"?

There have been already people pressured into working in unsafe environments, there has been throughout, not least in the NHS on the covid wards, and the response has been appalling. People have died because they have continued working. It is absolutely the case that more people will die when they go back to work, and it is absolutely the case that right now most of those will be working class in manual jobs. And that is not on the people for not using common sense.

And speaking of common sense, bringing an abstract concept into a set of rules cannot work. Ever.

[Edited 5/12/20 20:54pm]

The issue of employers putting pressure on employees despite them being unsafe (or even ill) at work is not new and has nothing to do with Boris Johnson's speech. I have experienced it and you have too. It's everyone's duty and responsibility to know and exercise their rights whenever necessary. That's simply called the law, not 'paradise' or an 'abstract concept'.

[Edited 5/13/20 3:41am]

Of course employee rights have always been an issue, but when BJ turned down offers to join a EU scheme to buy PPE more than once, then failed to acquire enough, and then put pressure on the nurses to work without proper kit with people that had tested positive for a deadly virus, then there is a problem. More than a few nurses and doctors walked out, but the media stuck with the stories of clapping and free food. You can easily put staff in care homes in this bracket, except the people they were working with couldn't get tested.

#JusticeForShukri http://chng.it/B5mNKrDrzK
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Reply #54 posted 05/13/20 6:30am

maplenpg

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CherryMoon57 said:

maplenpg said:

This. The speech on Sunday was appalling. Even Tory ministers have said so. And I just can't start on our response which has been failure after failure.


Here is the simplified version of his speech for those who need it:


_112235255_stages_lockdown_alt_may11_-3x640-nc.png

[Edited 5/13/20 3:40am]

And wouldn't it have been better if he had gone for something this simple instead of the blather that we got.

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Reply #55 posted 05/13/20 6:35am

poppys

CherryMoon57 said:

maplenpg said:

I think the best example of this is masks. NS said wear masks, BJ said do what you want, but if you want you can wear a mask, or not wear a mask, it's all common sense, it's up to you to decide.

All over Europe, free masks are being given out at stations, in bus stops and elsewhere. Why can we not at least give out free, disposable masks on public transport, and make it compulsary that people wear them? Same in shops.

Because if they are free - and people being people - these masks will end up being scattered anywhere and everywhere, adding risks of spreading the virus further thus making places unsafe as well as causing environmental hazard. As is already happening in the US: https://edition.cnn.com/2...index.html


Only people who can buy masks should have them? Everyone is a possible carrier. What makes you think only people who get free masks will litter?

What I'm seeing is a clear split between people who can mostly stay home and people who can't. The people who can mostly stay home are making a lot of judgements about those whose services they still depend on. That is why every government needs TESTING - then we can begin to figure out who is safe with out all the personal bullshit.

"if you can't clap on the one, then don't clap at all"
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Reply #56 posted 05/13/20 6:46am

CherryMoon57

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poppys said:

CherryMoon57 said:

Because if they are free - and people being people - these masks will end up being scattered anywhere and everywhere, adding risks of spreading the virus further thus making places unsafe as well as causing environmental hazard. As is already happening in the US: https://edition.cnn.com/2...index.html


Only people who can buy masks should have them? Everyone is a possible carrier. What makes you think only people who get free masks will litter?

What I'm seeing is a clear split between people who can mostly stay home and people who can't. The people who can mostly stay home are making a lot of judgements about those whose services they still depend on. That is why every government needs TESTING - then we can begin to figure out who is safe with out all the personal bullshit.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-52609777

"Darkness cannot drive out darkness, only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate, only love can do that." Martin Luther King Jr.
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Reply #57 posted 05/13/20 6:52am

DiminutiveRock
er

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CherryMoon57 said:

poppys said:


Only people who can buy masks should have them? Everyone is a possible carrier. What makes you think only people who get free masks will litter?

What I'm seeing is a clear split between people who can mostly stay home and people who can't. The people who can mostly stay home are making a lot of judgements about those whose services they still depend on. That is why every government needs TESTING - then we can begin to figure out who is safe with out all the personal bullshit.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-52609777

Doctors have said that washable cloth face masks are better for people to use and just as effective as the disposable ones. Or just a hankerchief covering your nose and mouth.

"His wretched incompetence and imbecility have weakened the country, delighted our adversaries and terrified our friends. Never in the annals of American history has a bigger failure and joke risen as high as the @realDonaldTrump" - S. Schmidt
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Reply #58 posted 05/13/20 6:58am

CherryMoon57

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DiminutiveRocker said:

CherryMoon57 said:

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-52609777

Doctors have said that washable cloth face masks are better for people to use and just as effective as the disposable ones. Or just a hankerchief covering your nose and mouth.

thumbs up!

"Darkness cannot drive out darkness, only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate, only love can do that." Martin Luther King Jr.
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Reply #59 posted 05/13/20 7:18am

CherryMoon57

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maplenpg said:

And wouldn't it have been better if he had gone for something this simple instead of the blather that we got.

I agree that he can ramble on a bit (he's a Classics graduate after all), but he always does reinforce the main key points with a firmer tone of voice... which I much prefer to Raab's unnervingly quiet tone, in fact so quiet you can't even hear him.

"Darkness cannot drive out darkness, only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate, only love can do that." Martin Luther King Jr.
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