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Thread started 09/11/19 7:57am

2freaky4church
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The Right goes crazy again over the Dixie Chicks.

Yea, they defend free speech my eye:

https://www.rollingstone....io-881632/

Their album should be called Fuck Trump, that'll get em.

All you others say Hell Yea!! woot!
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Reply #1 posted 09/11/19 8:08am

guitarslinger4
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People were prissy little bitches about the Dixie chicks when it happened, but the DC's should have known their audience better.
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Reply #2 posted 09/11/19 8:10am

2freaky4church
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You admitting they don't believe in free speech? Remember when Clear Channel banned a bunch of songs, even Imagine?

All you others say Hell Yea!! woot!
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Reply #3 posted 09/11/19 8:56am

poppys

16 years ago and the McCarthy card is still being played? Why didn't they just stay in their lane like Lady Antebellum? (sarcasm, admit I just don't like their name)

[Edited 9/11/19 11:24am]

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Reply #4 posted 09/11/19 9:29am

2elijah

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So in other words, they can only make political-related comments that don’t make some crazy righties’ or their audiences’ conscience uncomfortable. They shouldn’t be attacked for expressing how they feel about any President’s decision.
[Edited 9/11/19 9:32am]
“Uncomfortable conversations creates change” — Anonymous
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Reply #5 posted 09/11/19 10:26am

jjhunsecker

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2elijah said:

So in other words, they can only make political-related comments that don’t make some crazy righties’ or their audiences’ conscience uncomfortable. They shouldn’t be attacked for expressing how they feel about any President’s decision. [Edited 9/11/19 9:32am]

Exactly, just because they were a "country" act doesn't mean that they have to fall into the stereotype that all of those acts are "Conservative", or just keep quiet to appease their audience. Plus they have many fans (myself included) who totally agree with them

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Reply #6 posted 09/11/19 2:26pm

guitarslinger4
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2elijah said:

So in other words, they can only make political-related comments that don’t make some crazy righties’ or their audiences’ conscience uncomfortable. They shouldn’t be attacked for expressing how they feel about any President’s decision. [Edited 9/11/19 9:32am]


No one's saying you can't do it, but when your audience is made up of primarily people who voted for the president you're shitting on, you should expect blowback. Granted, the blowback they got was way worse than it should have been, but they were foolish to think they weren't going to get clapped for saying what they said.

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Reply #7 posted 09/11/19 2:26pm

OnlyNDaUsa

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2freaky4church1 said:

You admitting they don't believe in free speech? Remember when Clear Channel banned a bunch of songs, even Imagine?

he seems to be exercising free speech. same with people complaining. why are you mad that they are expressing themselves?

yes there is a line... like when you posted the Noam Chomsky video (that you do not seem to agree with him on) when it becomes vocative.. that is when there is violence or threats or even protest that have the effect of prevented said speech or the experience of it.

If "Assault" rifles are banned... COPS first! If they want to TRY to take them from the PEOPLE they should set the example!
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Reply #8 posted 09/11/19 2:29pm

guitarslinger4
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jjhunsecker said:

2elijah said:

So in other words, they can only make political-related comments that don’t make some crazy righties’ or their audiences’ conscience uncomfortable. They shouldn’t be attacked for expressing how they feel about any President’s decision. [Edited 9/11/19 9:32am]

Exactly, just because they were a "country" act doesn't mean that they have to fall into the stereotype that all of those acts are "Conservative", or just keep quiet to appease their audience. Plus they have many fans (myself included) who totally agree with them


IMO country artists are the ones who SHOULD be speaking up more because their audience is usually one of the ones that gets shit on hardest by Washington policy. There are actually several country acts I know of that lean more democrat (Toby Keith is actually one of them believe it or not!) but even if the audience could handle them speaking up, there's a good chance advertisers or radio would have a fit in anticipation of the assumed blowback they think the audience would dish up.

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Reply #9 posted 09/11/19 2:30pm

OnlyNDaUsa

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jjhunsecker said:

2elijah said:

So in other words, they can only make political-related comments that don’t make some crazy righties’ or their audiences’ conscience uncomfortable. They shouldn’t be attacked for expressing how they feel about any President’s decision. [Edited 9/11/19 9:32am]

Exactly, just because they were a "country" act doesn't mean that they have to fall into the stereotype that all of those acts are "Conservative", or just keep quiet to appease their audience. Plus they have many fans (myself included) who totally agree with them

yet a Conservative who is a 'minority' often attacked be their own for steeping out of line. other use ethnic or race based slurs and then hide behind their own victim-hood or make excuses for others that do.

If "Assault" rifles are banned... COPS first! If they want to TRY to take them from the PEOPLE they should set the example!
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Reply #10 posted 09/11/19 3:05pm

jjhunsecker

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Nobody has an issue with a minority group member who is "conservative"...this is a myth propagated by angry right wingers... In fact, many Black and Latino and Asian people have always been conservative, especially those who are very religious or have been in the military .

What many of us DO have an issue with are minority members who either downplay or excuse racism and other forms of discrimination perpetrated by other conservatives , or allow themselves to be used as tokens , or even worse, as mouthpieces to attack the majority of their own people

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Reply #11 posted 09/11/19 3:11pm

jjhunsecker

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guitarslinger44 said:

jjhunsecker said:

Exactly, just because they were a "country" act doesn't mean that they have to fall into the stereotype that all of those acts are "Conservative", or just keep quiet to appease their audience. Plus they have many fans (myself included) who totally agree with them


IMO country artists are the ones who SHOULD be speaking up more because their audience is usually one of the ones that gets shit on hardest by Washington policy. There are actually several country acts I know of that lean more democrat (Toby Keith is actually one of them believe it or not!) but even if the audience could handle them speaking up, there's a good chance advertisers or radio would have a fit in anticipation of the assumed blowback they think the audience would dish up.

There was a book a few years ago on the politics of Country Music. They mentioned in the book that the executives at the labels were generally more liberal and voted Democratically more often than the artists- I suspect that because the executives are probably more educated and worldly (Though there are some Country stars , who like you pointed out, are probably pretty liberal- Tim McGraw and Faith Hill for example, and probably Garth Brooks and Trisha Yearwood, and certainly Kasey Musgraves)

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Reply #12 posted 09/11/19 3:23pm

OnlyNDaUsa

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jjhunsecker said:

Nobody has an issue with a minority group member who is "conservative"...this is a myth propagated by angry right wingers... In fact, many Black and Latino and Asian people have always been conservative, especially those who are very religious or have been in the military .

What many of us DO have an issue with are minority members who either downplay or excuse racism and other forms of discrimination perpetrated by other conservatives , or allow themselves to be used as tokens , or even worse, as mouthpieces to attack the majority of their own people

That's a myth...oh wait no it's real.

If "Assault" rifles are banned... COPS first! If they want to TRY to take them from the PEOPLE they should set the example!
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Reply #13 posted 09/11/19 3:25pm

guitarslinger4
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jjhunsecker said:

Nobody has an issue with a minority group member who is "conservative"...this is a myth propagated by angry right wingers... In fact, many Black and Latino and Asian people have always been conservative, especially those who are very religious or have been in the military .

What many of us DO have an issue with are minority members who either downplay or excuse racism and other forms of discrimination perpetrated by other conservatives , or allow themselves to be used as tokens , or even worse, as mouthpieces to attack the majority of their own people


Only's not wrong though, I can't count the number of times I heard people refer to Ben Carson, Herman Cain, Marco Rubio, even friends of mine who are Mexican or black as uncle toms, tio tomas, or whatever else just for not toeing the line of being all in for the democrats. I'd agree that there's a bit of a conservative streak to a lot of non-whites, but it seems like if those folks decide to part with the herd and vote for anyone but a Democrat, they hear about it.

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Reply #14 posted 09/11/19 3:26pm

guitarslinger4
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jjhunsecker said:

guitarslinger44 said:


IMO country artists are the ones who SHOULD be speaking up more because their audience is usually one of the ones that gets shit on hardest by Washington policy. There are actually several country acts I know of that lean more democrat (Toby Keith is actually one of them believe it or not!) but even if the audience could handle them speaking up, there's a good chance advertisers or radio would have a fit in anticipation of the assumed blowback they think the audience would dish up.

There was a book a few years ago on the politics of Country Music. They mentioned in the book that the executives at the labels were generally more liberal and voted Democratically more often than the artists- I suspect that because the executives are probably more educated and worldly (Though there are some Country stars , who like you pointed out, are probably pretty liberal- Tim McGraw and Faith Hill for example, and probably Garth Brooks and Trisha Yearwood, and certainly Kasey Musgraves)


There are still quite a few conservative people among the ranks of the artists, but it isn't like it used to be. Most of the artists have been to college, are from more upscale backgrounds, or just aren't straight up hicks lot a lot of them used to be.

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Reply #15 posted 09/11/19 3:33pm

jjhunsecker

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guitarslinger44 said:

jjhunsecker said:

Nobody has an issue with a minority group member who is "conservative"...this is a myth propagated by angry right wingers... In fact, many Black and Latino and Asian people have always been conservative, especially those who are very religious or have been in the military .

What many of us DO have an issue with are minority members who either downplay or excuse racism and other forms of discrimination perpetrated by other conservatives , or allow themselves to be used as tokens , or even worse, as mouthpieces to attack the majority of their own people


Only's not wrong though, I can't count the number of times I heard people refer to Ben Carson, Herman Cain, Marco Rubio, even friends of mine who are Mexican or black as uncle toms, tio tomas, or whatever else just for not toeing the line of being all in for the democrats. I'd agree that there's a bit of a conservative streak to a lot of non-whites, but it seems like if those folks decide to part with the herd and vote for anyone but a Democrat, they hear about it.

Part of the problem is that you never hear Ben Carson or Herman Cain speak out against White racism, especially when it comes from Conservative Republicans.

On the other hand, Black conservatives like Condi Rice and Colin Powell and Michael Steele are generally respected by their communities, even those who don't totally agree with their politics, because THEY are willing to stand up against bigotry and racism, and not pretend it doesn't exist.


The bottom line is, there ARE "Uncle Toms" and "Uncle Tomales" out there...it's rooted in a lot more than just being "conservative".

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Reply #16 posted 09/11/19 3:35pm

jjhunsecker

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guitarslinger44 said:

jjhunsecker said:

There was a book a few years ago on the politics of Country Music. They mentioned in the book that the executives at the labels were generally more liberal and voted Democratically more often than the artists- I suspect that because the executives are probably more educated and worldly (Though there are some Country stars , who like you pointed out, are probably pretty liberal- Tim McGraw and Faith Hill for example, and probably Garth Brooks and Trisha Yearwood, and certainly Kasey Musgraves)


There are still quite a few conservative people among the ranks of the artists, but it isn't like it used to be. Most of the artists have been to college, are from more upscale backgrounds, or just aren't straight up hicks lot a lot of them used to be.

I agree, and even provided some examples (and I forgot to include Steve Earle, and of course, Willie Nelson, and even in many respects, the great Johnny Cash)

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Reply #17 posted 09/11/19 3:42pm

guitarslinger4
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jjhunsecker said:

guitarslinger44 said:


Only's not wrong though, I can't count the number of times I heard people refer to Ben Carson, Herman Cain, Marco Rubio, even friends of mine who are Mexican or black as uncle toms, tio tomas, or whatever else just for not toeing the line of being all in for the democrats. I'd agree that there's a bit of a conservative streak to a lot of non-whites, but it seems like if those folks decide to part with the herd and vote for anyone but a Democrat, they hear about it.

Part of the problem is that you never hear Ben Carson or Herman Cain speak out against White racism, especially when it comes from Conservative Republicans.

On the other hand, Black conservatives like Condi Rice and Colin Powell and Michael Steele are generally respected by their communities, even those who don't totally agree with their politics, because THEY are willing to stand up against bigotry and racism, and not pretend it doesn't exist.


The bottom line is, there ARE "Uncle Toms" and "Uncle Tomales" out there...it's rooted in a lot more than just being "conservative".


Why do Ben Carson or Herman Cain HAVE to speak out against racism in order to be seen as credible among their ethnic groups? Isn't that one of those things that people get upset about, certain groups having to be treated as monolith just to be seen as "one of us?"


I've heard quite the opposite about Condi Rice, at least I remember hearing a lot of black folks shit on her when she was working for Bush.

i get there are Uncle Ruckus types but why is every member of a given group REQUIRED to do it? It's like this unwritten rule that EVERY black comedian has to do jokes about racism. It's fine if they do, but they don't, does that mean they're somehow less legit?

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Reply #18 posted 09/11/19 3:45pm

jjhunsecker

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guitarslinger44 said:

jjhunsecker said:

Part of the problem is that you never hear Ben Carson or Herman Cain speak out against White racism, especially when it comes from Conservative Republicans.

On the other hand, Black conservatives like Condi Rice and Colin Powell and Michael Steele are generally respected by their communities, even those who don't totally agree with their politics, because THEY are willing to stand up against bigotry and racism, and not pretend it doesn't exist.


The bottom line is, there ARE "Uncle Toms" and "Uncle Tomales" out there...it's rooted in a lot more than just being "conservative".


Why do Ben Carson or Herman Cain HAVE to speak out against racism in order to be seen as credible among their ethnic groups? Isn't that one of those things that people get upset about, certain groups having to be treated as monolith just to be seen as "one of us?"


I've heard quite the opposite about Condi Rice, at least I remember hearing a lot of black folks shit on her when she was working for Bush.

i get there are Uncle Ruckus types but why is every member of a given group REQUIRED to do it? It's like this unwritten rule that EVERY black comedian has to do jokes about racism. It's fine if they do, but they don't, does that mean they're somehow less legit?

Because racism is a part of the lives of EVERY Black person in America. If someone is in a prominent position, then they need to acknowledge that and not pretend it doesn't exist...at least if they want their respect and even support

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Reply #19 posted 09/11/19 3:49pm

guitarslinger4
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jjhunsecker said:

guitarslinger44 said:


Why do Ben Carson or Herman Cain HAVE to speak out against racism in order to be seen as credible among their ethnic groups? Isn't that one of those things that people get upset about, certain groups having to be treated as monolith just to be seen as "one of us?"


I've heard quite the opposite about Condi Rice, at least I remember hearing a lot of black folks shit on her when she was working for Bush.

i get there are Uncle Ruckus types but why is every member of a given group REQUIRED to do it? It's like this unwritten rule that EVERY black comedian has to do jokes about racism. It's fine if they do, but they don't, does that mean they're somehow less legit?

Because racism is a part of the lives of EVERY Black person in America. If someone is in a prominent position, then they need to acknowledge that and not pretend it doesn't exist...at least if they want their respect and even support


I get that, but why does EVERY black person need to jump up on that soap box? Isn't that pigeonholing them? In essence, "you're only TRULY black if you've been a victim of racism and you talk about it?"

I'm just trying to understand is all.

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Reply #20 posted 09/11/19 4:22pm

poppys

I'm trying to understand why SIXTEEN years after the fact, people are still hating on the Dixie Chicks for singing background on a record.

Because they opposed what WAS a stupid ass war.

I saw Steve Earle live the same year - 2003 - and he had a giant oil drum with WMD painted on it front and center onstage. He raved and beat the hell out of that thing during the entire show as an anti-war protest. Funny - he still has a career. Just played Preservation Hall down here a few months ago.

[Edited 9/11/19 16:26pm]

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Reply #21 posted 09/11/19 4:28pm

OnlyNDaUsa

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jjhunsecker said:

guitarslinger44 said:


There are still quite a few conservative people among the ranks of the artists, but it isn't like it used to be. Most of the artists have been to college, are from more upscale backgrounds, or just aren't straight up hicks lot a lot of them used to be.

I agree, and even provided some examples (and I forgot to include Steve Earle, and of course, Willie Nelson, and even in many respects, the great Johnny Cash)

the bigot often has a few token friends

If "Assault" rifles are banned... COPS first! If they want to TRY to take them from the PEOPLE they should set the example!
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Reply #22 posted 09/11/19 4:30pm

poppys

jjhunsecker said:

Because racism is a part of the lives of EVERY Black person in America. If someone is in a prominent position, then they need to acknowledge that and not pretend it doesn't exist...at least if they want their respect and even support


How hard is that to get? It's pretty obvious - even to some white people.

[Edited 9/11/19 16:36pm]

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Reply #23 posted 09/11/19 4:49pm

guitarslinger4
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poppys said:

I'm trying to understand why SIXTEEN years after the fact, people are still hating on the Dixie Chicks for singing background on a record.

Because they opposed what WAS a stupid ass war.

I saw Steve Earle live the same year - 2003 - and he had a giant oil drum with WMD painted on it front and center onstage. He raved and beat the hell out of that thing during the entire show as an anti-war protest. Funny - he still has a career. Just played Preservation Hall down here a few months ago.

[Edited 9/11/19 16:26pm]


Steve has a completely different audience than the DCs for the most part. His audience knows what they're getting when they dig into his music.

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Reply #24 posted 09/11/19 4:50pm

guitarslinger4
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poppys said:

jjhunsecker said:

Because racism is a part of the lives of EVERY Black person in America. If someone is in a prominent position, then they need to acknowledge that and not pretend it doesn't exist...at least if they want their respect and even support


How hard is that to get? It's pretty obvious - even to some white people.

[Edited 9/11/19 16:36pm]


Reread my post. It's not that I don't know or understand that racism affects every black person, it's just that I don't understand why a black person who ascends has to soapbox about it in order to been seen as "legit" to their own community.

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Reply #25 posted 09/11/19 5:00pm

OnlyNDaUsa

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poppys said:

jjhunsecker said:

Because racism is a part of the lives of EVERY Black person in America. If someone is in a prominent position, then they need to acknowledge that and not pretend it doesn't exist...at least if they want their respect and even support


How hard is that to get? It's pretty obvious - even to some white people.

[Edited 9/11/19 16:36pm]

yeah and? what does that have to do with anything? why do some get to decide how someone should react.

If "Assault" rifles are banned... COPS first! If they want to TRY to take them from the PEOPLE they should set the example!
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Reply #26 posted 09/11/19 5:19pm

jjhunsecker

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guitarslinger44 said:

jjhunsecker said:

Because racism is a part of the lives of EVERY Black person in America. If someone is in a prominent position, then they need to acknowledge that and not pretend it doesn't exist...at least if they want their respect and even support


I get that, but why does EVERY black person need to jump up on that soap box? Isn't that pigeonholing them? In essence, "you're only TRULY black if you've been a victim of racism and you talk about it?"

I'm just trying to understand is all.

They don't HAVE to...they only need to do it if they want the respect and support of most of the Black community (or Latino community if that is a factor). There can be a "liberal" solution to racial inequality and bias, there can be a "conservative" solution to racial inequality and bias. But don't get up there and pretend that racial inequality and bias DOESN'T exist, or work for and with those who are helping to fan the flames of hatred and discrimination.



BUT...as I have said before, generally White Conservatives like and support minorities if they (the Black or Hispanic in question), does NOT have a substantial following or support amongst their own group. It's like : "I don't mind Black people....as long as they don't ever bring up that racism or slavery or police brutality or inequality stuff"....and there are minorities who will try to play to THAT audience

[Edited 9/11/19 23:54pm]

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Reply #27 posted 09/11/19 6:16pm

poppys

One of the reasons Steve Earle gets a pass and the Dixie Chicks don't - is because they're CHICKS.

And, since Conservatism and Race is now a part of this thread, WHY is Republican Congressman Steve King - in office for the same SIXTEEN years spouting blatantly racist crap to the point of being repriminanded multiple times by his own party - still getting elected??? Talk about a soapbox. He needs his mouth washed out every damn day.

Meanwhile, the Dixie Chick's careers are still sidelined for having an opinion about an unpopular war that was a complete fabrication from the start. Now they're getting beat up again. Double standard.

[Edited 9/11/19 19:17pm]

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Reply #28 posted 09/11/19 11:47pm

jjhunsecker

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poppys said:

One of the reasons Steve Earle gets a pass and the Dixie Chicks don't - is because they're CHICKS.

And, since Conservatism and Race is now a part of this thread, WHY is Republican Congressman Steve King - in office for the same SIXTEEN years spouting blatantly racist crap to the point of being repriminanded multiple times by his own party - still getting elected??? Talk about a soapbox. He needs his mouth washed out every damn day.

Meanwhile, the Dixie Chick's careers are still sidelined for having an opinion about an unpopular war that was a complete fabrication from the start. Now they're getting beat up again. Double standard.

[Edited 9/11/19 19:17pm]

I would suspect that was a large part of it...."Shut up and Sing !"

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Reply #29 posted 09/12/19 3:37am

jaawwnn

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I had no idea the Dixie Chicks were still blacklisted! I thought all the MAGA heads were isolationists in 2019 anyway?

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