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Reply #330 posted 08/13/19 9:06pm

IanRG

CherryMoon57 said:

IanRG said:

Do you even know why you are still arguing?

.

I was the person who raised that we can learn from the NZ response. The NZ response was not to blame the media as you obsessed with doing. It was to starve the murder/suiciders of oxygen to promote themselves or their cause/manifesto/agenda so the focus was on standing together as one to care for and protect the victims. It is possible for media to be part of the solution without needing to be blamed for being part of the problem. This is just slavishly following the president's spiel. The police can do better - this does not make them part of the problem. The community can do better so less people feel isolated and threatened and turn to extremist ideologies, especially far right white supremacists ones, but this does not mean that the communities are part of problem. The mental health services can do a better job to identify and assist people with mental health issues in general but this doe not mean they are part of problem. And I can go on.

.

The only place where we are disagreeing is you want the media to be seen as part of the problem. I have agreed that certain parts of the media - extremist, generally far right hate sites etc are part of the problem when they actively promote racism and violence. But cameras following OJ on the TV is an example of how TV inspires people to attempt murder/suicides of this type? Give me a break.

.

I don't think how trump behaves influences people: I believe that when so many of these murder/suiciders act on what trump says and they cite his rhetoric and encouragments to violence as why they did the violence then this is part of the reason they did the violence. This is not contracted by me saying the media, by reporting their horror over murder/suicides, is not to blame for these murder/suicides, however if they report this horror in line with what NZ did, then this change in focus will starve the perp of the oxygen they seek to justify their selfish violent acts.

.

You, at this point are just trolling. The only time I have ever used the term 'invalid' was specifically and only in regards to the demand we only ever compare countries with similar sized US states. I showed that this was an invalid argument because the figures are already adjusted for polulation differences. All that following that demand did was that instead of the US being the most dangerous of the 22 high income nations by an order of magnitude in terms of deaths by gun violence per 100,000 people it became all the 49 continental states are the 49 most dangerous places of the 71 high income nations and US states in terms of death by gun violence per 100,000 people. Proof that this was invalid argument came when the response to me pointing out this was to change the demand to the US cannot be compared to any where.

[Edited 8/13/19 14:11pm]


For the sake of not repeating myself, I will just reply to the part we have not finished discussing yet (in bold).

O.J. Simpson was already a national hero and a famous actor prior to being arrested and accused of two murders. Making the whole thing into a real life drama was of course a dangerous path to tread on. He still had fans, many young people looked up to him as a football celebrity. And despite the accusations, millions gave him their entire support and he was cheered by crowds wherever his car passed during the chase.

And boy did he get media attention? The chase and lengthy trial caused the biggest media hysteria in the whole history of the United States. His celebrity status increased ten times after that because until then, many outside of the States didn't know who he was while after that most did. The event literaly paved the way for the 24 hours news that today's society feeds off daily.

No doubt all of that would have got some vulnerable minds thinking.

.

Thinking what? An already famous sportsman and actor became more famous in court case, there for I can get famous by shooting up a school, mall or festival?

.

The argument you were making was that the media is partly to blame. Can you name one person who cited the OJ trial as their reason for committing one of these types of murder suicides? This is not an unreasonable request - Most have cited other reasons.

[Edited 8/13/19 21:47pm]

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Reply #331 posted 08/14/19 2:16am

CherryMoon57

avatar

^ I'll let you ponder over it Ian, I know you can do it!

Open your heart open your mind
A train is leaving all day
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Reply #332 posted 08/14/19 7:14am

OldFriends4Sal
e

avatar

moderator

IanRG said:

OldFriends4Sale said:

Europe is a continent of 44 countries

the USA is a country of 50 states

.

the only way to change is to become like China.
Even Prince when talking about Muslim societies said, it was easier, 1 religion 1 government etc everyones happy, no confusion.

.

Firearms control was inherited during British and Portuguese rule and more or less retained today. Under the Section 13 of Cap 238 Firearms and Ammunition Ordinance of the Hong Kong law, unrestricted firearms and ammunition requires a license. Those found in possession without a license could be fined HKD$100,000 and imprisonment for up to 14 years.
Illegal possession or sale of firearms may result in a minimum punishment of 3 years in prison, with the maximum being the death penalty.

.

China's government. the same place that is taking down Islamic scripting in place of Chinese? The same place persecuting Muslims and Christians? The Chinese government has been variously described as communist and socialist, but also as authoritarian and corporatist, with heavy restrictions in many areas, most notably against free access to the Internet, freedom of the press, freedom of assembly, the right to have children, free formation of social organizations and freedom of religion. Its current political, ideological and economic system has been termed by its leaders as the "people's democratic dictatorship", "socialism with Chinese characteristics" (which is Marxism adapted to Chinese circumstances) and the "socialist market economy" respectively

The government of the People's Republic of China officially espouses state atheism, and has conducted antireligious campaigns to this end. Religious affairs and issues in the country are overseen by the State Administration for ...us Affairs.Freedom of religion is guaranteed by China's constitution, although religious organizations that lack official approval can be subject to state persecution.
.
Canada of course is a large land mass, but the land is not pupulated with humans as China or the USA or England.

.

Canada is approximately 9,984,670 sq km, while

United States is approximately 9,833,517 sq km.

Meanwhile, the population of Canada is ~35.6 million people (291.0 million more people live in United States).
.
As of 1 January 2019, the population of Canada was estimated to be 37 million people.

As of summer 2019, the population of the United States is approximately 330 million.

.

The comparing of countries just doesn't work.

.

Let it go. The internationally agreed measure of gun violence deaths per 100,000 people adjusts for this and then you can consider the differences between each unique state or nation. Please stop resurrecting 5 month old arguments over and over.

Let go of the comparisons.

It is silly.

and again Europe is a continent of countries, how do you compare a continent to a country.

The comparisons don't work.

Les enfants qui mentent ne vont pas au paradis

#IDEFINEME #ALBUMSSTILLMATTER

A Liar Shall Not Tarry In My Presence

What's the matter with your life
Is poverty bringing U down?
Is the mailman jerking U 'round?
Did he put your million dollar check
In someone else's box?
Tell me, what's the m
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Reply #333 posted 08/14/19 1:19pm

IanRG

OldFriends4Sale said:

IanRG said:

.

Let it go. The internationally agreed measure of gun violence deaths per 100,000 people adjusts for this and then you can consider the differences between each unique state or nation. Please stop resurrecting 5 month old arguments over and over.

Let go of the comparisons.

It is silly.

and again Europe is a continent of countries, how do you compare a continent to a country.

The comparisons don't work.

Les enfants qui mentent ne vont pas au paradis

.

"Children who lie don't go to heaven". Your really are being highly offensive here. I have never lied here. I showed you where your have been making these statements starting 5 months ago. - The only liar who seeks to tarry in your presence is yourself.

.

I stand by the internationally accepted ways of comparing different groups of people as used by criminologist, medical researchers, sociologists etc, etc.

.

You said I can't compare US to other countries because is really a collection of 50 different states with their own government and a Federal government. The EU (I never said Europe) is collection of different countries each with their own government and a federal parliament. The US fits inbetween a single state nation and a federation of countries with federal parliament. You are clutching at straws.

.

The comparisons work and are based on scales and methods applied internationally by professionals on a daily basis for many different scientific, economics and social analysis purposes.

.

As a result of your false accusations and your offensive nature, I have no intention of further engaging with you on this. Let it go.

[Edited 8/14/19 13:59pm]

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Reply #334 posted 08/14/19 1:26pm

IanRG

CherryMoon57 said:

^ I'll let you ponder over it Ian, I know you can do it!

.

Pondering completed long ago:

.

When a person says I did the murder/suicide in support of these people and as a result of these previous actions ... and the alternative is I just wanted to be as famous as OJ but never said anything like this and showed no apparent interest in this, then I am prepared to dismiss the reporting of the OJ court case as a reason for the media being partly to blame for the recent mass shootings.

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Reply #335 posted 08/14/19 3:23pm

OldFriends4Sal
e

avatar

moderator

IanRG said:

OldFriends4Sale said:

Let go of the comparisons.

It is silly.

and again Europe is a continent of countries, how do you compare a continent to a country.

The comparisons don't work.

Les enfants qui mentent ne vont pas au paradis

.

"Children who lie don't go to heaven". Your really are being highly offensive here. I have never lied here. I showed you where your have been making these statements starting 5 months ago. - The only liar who seeks to tarry in your presence is yourself.

.

I stand by the internationally accepted ways of comparing different groups of people as used by criminologist, medical researchers, sociologists etc, etc.

.

You said I can't compare US to other countries because is really a collection of 50 different states with their own government and a Federal government. The EU (I never said Europe) is collection of different countries each with their own government and a federal parliament. The US fits inbetween a single state nation and a federation of countries with federal parliament. You are clutching at straws.

.

The comparisons work and are based on scales and methods applied internationally by professionals on a daily basis for many different scientific, economics and social analysis purposes.

.

As a result of your false accusations and your offensive nature, I have no intention of further engaging with you on this. Let it go.

[Edited 8/14/19 13:59pm]

post #309

Europe (EU) is 4.4 million square kilometres and has a population 507 million. The USA is a bit more than double this area but has a lot fewer 329 million people.

.

It doesn't work.

.

How do you compare a communistic country with a democratic country?

Do you understand China's politics? Are you even following what is happening in China and Russia and what the government is threatening those who took part in the protests? You cannot compare.


And in recent years,

Chinese authorities have been encroaching

on the rights supposedly guaranteed to Hong Kongers

under the “one country, two systems” agreement.

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/newsopinion/james-carafano-what-hong-kong-unrest-tells-us-about-chinas-plans-for-the-rest-of-the-world/ar-AAFKDcD?ocid=msn360

.

The Chinese government has been variously described as communist and socialist, but also as authoritarian and corporatist, with heavy restrictions in many areas, most notably against free access to the Internet, freedom of the press, freedom of assembly, the right to have children, free formation of social organizations and freedom of religion. Its current political, ideological and economic system has been termed by its leaders as the "people's democratic dictatorship", "socialism with Chinese characteristics" (which is Marxism adapted to Chinese circumstances) and the "socialist market economy" respectively

The government of the People's Republic of China officially espouses state atheism, and has conducted antireligious campaigns to this end. Religious affairs and issues in the country are overseen by the State Administration for ...us Affairs.Freedom of religion is guaranteed by China's constitution, although religious organizations that lack official approval can be subject to state persecution.

#IDEFINEME #ALBUMSSTILLMATTER

A Liar Shall Not Tarry In My Presence

What's the matter with your life
Is poverty bringing U down?
Is the mailman jerking U 'round?
Did he put your million dollar check
In someone else's box?
Tell me, what's the m
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Reply #336 posted 08/14/19 4:27pm

IanRG

OldFriends4Sale said:



IanRG said:




OldFriends4Sale said:




Let go of the comparisons.



It is silly.



and again Europe is a continent of countries, how do you compare a continent to a country.



The comparisons don't work.



Les enfants qui mentent ne vont pas au paradis




.


"Children who lie don't go to heaven". Your really are being highly offensive here. I have never lied here. I showed you where your have been making these statements starting 5 months ago. - The only liar who seeks to tarry in your presence is yourself.


.


I stand by the internationally accepted ways of comparing different groups of people as used by criminologist, medical researchers, sociologists etc, etc.


.


You said I can't compare US to other countries because is really a collection of 50 different states with their own government and a Federal government. The EU (I never said Europe) is collection of different countries each with their own government and a federal parliament. The US fits inbetween a single state nation and a federation of countries with federal parliament. You are clutching at straws.


.


The comparisons work and are based on scales and methods applied internationally by professionals on a daily basis for many different scientific, economics and social analysis purposes.


.


As a result of your false accusations and your offensive nature, I have no intention of further engaging with you on this. Let it go.


[Edited 8/14/19 13:59pm]





post #309


Europe (EU) is 4.4 million square kilometres and has a population 507 million. The USA is a bit more than double this area but has a lot fewer 329 million people.



.


It doesn't work.


.


How do you compare a communistic country with a democratic country?


Do you understand China's politics? Are you even following what is happening in China and Russia and what the government is threatening those who took part in the protests? You cannot compare.


And in recent years,


Chinese authorities have been encroaching


on the rights supposedly guaranteed to Hong Kongers


under the “one country, two systems” agreement.


https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/newsopinion/james-carafano-what-hong-kong-unrest-tells-us-about-chinas-plans-for-the-rest-of-the-world/ar-AAFKDcD?ocid=msn360


.



The Chinese government has been variously described as communist and socialist, but also as authoritarian and corporatist, with heavy restrictions in many areas, most notably against free access to the Internet, freedom of the press, freedom of assembly, the right to have children, free formation of social organizations and freedom of religion. Its current political, ideological and economic system has been termed by its leaders as the "people's democratic dictatorship", "socialism with Chinese characteristics" (which is Marxism adapted to Chinese circumstances) and the "socialist market economy" respectively



The government of the People's Republic of China officially espouses state atheism, and has conducted antireligious campaigns to this end. Religious affairs and issues in the country are overseen by the State Administration for ...us Affairs.Freedom of religion is guaranteed by China's constitution, although religious organizations that lack official approval can be subject to state persecution.



,
Let it go. I have explained how for 5 months but only get repetative posts followed by offensive and false accusations.
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Reply #337 posted 08/14/19 4:55pm

OldFriends4Sal
e

avatar

moderator

IanRG said:

OldFriends4Sale said:

post #309

Europe (EU) is 4.4 million square kilometres and has a population 507 million. The USA is a bit more than double this area but has a lot fewer 329 million people.

.

It doesn't work.

.

How do you compare a communistic country with a democratic country?

Do you understand China's politics? Are you even following what is happening in China and Russia and what the government is threatening those who took part in the protests? You cannot compare.


And in recent years,

Chinese authorities have been encroaching

on the rights supposedly guaranteed to Hong Kongers

under the “one country, two systems” agreement.

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/newsopinion/james-carafano-what-hong-kong-unrest-tells-us-about-chinas-plans-for-the-rest-of-the-world/ar-AAFKDcD?ocid=msn360

.

The Chinese government has been variously described as communist and socialist, but also as authoritarian and corporatist, with heavy restrictions in many areas, most notably against free access to the Internet, freedom of the press, freedom of assembly, the right to have children, free formation of social organizations and freedom of religion. Its current political, ideological and economic system has been termed by its leaders as the "people's democratic dictatorship", "socialism with Chinese characteristics" (which is Marxism adapted to Chinese circumstances) and the "socialist market economy" respectively

The government of the People's Republic of China officially espouses state atheism, and has conducted antireligious campaigns to this end. Religious affairs and issues in the country are overseen by the State Administration for ...us Affairs.Freedom of religion is guaranteed by China's constitution, although religious organizations that lack official approval can be subject to state persecution.

, Let it go. I have explained how for 5 months but only get repetative posts followed by offensive and false accusations.

Also the USA has a larger population than Canada, so it's China USA then Canada

#IDEFINEME #ALBUMSSTILLMATTER

A Liar Shall Not Tarry In My Presence

What's the matter with your life
Is poverty bringing U down?
Is the mailman jerking U 'round?
Did he put your million dollar check
In someone else's box?
Tell me, what's the m
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Reply #338 posted 08/15/19 1:02am

IanRG

OldFriends4Sale said:

IanRG said:

Let it go. I have explained how for 5 months but only get repetative posts followed by offensive and false accusations.

Also the USA has a larger population than Canada, so it's China USA then Canada

.

Let it go. Backing up being offensive and making false accusations with stating the bleeding obvious as if I said anything contrary to this is just trolling.

.

Have you hacked OldFriends4Sale's account? Because how you are acting is why OF4$ says he hates this forum.

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Reply #339 posted 08/15/19 4:53am

CherryMoon57

avatar

IanRG said:

OldFriends4Sale said:

Also the USA has a larger population than Canada, so it's China USA then Canada

.

Let it go. Backing up being offensive and making false accusations with stating the bleeding obvious as if I said anything contrary to this is just trolling.

.

Have you hacked OldFriends4Sale's account? Because how you are acting is why OF4$ says he hates this forum.


Open your heart open your mind
A train is leaving all day
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Reply #340 posted 08/15/19 5:23am

OldFriends4Sal
e

avatar

moderator

IanRG said:

OldFriends4Sale said:

Also the USA has a larger population than Canada, so it's China USA then Canada

.

Let it go. Backing up being offensive and making false accusations with stating the bleeding obvious as if I said anything contrary to this is just trolling.

.

Have you hacked OldFriends4Sale's account? Because how you are acting is why OF4$ says he hates this forum.

plus de mensonges, OF4$ never said he hated this forum, it is very problematic though. But I'll ask him later after his coffee brake

man up biggrin don't be offended, the USA popul. is bigger than Canada and Europe cannot be compared to the USA ok fini

And I've seen your interactions in the sexual assault threads, you don't let it go so easily

PEACE OUT!!! flower

#IDEFINEME #ALBUMSSTILLMATTER

A Liar Shall Not Tarry In My Presence

What's the matter with your life
Is poverty bringing U down?
Is the mailman jerking U 'round?
Did he put your million dollar check
In someone else's box?
Tell me, what's the m
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Reply #341 posted 08/15/19 1:11pm

IanRG

OldFriends4Sale said:

IanRG said:

.

Let it go. Backing up being offensive and making false accusations with stating the bleeding obvious as if I said anything contrary to this is just trolling.

.

Have you hacked OldFriends4Sale's account? Because how you are acting is why OF4$ says he hates this forum.

plus de mensonges,

.

No lies and I have not lied at all. Your are seriously trying going to call someone a liar because they equated all your frequent negative comments about this forum and people who post almost exclusively here with what you hate about this forum!

.

You use highly offensive statements like Les enfants qui mentent ne vont pas au paradis when I pointed out that you have been seeking to argue the US cannot be compared to other nations for 5 months now - And you think I can't let things go! That I should just man up and accept your abusive nature because I have, in your opinion, been too against sexual abuse!

.

The topic is "How should mass shootings be prevented". To prevent these, you must analyse the problem and that includes the frequency of the problem. The internationally recognised measure of things like this is a rate per 100,000 people. This is used by the UN, criminoligists, the CIA, FBI and all PDs, health professionals, medical researcher, The CDC, WHO and other health science organisations, psychologicist, sociologists, economists, civic planners, marketing experts etc, etc, etc. All of these also consider specific circumstances but none are so silly as to argue firstly you must only ever compare the US state by state but only against a equivalent nations of equal size and area. then when this fails to hide the problem, change to the USA cannot be compared to anywhere ever. You are only doing this because this shines the "ugly light" - your term from when you started this 5 months ago - on the US. There is no justification for imagining the US is beyond comparison with every othe country in the world. There is no solution to the gun violence problem if at every turn people like you attack and dismiss anyone who offends your national pride.

.

Let it go. And stop the offensive and false accusations in any language. Don't keep making this forum a place where people can win an argument the way you are trying to "win" this. Do you really think being abusive in a foriegn language makes it better?

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Reply #342 posted 08/15/19 2:01pm

IanRG

CherryMoon57 said:

IanRG said:

.

Let it go. Backing up being offensive and making false accusations with stating the bleeding obvious as if I said anything contrary to this is just trolling.

.

Have you hacked OldFriends4Sale's account? Because how you are acting is why OF4$ says he hates this forum.


.

I have been trying to get him to, but since you re-raised my comment on his invalid argument against comparing deaths by gun violence using professional and internationally agreed relative measures, he simply just wont let it go.

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Reply #343 posted 08/15/19 2:22pm

OldFriends4Sal
e

avatar

moderator

LOL IanRG IanRG IanRG

.

So you don't listen to Do U Lie? is it highly offensive when Prince has it in his music?

Stop making exaggerated statements. Let it go.

IanRG said:

OldFriends4Sale said:

plus de mensonges,

.

No lies and I have not lied at all. Your are seriously trying going to call someone a liar because they equated all your frequent negative comments about this forum and people who post almost exclusively here with what you hate about this forum!

.

You use highly offensive statements like Les enfants qui mentent ne vont pas au paradis when I pointed out that you have been seeking to argue the US cannot be compared to other nations for 5 months now - And you think I can't let things go! That I should just man up and accept your abusive nature because I have, in your opinion, been too against sexual abuse!

.

The topic is "How should mass shootings be prevented". To prevent these, you must analyse the problem and that includes the frequency of the problem. The internationally recognised measure of things like this is a rate per 100,000 people. This is used by the UN, criminoligists, the CIA, FBI and all PDs, health professionals, medical researcher, The CDC, WHO and other health science organisations, psychologicist, sociologists, economists, civic planners, marketing experts etc, etc, etc. All of these also consider specific circumstances but none are so silly as to argue firstly you must only ever compare the US state by state but only against a equivalent nations of equal size and area. then when this fails to hide the problem, change to the USA cannot be compared to anywhere ever. You are only doing this because this shines the "ugly light" - your term from when you started this 5 months ago - on the US. There is no justification for imagining the US is beyond comparison with every othe country in the world. There is no solution to the gun violence problem if at every turn people like you attack and dismiss anyone who offends your national pride.

.

Let it go. And stop the offensive and false accusations in any language. Don't keep making this forum a place where people can win an argument the way you are trying to "win" this. Do you really think being abusive in a foriegn language makes it better?

#IDEFINEME #ALBUMSSTILLMATTER

A Liar Shall Not Tarry In My Presence

What's the matter with your life
Is poverty bringing U down?
Is the mailman jerking U 'round?
Did he put your million dollar check
In someone else's box?
Tell me, what's the m
 Reply w/quote - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #344 posted 08/15/19 2:30pm

IanRG

OldFriends4Sale said:

LOL IanRG IanRG IanRG

So you don't listen to Do U Lie? is it highly offensive when Prince has it in his music?

Can you let it go?

IanRG said:

.

No lies and I have not lied at all. Your are seriously trying going to call someone a liar because they equated all your frequent negative comments about this forum and people who post almost exclusively here with what you hate about this forum!

.

You use highly offensive statements like Les enfants qui mentent ne vont pas au paradis when I pointed out that you have been seeking to argue the US cannot be compared to other nations for 5 months now - And you think I can't let things go! That I should just man up and accept your abusive nature because I have, in your opinion, been too against sexual abuse!

.

The topic is "How should mass shootings be prevented". To prevent these, you must analyse the problem and that includes the frequency of the problem. The internationally recognised measure of things like this is a rate per 100,000 people. This is used by the UN, criminoligists, the CIA, FBI and all PDs, health professionals, medical researcher, The CDC, WHO and other health science organisations, psychologicist, sociologists, economists, civic planners, marketing experts etc, etc, etc. All of these also consider specific circumstances but none are so silly as to argue firstly you must only ever compare the US state by state but only against a equivalent nations of equal size and area. then when this fails to hide the problem, change to the USA cannot be compared to anywhere ever. You are only doing this because this shines the "ugly light" - your term from when you started this 5 months ago - on the US. There is no justification for imagining the US is beyond comparison with every othe country in the world. There is no solution to the gun violence problem if at every turn people like you attack and dismiss anyone who offends your national pride.

.

Let it go. And stop the offensive and false accusations in any language. Don't keep making this forum a place where people can win an argument the way you are trying to "win" this. Do you really think being abusive in a foriegn language makes it better?

.

Yes. I listen to "Do U Lie?". I don't expect it be used in a highly offensive manner to falsely accuse me of lying just because you don't want people to use an international professional measure that shows the US in an "ugly light".

.

Yes, I can let it go. I have been trying to, but your unapologetic abuse continues.

.

Can you let it go? It appears not.

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Reply #345 posted 08/15/19 2:33pm

OldFriends4Sal
e

avatar

moderator

IanRG said:

OldFriends4Sale said:

LOL IanRG IanRG IanRG

So you don't listen to Do U Lie? is it highly offensive when Prince has it in his music?

Can you let it go?

.

Yes. I listen to "Do U Lie?". I don't expect it be used in a highly offensive manner to falsely accuse me of lying just because you don't want people to use an international professional measure that shows the US in an "ugly light".

.

Yes, I can let it go. I have been trying to, but your unapologetic abuse continues.

.

Can you let it go? It appears not.

I remember growing up people would act like you cursed if you said 'he/she lied' You had to say 'told a story'.

You said you were done many times, It appears you weren't

I never said I was going to let this aspect go, comparing countries and nations in these ways is not going to give a solution.

America is a country and cannot be compared to a continent

#IDEFINEME #ALBUMSSTILLMATTER

A Liar Shall Not Tarry In My Presence

What's the matter with your life
Is poverty bringing U down?
Is the mailman jerking U 'round?
Did he put your million dollar check
In someone else's box?
Tell me, what's the m
 Reply w/quote - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #346 posted 08/15/19 2:38pm

IanRG

OldFriends4Sale said:

IanRG said:

.

Yes. I listen to "Do U Lie?". I don't expect it be used in a highly offensive manner to falsely accuse me of lying just because you don't want people to use an international professional measure that shows the US in an "ugly light".

.

Yes, I can let it go. I have been trying to, but your unapologetic abuse continues.

.

Can you let it go? It appears not.

I remember growing up people would act like you cursed if you said 'he/she lied' You had to say 'told a story'.

let it go

.

See you still cannot let it go and are still falsely accusing me of lying.

.

Nothing on the topic? Of course not.

.

Let it go. Have the last post you so desparately want (unless it includes yet another highly offensive false accusation).

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Reply #347 posted 08/15/19 2:51pm

OldFriends4Sal
e

avatar

moderator

IanRG said:

OldFriends4Sale said:

I remember growing up people would act like you cursed if you said 'he/she lied' You had to say 'told a story'.

let it go

.

See you still cannot let it go and are still falsely accusing me of lying.

.

Nothing on the topic? Of course not.

.

Let it go. Have the last post you so desparately want (unless it includes yet another highly offensive false accusation).

lol you said that I said I hated the P&R forum, I never said that, you told a story

Only you have control of your bit and bridle, even if it is expressed through typing

And the US population is larger than the Canadian population.

.

Comparing Countries and Continents is not going to help with a solution.

Even looking at Switzerland, the USA could not impliment what they do here. Their history and politics is much different. Comparisons.

Switzerland is obsessed with getting shooting right. Every year, it holds a shooting contest for kids aged 13 to 17.

#IDEFINEME #ALBUMSSTILLMATTER

A Liar Shall Not Tarry In My Presence

What's the matter with your life
Is poverty bringing U down?
Is the mailman jerking U 'round?
Did he put your million dollar check
In someone else's box?
Tell me, what's the m
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Reply #348 posted 08/15/19 3:08pm

IanRG

OldFriends4Sale said:

IanRG said:

.

See you still cannot let it go and are still falsely accusing me of lying.

.

Nothing on the topic? Of course not.

.

Let it go. Have the last post you so desparately want (unless it includes yet another highly offensive false accusation).

lol you said that I said I hated the P&R forum, I never said that, you told a story

Only you have control of your bit and bridle, even if it is expressed through typing

And the US population is larger than the Canadian population.

.

Comparing Countries and Continents is not going to help with a solution.

Even looking at Switzerland, the USA could not impliment what they do here. Their history and politics is much different. Comparisons.

Switzerland is obsessed with getting shooting right. Every year, it holds a shooting contest for kids aged 13 to 17.

.

I never quoted you saying you hate this forum. I said you hate it as a direct result of the criticism you make of it and your comments about these reasons being why you don't post here often. These often include criticism of people here who seldom post in the other forums and dimissing discussions here because they do not solve anything. Hate is just summary of your position, I can accept your criticism and reduce this to you hate certain aspects of this forum. This is not the only thing you offensively falsely accused me of and it is the least of these. Let it go.

.

It is not only possible to compare different groups of people, it is necessary to do this to identify what scale the problem is, how each group is different and how the groups shown up in the ugly light can improve. Your argument is invalid: the US or each individual US state or city or the fact that most of the world's most dangerous cities in terms of rates of murder are in the two American continents can be measured and considered using internationally agreed measures by people far more professional than you. People that use these comparisons to amke real world improvements everyday.

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Reply #349 posted 08/15/19 4:08pm

OldFriends4Sal
e

avatar

moderator

IanRG said:

OldFriends4Sale said:

lol you said that I said I hated the P&R forum, I never said that, you told a story

Only you have control of your bit and bridle, even if it is expressed through typing

And the US population is larger than the Canadian population.

.

Comparing Countries and Continents is not going to help with a solution.

Even looking at Switzerland, the USA could not impliment what they do here. Their history and politics is much different. Comparisons.

5a90a6a7aae6051c008b4763-750-581.jpg

.

I never quoted you saying you hate this forum. I said you hate it as a direct result of the criticism you make of it and your comments about these reasons being why you don't post here often. These often include criticism of people here who seldom post in the other forums and dimissing discussions here because they do not solve anything. Hate is just summary of your position, I can accept your criticism and reduce this to you hate certain aspects of this forum. This is not the only thing you offensively falsely accused me of and it is the least of these. Let it go.

.

It is not only possible to compare different groups of people, it is necessary to do this to identify what scale the problem is, how each group is different and how the groups shown up in the ugly light can improve. Your argument is invalid: the US or each individual US state or city or the fact that most of the world's most dangerous cities in terms of rates of murder are in the two American continents can be measured and considered using internationally agreed measures by people far more professional than you. People that use these comparisons to amke real world improvements everyday.

lol ok IanRG I know in specific religious denominations 'LIE' is connected with Satan being the father of liars. So I probably understand why your highly offended.
.
"OF4$ says he hates this forum." that is a statement. The other things were also stated exagerations that did not need to be said in connection to the discussion. I was not pushing a narrative over months about country comparison. That is not true.
.
I just replied to what you said of me. And rebuffed it. post #201 another 'story'

It was about me, so you will have to get over your offense. Just don't make statements about me, that could end up with me saying 'i did not say that' You started this, not me.

post 176 full of lies

You say I'm making a 'spin' to make the media part of blame in line with Trump's rhetoric.
LIE ie Not Truth

IanRG said: This is spin to make the media to part of blame in line with trump's rhetoric.

.

IanRG said: What she wanted is to starve the killer and his agenda of oxygen. She did not say the media is partly to blame for this but that the media can be part of this starvation by choosing to follow her lead and not report his name or details of his agenda so they are part of the solution.

.

Never blamed the Media(do you work in Media?) All I and some others were saying is how things are covered can make a difference.

.

IanrG said: You are playing more semantics. Outside of your desire to blame the media,
'playing semantics' ... 'Outside of your(OF4$) desire to blame the media

another LIE, I never blamed the Media. Never. You put the spin on that. not me. that like Trump my desire is the blame the Media. Trying to 'demonize' my posts in connection with Trump. Do you work in Media? No pigs in the parlor here kid.

.

my first post in this thread pointed to laws across the board in the USA state to state, secondly I dealt with different levels of prevention which is societal/community. Never brought up the Media.

I then brought up some information to collectively understand how 'Mass Shooting' is being defined.
You came in and replied to my posts saying, none of this is going to work, blah blah blah No matter what I said, you reply with this is wrong, this is invalid, this doesn't work. That I'm 'favoring a definition' another 'story'. It is you who started focusing in on 'me' Ian. Oh you came in focused.
4 pages in I cut in paste a heading from a link and ask people, if coverage of these thing contribute. Never blamed the Media. From the start I focused on the mindset of people who commit these kinds of things and the copycats. Not the mindset of those in Media. Books, tv, movies, articles, news is MEDIA, sociopathic killers look to be talked about. Notoriety comes through the spreading of news and names. Adjusting coverage can make a difference therefore being a piece of the prevention. Along with other things I and others addressed.

.
You focused on me, and tried to assign a motive to my reasonings. Like saying I'm playing semantics and have a desire to blame Media, like Trump. You said this, quoted above from your post #176. Be highly offended. You will not get an apology from me, when it is you who are the offender.
.
lol It is only invalid, because it disagrees with you. How do you compare China and the USA? a communistic country with a democratic country? Maybe that is why people don't have guns because the leaders described as dictatorship, might not want people to have guns? Again if you don't want to continue this, only Ian has control of the bit and bridle... but you have no control. So you need me to be the strong one.

.

authoritarian and corporatist, with heavy restrictions in many areas, most notably against free access to the Internet, freedom of the press, freedom of assembly, the right to have children, free formation of social organizations and freedom of religion. Its current political, ideological and economic system has been termed by its leaders as the "people's democratic dictatorship", "socialism with Chinese characteristics" (which is Marxism adapted to Chinese circumstances) and the "socialist market economy" respectively

The government of the People's Republic of China officially espouses state atheism, and has conducted antireligious campaigns to this end.

#IDEFINEME #ALBUMSSTILLMATTER

A Liar Shall Not Tarry In My Presence

What's the matter with your life
Is poverty bringing U down?
Is the mailman jerking U 'round?
Did he put your million dollar check
In someone else's box?
Tell me, what's the m
 Reply w/quote - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #350 posted 08/15/19 6:35pm

IanRG

OldFriends4Sale said:

IanRG said:

.

I never quoted you saying you hate this forum. I said you hate it as a direct result of the criticism you make of it and your comments about these reasons being why you don't post here often. These often include criticism of people here who seldom post in the other forums and dimissing discussions here because they do not solve anything. Hate is just summary of your position, I can accept your criticism and reduce this to you hate certain aspects of this forum. This is not the only thing you offensively falsely accused me of and it is the least of these. Let it go.

.

It is not only possible to compare different groups of people, it is necessary to do this to identify what scale the problem is, how each group is different and how the groups shown up in the ugly light can improve. Your argument is invalid: the US or each individual US state or city or the fact that most of the world's most dangerous cities in terms of rates of murder are in the two American continents can be measured and considered using internationally agreed measures by people far more professional than you. People that use these comparisons to amke real world improvements everyday.

lol ok IanRG I know in specific religious denominations 'LIE' is connected with Satan being the father of liars. So I probably understand why your highly offended.
.
"OF4$ says he hates this forum." that is a statement. The other things were also stated exagerations that did not need to be said in connection to the discussion. I was not pushing a narrative over months about country comparison. That is not true.
.
I just replied to what you said of me. And rebuffed it. post #201 another 'story'

It was about me, so you will have to get over your offense. Just don't make statements about me, that could end up with me saying 'i did not say that' You started this, not me.

post 176 full of lies

You say I'm making a 'spin' to make the media part of blame in line with Trump's rhetoric.
LIE ie Not Truth

IanRG said: This is spin to make the media to part of blame in line with trump's rhetoric.

.

IanRG said: What she wanted is to starve the killer and his agenda of oxygen. She did not say the media is partly to blame for this but that the media can be part of this starvation by choosing to follow her lead and not report his name or details of his agenda so they are part of the solution.

.

Never blamed the Media(do you work in Media?) All I and some others were saying is how things are covered can make a difference.

.

IanrG said: You are playing more semantics. Outside of your desire to blame the media,
'playing semantics' ... 'Outside of your(OF4$) desire to blame the media

another LIE, I never blamed the Media. Never. You put the spin on that. not me. that like Trump my desire is the blame the Media. Trying to 'demonize' my posts in connection with Trump. Do you work in Media? No pigs in the parlor here kid.

.

my first post in this thread pointed to laws across the board in the USA state to state, secondly I dealt with different levels of prevention which is societal/community. Never brought up the Media.

I then brought up some information to collectively understand how 'Mass Shooting' is being defined.
You came in and replied to my posts saying, none of this is going to work, blah blah blah No matter what I said, you reply with this is wrong, this is invalid, this doesn't work. That I'm 'favoring a definition' another 'story'. It is you who started focusing in on 'me' Ian. Oh you came in focused.
4 pages in I cut in paste a heading from a link and ask people, if coverage of these thing contribute. Never blamed the Media. From the start I focused on the mindset of people who commit these kinds of things and the copycats. Not the mindset of those in Media. Books, tv, movies, articles, news is MEDIA, sociopathic killers look to be talked about. Notoriety comes through the spreading of news and names. Adjusting coverage can make a difference therefore being a piece of the prevention. Along with other things I and others addressed.

.
You focused on me, and tried to assign a motive to my reasonings. Like saying I'm playing semantics and have a desire to blame Media, like Trump. You said this, quoted above from your post #176. Be highly offended. You will not get an apology from me, when it is you who are the offender.
.
lol It is only invalid, because it disagrees with you. How do you compare China and the USA? a communistic country with a democratic country? Maybe that is why people don't have guns because the leaders described as dictatorship, might not want people to have guns? Again if you don't want to continue this, only Ian has control of the bit and bridle... but you have no control. So you need me to be the strong one.

.

authoritarian and corporatist, with heavy restrictions in many areas, most notably against free access to the Internet, freedom of the press, freedom of assembly, the right to have children, free formation of social organizations and freedom of religion. Its current political, ideological and economic system has been termed by its leaders as the "people's democratic dictatorship", "socialism with Chinese characteristics" (which is Marxism adapted to Chinese circumstances) and the "socialist market economy" respectively

The government of the People's Republic of China officially espouses state atheism, and has conducted antireligious campaigns to this end.

.

Still cannot let it go and still with the offensive false accusations.

.

This is not about you dismissing your offensive and false accusations as being OK except to certain religious beliefs. It is that you made these false accusations in offensive ways.

.

You have expressed your strong dislike of this forum and people who mainly only post here. That is what I meant by hate. There is no lie: you regularly express this. I retract the word hate and replace it with strong dislike. Move on.

.

I have quoted you stating that you reject comparisons of the US to other countries over the last 5 months. I listed the threads were you did this in. There is no lie by my in this. What I said is true. It is not true that you did not make the posts I quoted you making.

.

What I said in Post 176 was:

.

(1) No, the highlighted section is not what Jacinda Arden said at all.

.

(2) This is spin to make the media to part of blame in line with trump's rhetoric.

.

(3) What she wanted is to starve the killer and his agenda of oxygen. She did not say the media is partly to blame for this but that the media can be part of this starvation by choosing to follow her lead and not report his name or details of his agenda so they are part of the solution.

.

(4) You are playing more semantics. Outside of your desire to blame the media, we are actually agreeing.

.

(1) This is not a lie. Jacinda Arden did not say the media is partly to blame in the link you said she did.

.

(2) This is not a lie. At the same time you where arguing the media is partly to blame, trump was arguing the media is to blame. It was the GOP and gun lobby talking point at that time and you have argued that guns (other than Chicago's illegal one's) are not the problem in your responses to threads on gun violence in the US over the last 5 months.

.

(3) This is not a lie. See point (1). The link you linked spoke about what she was doing - amongst other things, that she was not going to give him anything by saying his name. I said before you that we can learn from the NZ response and the media can be part of the solution. This agrees with what Jacinda Arden actually said and it is not the same as partly blaming the media for the crimes of these murder/suiciders.

.

(4) This is not a lie. I presume you think that the violence is wrong, the violence should be stopped, the media, police, politicians etc can be part of the solution by changing how we respond to horrible events like this. The area of disagreement is the blame you apportion to media etc. If you just accepted we disagree and did not make your offensive false accusations, then, just as occurred with everyone else (except Cherry) we would have just moved on.

.

Proof of your semantics is in post 169 you said:

.

"YOU said the media is NOT to blame. I'm saying they have blame in this. No, as New Zealand said, not letting the notoriety of those criminals be spread via Media ie the Media has part in this. see post #147 she the New Zealand president disagrees with those that say the media have no part of blame in this."

.

In post 170 you said:

.

"She didn't not blame the media"

.

.

This flip flopping in consecutive posts is because you were playing sematics in your different responces to different statements by me. When it suited you, you agreed with me that she did not blame the media. At other times you apportioned blame to the media and said she did as well. (P.S. she is no the President, she is the Prime Minister)

.

The only argument I said of yours that is invalid is the arguments about how you don't want to compare the US to anywhere else. Initially you demanded comparisions be specific state to similar country. When I did this you changed to the US and its individual states cannot be compared to anywhere. And we end up in this mess of offensive false accusations and reasons other countries or groups are different. I have basced my positions with a sample list of all the professional people and organisations that disagree with you and use the same methodology I used that you have been saying should not be used on the US because it shines an "ugly light" on the US by people who are jealous of the US - as you have been saying in the previously identified posts starting 5 months ago.

.

Let it go. I will if you stop your unapologetic, offensive and false accusations.

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Reply #351 posted 08/15/19 7:57pm

OldFriends4Sal
e

avatar

moderator

No, you stop yourself and no apologies for what you exaggerated and implied

IanRG said:

OldFriends4Sale said:

.

In post 170 you said:

.

"She didn't not blame the media"

.

.

This flip flopping in consecutive posts is because you were playing sematics in your different responces to different statements by me. When it suited you, you agreed with me that she did not blame the media. At other times you apportioned blame to the media and said she did as well. (P.S. she is no the President, she is the Prime Minister)

.

The only argument I said of yours that is invalid is the arguments about how you don't want to compare the US to anywhere else. Initially you demanded comparisions be specific state to similar country. When I did this you changed to the US and its individual states cannot be compared to anywhere. And we end up in this mess of offensive false accusations and reasons other countries or groups are different. I have basced my positions with a sample list of all the professional people and organisations that disagree with you and use the same methodology I used that you have been saying should not be used on the US because it shines an "ugly light" on the US by people who are jealous of the US - as you have been saying in the previously identified posts starting 5 months ago.

.

Let it go. I will if you stop your unapologetic, offensive and false accusations.

#IDEFINEME #ALBUMSSTILLMATTER

A Liar Shall Not Tarry In My Presence

What's the matter with your life
Is poverty bringing U down?
Is the mailman jerking U 'round?
Did he put your million dollar check
In someone else's box?
Tell me, what's the m
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Reply #352 posted 08/19/19 4:49pm

OnlyNDaUsa

avatar

By making it easier and cheaper to become certified to carry and to allow public places to decided for themselves to allow or prohibit guns. If a place is known to allow people to have guns would be shooters are less likely to shot that place up... and less likely to be as successful. Put a big sign..."Guns welcome with permit: criminals beware!" of "No Guns Allowed: criminals welcome"



I saw a sick thing the other day were some state (maybe my own) that they were going to consider allowing churches to allow guns! That should never have been an issue it should have been left up to the church.

(it is funny how some cry when someone is oppressed by some government official or agency but then begs them to make us all more venerable and dependant on them?)

Antifa: are Fascist. People are fooled by their name! They carry out acts of violence to instill fear in order to push a political agenda or combat one. Do you support them?
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Reply #353 posted 08/19/19 4:59pm

Ugot2shakesumt
hin

avatar

OnlyNDaUsa said:

By making it easier and cheaper to become certified to carry and to allow public places to decided for themselves to allow or prohibit guns. If a place is known to allow people to have guns would be shooters are less likely to shot that place up... and less likely to be as successful. Put a big sign..."Guns welcome with permit: criminals beware!" of "No Guns Allowed: criminals welcome"



I saw a sick thing the other day were some state (maybe my own) that they were going to consider allowing churches to allow guns! That should never have been an issue it should have been left up to the church.




(it is funny how some cry when someone is oppressed by some government official or agency but then begs them to make us all more venerable and dependant on them?)



Fuck that! lol
That’s how we got all these fucking scary ass 20 yr olds massing killings.
.
On a side note, I’ve read about three other 20somethings who were caught before they went on their rampages.
What’s going on with this generation?
I know you males in general are powder kegs, but this is scary as fuck.
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Reply #354 posted 08/19/19 5:05pm

OnlyNDaUsa

avatar

Ugot2shakesumthin said:

OnlyNDaUsa said:

By making it easier and cheaper to become certified to carry and to allow public places to decided for themselves to allow or prohibit guns. If a place is known to allow people to have guns would be shooters are less likely to shot that place up... and less likely to be as successful. Put a big sign..."Guns welcome with permit: criminals beware!" of "No Guns Allowed: criminals welcome"



I saw a sick thing the other day were some state (maybe my own) that they were going to consider allowing churches to allow guns! That should never have been an issue it should have been left up to the church.

(it is funny how some cry when someone is oppressed by some government official or agency but then begs them to make us all more venerable and dependant on them?)

Fuck that! lol That’s how we got all these fucking scary ass 20 yr olds massing killings. . On a side note, I’ve read about three other 20somethings who were caught before they went on their rampages. What’s going on with this generation? I know you males in general are powder kegs, but this is scary as fuck.

haha triggered? and please do not use gender biased language.

Antifa: are Fascist. People are fooled by their name! They carry out acts of violence to instill fear in order to push a political agenda or combat one. Do you support them?
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Reply #355 posted 08/19/19 5:18pm

Ugot2shakesumt
hin

avatar

OnlyNDaUsa said:

Ugot2shakesumthin said:

OnlyNDaUsa said: Fuck that! lol That’s how we got all these fucking scary ass 20 yr olds massing killings. . On a side note, I’ve read about three other 20somethings who were caught before they went on their rampages. What’s going on with this generation? I know you males in general are powder kegs, but this is scary as fuck.

haha triggered? and please do not use gender biased language.

It's not biased. It's well documented.

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Reply #356 posted 08/19/19 5:26pm

OnlyNDaUsa

avatar

Ugot2shakesumthin said:

OnlyNDaUsa said:

haha triggered? and please do not use gender biased language.

It's not biased. It's well documented.

haha if you say so...

Antifa: are Fascist. People are fooled by their name! They carry out acts of violence to instill fear in order to push a political agenda or combat one. Do you support them?
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Reply #357 posted 08/19/19 5:32pm

Ugot2shakesumt
hin

avatar

OnlyNDaUsa said:

Ugot2shakesumthin said:

It's not biased. It's well documented.

haha if you say so...

I say so.

...and so does reality.

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Reply #358 posted 08/19/19 5:47pm

OnlyNDaUsa

avatar

Ugot2shakesumthin said:

OnlyNDaUsa said:

haha if you say so...

I say so.

...and so does reality.

so you approve of profiling...

Antifa: are Fascist. People are fooled by their name! They carry out acts of violence to instill fear in order to push a political agenda or combat one. Do you support them?
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Reply #359 posted 08/19/19 5:52pm

Ugot2shakesumt
hin

avatar

OnlyNDaUsa said:



Ugot2shakesumthin said:




OnlyNDaUsa said:




haha if you say so...



I say so.


...and so does reality.





so you approve of profiling...


I know you’re just trolling but I’ll play along.

Are you telling me that babies don’t behave differently than teens? That teens don’t behave different than the elderly?
Is that profiling or just facts?

..on second thought, I shouldn’t play along. You’ll endlessly troll until someone gives up..
lol
[Edited 8/19/19 17:58pm]
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