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Reply #60 posted 06/10/19 4:29pm

RodeoSchro

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guitarslinger44 said:

RodeoSchro said:



We should do both - help people right now that need it, as well as invest in helping others help themselves.

I'm all for helping people that haven't circumvented the laws of our country and have gone through proper channels to be here. But part of fixing the system here should be disincentivising bad/illegal behavior be it from illegal immigrants or douchebag Wall Street types.



Those are two completely different buckets.

People fleeing Central America do so in large part because their lives are in danger at home. I don't think that's subject to much dispute. They need help right now. It's not the right thing to do to say, "Sorry. We have ours, too bad you don't have yours. Go back to somewhere in which you'll be a target for killing, repression or slavery". That is not the American way.

But Wall Street criminals? That's easily and quickly remedied. Heck, so is a large part of the illegal immigration we don't want. There are laws on the books that call for the financial punishment of employers who hire illegal immigrants.

If you sincerely want to stop those people sneaking in here for no other reason than to get a job, then penalize the employers who hire them. We don't do that, even though we can. I suspect a large reason for that is there isn't anyone else who wants to do the jobs illegal immigrants will, or won't do it at the wage that illegal immigrants will accept.

So if we stopped economically-driven illegal immigration that way, whatever stuff the immigrants were involved in would go up. I suspect our restaurant and food prices would go up; the cost of construction would rise; housecleaning and lawn maintenance would increase; etc.

We could stop that kind of illegal immigration in a heartbeat by fining employers $$$thousands or $$$millions for hiring illegal immigrants. Of course, unrepentant serial adulterer Donald J. Trump's organization would have paid a large fine, so maybe there's your answer.

Second Funkiest White Man in America

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Reply #61 posted 06/10/19 4:59pm

DiminutiveRock
er

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guitarslinger44 said:

DiminutiveRocker said:

I'm a happy Californian right now.


People come here to live - to work and pay rent and buy food and goods.



No they don't. There's a mass exodus of Californians leaving the state to move to Nevada, Texas, Arizona, and unfortunately, Nashville where I live due to exactly these types of policies that have driven costs to astronomical levels that are out of reach for a lot of particularly lower income people. Don't believe me? Read: https://m.sfgate.com/expe...614119.php https://www.investors.com...alifornia/ https://www.cnbc.com/2018...state.html [Edited 6/10/19 16:26pm]

These are your sources? lol 2 of the three quotes the same 65 year old guy who does not want to pay taxes and one is San Francisco centric.


I have lived in California all my life and likely know more about California than you do. As for taxes? All those highways and public utilities do not pay for themselves.


falloff Oh yeah - of the 40 million that live here some 137,000 moved to Nevada and Arizona? Retirees? It's tantamount to East Coast retireees moving to Florida.




wink






[Edited 6/10/19 17:01pm]

"'Were it left to me to decide whether we should have a government without newspapers, or newspapers without a government, I should not hesitate a moment to prefer the latter.'' - Thomas Jefferson
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Reply #62 posted 06/11/19 6:18am

OnlyNDaUsa

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guitarslinger44 said:

RodeoSchro said:



We should do both - help people right now that need it, as well as invest in helping others help themselves.

I'm all for helping people that haven't circumvented the laws of our country and have gone through proper channels to be here. But part of fixing the system here should be disincentivising bad/illegal behavior be it from illegal immigrants or douchebag Wall Street types.

what do you mean douchebag Wall Street types? Do you mean people who get rich? Yes a few do game the system, but many of them create wealth. The make it from nothing. And they feel the systems we all use. One falsehood told is "Such and So made 50Billion and Paid No Taxes!" well for one that not true. And two so what? Many companes have very thin margins of profit. Earnings is NOT Profit. And I agree the tax system is such that most people in the middle class can not use the it in a way that is of much help. But the laws are the same.

Being a die-hard civil rights champion,
Being a die-hard libertarian,
Sometimes I have to defend
that which I find distasteful.
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Reply #63 posted 06/11/19 8:08am

RodeoSchro

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OnlyNDaUsa said:

guitarslinger44 said:

RodeoSchro said: I'm all for helping people that haven't circumvented the laws of our country and have gone through proper channels to be here. But part of fixing the system here should be disincentivising bad/illegal behavior be it from illegal immigrants or douchebag Wall Street types.

what do you mean douchebag Wall Street types? Do you mean people who get rich? Yes a few do game the system, but many of them create wealth. The make it from nothing. And they feel the systems we all use. One falsehood told is "Such and So made 50Billion and Paid No Taxes!" well for one that not true. And two so what? Many companes have very thin margins of profit. Earnings is NOT Profit. And I agree the tax system is such that most people in the middle class can not use the it in a way that is of much help. But the laws are the same.



Nice try. It didn't work, but nice try.

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Reply #64 posted 06/11/19 8:51am

guitarslinger4
4

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DiminutiveRocker said:

guitarslinger44 said:

DiminutiveRocker said: No they don't. There's a mass exodus of Californians leaving the state to move to Nevada, Texas, Arizona, and unfortunately, Nashville where I live due to exactly these types of policies that have driven costs to astronomical levels that are out of reach for a lot of particularly lower income people. Don't believe me? Read: https://m.sfgate.com/expe...614119.php https://www.investors.com...alifornia/ https://www.cnbc.com/2018...state.html [Edited 6/10/19 16:26pm]

These are your sources? lol 2 of the three quotes the same 65 year old guy who does not want to pay taxes and one is San Francisco centric.


I have lived in California all my life and likely know more about California than you do. As for taxes? All those highways and public utilities do not pay for themselves.


falloff Oh yeah - of the 40 million that live here some 137,000 moved to Nevada and Arizona? Retirees? It's tantamount to East Coast retireees moving to Florida.




wink






[Edited 6/10/19 17:01pm]


Apparently you don't know that much about what's going on with your home state if you don't know that people are leaving in droves because of how unaffordable it's become to live there due to touchy feely leftist policies. I provided you with three of many sources, two of which, you waved away, one of which you didn't even acknowledge. There are countless articles about how Californians leaving are starting to turn Arizon, Texas, etc into purple states.

What did you bring to the table?


Nothing except smugness and anecdotes. I know many people who still live there, and even more who have left the state because of the reasons those articles stated.

Get out of your bubble, or at least do a little research.


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Reply #65 posted 06/11/19 8:55am

guitarslinger4
4

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RodeoSchro said:

guitarslinger44 said:

RodeoSchro said: I'm all for helping people that haven't circumvented the laws of our country and have gone through proper channels to be here. But part of fixing the system here should be disincentivising bad/illegal behavior be it from illegal immigrants or douchebag Wall Street types.



Those are two completely different buckets.

People fleeing Central America do so in large part because their lives are in danger at home. I don't think that's subject to much dispute. They need help right now. It's not the right thing to do to say, "Sorry. We have ours, too bad you don't have yours. Go back to somewhere in which you'll be a target for killing, repression or slavery". That is not the American way.

But Wall Street criminals? That's easily and quickly remedied. Heck, so is a large part of the illegal immigration we don't want. There are laws on the books that call for the financial punishment of employers who hire illegal immigrants.

If you sincerely want to stop those people sneaking in here for no other reason than to get a job, then penalize the employers who hire them. We don't do that, even though we can. I suspect a large reason for that is there isn't anyone else who wants to do the jobs illegal immigrants will, or won't do it at the wage that illegal immigrants will accept.

So if we stopped economically-driven illegal immigration that way, whatever stuff the immigrants were involved in would go up. I suspect our restaurant and food prices would go up; the cost of construction would rise; housecleaning and lawn maintenance would increase; etc.

We could stop that kind of illegal immigration in a heartbeat by fining employers $$$thousands or $$$millions for hiring illegal immigrants. Of course, unrepentant serial adulterer Donald J. Trump's organization would have paid a large fine, so maybe there's your answer.


Documents can be forged. I used to work at a place that had several illegal folks working there, and they told me themselves it was easier to move around as an illegal than it was to do things the right way. So the system itself needs an overhaul. I'd be good with folks who are here illegally right now being able to get on a path to citizenship provided they don't have criminal records and aren't on public assistance.

But this idea that we have to take on anybody and everybody is ridiculous. No other country in the world does this or is expected to do it.

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Reply #66 posted 06/11/19 8:57am

guitarslinger4
4

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OnlyNDaUsa said:

guitarslinger44 said:

RodeoSchro said: I'm all for helping people that haven't circumvented the laws of our country and have gone through proper channels to be here. But part of fixing the system here should be disincentivising bad/illegal behavior be it from illegal immigrants or douchebag Wall Street types.

what do you mean douchebag Wall Street types? Do you mean people who get rich? Yes a few do game the system, but many of them create wealth. The make it from nothing. And they feel the systems we all use. One falsehood told is "Such and So made 50Billion and Paid No Taxes!" well for one that not true. And two so what? Many companes have very thin margins of profit. Earnings is NOT Profit. And I agree the tax system is such that most people in the middle class can not use the it in a way that is of much help. But the laws are the same.



Wall Street is my idea of a sham industry. They create "value" out of thin air, with nothing, and expect everyone else to kowtow to them because they are the only ones who know how it all works, so OF COURSE they can game the system. But you had executives that cleaned out people's retirement funds, basically deep sixed the company they were heading, and got away scot free with a golden parachute no less. How do we get surprised that people lie and cheat when these guys were rewarded for it?

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Reply #67 posted 06/11/19 9:04am

jjhunsecker

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guitarslinger44 said:



OnlyNDaUsa said:




guitarslinger44 said:


RodeoSchro said: I'm all for helping people that haven't circumvented the laws of our country and have gone through proper channels to be here. But part of fixing the system here should be disincentivising bad/illegal behavior be it from illegal immigrants or douchebag Wall Street types.


what do you mean douchebag Wall Street types? Do you mean people who get rich? Yes a few do game the system, but many of them create wealth. The make it from nothing. And they feel the systems we all use. One falsehood told is "Such and So made 50Billion and Paid No Taxes!" well for one that not true. And two so what? Many companes have very thin margins of profit. Earnings is NOT Profit. And I agree the tax system is such that most people in the middle class can not use the it in a way that is of much help. But the laws are the same.





Wall Street is my idea of a sham industry. They create "value" out of thin air, with nothing, and expect everyone else to kowtow to them because they are the only ones who know how it all works, so OF COURSE they can game the system. But you had executives that cleaned out people's retirement funds, basically deep sixed the company they were heading, and got away scot free with a golden parachute no less. How do we get surprised that people lie and cheat when these guys were rewarded for it?



Total agreement with this.
They get rich while the average person gets fucked over
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Reply #68 posted 06/11/19 9:07am

RodeoSchro

avatar

guitarslinger44 said:

DiminutiveRocker said:

These are your sources? lol 2 of the three quotes the same 65 year old guy who does not want to pay taxes and one is San Francisco centric.


I have lived in California all my life and likely know more about California than you do. As for taxes? All those highways and public utilities do not pay for themselves.


falloff Oh yeah - of the 40 million that live here some 137,000 moved to Nevada and Arizona? Retirees? It's tantamount to East Coast retireees moving to Florida.




wink






[Edited 6/10/19 17:01pm]


Apparently you don't know that much about what's going on with your home state if you don't know that people are leaving in droves because of how unaffordable it's become to live there due to touchy feely leftist policies. I provided you with three of many sources, two of which, you waved away, one of which you didn't even acknowledge. There are countless articles about how Californians leaving are starting to turn Arizon, Texas, etc into purple states.

What did you bring to the table?


Nothing except smugness and anecdotes. I know many people who still live there, and even more who have left the state because of the reasons those articles stated.

Get out of your bubble, or at least do a little research.




As a Texan, I have to report that these droves of Californians are NOT moving to Houston. I can't name one person I've met in - ever? - that "fled" California and moved to Texas. If that's happening, it isn't happening in Houston. That I can promise you.

Texas is turning purple because of changing demographics, not because people are moving here from blue states. The percent of Houston's population that is 20 years or younger and is Hispanic is 61%. Sixty-one percent! No one can predict the future but if the Democrats in Texas do their job right (and that's a giant "if"), Texas will be bluer than blue before the Prince estate puts out "Originals Volume 2".

I posted in the earlier #MAGA thread that for 2019 it is projected that California needs 180,000 new homes built to handle the influx of new residents, yet there are only 90,000 expected to be built. This indicates that California is growing, not shrinking. (It also indicates that I need to start a homebuilding company in California.)

These rumors about people "fleeing" California remind me of the propoganda put out by the GOP when ObamaCare was enacted. The radical right-wing Republicans said "All the doctors are going to quit!!1!!11!!! Who's going to take care of you when that happens?!?!?!?"

And of course, the number of doctors who quit practicing medicine because the ACA was enacted turned out to be zero point zero.

I don't know where you get the information, or maybe more accurately the conclusion, that people are fleeing California for Texas, but whoever puts that out is dead wrong.

Second Funkiest White Man in America

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Reply #69 posted 06/11/19 9:13am

guitarslinger4
4

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RodeoSchro said:

guitarslinger44 said:


Apparently you don't know that much about what's going on with your home state if you don't know that people are leaving in droves because of how unaffordable it's become to live there due to touchy feely leftist policies. I provided you with three of many sources, two of which, you waved away, one of which you didn't even acknowledge. There are countless articles about how Californians leaving are starting to turn Arizon, Texas, etc into purple states.

What did you bring to the table?


Nothing except smugness and anecdotes. I know many people who still live there, and even more who have left the state because of the reasons those articles stated.

Get out of your bubble, or at least do a little research.




As a Texan, I have to report that these droves of Californians are NOT moving to Houston. I can't name one person I've met in - ever? - that "fled" California and moved to Texas. If that's happening, it isn't happening in Houston. That I can promise you.

Texas is turning purple because of changing demographics, not because people are moving here from blue states. The percent of Houston's population that is 20 years or younger and is Hispanic is 61%. Sixty-one percent! No one can predict the future but if the Democrats in Texas do their job right (and that's a giant "if"), Texas will be bluer than blue before the Prince estate puts out "Originals Volume 2".

I posted in the earlier #MAGA thread that for 2019 it is projected that California needs 180,000 new homes built to handle the influx of new residents, yet there are only 90,000 expected to be built. This indicates that California is growing, not shrinking. (It also indicates that I need to start a homebuilding company in California.)

These rumors about people "fleeing" California remind me of the propoganda put out by the GOP when ObamaCare was enacted. The radical right-wing Republicans said "All the doctors are going to quit!!1!!11!!! Who's going to take care of you when that happens?!?!?!?"

And of course, the number of doctors who quit practicing medicine because the ACA was enacted turned out to be zero point zero.

I don't know where you get the information, or maybe more accurately the conclusion, that people are fleeing California for Texas, but whoever puts that out is dead wrong.



People seem to be flocking to Austin, Dallas, and San Antonio. I dunno, this is just what I've been reading and from what people I know who have left have told me. It's not propaganda, one of those links I posted was from CNBC.

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Reply #70 posted 06/11/19 9:18am

OnlyNDaUsa

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guitarslinger44 said:



People seem to be flocking to Austin, Dallas, and San Antonio. I dunno, this is just what I've been reading and from what people I know who have left have told me. It's not propaganda, one of those links I posted was from CNBC.

unlike some... I base what I say on facts not on what I have experinced... and I assure you many people are moving to texas from liberal states... some of them are trying to get away from failed liberal polies... the sad part is too many of them still vote for the same failed ideas they just escaped.

Being a die-hard civil rights champion,
Being a die-hard libertarian,
Sometimes I have to defend
that which I find distasteful.
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Reply #71 posted 06/11/19 9:24am

RodeoSchro

avatar

guitarslinger44 said:

RodeoSchro said:



Those are two completely different buckets.

People fleeing Central America do so in large part because their lives are in danger at home. I don't think that's subject to much dispute. They need help right now. It's not the right thing to do to say, "Sorry. We have ours, too bad you don't have yours. Go back to somewhere in which you'll be a target for killing, repression or slavery". That is not the American way.

But Wall Street criminals? That's easily and quickly remedied. Heck, so is a large part of the illegal immigration we don't want. There are laws on the books that call for the financial punishment of employers who hire illegal immigrants.

If you sincerely want to stop those people sneaking in here for no other reason than to get a job, then penalize the employers who hire them. We don't do that, even though we can. I suspect a large reason for that is there isn't anyone else who wants to do the jobs illegal immigrants will, or won't do it at the wage that illegal immigrants will accept.

So if we stopped economically-driven illegal immigration that way, whatever stuff the immigrants were involved in would go up. I suspect our restaurant and food prices would go up; the cost of construction would rise; housecleaning and lawn maintenance would increase; etc.

We could stop that kind of illegal immigration in a heartbeat by fining employers $$$thousands or $$$millions for hiring illegal immigrants. Of course, unrepentant serial adulterer Donald J. Trump's organization would have paid a large fine, so maybe there's your answer.


Documents can be forged. I used to work at a place that had several illegal folks working there, and they told me themselves it was easier to move around as an illegal than it was to do things the right way. So the system itself needs an overhaul. I'd be good with folks who are here illegally right now being able to get on a path to citizenship provided they don't have criminal records and aren't on public assistance.

But this idea that we have to take on anybody and everybody is ridiculous. No other country in the world does this or is expected to do it.




There isn't an idea that we have to take on anybody and everybody. We have strict enforcement at our borders. In fact, during President Obama's eight year term, we had a net LOSS of immigrants. That's right - we deported more than got in. That trend has continued under unrepentant serial adulterer Donald J. Trump. It's not like he's done anything new but as we all know, he's a snowflake who cannot give President Obama credit for anything.

What needs overhauling is our asylum system. Simply put, we have more people LEGALLY asking for asylum than we can handle. As stated before, it's generally because of deadly condition in their home country.

We can't fix their home countries overnight, or maybe even ever. But we CAN increase our asylum personell and facilities pretty dang quickly. However, unrepentant serial adulterer Donald J. Trump won't do that.

Have no doubt - the process to ask for asylum in the USA is NO DIFFERENT than any other developed country's. It's just that more people want to come here. But to say that we're just letting anyone and everyone in is not accurate at all.

Finally - what is wrong with holding those who hire illegal immigrants legally and financially responsible? Heavily fine the restaurants and fruit companies that break the law and hire illegal workers, and soon you won't have people sneaking in because there won't be anyone who will risk hiring them.

For some reason, no Republican wants to hold American lawbreakers responsible for their illegal actions.

Second Funkiest White Man in America

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Reply #72 posted 06/11/19 9:25am

RodeoSchro

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guitarslinger44 said:

RodeoSchro said:



As a Texan, I have to report that these droves of Californians are NOT moving to Houston. I can't name one person I've met in - ever? - that "fled" California and moved to Texas. If that's happening, it isn't happening in Houston. That I can promise you.

Texas is turning purple because of changing demographics, not because people are moving here from blue states. The percent of Houston's population that is 20 years or younger and is Hispanic is 61%. Sixty-one percent! No one can predict the future but if the Democrats in Texas do their job right (and that's a giant "if"), Texas will be bluer than blue before the Prince estate puts out "Originals Volume 2".

I posted in the earlier #MAGA thread that for 2019 it is projected that California needs 180,000 new homes built to handle the influx of new residents, yet there are only 90,000 expected to be built. This indicates that California is growing, not shrinking. (It also indicates that I need to start a homebuilding company in California.)

These rumors about people "fleeing" California remind me of the propoganda put out by the GOP when ObamaCare was enacted. The radical right-wing Republicans said "All the doctors are going to quit!!1!!11!!! Who's going to take care of you when that happens?!?!?!?"

And of course, the number of doctors who quit practicing medicine because the ACA was enacted turned out to be zero point zero.

I don't know where you get the information, or maybe more accurately the conclusion, that people are fleeing California for Texas, but whoever puts that out is dead wrong.



People seem to be flocking to Austin, Dallas, and San Antonio. I dunno, this is just what I've been reading and from what people I know who have left have told me. It's not propaganda, one of those links I posted was from CNBC.




LOL, so they completely avoid Texas's largest city? Ah....no.

No offense, but your information is bunk.

Second Funkiest White Man in America

P&R's Palladin
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Reply #73 posted 06/11/19 9:26am

RodeoSchro

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OnlyNDaUsa said:

guitarslinger44 said:



People seem to be flocking to Austin, Dallas, and San Antonio. I dunno, this is just what I've been reading and from what people I know who have left have told me. It's not propaganda, one of those links I posted was from CNBC.

unlike some... I base what I say on facts not on what I have experinced... and I assure you many people are moving to texas from liberal states... some of them are trying to get away from failed liberal polies... the sad part is too many of them still vote for the same failed ideas they just escaped.



Prove it.

Second Funkiest White Man in America

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Reply #74 posted 06/11/19 10:07am

guitarslinger4
4

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RodeoSchro said:



guitarslinger44 said:




RodeoSchro said:





As a Texan, I have to report that these droves of Californians are NOT moving to Houston. I can't name one person I've met in - ever? - that "fled" California and moved to Texas. If that's happening, it isn't happening in Houston. That I can promise you.

Texas is turning purple because of changing demographics, not because people are moving here from blue states. The percent of Houston's population that is 20 years or younger and is Hispanic is 61%. Sixty-one percent! No one can predict the future but if the Democrats in Texas do their job right (and that's a giant "if"), Texas will be bluer than blue before the Prince estate puts out "Originals Volume 2".

I posted in the earlier #MAGA thread that for 2019 it is projected that California needs 180,000 new homes built to handle the influx of new residents, yet there are only 90,000 expected to be built. This indicates that California is growing, not shrinking. (It also indicates that I need to start a homebuilding company in California.)

These rumors about people "fleeing" California remind me of the propoganda put out by the GOP when ObamaCare was enacted. The radical right-wing Republicans said "All the doctors are going to quit!!1!!11!!! Who's going to take care of you when that happens?!?!?!?"

And of course, the number of doctors who quit practicing medicine because the ACA was enacted turned out to be zero point zero.

I don't know where you get the information, or maybe more accurately the conclusion, that people are fleeing California for Texas, but whoever puts that out is dead wrong.





People seem to be flocking to Austin, Dallas, and San Antonio. I dunno, this is just what I've been reading and from what people I know who have left have told me. It's not propaganda, one of those links I posted was from CNBC.






LOL, so they completely avoid Texas's largest city? Ah....no.

No offense, but your information is bunk.




Austin is a lock because it's the liberal mecca of Texas, at least as far as everyone knows. I don't know why anyone would move to Houston anyway. Why don't you read the cnbc link I posted rather than shooting from the hip?
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Reply #75 posted 06/11/19 10:41am

maplenpg

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guitarslinger44 said:

RodeoSchro said:




LOL, so they completely avoid Texas's largest city? Ah....no.

No offense, but your information is bunk.

Austin is a lock because it's the liberal mecca of Texas, at least as far as everyone knows. I don't know why anyone would move to Houston anyway. Why don't you read the cnbc link I posted rather than shooting from the hip?

I've read the link, but it seems to me that it's a nothingburger. A quick Google search bought up many articles about people moving to California, including this article. I quote:


Consider that in 2017:

  • More people left California (661,026) than arrived (523,131) from other U.S. states. But for the nation’s most populous state, with 39 million residents, that amounted to a tiny fraction in net departures: just 0.35%.

  • Among the 25-years-and-older set, the state lost a net 86,890 residents without bachelor’s degrees, and just 4,443 with a four-year degree. It gained 11,653 people with graduate degrees.

  • No state boasts more loudly of its attractions than Texas. Indeed, 63,174 people relocated from California to the nation’s second-most populous state, more than to anywhere else in the U.S. But it’s also true that no state sent more people here than the Lone Star State — 40,999.

“The cost of living, especially housing, is what stops the whole world from moving to California,” said USC demographer Dowell Myers, a longtime census expert. “Otherwise, who wouldn’t prefer California? We have superior weather. We have mountains and oceans. And we have better jobs — better paying and more specialized, whether in tech, entertainment, the arts or medicine.”

If you're going to refer to people as 'scum', at least have a reason to do so.
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Reply #76 posted 06/11/19 12:23pm

RodeoSchro

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guitarslinger44 said:

RodeoSchro said:




LOL, so they completely avoid Texas's largest city? Ah....no.

No offense, but your information is bunk.

Austin is a lock because it's the liberal mecca of Texas, at least as far as everyone knows. I don't know why anyone would move to Houston anyway. Why don't you read the cnbc link I posted rather than shooting from the hip?



Is Austin a "liberal mecca"? Hmmm, let me know the political affiliations of their Congressional representatives, and get back to me on that.

I did read the article. The two reasons mentioned for "fleeing" California were:

1. Increased housing prices; and
2. Taxation.

Let's take these in reverse order.

TAXATION - To my knowledge, state taxes in California haven't changed much in quite awhile. Someone can correct me if I'm wrong. What did change recently was the tax law pushed through by unrepentant serial adulterer Donald J. Trump, whereby he changed to ability to deduct state taxes from your federal return. A truly petty move and one designed out of pure spite. So if one wants to bellyache about taxation, the blame goes to the unrepentant serial adulterer in the White House

HOUSING PRICES - I am truly surprised by the complete lack of basic economic knowledge here. I mean - why the Sam Hill do radical right-wing Republicans think housing has gotten so expensive in California? Because it's a poophole? Of course not! It's supply and demand - surely a topic covered by Milton Friedman, right? Housing prices in California rise because demand is greater than supply. That indicates the exact opposite of a "fleeing" environment. But maybe there's good news with all this "fleeing"! Maybe so many people will leave California that housing prices will crash, and we can scoop up some sweet Beverly Hills mansions on the cheap! Yeah - if you believe that, then you probably also believe in the tooth fairy, but not in the laws of supply and demand

There you go. Completely shot from the hip, and completely on target.

Second Funkiest White Man in America

P&R's Palladin
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Reply #77 posted 06/11/19 2:05pm

guitarslinger4
4

avatar

RodeoSchro said:



guitarslinger44 said:


RodeoSchro said:





LOL, so they completely avoid Texas's largest city? Ah....no.

No offense, but your information is bunk.



Austin is a lock because it's the liberal mecca of Texas, at least as far as everyone knows. I don't know why anyone would move to Houston anyway. Why don't you read the cnbc link I posted rather than shooting from the hip?



Is Austin a "liberal mecca"? Hmmm, let me know the political affiliations of their Congressional representatives, and get back to me on that.

I did read the article. The two reasons mentioned for "fleeing" California were:

1. Increased housing prices; and
2. Taxation.

Let's take these in reverse order.

TAXATION - To my knowledge, state taxes in California haven't changed much in quite awhile. Someone can correct me if I'm wrong. What did change recently was the tax law pushed through by unrepentant serial adulterer Donald J. Trump, whereby he changed to ability to deduct state taxes from your federal return. A truly petty move and one designed out of pure spite. So if one wants to bellyache about taxation, the blame goes to the unrepentant serial adulterer in the White House

HOUSING PRICES - I am truly surprised by the complete lack of basic economic knowledge here. I mean - why the Sam Hill do radical right-wing Republicans think housing has gotten so expensive in California? Because it's a poophole? Of course not! It's supply and demand - surely a topic covered by Milton Friedman, right? Housing prices in California rise because demand is greater than supply. That indicates the exact opposite of a "fleeing" environment. But maybe there's good news with all this "fleeing"! Maybe so many people will leave California that housing prices will crash, and we can scoop up some sweet Beverly Hills mansions on the cheap! Yeah - if you believe that, then you probably also believe in the tooth fairy, but not in the laws of supply and demand

There you go. Completely shot from the hip, and completely on target.



What you just typed was my whole point and what I said from the jump.

California is a state run by people who claim to care about the "less fortunate" and yet their policies are turning their own population into the less fortunate in some cases. Cali had high taxes before Trump, his tax policy just made a bad problem worse.

And yes, compared to the rest of Texas, Austin is a liberal mecca. It's like Nashville, Portland, or Atlanta.
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Reply #78 posted 06/11/19 2:32pm

Ugot2shakesumt
hin

avatar

People move for lots of reasons and California has always been the place where the best of the best gravitate to. So no one should worry for California.

Here is one study that has grabbed a lot of headlines over the past year. It's from a large moving van company.

the top 10 states people moved to and from, and more on the most popular states for relocation in 2018.

*Top states people moved to:

Vermont (72.1%)
Oregon (63.8%)
Idaho (62.4%)
Nevada (61.8%)
Arizona (60.2%)
South Carolina (59.9%)
Washington (58.8%)
South Dakota (57%)
North Carolina (57%)
District of Columbia (56.7%)
*Top states people moved from:

New Jersey (66.8)
Illinois (65.9%)
Connecticut (62%)
New York (61.5%)
Kansas (58.7%)
Ohio (56.5%)
Massachusetts (55.7%)
Iowa (55.5%)
Montana (55%)
Michigan (55%)
Persistent Turd is the shit.
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Reply #79 posted 06/12/19 4:40am

DiminutiveRock
er

avatar

guitarslinger44 said:

DiminutiveRocker said:

These are your sources? lol 2 of the three quotes the same 65 year old guy who does not want to pay taxes and one is San Francisco centric.


I have lived in California all my life and likely know more about California than you do. As for taxes? All those highways and public utilities do not pay for themselves.


falloff Oh yeah - of the 40 million that live here some 137,000 moved to Nevada and Arizona? Retirees? It's tantamount to East Coast retireees moving to Florida.




wink






[Edited 6/10/19 17:01pm]


Apparently you don't know that much about what's going on with your home state if you don't know that people are leaving in droves because of how unaffordable it's become to live there due to touchy feely leftist policies. I provided you with three of many sources, two of which, you waved away, one of which you didn't even acknowledge. There are countless articles about how Californians leaving are starting to turn Arizon, Texas, etc into purple states.

What did you bring to the table?


Nothing except smugness and anecdotes. I know many people who still live there, and even more who have left the state because of the reasons those articles stated.

Get out of your bubble, or at least do a little research.



Droves... lol tell that to cross-town commuters on the city freeways spit


I strongly suggest that YOU get out of your uneducated and misinformed bubble before you even take a seat at the "table" - I brought facts, you brought misinformation.


The truth is that, again, you do not know what the fuck you are talking about.

Here's my research:

LA Times:

Who moves to California? The wealthier and better educated, mostly

By MARGOT ROOSEVELT

DEC 21, 2018 | 6:00 AM



High taxes. Stifling regulations. Exorbitant housing costs. Freeway gridlock. Fires and floods.

Hand-wringing over an exodus of disillusioned Californians may be a Golden State pastime, the subject of political punditry and strung-out social media threads.


But the latest data are far from dire. The U.S. Census Bureau, in its newly released surveys for 2017, shows that California’s net migration remained fairly stable. Since 2010, as the economic recovery took hold and housing prices skyrocketed, departures accelerated — but the number of newcomers rose steadily as well.


The state attracts a steady stream of college graduates, especially from the East Coast, even as many less-educated residents move to neighboring states — and to Texas — in search of a lower cost of living.

Consider that in 2017:

  • More people left California (661,026) than arrived (523,131) from other U.S. states. But for the nation’s most populous state, with 39 million residents, that amounted to a tiny fraction in net departures: just 0.35%.

  • Among the 25-years-and-older set, the state lost a net 86,890 residents without bachelor’s degrees, and just 4,443 with a four-year degree. It gained 11,653 people with graduate degrees.

  • No state boasts more loudly of its attractions than Texas. Indeed, 63,174 people relocated from California to the nation’s second-most populous state, more than to anywhere else in the U.S. But it’s also true that no state sent more people here than the Lone Star State — 40,999.



And thanks to your Republican congress in 2017...

“The tax bill made it worse,” Kotkin said, pointing out that the federal tax changes mean deductions for state, local and property taxes now get capped at $10,000. “State taxes have become a significant factor now. We’re getting into a situation where the middle class in California really can’t hack it.”

Overall, the Edelman survey involved a total of 1,900 California residents and was conducted Jan. 4 to Jan. 20. It said results were weighted to the Census to be representative of the state’s adult population.

A report from California’s Legislative Analyst’s Office last year indicated Texas, Arizona, Oregon and Nevada are popular destinations for relocating Californians. It also found families with kids and those Californians with only a high school education were most likely to flee to lower cost states than college-educated residents.





[Edited 6/12/19 7:03am]

"'Were it left to me to decide whether we should have a government without newspapers, or newspapers without a government, I should not hesitate a moment to prefer the latter.'' - Thomas Jefferson
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Reply #80 posted 06/12/19 6:20am

13cjk13

DiminutiveRocker said:

guitarslinger44 said:


Apparently you don't know that much about what's going on with your home state if you don't know that people are leaving in droves because of how unaffordable it's become to live there due to touchy feely leftist policies. I provided you with three of many sources, two of which, you waved away, one of which you didn't even acknowledge. There are countless articles about how Californians leaving are starting to turn Arizon, Texas, etc into purple states.

What did you bring to the table?


Nothing except smugness and anecdotes. I know many people who still live there, and even more who have left the state because of the reasons those articles stated.

Get out of your bubble, or at least do a little research.



Droves... lol tell that to cross-town commuters on the city freeways spit



Here's my research:

LA Times:

Who moves to California? The wealthier and better educated, mostly

By MARGOT ROOSEVELT

DEC 21, 2018 | 6:00 AM



High taxes. Stifling regulations. Exorbitant housing costs. Freeway gridlock. Fires and floods.

Hand-wringing over an exodus of disillusioned Californians may be a Golden State pastime, the subject of political punditry and strung-out social media threads.


But the latest data are far from dire. The U.S. Census Bureau, in its newly released surveys for 2017, shows that California’s net migration remained fairly stable. Since 2010, as the economic recovery took hold and housing prices skyrocketed, departures accelerated — but the number of newcomers rose steadily as well.


The state attracts a steady stream of college graduates, especially from the East Coast, even as many less-educated residents move to neighboring states — and to Texas — in search of a lower cost of living.

Consider that in 2017:

  • More people left California (661,026) than arrived (523,131) from other U.S. states. But for the nation’s most populous state, with 39 million residents, that amounted to a tiny fraction in net departures: just 0.35%.

  • Among the 25-years-and-older set, the state lost a net 86,890 residents without bachelor’s degrees, and just 4,443 with a four-year degree. It gained 11,653 people with graduate degrees.

  • No state boasts more loudly of its attractions than Texas. Indeed, 63,174 people relocated from California to the nation’s second-most populous state, more than to anywhere else in the U.S. But it’s also true that no state sent more people here than the Lone Star State — 40,999.



And thanks to your Republican congress in 2017...

“The tax bill made it worse,” Kotkin said, pointing out that the federal tax changes mean deductions for state, local and property taxes now get capped at $10,000. “State taxes have become a significant factor now. We’re getting into a situation where the middle class in California really can’t hack it.”

Overall, the Edelman survey involved a total of 1,900 California residents and was conducted Jan. 4 to Jan. 20. It said results were weighted to the Census to be representative of the state’s adult population.

A report from California’s Legislative Analyst’s Office last year indicated Texas, Arizona, Oregon and Nevada are popular destinations for relocating Californians. It also found families with kids and those Californians with only a high school education were most likely to flee to lower cost states than college-educated residents.





[Edited 6/12/19 4:53am]

yeahthat

"If we had had confidence the president clearly did not commit a crime, we would have said so."
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Reply #81 posted 06/12/19 7:08am

DiminutiveRock
er

avatar

13cjk13 said:

DiminutiveRocker said:


Droves... lol tell that to cross-town commuters on the city freeways spit



Here's my research:

LA Times:

Who moves to California? The wealthier and better educated, mostly

By MARGOT ROOSEVELT

DEC 21, 2018 | 6:00 AM



High taxes. Stifling regulations. Exorbitant housing costs. Freeway gridlock. Fires and floods.

Hand-wringing over an exodus of disillusioned Californians may be a Golden State pastime, the subject of political punditry and strung-out social media threads.


But the latest data are far from dire. The U.S. Census Bureau, in its newly released surveys for 2017, shows that California’s net migration remained fairly stable. Since 2010, as the economic recovery took hold and housing prices skyrocketed, departures accelerated — but the number of newcomers rose steadily as well.


The state attracts a steady stream of college graduates, especially from the East Coast, even as many less-educated residents move to neighboring states — and to Texas — in search of a lower cost of living.

Consider that in 2017:

  • More people left California (661,026) than arrived (523,131) from other U.S. states. But for the nation’s most populous state, with 39 million residents, that amounted to a tiny fraction in net departures: just 0.35%.

  • Among the 25-years-and-older set, the state lost a net 86,890 residents without bachelor’s degrees, and just 4,443 with a four-year degree. It gained 11,653 people with graduate degrees.

  • No state boasts more loudly of its attractions than Texas. Indeed, 63,174 people relocated from California to the nation’s second-most populous state, more than to anywhere else in the U.S. But it’s also true that no state sent more people here than the Lone Star State — 40,999.



And thanks to your Republican congress in 2017...

“The tax bill made it worse,” Kotkin said, pointing out that the federal tax changes mean deductions for state, local and property taxes now get capped at $10,000. “State taxes have become a significant factor now. We’re getting into a situation where the middle class in California really can’t hack it.”

Overall, the Edelman survey involved a total of 1,900 California residents and was conducted Jan. 4 to Jan. 20. It said results were weighted to the Census to be representative of the state’s adult population.

A report from California’s Legislative Analyst’s Office last year indicated Texas, Arizona, Oregon and Nevada are popular destinations for relocating Californians. It also found families with kids and those Californians with only a high school education were most likely to flee to lower cost states than college-educated residents.





[Edited 6/12/19 4:53am]

yeahthat


The dissemination of misinformation is a right wing disease.

"'Were it left to me to decide whether we should have a government without newspapers, or newspapers without a government, I should not hesitate a moment to prefer the latter.'' - Thomas Jefferson
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Reply #82 posted 06/12/19 7:48am

OnlyNDaUsa

avatar

DiminutiveRocker said:

13cjk13 said:

yeahthat


The dissemination of misinformation is a right wing disease.

haha come on you can't possibly believe the left doesn't do that all the time... and no agreeing with their goal is NOT a reason to see it as okay... and NO I will not give any example as then some will report them as off topic and say I thread jacked...


And no this is not what-about-ism. it is always bad when anyone does it PERIOD.

Being a die-hard civil rights champion,
Being a die-hard libertarian,
Sometimes I have to defend
that which I find distasteful.
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Reply #83 posted 06/12/19 7:56am

RodeoSchro

avatar

OnlyNDaUsa said:

DiminutiveRocker said:


The dissemination of misinformation is a right wing disease.

haha come on you can't possibly believe the left doesn't do that all the time... and no agreeing with their goal is NOT a reason to see it as okay... and NO I will not give any example as then some will report them as off topic and say I thread jacked...


And no this is not what-about-ism. it is always bad when anyone does it PERIOD.



I have a solution!

Instead of just pulling things out of where ever with no factual support other than your memory, post links that provide verifiable information in support of your claim.

It's what all the grown ups are doing!

Second Funkiest White Man in America

P&R's Palladin
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Reply #84 posted 06/12/19 8:05am

Ugot2shakesumt
hin

avatar

OnlyNDaUsa said:



DiminutiveRocker said:




13cjk13 said:



yeahthat




The dissemination of misinformation is a right wing disease.





haha come on you can't possibly believe the left doesn't do that all the time... and no agreeing with their goal is NOT a reason to see it as okay... and NO I will not give any example as then some will report them as off topic and say I thread jacked...


And no this is not what-about-ism. it is always bad when anyone does it PERIOD.




lol

Your signature meant to be parody Mother Theresa Jesus MLK?
[Edited 6/12/19 8:07am]
Persistent Turd is the shit.
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Reply #85 posted 06/12/19 8:23am

OnlyNDaUsa

avatar

Ugot2shakesumthin said:

OnlyNDaUsa said:

haha come on you can't possibly believe the left doesn't do that all the time... and no agreeing with their goal is NOT a reason to see it as okay... and NO I will not give any example as then some will report them as off topic and say I thread jacked...


And no this is not what-about-ism. it is always bad when anyone does it PERIOD.

lol Your signature meant to be parody Mother Theresa Jesus MLK? [Edited 6/12/19 8:07am]


Do you not agree?

my sig is to make it known where I stand on liberty... that liberty trumps feelings and when it comes to conduct unless it causes harm to others and those people can not avoid said harm then that conduct ought to be legal. And even when there is not easy way to avoid harm that is not a basis by itself to ban that conduct.

Being a die-hard civil rights champion,
Being a die-hard libertarian,
Sometimes I have to defend
that which I find distasteful.
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Reply #86 posted 06/12/19 8:29am

Ugot2shakesumt
hin

avatar

OnlyNDaUsa said:



Ugot2shakesumthin said:


OnlyNDaUsa said:




haha come on you can't possibly believe the left doesn't do that all the time... and no agreeing with their goal is NOT a reason to see it as okay... and NO I will not give any example as then some will report them as off topic and say I thread jacked...


And no this is not what-about-ism. it is always bad when anyone does it PERIOD.



lol Your signature meant to be parody Mother Theresa Jesus MLK? [Edited 6/12/19 8:07am]



Do you not agree?


my sig is to make it known where I stand on liberty... that liberty trumps feelings and when it comes to conduct unless it causes harm to others and those people can not avoid said harm then that conduct ought to be legal. And even when there is not easy way to avoid harm that is not a basis by itself to ban that conduct.



You've been on the wrong side of history ever since I've seen your posts. Nice try???
Persistent Turd is the shit.
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Reply #87 posted 06/12/19 8:34am

OnlyNDaUsa

avatar

Ugot2shakesumthin said:

OnlyNDaUsa said:


Do you not agree?

my sig is to make it known where I stand on liberty... that liberty trumps feelings and when it comes to conduct unless it causes harm to others and those people can not avoid said harm then that conduct ought to be legal. And even when there is not easy way to avoid harm that is not a basis by itself to ban that conduct.

You've been on the wrong side of history ever since I've seen your posts. Nice try???

in your opnion but I have been correct many times... give an example where I was wrong?

Being a die-hard civil rights champion,
Being a die-hard libertarian,
Sometimes I have to defend
that which I find distasteful.
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Reply #88 posted 06/12/19 8:45am

Ugot2shakesumt
hin

avatar

OnlyNDaUsa said:



Ugot2shakesumthin said:


OnlyNDaUsa said:




Do you not agree?


my sig is to make it known where I stand on liberty... that liberty trumps feelings and when it comes to conduct unless it causes harm to others and those people can not avoid said harm then that conduct ought to be legal. And even when there is not easy way to avoid harm that is not a basis by itself to ban that conduct.



You've been on the wrong side of history ever since I've seen your posts. Nice try???


in your opnion but I have been correct many times... give an example where I was wrong?



Oh stop it. Get over yourself.
Persistent Turd is the shit.
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Reply #89 posted 06/12/19 8:49am

OnlyNDaUsa

avatar

Ugot2shakesumthin said:

OnlyNDaUsa said:

in your opnion but I have been correct many times... give an example where I was wrong?

Oh stop it. Get over yourself.

you accused me of something and then tell me to get over myself? nice!

Being a die-hard civil rights champion,
Being a die-hard libertarian,
Sometimes I have to defend
that which I find distasteful.
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