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Reply #120 posted 06/02/19 8:05pm

OldFriends4Sal
e

avatar

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IanRG said:

OldFriends4Sale said:

This issue of mass shootings is not by friends family and loved ones.

Mass shooting happens by strangers criminals and people who have a mental/psychological break

Domestic killings are usualy 1 person killed. and guns are not always the tool of death. Same with suicides. The people here who argue 'gun control' in domestic situations are not being realistic. Because suicides range from jumping off a high place, hanging, overdose, cutting the wrist etc

Gun control is not going to curb suicide. Domestic killings fall under the same issue.

I say it's envy, because those same countries/people judge the US when it doesn't respond they way they want.

a feeling of discontented or resentful longing aroused by someone else's possessions, qualities, or luck.

.

Americans think they are the beacon of light, most don't know anything about other countries, so I doubt they are envious.

.

Correct, becaue China has less freedom.
.
I don't expect people to come to P&R to show evidence of mourning or being troubled by these situations. We really cannot judge that, because we really don't know what happens in the other persons -home/inner person. I doubt people are not troubled by it.

.

These debates of _ vs _ are still all about which side is right. Emotional decisions are not necessarily good decisions either. That is generally how we get into trouble. Slogans and chants don't change things. I and a lot of other people I know are having more open discussions about depressions. I let people know, hey let's talk, what's going on etc Homes being a safe space. those are the things that deter suicides by guns or anything else. Too many people are isolated in our society. Technological advances in many ways contribute to it. These things increase violence. Loneliness, being misunderstood, bullying, being invisible/ignored, being treated unfairly and isolated. And even though male and female go through this, men I believe experience it much more. In most states still, if a couple go through a divorce the woman tends to get the kids, no matter the circumstances. And she is generally supported while the man is judged and isolated. His family taken from his except every other weekened and maybe Tuesdays. Holidays and birthdays etc There is so much more, of why these things happen. Take away guns is not an answer. It's like putting a bandaid on a cut that is to the bone.

It's very similar to the Pro-Life vs Pro-Choice debate, those are bandaid answers that make the persons feel good, but the real problems are what happens that lead up to having to have this debate, as well as what happens after, which the pro-lifers need to see the evils ills abuses of the result of unwanted children brought into the world. Bandaid replies.

.

Look at the Columbine school shootings, and many others, the root of the problems falls under these societal fails. If gun violence happens it's just the aftershock of inner violence.

.

It depends on the definition of mass killings as to whether they include by friends, family or loved ones. The definition by Congress since 2013 is 3 or more people killed excluding the killer with no restriction that this must not be a family killing. The definition used in a USA Today 2015 report was 4 or more and specifically including family killings. A report in the Huffington Post in 2016 found that there is a strong connection between mass shootings and domestic violence in the US: in 76 of 133 cases (57%) a current or former intimate partner or family member of the killer was killed.

.

Mass killings are generally by people who have a mental/psychological break. Killings of a person's family and friends en masse is also by people have a mental/psychological break and they can be in numbers considered to be mass shootings.

.

If gun control is not going to curb mass killings or individual family/friend killings, why is the US so much higher in proportional numbers compared to other equivalent countries? How are places like Australia horribly failing our people but doing this proportionally an order of magnitude less than how your country is failing its people?

.

US delusions of being envied does not mean it is envied.

.

Generally countries that have less freedom have higher levels of violence, not lower. Also, you are sounding like the US deaths are the price of freedom - Again, other countries just as free or more so don't have the rates of killings the US has.

.

You appear to be working under the mistaken belief that I think gun control is the only answer or the whole answer. Now it is your turn back to what I said about Super's its all mental health. It is not just solved by gun control and not just solved by focusing on mental health: it is about these two and more. I have not quoted a slogan, so I don't understand why you think I have. I have not sought a bandaid solution either - I have said that you need a step change to break this cycle you are locked in.

[Edited 6/2/19 18:56pm]

Domestic killings, suicide is much different from these 'random/targeted' shootings. We never even create 'threads on the domestic stuff. and rarely do we talk about suicide.

.

But domestic shootings/killings etc are a problem of course. But much different. From what I view in the news someone get's stabbed, shot or beaten, sometimes they live sometimes they don't. And it's usually one person. A mother killing her child(ren) a father killing his wife etc are looked at much differently.

.

I never said we should not deal with gun control. I said getting rid of guns is not going to solve it. Each state as of yet deals with gun control issues and laws differently. That is one problem. the 50 states are like 50 countries.

.

The US is admired and envied. They go hand in hand.

.

China may have higher issues of violence that doesn't involve guns from the civilian side. There are many other ways violence takes place.

.

I'm not thinking at all about what you might be thinking. I was just talking about deeper issues beyond what the people in general focus on.

I think you took that part of my post to personal. I was not talk about what I think you think or should do. You're not American.

I'm not in a cycle. I don't know any gun violence remotely close to my life.

Getting rid of guns is a bandaid though.

#IDEFINEME #ALBUMSSTILLMATTER

A Liar Shall Not Tarry In My Presence

What's the matter with your life
Is poverty bringing U down?
Is the mailman jerking U 'round?
Did he put your million dollar check
In someone else's box?
Tell me, what's the m
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Reply #121 posted 06/02/19 8:26pm

OldFriends4Sal
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Trump makes unannounced stop at Virginia church

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/trump-makes-unannounced-stop-at-virginia-church/ar-AAChTpD?ocid=spartanntp

The White House said Trump was stopping at McLean Bible Church in Vienna, Virginia, "to visit with the Pastor and pray for the victims and community of Virginia Beach."

But the stop on Sunday only lasted a short time and there was no explicit mention of the shooting victims.

Twelve people died after a gunman opened fire at a municipal office in Virginia Beach on Friday. Trump has tweeted his condolences and spoken with local leaders.

Trump walked on stage at the church wearing khaki pants and a jacket over his polo shirt and holding a golf hat. He stood alongside pastor David Platt, who noted that there had been calls from Christian leaders to pray for the president on Sunday.

"We don't want to do that just on this Sunday," Platt said. "We want to do that continually, day in and day out. So I want to ask us to bow our heads together now and pray for our president."

The pastor went on to offer a prayer for the president and other political leaders.

"We know we need your mercy. We need your grace. We need your help. We need your wisdom in our country," he said. "And so we stand right now on behalf of our president, and we pray for your grace and your mercy and your wisdom upon him."

The pastor added that he was praying not just for the president, but for "leaders in Congress," "leaders in courts" and state leaders.

The president did not make remarks on stage before departing.

Evangelist Franklin Graham and 250 other Christian leaders last week announced they were calling for a "Special Day of Prayer" to set aside time to lead their local congregations in praying for the president on Sunday.

Trump had retweeted several messages on Saturday night mentioning the planned day of prayer.

#IDEFINEME #ALBUMSSTILLMATTER

A Liar Shall Not Tarry In My Presence

What's the matter with your life
Is poverty bringing U down?
Is the mailman jerking U 'round?
Did he put your million dollar check
In someone else's box?
Tell me, what's the m
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Reply #122 posted 06/02/19 8:45pm

PennyPurple

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I think we the people need all the Prayers we can get, with that idiot in office.

OldFriends4Sale said:

Trump makes unannounced stop at Virginia church

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/trump-makes-unannounced-stop-at-virginia-church/ar-AAChTpD?ocid=spartanntp

The White House said Trump was stopping at McLean Bible Church in Vienna, Virginia, "to visit with the Pastor and pray for the victims and community of Virginia Beach."

But the stop on Sunday only lasted a short time and there was no explicit mention of the shooting victims.

Twelve people died after a gunman opened fire at a municipal office in Virginia Beach on Friday. Trump has tweeted his condolences and spoken with local leaders.

Trump walked on stage at the church wearing khaki pants and a jacket over his polo shirt and holding a golf hat. He stood alongside pastor David Platt, who noted that there had been calls from Christian leaders to pray for the president on Sunday.

"We don't want to do that just on this Sunday," Platt said. "We want to do that continually, day in and day out. So I want to ask us to bow our heads together now and pray for our president."

The pastor went on to offer a prayer for the president and other political leaders.

"We know we need your mercy. We need your grace. We need your help. We need your wisdom in our country," he said. "And so we stand right now on behalf of our president, and we pray for your grace and your mercy and your wisdom upon him."

The pastor added that he was praying not just for the president, but for "leaders in Congress," "leaders in courts" and state leaders.

The president did not make remarks on stage before departing.

Evangelist Franklin Graham and 250 other Christian leaders last week announced they were calling for a "Special Day of Prayer" to set aside time to lead their local congregations in praying for the president on Sunday.

Trump had retweeted several messages on Saturday night mentioning the planned day of prayer.

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Reply #123 posted 06/02/19 11:52pm

IanRG

OldFriends4Sale said:

IanRG said:

.

It depends on the definition of mass killings as to whether they include by friends, family or loved ones. The definition by Congress since 2013 is 3 or more people killed excluding the killer with no restriction that this must not be a family killing. The definition used in a USA Today 2015 report was 4 or more and specifically including family killings. A report in the Huffington Post in 2016 found that there is a strong connection between mass shootings and domestic violence in the US: in 76 of 133 cases (57%) a current or former intimate partner or family member of the killer was killed.

.

Mass killings are generally by people who have a mental/psychological break. Killings of a person's family and friends en masse is also by people have a mental/psychological break and they can be in numbers considered to be mass shootings.

.

If gun control is not going to curb mass killings or individual family/friend killings, why is the US so much higher in proportional numbers compared to other equivalent countries? How are places like Australia horribly failing our people but doing this proportionally an order of magnitude less than how your country is failing its people?

.

US delusions of being envied does not mean it is envied.

.

Generally countries that have less freedom have higher levels of violence, not lower. Also, you are sounding like the US deaths are the price of freedom - Again, other countries just as free or more so don't have the rates of killings the US has.

.

You appear to be working under the mistaken belief that I think gun control is the only answer or the whole answer. Now it is your turn back to what I said about Super's its all mental health. It is not just solved by gun control and not just solved by focusing on mental health: it is about these two and more. I have not quoted a slogan, so I don't understand why you think I have. I have not sought a bandaid solution either - I have said that you need a step change to break this cycle you are locked in.

[Edited 6/2/19 18:56pm]

Domestic killings, suicide is much different from these 'random/targeted' shootings. We never even create 'threads on the domestic stuff. and rarely do we talk about suicide.

.

But domestic shootings/killings etc are a problem of course. But much different. From what I view in the news someone get's stabbed, shot or beaten, sometimes they live sometimes they don't. And it's usually one person. A mother killing her child(ren) a father killing his wife etc are looked at much differently.

.

I never said we should not deal with gun control. I said getting rid of guns is not going to solve it. Each state as of yet deals with gun control issues and laws differently. That is one problem. the 50 states are like 50 countries.

.

The US is admired and envied. They go hand in hand.

.

China may have higher issues of violence that doesn't involve guns from the civilian side. There are many other ways violence takes place.

.

I'm not thinking at all about what you might be thinking. I was just talking about deeper issues beyond what the people in general focus on.

I think you took that part of my post to personal. I was not talk about what I think you think or should do. You're not American.

I'm not in a cycle. I don't know any gun violence remotely close to my life.

Getting rid of guns is a bandaid though.

.

But the stats on mass shootings are not talking about one person injuring or killing one other person. They are looking at shootings that kill above a certain number and these include where is being killed by a friend, family member or loved one - 57% of all mass shootings. You can look at them differently but others don't.

.

I never getting rid of guns. I said the rate of US gun ownership together with its gun culture is failing the US people and a step (non-bandaid) change is needed to just as bad as the rest of us.

.

I don't know why you are obsessing with other places envy the US. Aside from some gun rights activists prepared to sacrifice people in the name of freedom I think you vastly overestimate how many people admire and envy the US over their rate of killing nad injurying people due to gun and other weopons violence.

.

What China may have is speculation.

.

Re I'm not ..., Thank you for clarifying

.

And right back at you: When I say the US cycle of gun and other weapon violence that sees it an order of magnitude higher than equivalent countries, I was not referring to you individually.

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Reply #124 posted 06/03/19 12:04am

BombSquad

avatar

PennyPurple said:

When will it end?

why should it? this should not be a day for mourning

this is a great and joyful day to celebrate Freedom once again!!









[Edited 6/3/19 0:04am]

Ideally speaking, the President of the United States and the dumbest person in the country would be two different people. Oh well.... money can't fix stupid
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Reply #125 posted 06/03/19 5:09am

OldFriends4Sal
e

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moderator

IanRG said:

OldFriends4Sale said:

Domestic killings, suicide is much different from these 'random/targeted' shootings. We never even create 'threads on the domestic stuff. and rarely do we talk about suicide.

.

But domestic shootings/killings etc are a problem of course. But much different. From what I view in the news someone get's stabbed, shot or beaten, sometimes they live sometimes they don't. And it's usually one person. A mother killing her child(ren) a father killing his wife etc are looked at much differently.

.

I never said we should not deal with gun control. I said getting rid of guns is not going to solve it. Each state as of yet deals with gun control issues and laws differently. That is one problem. the 50 states are like 50 countries.

.

The US is admired and envied. They go hand in hand.

.

China may have higher issues of violence that doesn't involve guns from the civilian side. There are many other ways violence takes place.

.

I'm not thinking at all about what you might be thinking. I was just talking about deeper issues beyond what the people in general focus on.

I think you took that part of my post to personal. I was not talk about what I think you think or should do. You're not American.

I'm not in a cycle. I don't know any gun violence remotely close to my life.

Getting rid of guns is a bandaid though.

.

But the stats on mass shootings are not talking about one person injuring or killing one other person. They are looking at shootings that kill above a certain number and these include where is being killed by a friend, family member or loved one - 57% of all mass shootings. You can look at them differently but others don't.

.

I never getting rid of guns. I said the rate of US gun ownership together with its gun culture is failing the US people and a step (non-bandaid) change is needed to just as bad as the rest of us.

.

I don't know why you are obsessing with other places envy the US. Aside from some gun rights activists prepared to sacrifice people in the name of freedom I think you vastly overestimate how many people admire and envy the US over their rate of killing nad injurying people due to gun and other weopons violence.

.

What China may have is speculation.

.

Re I'm not ..., Thank you for clarifying

.

And right back at you: When I say the US cycle of gun and other weapon violence that sees it an order of magnitude higher than equivalent countries, I was not referring to you individually.

Obsessed? Have you ever heard me talk about this prior to yesterday? Don't exaggerate. It was a passing comment.

#IDEFINEME #ALBUMSSTILLMATTER

A Liar Shall Not Tarry In My Presence

What's the matter with your life
Is poverty bringing U down?
Is the mailman jerking U 'round?
Did he put your million dollar check
In someone else's box?
Tell me, what's the m
 Reply w/quote - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #126 posted 06/03/19 5:09am

OldFriends4Sal
e

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LOL

PennyPurple said:

I think we the people need all the Prayers we can get, with that idiot in office.

OldFriends4Sale said:

Trump makes unannounced stop at Virginia church

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/trump-makes-unannounced-stop-at-virginia-church/ar-AAChTpD?ocid=spartanntp

The White House said Trump was stopping at McLean Bible Church in Vienna, Virginia, "to visit with the Pastor and pray for the victims and community of Virginia Beach."

But the stop on Sunday only lasted a short time and there was no explicit mention of the shooting victims.

Twelve people died after a gunman opened fire at a municipal office in Virginia Beach on Friday. Trump has tweeted his condolences and spoken with local leaders.

Trump walked on stage at the church wearing khaki pants and a jacket over his polo shirt and holding a golf hat. He stood alongside pastor David Platt, who noted that there had been calls from Christian leaders to pray for the president on Sunday.

"We don't want to do that just on this Sunday," Platt said. "We want to do that continually, day in and day out. So I want to ask us to bow our heads together now and pray for our president."

The pastor went on to offer a prayer for the president and other political leaders.

"We know we need your mercy. We need your grace. We need your help. We need your wisdom in our country," he said. "And so we stand right now on behalf of our president, and we pray for your grace and your mercy and your wisdom upon him."

The pastor added that he was praying not just for the president, but for "leaders in Congress," "leaders in courts" and state leaders.

The president did not make remarks on stage before departing.

Evangelist Franklin Graham and 250 other Christian leaders last week announced they were calling for a "Special Day of Prayer" to set aside time to lead their local congregations in praying for the president on Sunday.

Trump had retweeted several messages on Saturday night mentioning the planned day of prayer.

#IDEFINEME #ALBUMSSTILLMATTER

A Liar Shall Not Tarry In My Presence

What's the matter with your life
Is poverty bringing U down?
Is the mailman jerking U 'round?
Did he put your million dollar check
In someone else's box?
Tell me, what's the m
 Reply w/quote - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #127 posted 06/03/19 5:21am

OldFriends4Sal
e

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moderator

DeWayne Craddock was violent with co-workers before Virginia Beach shooting: report

The gunman who shot dead 12 people at a Virginia Beach municipal building had been facing disciplinary action for a violent fight at work, according to a report.

DeWayne Craddock, 40, was still employed as an engineer with the Department of Public Utilities when he went on his shooting rampage Friday, killing 12 and injuring several others, including a cop.

But he recently started showing serious behavioral problems and got into physical "scuffles" with other city workers, a source told The New York Times.

The source told the paper that the troubles had escalated in the week leading up to the mass shooting — and Craddock was involved in what it called "a violent altercation on city grounds."

Craddock reportedly knew he was facing

https://nypost.com/2019/0...cn_5avgRsU

#IDEFINEME #ALBUMSSTILLMATTER

A Liar Shall Not Tarry In My Presence

What's the matter with your life
Is poverty bringing U down?
Is the mailman jerking U 'round?
Did he put your million dollar check
In someone else's box?
Tell me, what's the m
 Reply w/quote - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #128 posted 06/03/19 5:54am

maplenpg

avatar

OldFriends4Sale said:

No, it's not irrelevant. Comparisons have to make sense in terms of sizes of nations. There are European countries that could fit inside of a US state. Australia(continent) has 5 cities, New York State alone has at least 5.

And I'll say again, if someone 'snaps' and wants to kill people (1 or more) despite 'gun' laws they will do it. Illegal people don't follow the rules. Only the law abiding citizens follow the rules. Banning guns won't stop someone from making a gun or obtaining it illegally. We cannot even stop drug abuses. What laws? If they cannot get coke or heroin, they'll get opiods or use glue.

The laws actually put the 'law abiding citizens' in a harder place, than the criminal. The criminal goes around or under the law to get guns. Also, our human existance and or flawed nature isn't covered nor can it be covered by the law. A man or woman who never had an issue their whole life can have something happen and they snap.

.

Naw 'envy' of the US, even though the people I communicate with and debate their 'envy' the fact is countries do. They look to the US as an example of freedom(why do so many from countries and continents all over flock to the US) or countries who look to us to send our military to fight battles. Why are so many people from Latin America trying to get int the US.

.

.

Ian, you replied to my reply to maplenpg, who said: We do not have these mass killings in other western countries with much stricter gun laws.

who replied to my comment to 2Freaky...

So go back and read the full discourse, before you start 'you-ing', that you were not originally in.

.

.

and the problem is not people who defend guns rather than mourn deaths. People can do both at the same time. That's like people who gripe 'we don't need a theater until we deal with child poverty' You can do both at the same time.

.

But as I said earlier, true freedom and our flawed human race, along with ideals and fears in America are closer to the root of the problem.

Just for the record, I didn't respond to your response as Ian said everything I would have.

If love is the answer, what was the question? - Carter USM.
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Reply #129 posted 06/03/19 6:28am

OldFriends4Sal
e

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moderator

maplenpg said:

OldFriends4Sale said:

No, it's not irrelevant. Comparisons have to make sense in terms of sizes of nations. There are European countries that could fit inside of a US state. Australia(continent) has 5 cities, New York State alone has at least 5.

And I'll say again, if someone 'snaps' and wants to kill people (1 or more) despite 'gun' laws they will do it. Illegal people don't follow the rules. Only the law abiding citizens follow the rules. Banning guns won't stop someone from making a gun or obtaining it illegally. We cannot even stop drug abuses. What laws? If they cannot get coke or heroin, they'll get opiods or use glue.

The laws actually put the 'law abiding citizens' in a harder place, than the criminal. The criminal goes around or under the law to get guns. Also, our human existance and or flawed nature isn't covered nor can it be covered by the law. A man or woman who never had an issue their whole life can have something happen and they snap.

.

Naw 'envy' of the US, even though the people I communicate with and debate their 'envy' the fact is countries do. They look to the US as an example of freedom(why do so many from countries and continents all over flock to the US) or countries who look to us to send our military to fight battles. Why are so many people from Latin America trying to get int the US.

.

.

Ian, you replied to my reply to maplenpg, who said: We do not have these mass killings in other western countries with much stricter gun laws.

who replied to my comment to 2Freaky...

So go back and read the full discourse, before you start 'you-ing', that you were not originally in.

.

.

and the problem is not people who defend guns rather than mourn deaths. People can do both at the same time. That's like people who gripe 'we don't need a theater until we deal with child poverty' You can do both at the same time.

.

But as I said earlier, true freedom and our flawed human race, along with ideals and fears in America are closer to the root of the problem.

Just for the record, I didn't respond to your response as Ian said everything I would have.

for the record see post #13 (that above was what I quoted from you)

maplenpg, it's past, we don't have to do a back in forth

nothing personal, we're goood

We are not going to solve anything on the org

#IDEFINEME #ALBUMSSTILLMATTER

A Liar Shall Not Tarry In My Presence

What's the matter with your life
Is poverty bringing U down?
Is the mailman jerking U 'round?
Did he put your million dollar check
In someone else's box?
Tell me, what's the m
 Reply w/quote - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #130 posted 06/03/19 7:33am

maplenpg

avatar

OldFriends4Sale said:

maplenpg said:

Just for the record, I didn't respond to your response as Ian said everything I would have.

for the record see post #13 (that above was what I quoted from you)

maplenpg, it's past, we don't have to do a back in forth

nothing personal, we're goood

We are not going to solve anything on the org

I didn't take it personal, don't worry. As you say, we're goood lol

If love is the answer, what was the question? - Carter USM.
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Reply #131 posted 06/03/19 11:43am

OldFriends4Sal
e

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moderator

'Got to see if anybody else needs help': Virginia Beach shooting hero died trying to save others

When Ryan Keith Cox and his co-workers heard the gunshots, he rushed to get them to safety but sacrificed himself to try to save others.

Cox was one of 12 victims of Friday's shooting at a Virginia Beach municipal building, and one of his co-workers says the longtime public utilities worker died a hero.

Christi Dewar, also a longtime employee of the public utility department, told NPR and the Virginian-Pilot that she thought the gunshots were a nail gun at first. Then, a co-worker came rushing down the hall to tell them it was real.

"We ran to the back door of our office, which is near the south stairwell, and one of the girls screamed, 'It's too late, it's too late! Run the other way,'" Dewar told the Virginian-Pilot.

More: Virginia Beach shooting: What we know about the motive, the victims

Cox led Dewar and other co-workers into a break room and told them to stand against a wall, she told the newspaper.

"If at all possible, I knew he was going to lead us to safety. We felt safe. He stayed calm. He didn't have any anxious thought in his voice," she said.

Cox stood guard and then told the group to lock themselves into an office when it looked clear. But he wasn't staying with them."I said, 'Keith, come on,'" Dewar told the Virginian-Pilot. "He said, 'I've got to see if anybody else needs help.' He said, 'Barricade the door. Do it now.'"

...

http://www.msn.com/en-us/...ocid=ientp

#IDEFINEME #ALBUMSSTILLMATTER

A Liar Shall Not Tarry In My Presence

What's the matter with your life
Is poverty bringing U down?
Is the mailman jerking U 'round?
Did he put your million dollar check
In someone else's box?
Tell me, what's the m
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Reply #132 posted 06/04/19 8:25am

poppys

Aerial photo of Virginia Beach.

See the source image

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Reply #133 posted 06/05/19 12:23pm

OldFriends4Sal
e

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Virginia Beach shooter appeared to target supervisors in his department

The Virginia Beach gunman appeared to target supervisors in his department in the early moments of a shooting spree that left 12 people dead on Friday, according to a survivor of the attack and a city councilman.

Authorities in Virginia Beach say they are still working to determine what motivated DeWayne Craddock to bring two handguns into his municipal office last week and begin shooting.

In the meantime, the survivor and the councilman described how Craddock walked down a hallway past a number of employees on the second floor of Building 2 before firing his first shots inside of the building, in an area where senior engineers and supervisors sat.

"He was looking for specific people apparently, at least at first," said Louis Jones, a Virginia Beach councilman and former mayor whose grandson, Jack Jones, was interning in the public works department and working on the second floor when the shooting occurred.

Craddock, a longtime engineer in the city's Department of Public Utilities, submitted a short letter of resignation the morning of the shooting. He wrote that he was giving his two weeks' notice "due to personal reasons," and that "it has been a pleasure to serve the City," according to a copy of the email released by the city on Monday.

City Manager Dave Hansen said on Sunday that questions around Craddock's employment status were part of the continuing investigation, but that Craddock had not been fired before Friday, and that there were "no issues of discipline ongoing."

Slideshow by photo services

The city redacted the names of the person or people Craddock sent the email to. But a colleague of Craddock's told CNN that Richard Nettleton, a 28-year employee of the city who was killed in that back office area, received the letter.

Jones, the councilman, said that his grandson was alone in an office on the second floor just after 4 p.m. on Friday when the gunman came to the door, looked at him, and then turned around, proceeding farther down the hallway.

Soon after, Jones said his grandson heard a first shot fired. The 21-year-old is being credited for potentially saving lives as he ran down the hallway screaming "gun, gun, gun," and "everybody get out," the councilman said in an interview.

Mike, an engineer who worked in Building 2 who would only give CNN his first name, said that he and his colleagues were first alerted to danger by a woman's scream from the back part of the second floor, where the engineering supervisors sat.

"I heard a scream and we all started going toward the scream. And then we heard gun shots," he said.

Nettleton and Katherine Nixon, both longtime engineers with the city and supervisors in the public utilities department, sat in the back area of the second floor hallway. They were killed in the shooting.

Nixon was not in Craddock's chain of command, according to a city official.

....

"We passed by a gentleman that was carrying a gun in his hand, but it looked so theatrical because of the extended magazine and the suppressor that was on the end of it," Carlstrom said. "He glanced at me, but he never raised the gun at me to shoot me."

Authorities have said that victims were found on multiple floors of the four-story municipal building, which includes a basement.

Another city worker who survived the shooting, Christi DeWar, described huddling in an office that she and her coworkers had barricaded with a metal filing cabinet.

DeWar said that she heard Craddock walking around on what sounded like the first floor of the building. According to DeWar, a colleague taking cover with DeWar later said she was texting with someone on the third floor who had heard the gunman there.

Four police officers encountered Craddock on the building's second floor about seven to ten minutes after responders were first dispatched to reports of an active shooter, according to Cervera, the police chief.

Cervera said the officers engaged the gunman in a long shootout through numerous office spaces before he barricaded himself in a room on the second floor.

"They realized the need to enter that office so that he would not then escape and perpetrate more violence on that second floor, so they had to figure a way to breach the door in a tactically safe and sound way. That's not an easy decision to make," Cervera said.

The officers breached the door and found Craddock inside, shot but still alive, Cervera said. As is their training, Cervera said, the officers then began to immediately render aid on the gunman, although he died soon after.

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Forums > Politics & Religion > Virginia Beach, VA:Another Week Another Mass Shooting