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Reply #30 posted 05/23/17 9:19am

2freaky4church
1

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What do you think the Civil War was about? Slavery. duh

All you others say Hell Yea!! woot!
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Reply #31 posted 05/23/17 9:21am

purplepoppy

jjhunsecker said:

OnlyNDaUsa said:

I do not agree that the monuments should be removed. It is messed up thing to do and dangerous trend to start. I have said it before: but watch out what you wish for as at some point the same kind of thing might happen to you.

Dang It! EDIT!

That being said, there is something very disturbing with how they choose to protest.

[Edited 5/19/17 13:05pm]

Should Nazi era artifacts be left up in Berlin or Nuremberg?

No, and they weren't. Even German Americans felt so much shame after WWII.

Only said it was a messed up thing to remove the monuments and a dangerous trend to start. Like it's a fashion, yeah well that trend is over, tear em ALL down. Texas motherfucker wants New Orleans to keep their racist statues, typical. We live here and WE want them down!


[Edited 5/23/17 9:25am]

Brand new boogie without the hero.
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Reply #32 posted 05/23/17 11:10am

jjhunsecker

avatar

OnlyNDaUsa said:



jjhunsecker said:


OnlyNDaUsa said:

I do not agree that the monuments should be removed. It is messed up thing to do and dangerous trend to start. I have said it before: but watch out what you wish for as at some point the same kind of thing might happen to you.

Dang It! EDIT!

That being said, there is something very disturbing with how they choose to protest.


[Edited 5/19/17 13:05pm]



Should Nazi era artifacts be left up in Berlin or Nuremberg?


that is not a legitimate comparison




Why not ?
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Reply #33 posted 05/23/17 11:16am

Pokeno4Money

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2freaky4church1 said:

What do you think the Civil War was about? Slavery. duh


Wrong.

"Jussie Smollett wanted to become the Rosa Parks of Gay Black Men, but instead he became the Rosie Ruiz."

https://nypost.com/2019/0...a-is-long/
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Reply #34 posted 05/23/17 11:22am

OnlyNDaUsa

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2freaky4church1 said:

What do you think the Civil War was about? Slavery. duh

Except the North was not fighting to end slavery but to keep it

No one is coming for your abortion: they just want common-sense abortion regulations: background checks, waiting periods, lifetime limits, take a class, and a small tax.
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Reply #35 posted 05/23/17 11:24am

OnlyNDaUsa

avatar

jjhunsecker said:

OnlyNDaUsa said:

that is not a legitimate comparison

Why not ?

for one are there such monuments? and two the South did not start the war the North did. The North was not fighting to end slavery but to keep it.

No one is coming for your abortion: they just want common-sense abortion regulations: background checks, waiting periods, lifetime limits, take a class, and a small tax.
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Reply #36 posted 05/23/17 11:27am

OnlyNDaUsa

avatar

purplepoppy said:

jjhunsecker said:

OnlyNDaUsa said: Should Nazi era artifacts be left up in Berlin or Nuremberg?

No, and they weren't. Even German Americans felt so much shame after WWII.

I think if you study history you will see the 2 are vastly different

Only said it was a messed up thing to remove the monuments and a dangerous trend to start.

well when they decided to remove other monuments too do not whine to me about it


Like it's a fashion, yeah well that trend is over, tear em ALL down.

Again be careful what you support you can not predict where it will end


Texas motherfucker wants New Orleans to keep their racist statues, typical.


How can a statue be racist? and I do not WANT you to keep anything you seem to not follow what I have said


We live here and WE want them down!

Really was there a vote?


No one is coming for your abortion: they just want common-sense abortion regulations: background checks, waiting periods, lifetime limits, take a class, and a small tax.
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Reply #37 posted 05/23/17 11:33am

Pokeno4Money

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OnlyNDaUsa said:

How can a statue be racist?


How can a bottle of syrup be racist?

"Jussie Smollett wanted to become the Rosa Parks of Gay Black Men, but instead he became the Rosie Ruiz."

https://nypost.com/2019/0...a-is-long/
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Reply #38 posted 05/23/17 11:42am

jjhunsecker

avatar

OnlyNDaUsa said:



purplepoppy said:




jjhunsecker said:


OnlyNDaUsa said: Should Nazi era artifacts be left up in Berlin or Nuremberg?

No, and they weren't. Even German Americans felt so much shame after WWII.

I think if you study history you will see the 2 are vastly different



Only said it was a messed up thing to remove the monuments and a dangerous trend to start.

well when they decided to remove other monuments too do not whine to me about it


Like it's a fashion, yeah well that trend is over, tear em ALL down.

Again be careful what you support you can not predict where it will end


Texas motherfucker wants New Orleans to keep their racist statues, typical.


How can a statue be racist? and I do not WANT you to keep anything you seem to not follow what I have said


We live here and WE want them down!

Really was there a vote?







Would a statue of Hitler or Goebbels be considered "racist" ? There were Nazi symbols all over Germany ; they took them down after the war (how do you really NOT KNOW this ??).

You seem to choose not to see the analogy... Wonder why ???
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Reply #39 posted 05/23/17 11:46am

jjhunsecker

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Perhaps a bottle of syrup could be considered "racist" if it pictures or is shaped as an old darkie mammy figure . What next, ATMs with a picture of Shylock on it ?
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Reply #40 posted 05/23/17 11:48am

OnlyNDaUsa

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jjhunsecker said:

OnlyNDaUsa said:

Would a statue of Hitler or Goebbels be considered "racist" ? There were Nazi symbols all over Germany ; they took them down after the war (how do you really NOT KNOW this ??).


You seem to choose not to see the analogy... Wonder why ???

I know the history, and within a few days to week those symbols were removed. And being racist? Is being racist a crime? Do you think it should be?

And I understand the point you want to make I just do not agree it is even close to being the same.

and your attempt to call me a racist is really pathetic.

No one is coming for your abortion: they just want common-sense abortion regulations: background checks, waiting periods, lifetime limits, take a class, and a small tax.
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Reply #41 posted 05/23/17 11:53am

OnlyNDaUsa

avatar

jjhunsecker said:

Perhaps a bottle of syrup could be considered "racist" if it pictures or is shaped as an old darkie mammy figure . What next, ATMs with a picture of Shylock on it ?

to me, it is a little like the so-called 'rebel' flag. People that display it say "it's not racist." To which I say: "Even if it is not racist, even if you do not mean it to be racist, you know or should know how some people view it and that alone ought to give you pause to not display it. The fact that you choose to display it know how it is taken my many is itself bigoted."

Same with using stereotypical images to sell stuff. Maybe it is not really racist. But maybe you need not use it because of how it is viewed.

Same with the Washington Redskins... maybe not racist but they know how some people see it... and that is almost as bad.

No one is coming for your abortion: they just want common-sense abortion regulations: background checks, waiting periods, lifetime limits, take a class, and a small tax.
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Reply #42 posted 05/23/17 12:02pm

jjhunsecker

avatar

OnlyNDaUsa said:



jjhunsecker said:


OnlyNDaUsa said:




Would a statue of Hitler or Goebbels be considered "racist" ? There were Nazi symbols all over Germany ; they took them down after the war (how do you really NOT KNOW this ??).


You seem to choose not to see the analogy... Wonder why ???



I know the history, and within a few days to week those symbols were removed. And being racist? Is being racist a crime? Do you think it should be?

And I understand the point you want to make I just do not agree it is even close to being the same.

and your attempt to call me a racist is really pathetic.



I never called you a racist... I simply wondered why you are so invested in this issue....

As to racism being a "crime"... I'm not sure I know what you mean. I do think society should strive to be civil and respectful. Maybe not among those you know, but a very high percentage of people, of a variety of backgrounds, find these items to be monuments to White supremacy and the subjugation of Blacks. It's not just 2 or 3 people complaining...

I ask- could or even should Germany put up monuments, not to Hitler or his crew, but to the average German "grunt" that was drafted, and served the Nazi cause bravely?
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Reply #43 posted 05/23/17 12:03pm

jjhunsecker

avatar

OnlyNDaUsa said:



jjhunsecker said:


OnlyNDaUsa said:




Would a statue of Hitler or Goebbels be considered "racist" ? There were Nazi symbols all over Germany ; they took them down after the war (how do you really NOT KNOW this ??).


You seem to choose not to see the analogy... Wonder why ???



I know the history, and within a few days to week those symbols were removed. And being racist? Is being racist a crime? Do you think it should be?

And I understand the point you want to make I just do not agree it is even close to being the same.

and your attempt to call me a racist is really pathetic.



I never called you a racist... I simply wondered why you are so invested in this issue....

As to racism being a "crime"... I'm not sure I know what you mean. I do think society should strive to be civil and respectful. Maybe not among those you know, but a very high percentage of people, of a variety of backgrounds, find these items to be monuments to White supremacy and the subjugation of Blacks. It's not just 2 or 3 people complaining...

I ask- could or even should Germany put up monuments, not to Hitler or his crew, but to the average German "grunt" that was drafted, and served the Nazi cause bravely?
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Reply #44 posted 05/23/17 12:07pm

OnlyNDaUsa

avatar

jjhunsecker said:

OnlyNDaUsa said:

I know the history, and within a few days to week those symbols were removed. And being racist? Is being racist a crime? Do you think it should be?

And I understand the point you want to make I just do not agree it is even close to being the same.

and your attempt to call me a racist is really pathetic.

I never called you a racist... I simply wondered why you are so invested in this issue....

Oh please. we all know what that "wonder why?" means...

As to racism being a "crime"... I'm not sure I know what you mean.

I am trying to workout were you think the line should be drawn If 51% of people are offended by something should it be taken away? or what?



I do think society should strive to be civil and respectful. Maybe not among those you know, but a very high percentage of people, of a variety of backgrounds, find these items to be monuments to White supremacy and the subjugation of Blacks.


so where is the data to support that it was a very high %? was there a vote? and what % should be the standard?


It's not just 2 or 3 people complaining... I ask- could or even should Germany put up monuments, not to Hitler or his crew, but to the average German "grunt" that was drafted, and served the Nazi cause bravely?


Again I do not accept the comparison. I find it disrespeful to the millions of Jewish and homosexuals and others butchered by Hitler's Germany.

No one is coming for your abortion: they just want common-sense abortion regulations: background checks, waiting periods, lifetime limits, take a class, and a small tax.
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Reply #45 posted 05/23/17 12:24pm

jjhunsecker

avatar

OnlyNDaUsa said:



jjhunsecker said:


OnlyNDaUsa said:




I know the history, and within a few days to week those symbols were removed. And being racist? Is being racist a crime? Do you think it should be?

And I understand the point you want to make I just do not agree it is even close to being the same.

and your attempt to call me a racist is really pathetic.



I never called you a racist... I simply wondered why you are so invested in this issue....

Oh please. we all know what that "wonder why?" means...

As to racism being a "crime"... I'm not sure I know what you mean.

I am trying to workout were you think the line should be drawn If 51% of people are offended by something should it be taken away? or what?



I do think society should strive to be civil and respectful. Maybe not among those you know, but a very high percentage of people, of a variety of backgrounds, find these items to be monuments to White supremacy and the subjugation of Blacks.


so where is the data to support that it was a very high %? was there a vote? and what % should be the standard?


It's not just 2 or 3 people complaining... I ask- could or even should Germany put up monuments, not to Hitler or his crew, but to the average German "grunt" that was drafted, and served the Nazi cause bravely?


Again I do not accept the comparison. I find it disrespeful to the millions of Jewish and homosexuals and others butchered by Hitler's Germany.



I'm saying "wonder why" because I truly wonder why you are so emotionally attached to this issue.

And you say monuments to German soldiers would be an insult to the people they killed. Yet you refuse to see that to many, these Confederate (traitor) monuments are an insult to the millions enslaved and beaten and raped and killed under the guise of promoting and protecting White Supremacy in the South. Again, I wonder why you fail to see that....
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Reply #46 posted 05/23/17 12:25pm

OnlyNDaUsa

avatar

jjhunsecker said:

OnlyNDaUsa said:

I'm saying "wonder why" because I truly wonder why you are so emotionally attached to this issue. And you say monuments to German soldiers would be an insult to the people they killed. Yet you refuse to see that to many, these Confederate (traitor) monuments are an insult to the millions enslaved and beaten and raped and killed under the guise of promoting and protecting White Supremacy in the South. Again, I wonder why you fail to see that....

I am not emotional at all... so you need to take a step back and if I have not told you directly before I am now: it is best for you to not make up assumptions about me.

No one is coming for your abortion: they just want common-sense abortion regulations: background checks, waiting periods, lifetime limits, take a class, and a small tax.
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Reply #47 posted 05/23/17 2:13pm

purplepoppy

Ain't nobody taking a step back here - poor choice of words.

YES, the New Orleans City Council VOTED to remove the statues. In the first place, what part of 56% black population of NOLA did you not get from my other post? And the white people that live here are in the majority of wanting it down. Why would anybody want to live in such a magnificent city with the most prominent sculptures being Jefferson Davis, and Robert E Lee? People come from all over the world for the music, the food and the culture here - black and blended culture - not Civil War memorabilia.


As a visual artist and history buff I have followed this argument closely, including those who say the monuments should stay, to remember the brutal historical record. Many of those folks don't live in New Orleans. What people don't get is that you can't go to Jazz Fest without seeing Confederate Gen Beauregard on a horse, Lee Circle is a major city hub, the French Quarter a crown jewel. This shit matters right now. The city is reflecting what it wants to look like.

Brand new boogie without the hero.
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Reply #48 posted 05/23/17 4:33pm

OnlyNDaUsa

avatar

purplepoppy said:

Ain't nobody taking a step back here - poor choice of words.

YES, the New Orleans City Council VOTED to remove the statues. In the first place, what part of 56% black population of NOLA did you not get from my other post? And the white people that live here are in the majority of wanting it down. Why would anybody want to live in such a magnificent city with the most prominent sculptures being Jefferson Davis, and Robert E Lee? People come from all over the world for the music, the food and the culture here - black and blended culture - not Civil War memorabilia.


As a visual artist and history buff I have followed this argument closely, including those who say the monuments should stay, to remember the brutal historical record. Many of those folks don't live in New Orleans. What people don't get is that you can't go to Jazz Fest without seeing Confederate Gen Beauregard on a horse, Lee Circle is a major city hub, the French Quarter a crown jewel. This shit matters right now. The city is reflecting what it wants to look like.

so you just assume most people in the city want them removed..got it

No one is coming for your abortion: they just want common-sense abortion regulations: background checks, waiting periods, lifetime limits, take a class, and a small tax.
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Reply #49 posted 05/23/17 5:00pm

jjhunsecker

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I'll post this, from a much more brilliant mind than me, Brent Staples of the NY Times

https://www.nytimes.com/2...e&_r=0

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Reply #50 posted 05/23/17 5:03pm

jjhunsecker

avatar

OnlyNDaUsa said:

jjhunsecker said:

OnlyNDaUsa said: I'm saying "wonder why" because I truly wonder why you are so emotionally attached to this issue. And you say monuments to German soldiers would be an insult to the people they killed. Yet you refuse to see that to many, these Confederate (traitor) monuments are an insult to the millions enslaved and beaten and raped and killed under the guise of promoting and protecting White Supremacy in the South. Again, I wonder why you fail to see that....

I am not emotional at all... so you need to take a step back and if I have not told you directly before I am now: it is best for you to not make up assumptions about me.

You seem pretty touchy...And I'll step wherever I want , thank you !

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Reply #51 posted 05/23/17 5:53pm

13cjk13

OnlyNDaUsa said:

purplepoppy said:

Ain't nobody taking a step back here - poor choice of words.

YES, the New Orleans City Council VOTED to remove the statues. In the first place, what part of 56% black population of NOLA did you not get from my other post? And the white people that live here are in the majority of wanting it down. Why would anybody want to live in such a magnificent city with the most prominent sculptures being Jefferson Davis, and Robert E Lee? People come from all over the world for the music, the food and the culture here - black and blended culture - not Civil War memorabilia.


As a visual artist and history buff I have followed this argument closely, including those who say the monuments should stay, to remember the brutal historical record. Many of those folks don't live in New Orleans. What people don't get is that you can't go to Jazz Fest without seeing Confederate Gen Beauregard on a horse, Lee Circle is a major city hub, the French Quarter a crown jewel. This shit matters right now. The city is reflecting what it wants to look like.

so you just assume most people in the city want them removed..got it

Yes, "people" do. Racist "monsters", not so much. Got that?

"If we had had confidence the president clearly did not commit a crime, we would have said so."
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Reply #52 posted 05/23/17 5:55pm

2freaky4church
1

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They were laughing about this on Morning Joe. Their moderate to center-right historian John Meachem said the Civil War was obviously fought because of slavery. Joe agreed.

All you others say Hell Yea!! woot!
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Reply #53 posted 05/23/17 7:25pm

jjhunsecker

avatar

OnlyNDaUsa said:

purplepoppy said:

Ain't nobody taking a step back here - poor choice of words.

YES, the New Orleans City Council VOTED to remove the statues. In the first place, what part of 56% black population of NOLA did you not get from my other post? And the white people that live here are in the majority of wanting it down. Why would anybody want to live in such a magnificent city with the most prominent sculptures being Jefferson Davis, and Robert E Lee? People come from all over the world for the music, the food and the culture here - black and blended culture - not Civil War memorabilia.


As a visual artist and history buff I have followed this argument closely, including those who say the monuments should stay, to remember the brutal historical record. Many of those folks don't live in New Orleans. What people don't get is that you can't go to Jazz Fest without seeing Confederate Gen Beauregard on a horse, Lee Circle is a major city hub, the French Quarter a crown jewel. This shit matters right now. The city is reflecting what it wants to look like.

so you just assume most people in the city want them removed..got it

I'm sure there are people in Germany who would still want Nazi symbols displayed. Should that happen because some still are fine with it ?

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Reply #54 posted 05/23/17 8:30pm

Pokeno4Money

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2freaky4church1 said:

They were laughing about this on Morning Joe. Their moderate to center-right historian John Meachem said the Civil War was obviously fought because of slavery. Joe agreed.


Then Joe's an idiot.

"Jussie Smollett wanted to become the Rosa Parks of Gay Black Men, but instead he became the Rosie Ruiz."

https://nypost.com/2019/0...a-is-long/
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Reply #55 posted 05/24/17 4:10am

2elijah

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2freaky4church1 said:

They were laughing about this on Morning Joe. Their moderate to center-right historian John Meachem said the Civil War was obviously fought because of slavery. Joe agreed.


Well, glad they got rid of those shit statues. Those kinds of reminders of a horrific past, should not be glorified.
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Reply #56 posted 05/24/17 4:12am

OnlyNDaUsa

avatar

2elijah said:

2freaky4church1 said:

They were laughing about this on Morning Joe. Their moderate to center-right historian John Meachem said the Civil War was obviously fought because of slavery. Joe agreed.

Well, glad they got rid of those shit statues. Those kinds of reminders of a horrific past, should not be glorified.

just remember if they ever start taking down things you might think have value that you can not really say much.

No one is coming for your abortion: they just want common-sense abortion regulations: background checks, waiting periods, lifetime limits, take a class, and a small tax.
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Reply #57 posted 05/24/17 4:16am

2elijah

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http://nypost.com/2017/05...ally-gone/


NEWS
In New Orleans, Confederate monuments are finally gone
By Associated Press

May 20, 2017 | 9:35am

The
AP
NEW ORLEANS — They were among the city’s oldest landmarks, as cemented to the landscape of New Orleans as the Superdome and St. Louis Cathedral: a stone obelisk heralding white supremacy and three statues of Confederate stalwarts.

But after decades standing sentinel over this Southern city, the Confederate monuments are gone, amid a controversy that at times hearkened back to the divisiveness of the Civil War they commemorated.

The last of the monuments — a statue of Gen. Robert E. Lee facing defiantly north with his arms crossed — was lifted by a crane from its pedestal late Friday. As air was seen between Lee’s statue and the pedestal below it, a cheer went out from the crowd who recorded the history with their phones and shook hands with each other in congratulations. Many in the crowd had waited since morning.


“I never thought I would see this day!” shouted Melanie Morel-Ensminger with joy. “But look! It’s happening.”


Lee’s was the last of four monuments to Confederate-era figures to be removed under a 2015 City Council vote on a proposal by Mayor Mitch Landrieu. It caps a nearly two-year-long process that has been railed against by those who feel the monuments are a part of Southern heritage and honor the dead. But removal of the monuments has drawn praise from those who saw them as brutal reminders of slavery and symbols of the historic oppression of black people.

Landrieu called for the monuments’ removal in the lingering emotional aftermath of the 2015 massacre of nine black parishioners at a South Carolina church. The killer, Dylann Roof, was an avowed racist who brandished Confederate battle flags in photos, recharging the debate over whether Confederate emblems represent racism or an honorable heritage.

While Roof’s actions spurred a debate in many parts of the South about whether it was appropriate to fly the Confederate battle emblem — and many places have taken it down — the reaction in New Orleans seemed to go even further, knocking away at even weightier, heavier parts of history.

Landrieu drew blistering criticism from monument supporters and even some political allies. But in explaining his reasoning, the mayor has repeatedly said they do not represent the diversity and future of New Orleans.

“These statues are not just stone and metal. They are not just innocent remembrances of a benign history. These monuments celebrate a fictional, sanitized Confederacy; ignoring the death, ignoring the enslavement, ignoring the terror that it actually stood for,” he said Friday.

"After the Civil War, these statues were a part of that terrorism, as much as burning a cross on someone’s lawn. They were erected purposefully to send a strong message to all who walked in their shadows about who was still in charge in this city,” he added.



Of the four monuments, Lee’s was easily the most prominent: The bronze statue alone is close to 20 feet (6 meters) tall. It’s a bronze sculpture of Lee looking toward the northern horizon from atop a roughly 60-foot-tall column.
wires and New Orleans’ famous streetcar lines.

The atmosphere Friday was almost festive as dozens of people, some with lawn chairs, came out to see what many called history in the making.
[Edited 5/24/17 4:52am]
[Edited 5/24/17 7:04am]
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Reply #58 posted 05/24/17 4:33am

DiminutiveRock
er

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clapping clapping clapping

"Families are torn apart, men women and children are separated. Children come home from school to find their parents have gone missing." - Anne Frank
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Reply #59 posted 05/24/17 5:30am

2elijah

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OnlyNDaUsa said:



2elijah said:


2freaky4church1 said:

They were laughing about this on Morning Joe. Their moderate to center-right historian John Meachem said the Civil War was obviously fought because of slavery. Joe agreed.



Well, glad they got rid of those shit statues. Those kinds of reminders of a horrific past, should not be glorified.



just remember if they ever start taking down things you might think have value that you can not really say much.


Why would any decent, human being be angered by such statues being removed, which represented evil or divisive actions of the past, to be celebrated or glorified in public space, especially if those figures are in a community, whose ancestors were affected by the evils of said figures those statues represented?

The taking down of those statues and confederate flags, for example, are baby steps in correcting/eradicating many wrongs of America's past, like removing 'public' representations of racist white supremacy teachings, and racial division, etc., It's time America faces its ugly past, by acknowledging/correcting the wrongs that past represented. It is an insult to glorify and embrace, such divisive figures in the face of communities, whose ancestors' lives were affected by the actions of the people those figures represent. Would you want to see a statue of Hitler in a Jewish community? I applaud the people of New Orleans who stood together, to have those statues removed.

Glad they took those shits down.
[Edited 5/24/17 7:17am]
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