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Thread started 06/01/10 4:34am

philipdalton

Jehovah's Witness Discussion Group

Does anyone care to contribute towards my new discussion group at http://www.premiercommuni...switnesses

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Reply #1 posted 06/01/10 8:28am

shellyevon

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Y'all know you're not supposed to be doing that, right? The GB does not approve. no no no!

And no, thank you, I am on a couple of JW forums, both pro and anti, I will not join any more. I just don't have the time.

"Be who you are and say what you feel because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind"-Dr Seuss

Pain is something to carry, like a radio...You should stand up for your right to feel your pain- Jim Morrison
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Reply #2 posted 06/04/10 12:00pm

tmo1965

I'm a member of Jehovahs-Witness.net. I had not visited the site in months until a couple of days ago. I found out about the new light on the 1914 Generation doctrine, although it did not surprise me.

I was wondering what active JWs on here think about it, but I've noticed for quite some time that they rarely participate in disscussions anymore and never start threads on JW doctrine.

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Reply #3 posted 06/05/10 8:18am

shellyevon

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tmo1965 said:

I'm a member of Jehovahs-Witness.net. I had not visited the site in months until a couple of days ago. I found out about the new light on the 1914 Generation doctrine, although it did not surprise me.

I was wondering what active JWs on here think about it, but I've noticed for quite some time that they rarely participate in disscussions anymore and never start threads on JW doctrine.

I am also a member of JWN but rarely post there. There is a lot there that every JW is entitled to know but are not allowed to investigate. Right now Randy Watters {Dogpatch} is telling about his Bethel experiences, really interesting.

I am also interested in knowing what active Witnesses think about the newest generation change.

They are changing the whole meaning of the word generation. They had to change something, the Millions now Living Who will Never Die are now, for the most part, dead.

[Edited 6/5/10 8:18am]

"Be who you are and say what you feel because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind"-Dr Seuss

Pain is something to carry, like a radio...You should stand up for your right to feel your pain- Jim Morrison
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Reply #4 posted 06/05/10 9:15pm

DavidSF

Why can't they just be humble and admit they were wrong...

I wonder what "new light" the GB can share with their famous quote, "millions now living will never die!" Maybe they will have "new light" on the meaning of "dead"? LOL.

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Reply #5 posted 06/07/10 9:12am

Deadflow3r

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I have never joined a witness site seeing as I am not a baptized witness but studied with them for over 18 months. There are so many great things about them but there were a few things that were red flags for me. One of them was that you had to take everything they believed lock stock and barrel. My daughter, who is little, absolutely hated everything about it. They don't have a childrens meeting and they are very boring and add to that they are party poopers and you can see why my daughter was not having any of it.

For me it scared me that preteens were getting baptized and held accountable for it if at 18 they decided to question the JW beliefs, their parents (me eventually) were suppose to stop talking to them. Anyway I think about God alot and was quite fascinated with alot they had to say. I also am very suprised that Prince still calls himself a JW. There are plenty of people who have been disfellowshipped from my area Kingdom Hall and I bet it was stuff a whole lot less blatantly out of bounds.

There came a time when the risk of remaining tight in the bud was more painful than the risk it took to blossom. Anais Nin.
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Reply #6 posted 06/07/10 12:26pm

2freaky4church
1

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A question. Do you have to be a JW to be allowed into a kingdom hall?

All you others say Hell Yea!! woot!
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Reply #7 posted 06/07/10 12:36pm

Deadflow3r

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2freaky4church1 said:

A question. Do you have to be a JW to be allowed into a kingdom hall?

No, not at all. Infact there are some people who attend meeting year after year and never get Baptized. A non-member is talked to, a disfellowshipped member is not. You, as a non member, can even comment at meetings - but I certainly wouldn't recomend it if you haven't studied for a while. The Watchtower Study they use on Sunday goes into more detail about their beliefs and someone is sure to hand you one when they see you don't have one of your own.

There came a time when the risk of remaining tight in the bud was more painful than the risk it took to blossom. Anais Nin.
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Reply #8 posted 06/07/10 9:25pm

godswill

Deadflow3r said:

I have never joined a witness site seeing as I am not a baptized witness but studied with them for over 18 months. There are so many great things about them but there were a few things that were red flags for me. One of them was that you had to take everything they believed lock stock and barrel. My daughter, who is little, absolutely hated everything about it. They don't have a childrens meeting and they are very boring and add to that they are party poopers and you can see why my daughter was not having any of it.

For me it scared me that preteens were getting baptized and held accountable for it if at 18 they decided to question the JW beliefs, their parents (me eventually) were suppose to stop talking to them. Anyway I think about God alot and was quite fascinated with alot they had to say. I also am very suprised that Prince still calls himself a JW. There are plenty of people who have been disfellowshipped from my area Kingdom Hall and I bet it was stuff a whole lot less blatantly out of bounds.

Hi Deadflow3r what Kingdom Hall did your daughter go to . I live in Chicago and that does sound right

at all. i have went and know a lot JW Witness this lady that lives down the block from me is the most sweetness person in the world. When i go to gym she see about my children and she don't take no Sh*t

so ain''t body going sway her believe. But i know every Saturday she and her friend knock at the doors.

And they stand on the counter with the "Watch Tower". I'm not an active member but i go sometimes and it's not like what you say. we'll you know i'm made a promised to God that what business Prince is not

mine. but getting back to the Kingdom Hall is were people conversation and fellowship. And all churches are boring to children.

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Reply #9 posted 06/08/10 10:25am

Astasheiks

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2freaky4church1 said:

A question. Do you have to be a JW to be allowed into a kingdom hall?

lol

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Reply #10 posted 06/08/10 11:28am

Deadflow3r

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philipdalton said:

Does anyone care to contribute towards my new discussion group at http://www.premiercommuni...switnesses

It appears that this sight is for baptized Witnesses. I would like to meet people like myself who agree with alot of their teachings but have reasons to not get baptized. I was brought up Catholic and knew the origins of Christmas and didn't like Santa's holiday masquerading as Jesus' birthday anyway. Add to that that the trinity didn't make sense to me either, neither did the cult of Mary or praying to saints and I thought I found the perfect place for me in Kingdom Hall. Well it's the near perfect place for me. I also have many homosexual friends and I don't know how harsh a stand I could take on the subject, truthfully.

There came a time when the risk of remaining tight in the bud was more painful than the risk it took to blossom. Anais Nin.
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Reply #11 posted 06/09/10 7:20am

shellyevon

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Deadflow3r said:

philipdalton said:

Does anyone care to contribute towards my new discussion group at http://www.premiercommuni...switnesses

It appears that this sight is for baptized Witnesses. I would like to meet people like myself who agree with alot of their teachings but have reasons to not get baptized. I was brought up Catholic and knew the origins of Christmas and didn't like Santa's holiday masquerading as Jesus' birthday anyway. Add to that that the trinity didn't make sense to me either, neither did the cult of Mary or praying to saints and I thought I found the perfect place for me in Kingdom Hall. Well it's the near perfect place for me. I also have many homosexual friends and I don't know how harsh a stand I could take on the subject, truthfully.

Try Jehovahs-Witness.net, there are manyhttp://freeminds.org/ people like you there.

Read their Best Of section, it will definitely give you something to think about.

Also Freeminds.org is an excellent site.

http://www.jehovahs-witness.net

http://www.freeminds.org

There are other religions that have most of the same beliefs, Christadelphians, Second Day Adventists and the original Bible Students that the JWs splintered off from are still in existence.

[Edited 6/9/10 7:37am]

"Be who you are and say what you feel because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind"-Dr Seuss

Pain is something to carry, like a radio...You should stand up for your right to feel your pain- Jim Morrison
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Reply #12 posted 06/09/10 8:21am

shellyevon

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Also there is The Laymen's Home Missionary Movement which is only one of the religions that re offshoots of the Jehovah's Winesses.

and

http://www.biblestudents.net/

[Edited 6/9/10 8:43am]

"Be who you are and say what you feel because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind"-Dr Seuss

Pain is something to carry, like a radio...You should stand up for your right to feel your pain- Jim Morrison
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Reply #13 posted 06/09/10 10:17pm

shellyevon

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DavidSF said:

Why can't they just be humble and admit they were wrong...

I wonder what "new light" the GB can share with their famous quote, "millions now living will never die!" Maybe they will have "new light" on the meaning of "dead"? LOL.

One of their Governing Body died this morning.

" Millions Now Living Will Never Die " - Quote from J.F. Rutherford circa 1920-1925 . Ted Jaracz Born 1925 Died 2010.

http://www.google.com/sea...ted+jaracz

[Edited 6/9/10 22:24pm]

"Be who you are and say what you feel because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind"-Dr Seuss

Pain is something to carry, like a radio...You should stand up for your right to feel your pain- Jim Morrison
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Reply #14 posted 06/10/10 9:54am

cristabel719

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2freaky4church1 said:

A question. Do you have to be a JW to be allowed into a kingdom hall?

No

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Reply #15 posted 06/14/10 8:35am

Deadflow3r

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shellyevon said:

Deadflow3r said:

It appears that this sight is for baptized Witnesses. I would like to meet people like myself who agree with alot of their teachings but have reasons to not get baptized. I was brought up Catholic and knew the origins of Christmas and didn't like Santa's holiday masquerading as Jesus' birthday anyway. Add to that that the trinity didn't make sense to me either, neither did the cult of Mary or praying to saints and I thought I found the perfect place for me in Kingdom Hall. Well it's the near perfect place for me. I also have many homosexual friends and I don't know how harsh a stand I could take on the subject, truthfully.

Try Jehovahs-Witness.net, there are manyhttp://freeminds.org/ people like you there.

Read their Best Of section, it will definitely give you something to think about.

Also Freeminds.org is an excellent site.

http://www.jehovahs-witness.net

http://www.freeminds.org

There are other religions that have most of the same beliefs, Christadelphians, Second Day Adventists and the original Bible Students that the JWs splintered off from are still in existence.

[Edited 6/9/10 7:37am]

Thanks for the info. There is a Christadelphian Chapel near me and they are sending me info.

There came a time when the risk of remaining tight in the bud was more painful than the risk it took to blossom. Anais Nin.
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Reply #16 posted 06/16/10 6:31am

shellyevon

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Deadflow3r said:

shellyevon said:

Try Jehovahs-Witness.net, there are manyhttp://freeminds.org/ people like you there.

Read their Best Of section, it will definitely give you something to think about.

Also Freeminds.org is an excellent site.

http://www.jehovahs-witness.net

http://www.freeminds.org

There are other religions that have most of the same beliefs, Christadelphians, Second Day Adventists and the original Bible Students that the JWs splintered off from are still in existence.

[Edited 6/9/10 7:37am]

Thanks for the info. There is a Christadelphian Chapel near me and they are sending me info.

You're welcome. I don't know what policies any of these groups have towards homosexuals, I think the Unitarians are the most accepting.

I am very leery of joining any religion but I love talking about spirituality.

"Be who you are and say what you feel because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind"-Dr Seuss

Pain is something to carry, like a radio...You should stand up for your right to feel your pain- Jim Morrison
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Reply #17 posted 06/25/10 11:21am

Deadflow3r

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shellyevon said:

Deadflow3r said:

Thanks for the info. There is a Christadelphian Chapel near me and they are sending me info.

You're welcome. I don't know what policies any of these groups have towards homosexuals, I think the Unitarians are the most accepting.

I am very leery of joining any religion but I love talking about spirituality.

I always wish that I could discuss it more here. At my age nearly 49, you look before you leap again. I feel that alot of the things that the Witnesses believe are on target. However, despite the fact that they say you should keep asking questions and get more knowledge, there are some questions that they don't want you to ask. Despite the fact that it looks like they clearly have more females then males, I don't see much of a female voice represented. Sure, women do the Bible studies with other women, but that is about it. At least the Catholic nuns had a bit of a voice, I am thinking of Mother Teresa and even St Therese of Liseaux aswell. The midevel St. Teresa of Avila wrote too.

There came a time when the risk of remaining tight in the bud was more painful than the risk it took to blossom. Anais Nin.
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Reply #18 posted 06/26/10 2:58pm

NobodyUknow

Deadflow3r said:

shellyevon said:

You're welcome. I don't know what policies any of these groups have towards homosexuals, I think the Unitarians are the most accepting.

I am very leery of joining any religion but I love talking about spirituality.

I always wish that I could discuss it more here. At my age nearly 49, you look before you leap again. I feel that alot of the things that the Witnesses believe are on target. However, despite the fact that they say you should keep asking questions and get more knowledge, there are some questions that they don't want you to ask. Despite the fact that it looks like they clearly have more females then males, I don't see much of a female voice represented. Sure, women do the Bible studies with other women, but that is about it. At least the Catholic nuns had a bit of a voice, I am thinking of Mother Teresa and even St Therese of Liseaux aswell. The midevel St. Teresa of Avila wrote too.

What's "on target" about the Witnesses?confused

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Reply #19 posted 06/26/10 3:57pm

paintedlady

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Deadflow3r said:

shellyevon said:

You're welcome. I don't know what policies any of these groups have towards homosexuals, I think the Unitarians are the most accepting.

I am very leery of joining any religion but I love talking about spirituality.

I always wish that I could discuss it more here. At my age nearly 49, you look before you leap again. I feel that alot of the things that the Witnesses believe are on target. However, despite the fact that they say you should keep asking questions and get more knowledge, there are some questions that they don't want you to ask. Despite the fact that it looks like they clearly have more females then males, I don't see much of a female voice represented. Sure, women do the Bible studies with other women, but that is about it. At least the Catholic nuns had a bit of a voice, I am thinking of Mother Teresa and even St Therese of Liseaux aswell. The midevel St. Teresa of Avila wrote too.

JW's are very dogmatic. They go by ONE translation of the Word of God.

I have dicovered myself in my own study (I was encouraged to study by a JW to learn the Word of God, and in doing so I learned that they have holes in thier doctrine that do not fit.

No one is perfect, but a few things I have seen are deade wrong.

1. Adam (930 years), Noah (950 years), Abraham (175 years) , Moses (120 and strong!), Jesus (31) all counted their years. We know in their story how old they are, so they did acknowlegde their birthdays. Not celebrate like we do now, but their years were counted because we know how long these men lived on earth.

You can acknowledge your birthday.

2. God tells us his name in the bible. He had Moses speak his name. His name was NOT forbidden to say.

God's name is, I AM , Exodus 3:14-15

this is why Jesus got beat down and killed because when he was asked who is he he answered "I AM" thus making the claim that he is God and this is why we as Christians believe in the Trinity.

3. Jesus was no "angel" he is the light of God. It was the first thing that was created. Jesus is the "light".

You can not enter into the kindom of God with out Jesus, he is the holder of the keys.... it is through Him (Jesus- His death, blood sacrafice) that we are saved.

This is the very definition of a "Christian" . You are either a Jew, a Muslim or a Christian.

Simple as pie, you believe he died and rose on the 3rd day, you are saved. You are a Christian.

This is what saves you, not "works" .... I was told by JW's that this is not true, that this is wrong. So I will never be a JW, since I read the bible and my bible (I read 4 different versions) all say the same thing.

Yes, you do want to repent and do good works, but is the belief in what Jesus has done that saves your soul.

Its easy, God made it that way. That's all you need, everything else is to make your life better, but you soul is covered in the blood of Christ.

That's what I know and I'm sticking to that. rose hug Bless your journey to the truth that is in the bible, it is easy to find and easy to know.

[Edited 6/26/10 16:41pm]

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Reply #20 posted 06/26/10 4:04pm

paintedlady

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I studied different doctrines, I am a non-denominational Christian. ALL Christians, Catholics, Baptists, Churches of Christ, Episcopal, Lutheran, Pentecostal and Presbyterian churches ALL are good, but many Christians split hairs, and this causes silly separation which to me is pointless, so I am a Christian. And if ANY other person who dares call him/herself saved by the blood of Jesus, then they are a Christian too,just like me, AND saved.

NO ONE CHURCH HAS ANY RIGHT TO CLAIM SOLITARY SALVATION UNDER THIER NAME/DOCTRINE.

All people are as imperfect as their churches, so no one Christian can say who is or isn't saved, who is or isn't going to "heaven", the "kingdom" , "hell" or anything .

We are not God and we can't say what he's gonna do or not do.

spell checks.

[Edited 6/26/10 16:30pm]

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Reply #21 posted 06/28/10 11:40am

Deadflow3r

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paintedlady said:

I studied different doctrines, I am a non-denominational Christian. ALL Christians, Catholics, Baptists, Churches of Christ, Episcopal, Lutheran, Pentecostal and Presbyterian churches ALL are good, but many Christians split hairs, and this causes silly separation which to me is pointless, so I am a Christian. And if ANY other person who dares call him/herself saved by the blood of Jesus, then they are a Christian too,just like me, AND saved.

NO ONE CHURCH HAS ANY RIGHT TO CLAIM SOLITARY SALVATION UNDER THIER NAME/DOCTRINE.

All people are as imperfect as their churches, so no one Christian can say who is or isn't saved, who is or isn't going to "heaven", the "kingdom" , "hell" or anything .

We are not God and we can't say what he's gonna do or not do.

spell checks.

[Edited 6/26/10 16:30pm]

I was Baptized as an infant a Catholic and this may be stranged to say, but I would like to be a Baptized member of a Christian church. Unfortunately, I will not say that I believe in something or not believe in something in order to get Baptized. ( I honestly don't believe that Prince agreed with the J.W. faith when he got Baptized. They believe that homosexuality is a sin and not a life choice. I honestly doubt, in his heart, he believes that they are "sinners".) Anyway, I like that the Christedelphians also don't believe in the Trinity but they also don't believe in Satan. I do.

You are right paintedlady it does come down to splitting hairs sometimes about something that is not the point. Like Jesus is the Messiah, whether he began his life as the angel Michael or not isn't really the point of the story. The whole birthday thing is an issue. That would not only eliminate Bday celebrations of my daughters but also all the parties she is invited to. In the 18 months I studied with them they never had a child/childrens party to go to that my daughter and I were invited to. So they take away all the parties, cakes, dancing etc and replace it with nothing except I can still wrap up gifts for her and give them to her for no reason at all. It is not the same. Like I say it's not only the parties that we would give but also all the others that we would go to, 4th of July would be next, that we would need to abstain from.

Another thing; she is an only child. I noticed that alot of grown witnesses that grew up "in the truth" were extremely close to their siblings and sometimes their cousins. They didn't have friends that were not related to them, for the most part. Well my daughter does not have cousins that she will ever know and also being an only child, who would be her support system when she grew up?

Lastly I know, and I may have said this before, If my daughter was disfellowshipped for dating outside the faith or some other thing that I did not think was intollerable I would continue speaking to her and having her in my life. There is no way that I am going to shun my daughter because she smokes for instance.

There came a time when the risk of remaining tight in the bud was more painful than the risk it took to blossom. Anais Nin.
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Reply #22 posted 06/28/10 1:22pm

paintedlady

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Deadflow3r said:

paintedlady said:

I studied different doctrines, I am a non-denominational Christian. ALL Christians, Catholics, Baptists, Churches of Christ, Episcopal, Lutheran, Pentecostal and Presbyterian churches ALL are good, but many Christians split hairs, and this causes silly separation which to me is pointless, so I am a Christian. And if ANY other person who dares call him/herself saved by the blood of Jesus, then they are a Christian too,just like me, AND saved.

NO ONE CHURCH HAS ANY RIGHT TO CLAIM SOLITARY SALVATION UNDER THIER NAME/DOCTRINE.

All people are as imperfect as their churches, so no one Christian can say who is or isn't saved, who is or isn't going to "heaven", the "kingdom" , "hell" or anything .

We are not God and we can't say what he's gonna do or not do.

spell checks.

[Edited 6/26/10 16:30pm]

I was Baptized as an infant a Catholic and this may be stranged to say, but I would like to be a Baptized member of a Christian church. Unfortunately, I will not say that I believe in something or not believe in something in order to get Baptized. ( I honestly don't believe that Prince agreed with the J.W. faith when he got Baptized. They believe that homosexuality is a sin and not a life choice. I honestly doubt, in his heart, he believes that they are "sinners".) Anyway, I like that the Christedelphians also don't believe in the Trinity but they also don't believe in Satan. I do.

You are right paintedlady it does come down to splitting hairs sometimes about something that is not the point. Like Jesus is the Messiah, whether he began his life as the angel Michael or not isn't really the point of the story. The whole birthday thing is an issue. That would not only eliminate Bday celebrations of my daughters but also all the parties she is invited to. In the 18 months I studied with them they never had a child/childrens party to go to that my daughter and I were invited to. So they take away all the parties, cakes, dancing etc and replace it with nothing except I can still wrap up gifts for her and give them to her for no reason at all. It is not the same. Like I say it's not only the parties that we would give but also all the others that we would go to, 4th of July would be next, that we would need to abstain from.

Another thing; she is an only child. I noticed that alot of grown witnesses that grew up "in the truth" were extremely close to their siblings and sometimes their cousins. They didn't have friends that were not related to them, for the most part. Well my daughter does not have cousins that she will ever know and also being an only child, who would be her support system when she grew up?

Lastly I know, and I may have said this before, If my daughter was disfellowshipped for dating outside the faith or some other thing that I did not think was intollerable I would continue speaking to her and having her in my life. There is no way that I am going to shun my daughter because she smokes for instance.

Those are important points.

You must be baptized, I was in a Church that was my home for 7 years. am still searching for a church home. Any church that claims I am not a Christian because I wasn't baptized by thier own priest or pastor is crazy IMHO.

I studied under a great Bishop ( Bishop Thompson of the Jubilee Church in Boston MA) , he taught me well. Find a good teaching church. One that focuses on understanding the bible itself, not just doctrine. What you read on your own should line up with teachings taught in the bible. Read the bible in its whole to recieve a full understanding of the stories told in contex.

You can find good teaching church just about with any doctrine... even JW..... just make sure the teacher is well qualified, not all churches in any doctrine are run the same or have the same standards unfortuneately. I wish they did. Let the Holy Spirit guide you, if it feels wrong then go.

Becareful with some Churches of Christ, the "Boston" chapters have gone cultish. They practice separation of families and are possive with your time as a member which are red flags of a cult.

As a Christian, you will be a light unto those around you, a pillar to your family. There may be struggle but in the end it will pull you closer to them, not separate even if they are not Christians.

God bless your journey heart hug

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Reply #23 posted 06/28/10 2:14pm

Deadflow3r

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paintedlady said:

Deadflow3r said:

I was Baptized as an infant a Catholic and this may be stranged to say, but I would like to be a Baptized member of a Christian church. Unfortunately, I will not say that I believe in something or not believe in something in order to get Baptized. ( I honestly don't believe that Prince agreed with the J.W. faith when he got Baptized. They believe that homosexuality is a sin and not a life choice. I honestly doubt, in his heart, he believes that they are "sinners".) Anyway, I like that the Christedelphians also don't believe in the Trinity but they also don't believe in Satan. I do.

You are right paintedlady it does come down to splitting hairs sometimes about something that is not the point. Like Jesus is the Messiah, whether he began his life as the angel Michael or not isn't really the point of the story. The whole birthday thing is an issue. That would not only eliminate Bday celebrations of my daughters but also all the parties she is invited to. In the 18 months I studied with them they never had a child/childrens party to go to that my daughter and I were invited to. So they take away all the parties, cakes, dancing etc and replace it with nothing except I can still wrap up gifts for her and give them to her for no reason at all. It is not the same. Like I say it's not only the parties that we would give but also all the others that we would go to, 4th of July would be next, that we would need to abstain from.

Another thing; she is an only child. I noticed that alot of grown witnesses that grew up "in the truth" were extremely close to their siblings and sometimes their cousins. They didn't have friends that were not related to them, for the most part. Well my daughter does not have cousins that she will ever know and also being an only child, who would be her support system when she grew up?

Lastly I know, and I may have said this before, If my daughter was disfellowshipped for dating outside the faith or some other thing that I did not think was intollerable I would continue speaking to her and having her in my life. There is no way that I am going to shun my daughter because she smokes for instance.

Those are important points.

You must be baptized, I was in a Church that was my home for 7 years. am still searching for a church home. Any church that claims I am not a Christian because I wasn't baptized by thier own priest or pastor is crazy IMHO.

I studied under a great Bishop ( Bishop Thompson of the Jubilee Church in Boston MA) , he taught me well. Find a good teaching church. One that focuses on understanding the bible itself, not just doctrine. What you read on your own should line up with teachings taught in the bible. Read the bible in its whole to recieve a full understanding of the stories told in contex.

You can find good teaching church just about with any doctrine... even JW..... just make sure the teacher is well qualified, not all churches in any doctrine are run the same or have the same standards unfortuneately. I wish they did. Let the Holy Spirit guide you, if it feels wrong then go.

Becareful with some Churches of Christ, the "Boston" chapters have gone cultish. They practice separation of families and are possive with your time as a member which are red flags of a cult.

As a Christian, you will be a light unto those around you, a pillar to your family. There may be struggle but in the end it will pull you closer to them, not separate even if they are not Christians.

God bless your journey heart hug

Like most Catholics I had an infant baptism, but I also had a Confirmation which is like Baptism but does not involve water at all. I like what you wrote about being a pillar of your family. I think that you are right on there. See, as you know, the tricky thing with the Witnesses is that if you are never Baptized then you can never be disfellowshipped which is why, most likely, Kathryn jackson is close to all her kids despite all the nutty things they did because only the one daughter got Baptised. It's just all weird and I don't want to be playing around with semantics when raising my daughter. Yikes. I must say though, that I am forever grateful to the JW's for doing home based Bible study with me.

There came a time when the risk of remaining tight in the bud was more painful than the risk it took to blossom. Anais Nin.
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Reply #24 posted 06/28/10 4:38pm

paintedlady

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Deadflow3r said:

paintedlady said:

Those are important points.

You must be baptized, I was in a Church that was my home for 7 years. am still searching for a church home. Any church that claims I am not a Christian because I wasn't baptized by thier own priest or pastor is crazy IMHO.

I studied under a great Bishop ( Bishop Thompson of the Jubilee Church in Boston MA) , he taught me well. Find a good teaching church. One that focuses on understanding the bible itself, not just doctrine. What you read on your own should line up with teachings taught in the bible. Read the bible in its whole to recieve a full understanding of the stories told in contex.

You can find good teaching church just about with any doctrine... even JW..... just make sure the teacher is well qualified, not all churches in any doctrine are run the same or have the same standards unfortuneately. I wish they did. Let the Holy Spirit guide you, if it feels wrong then go.

Becareful with some Churches of Christ, the "Boston" chapters have gone cultish. They practice separation of families and are possive with your time as a member which are red flags of a cult.

As a Christian, you will be a light unto those around you, a pillar to your family. There may be struggle but in the end it will pull you closer to them, not separate even if they are not Christians.

God bless your journey heart hug

Like most Catholics I had an infant baptism, but I also had a Confirmation which is like Baptism but does not involve water at all. I like what you wrote about being a pillar of your family. I think that you are right on there. See, as you know, the tricky thing with the Witnesses is that if you are never Baptized then you can never be disfellowshipped which is why, most likely, Kathryn jackson is close to all her kids despite all the nutty things they did because only the one daughter got Baptised. It's just all weird and I don't want to be playing around with semantics when raising my daughter. Yikes. I must say though, that I am forever grateful to the JW's for doing home based Bible study with me.

The Jw's have gotten one thing right for sure... the power is in the Word. They study! Which is a great thing, baptism is symbolic but essential in the journey to getting to know God.

Its a symbol of rebirth, so do it for you, in dedication to your new life with God. Walking in the Light is a wonderful thing, and do you remeber the story of the woman with the issue of blood?

She had to push by many, walking in the sand, weak and frail, bleeding knowing that she would get a severe beatdown if the others crowded around Jesus were aware of being made unclean from her pushing by them. But she pressed on, pushing obstacles out of her way.... to get to Him, the Light of God.

You are now on that journey. biggrin You will know God even more the more you seek him. Keep reading your bible, and keep an open heart when you enter different church homes.

Many Christian churches even the best ones may fall short, I loved my church, then it got too big, (it went from 500 members to well over 10,000+) and it became a place were many raced for prosperity $$$ and stopped being a true place of worship for me. broken

Church and the body of Christ is for accountability. We need to keeps tabs on each other to keep us in line with His plan, so that we may live full lives. You can have church when two or more are present in His name, but it is recommended to seek a body that will teach and counsel in depth so that you can grow and help others.

You will see, you seem to know what you need already. wink In a funny way, this thread helped me too, thank you. heart

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Reply #25 posted 06/29/10 10:14am

Deadflow3r

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paintedlady said:

Deadflow3r said:

Like most Catholics I had an infant baptism, but I also had a Confirmation which is like Baptism but does not involve water at all. I like what you wrote about being a pillar of your family. I think that you are right on there. See, as you know, the tricky thing with the Witnesses is that if you are never Baptized then you can never be disfellowshipped which is why, most likely, Kathryn jackson is close to all her kids despite all the nutty things they did because only the one daughter got Baptised. It's just all weird and I don't want to be playing around with semantics when raising my daughter. Yikes. I must say though, that I am forever grateful to the JW's for doing home based Bible study with me.

The Jw's have gotten one thing right for sure... the power is in the Word. They study! Which is a great thing, baptism is symbolic but essential in the journey to getting to know God.

Its a symbol of rebirth, so do it for you, in dedication to your new life with God. Walking in the Light is a wonderful thing, and do you remeber the story of the woman with the issue of blood?

She had to push by many, walking in the sand, weak and frail, bleeding knowing that she would get a severe beatdown if the others crowded around Jesus were aware of being made unclean from her pushing by them. But she pressed on, pushing obstacles out of her way.... to get to Him, the Light of God.

You are now on that journey. biggrin You will know God even more the more you seek him. Keep reading your bible, and keep an open heart when you enter different church homes.

Many Christian churches even the best ones may fall short, I loved my church, then it got too big, (it went from 500 members to well over 10,000+) and it became a place were many raced for prosperity $$$ and stopped being a true place of worship for me. broken

Church and the body of Christ is for accountability. We need to keeps tabs on each other to keep us in line with His plan, so that we may live full lives. You can have church when two or more are present in His name, but it is recommended to seek a body that will teach and counsel in depth so that you can grow and help others.

You will see, you seem to know what you need already. wink In a funny way, this thread helped me too, thank you. heart

I keep coming back to this thread because I know I am not alone and if anything my # is growing. More and more people, like me, are leaving the Catholic Church and looking for a new spiritual home. After feeling like we clearly had the wool pulled over our eyes we are a little skeptical about other branches of Christianity and if they can serve our needs for the remainder of our lifetime.

Your Church in Boston must have had a very Charesmatic preacher to go from 500 to 10,000! That's 20 times the original amount! It would be difficult for any church growing that fast to remain humble and true to it's original purpose.

The truth is that they are all made up of humans and mostly led by men. They can not be perfect so I need to accept some degree of imperfection. I would like to meet other seekers of spiritual growth. That is what I long for.

One of the things I most love about Prince's music are all his spiritual songs. They are not gospel, not traditional in anyway. They, the old ones, are just genuine expressions of the desire to be close to God. I don't see the songs that he has created over the last 10 years equal in beauty to the ones of past decades which makes me doubt that his present church is truly enriching his life spiritually. At the same time, I have met plenty of wonderful and warm Witnesses and the amount of time that they give to their Christian faith is admirable in my eyes.

I am so very grateful for this thread. It has been lovely to speak openly about my thoughts on the Witnesses and others and gain encouragement and knowledge from others in return. Thank you Shellyevon and paintedlady; I appretiate both of grouphug your posts.

There came a time when the risk of remaining tight in the bud was more painful than the risk it took to blossom. Anais Nin.
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Reply #26 posted 07/12/10 12:15pm

Deadflow3r

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Still haven't found a church. I have been watching "Daystar" I think that that is the name. Some preachers are quite inspirational and then there is this "Pastor Parsley" who comes across like a used car salesmen always asking his viewers to "sow that uncommon seed of $1,000 and he asks about every 7 minutes (at most).

But, weirdly enough I put my T.V. on this station and left it there and I was able to clean for about 6 hours in a row and that is amazing for me (hoarding/clutter problem). I found that very cool. It was like a prayer meditation sesion while I tried to plow through the mess. When I get home I am going to put it right back on and do it again.

There came a time when the risk of remaining tight in the bud was more painful than the risk it took to blossom. Anais Nin.
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Reply #27 posted 07/15/10 10:54pm

mav777

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paintedlady said:

Deadflow3r said:

I always wish that I could discuss it more here. At my age nearly 49, you look before you leap again. I feel that alot of the things that the Witnesses believe are on target. However, despite the fact that they say you should keep asking questions and get more knowledge, there are some questions that they don't want you to ask. Despite the fact that it looks like they clearly have more females then males, I don't see much of a female voice represented. Sure, women do the Bible studies with other women, but that is about it. At least the Catholic nuns had a bit of a voice, I am thinking of Mother Teresa and even St Therese of Liseaux aswell. The midevel St. Teresa of Avila wrote too.

JW's are very dogmatic. They go by ONE translation of the Word of God.

I have dicovered myself in my own study (I was encouraged to study by a JW to learn the Word of God, and in doing so I learned that they have holes in thier doctrine that do not fit.

No one is perfect, but a few things I have seen are deade wrong.

1. Adam (930 years), Noah (950 years), Abraham (175 years) , Moses (120 and strong!), Jesus (31) all counted their years. We know in their story how old they are, so they did acknowlegde their birthdays. Not celebrate like we do now, but their years were counted because we know how long these men lived on earth.

You can acknowledge your birthday.

2. God tells us his name in the bible. He had Moses speak his name. His name was NOT forbidden to say.

God's name is, I AM , Exodus 3:14-15

this is why Jesus got beat down and killed because when he was asked who is he he answered "I AM" thus making the claim that he is God and this is why we as Christians believe in the Trinity.

3. Jesus was no "angel" he is the light of God. It was the first thing that was created. Jesus is the "light".

You can not enter into the kindom of God with out Jesus, he is the holder of the keys.... it is through Him (Jesus- His death, blood sacrafice) that we are saved.

This is the very definition of a "Christian" . You are either a Jew, a Muslim or a Christian.

Simple as pie, you believe he died and rose on the 3rd day, you are saved. You are a Christian.

This is what saves you, not "works" .... I was told by JW's that this is not true, that this is wrong. So I will never be a JW, since I read the bible and my bible (I read 4 different versions) all say the same thing.

Yes, you do want to repent and do good works, but is the belief in what Jesus has done that saves your soul.

Its easy, God made it that way. That's all you need, everything else is to make your life better, but you soul is covered in the blood of Christ.

That's what I know and I'm sticking to that. rose hug Bless your journey to the truth that is in the bible, it is easy to find and easy to know.

[Edited 6/26/10 16:41pm]

You might want to read Jas 2:26:

(BBE)

For as the body without the spirit is dead even so faith without works is dead.

(CEV)

Anyone who doesn't breathe is dead, and faith that doesn't do anything is just as dead!

(GNB)

So then, as the body without the spirit is dead, also faith without actions is dead.

(ISV)

For just as the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without works is also dead.

(KJV)

For as the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without works is dead also.

You might also check out what Jesus said in Mat 24:13:

(BBE)

But he who goes through to the end will get salvation.

(CEV)

But if you keep on being faithful right to the end, you will be saved.

(GNB)

But whoever holds out to the end will be saved.

(ISV)

But the person who endures to the end will be saved.

(KJV)

But he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved.

While, according to scripture, belief in Jesus is necessary for salvation, that alone without corresponding works and enduring till the end of either the current world system or one's life does not ensure survival.

With regards to the name of God, you might want to do a bit of linguistic study before being so dogmatic. The fact that Jehovah is commonly acknowledged as the name of God can be seen from any English language dictionary. Heck, it is even in movies.

With respects to the non-acknowledgement of birthdays, I am yet to meet a JW who didnt know their age or be willing to tell you their birthday. They simply believe it shouldnt be celebrated. No scholar that I have read claims that either Jesus or the early christians CELEBRATED birthdays

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Reply #28 posted 07/24/10 5:03am

ladychel61

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2freaky4church1 said:

A question. Do you have to be a JW to be allowed into a kingdom hall?

EVERYONE IS WELCOME TO COME TO THE KINGDOM HALL TO LEARN THE TRUTH ABOUT JEHOVAH GOD AND HIS SON JESUS.grouphug hug

♥ Feeling Purple Rain...Don't hold on 2 the pain, hold on 2 the memories ♥
My heart will go on...Celine Dion
I will always love you...Whitney Houston
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Reply #29 posted 07/24/10 5:04pm

paintedlady

avatar

mav777 said:

paintedlady said:

JW's are very dogmatic. They go by ONE translation of the Word of God.

I have dicovered myself in my own study (I was encouraged to study by a JW to learn the Word of God, and in doing so I learned that they have holes in thier doctrine that do not fit.

No one is perfect, but a few things I have seen are deade wrong.

1. Adam (930 years), Noah (950 years), Abraham (175 years) , Moses (120 and strong!), Jesus (31) all counted their years. We know in their story how old they are, so they did acknowlegde their birthdays. Not celebrate like we do now, but their years were counted because we know how long these men lived on earth.

You can acknowledge your birthday.

2. God tells us his name in the bible. He had Moses speak his name. His name was NOT forbidden to say.

God's name is, I AM , Exodus 3:14-15

this is why Jesus got beat down and killed because when he was asked who is he he answered "I AM" thus making the claim that he is God and this is why we as Christians believe in the Trinity.

3. Jesus was no "angel" he is the light of God. It was the first thing that was created. Jesus is the "light".

You can not enter into the kindom of God with out Jesus, he is the holder of the keys.... it is through Him (Jesus- His death, blood sacrafice) that we are saved.

This is the very definition of a "Christian" . You are either a Jew, a Muslim or a Christian.

Simple as pie, you believe he died and rose on the 3rd day, you are saved. You are a Christian.

This is what saves you, not "works" .... I was told by JW's that this is not true, that this is wrong. So I will never be a JW, since I read the bible and my bible (I read 4 different versions) all say the same thing.

Yes, you do want to repent and do good works, but is the belief in what Jesus has done that saves your soul.

Its easy, God made it that way. That's all you need, everything else is to make your life better, but you soul is covered in the blood of Christ.

That's what I know and I'm sticking to that. rose hug Bless your journey to the truth that is in the bible, it is easy to find and easy to know.

[Edited 6/26/10 16:41pm]

You might want to read Jas 2:26:

(BBE)

For as the body without the spirit is dead even so faith without works is dead.

(CEV)

Anyone who doesn't breathe is dead, and faith that doesn't do anything is just as dead!

(GNB)

So then, as the body without the spirit is dead, also faith without actions is dead.

(ISV)

For just as the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without works is also dead.

(KJV)

For as the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without works is dead also.

You might also check out what Jesus said in Mat 24:13:

(BBE)

But he who goes through to the end will get salvation.

(CEV)

But if you keep on being faithful right to the end, you will be saved.

(GNB)

But whoever holds out to the end will be saved.

(ISV)

But the person who endures to the end will be saved.

(KJV)

But he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved.

While, according to scripture, belief in Jesus is necessary for salvation, that alone without corresponding works and enduring till the end of either the current world system or one's life does not ensure survival.

With regards to the name of God, you might want to do a bit of linguistic study before being so dogmatic. The fact that Jehovah is commonly acknowledged as the name of God can be seen from any English language dictionary. Heck, it is even in movies.

With respects to the non-acknowledgement of birthdays, I am yet to meet a JW who didnt know their age or be willing to tell you their birthday. They simply believe it shouldnt be celebrated. No scholar that I have read claims that either Jesus or the early christians CELEBRATED birthdays

I know Jehovah is acknoledged as the name of God, but the doctrine of JW's says that His name was forbidded to say in the past, according to teachings so that the name Jehovah must be used. The name jehovah is written in many places in the JW bible because of this instead of the word God. But the problem is that in other bibles the word God can mean the Holy Spirit, God the father, or God the Son.... not simply Jehovah. This is why many bibles do not use the name Jehovah but stick to the term "God" and keep it simple. Its NOTR because the name Jehovah was forbidden.

With regard to salvation, different churches practice different doctrines...

--------------------------------------------

Romans10:9-14 (NIV) That if you confess with your mouth, "Jesus is Lord," and believe in your heart that God raised him the dead, you will be saved. For it is with your heart that you will believe and are justified, and it is with your mouth that you confess and are saved. The Scripture says, "Anyone who trusts in him will never be put to shame." For there is no difference between Jew and Gentile -the same Lord is Lord of all and richly blesses all who call on him, for, "Every one who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved."

-----------------------------

It doesn't get more clearer than that with regards to salvation. I did not post parts of bits of scripture that could be misintrepeted.

Now you are right... salvation without works is dead... but that's not abvout salvation of your soul... that is about saving your life on earth. When you give your life to God/Jehovah/Yaweh you can't run around acting like a heathen. You use the word of God to follow and join into a fellowship of like minded people in order to improve your life here on earth and go about spreading the good news and living a fruitful life that is blessed.

So yes, you DO need to change you life and be a good steward of the earth, but that is extra.... your soul belongs to God if you proclaim him.

Its the same if you do great works but are an atheist. If you do not believe Jesus died and rose again you will not be saved. No matter how many good deads you do. Jesus holds the keys. biggrin This you already know.

As far as birthdays, no we don't know if they were "celebrated" but they were acknowledged. So I will acknowldge mine, thank you.... and have a little cake too. lol

sorry it took me so long to get back to this.

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