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Thread started 08/12/07 7:26am

sillyme

Christ followers? How do U reason with this?

Christian?
Christian?
Every Christian is supposed to be a "follower of Jesus" right?
But do we realize that Jesus was a "follower" too?

Doing of his Father’s will was uppermost at all times in the mind of Jesus is apparent from his own testimony:

“I cannot do a single thing of my own initiative; just as I hear, I judge, and the judgment that I render is righteous, because I seek not my own will but the will of him that sent me.”

“Because I have come down from heaven to do, not my will, but the will of him that sent me.”

“My food is for me to do the will of him that sent me and to finish his work.”—
John 4:34; 5:30; 6:38, (http://tinyurl.com/33p2bq)


PLEASE TAKE THE TIME TO READ THIS AND BARE WITH ME


If U were to ask anyone instructions on "how to pray", who would U chose?

Graham? Olsteen? John Paul II? or Jesus?

Luke 11:2 (http://tinyurl.com/2784vz)

"one of His disciples said to Him, “Lord, teach us to pray, as John also taught his disciples.” So He said to them, “When you pray, say:

(To whom)Our Father in heaven,[a]
1-Hallowed be Your name.
2-Your kingdom come.
3-Your will be done
On earth as it is in heaven."


That was a direct question with a direct answer by Jesus.

Please keep in mind that Jesus spent his ministry years exclusivly doing ONE thing, his father's will, which was mostly about announcing the Good News of God's Kingdom to come....

Jesus Christ instructed his followers to engage "spreading the Good News". “As you go, preach, saying, ‘The kingdom of the heavens has drawn near.”’ (Matt. 10:7; 4:12-17)

With that in mind, I am CERTAIN that no Christian would dare to assume that Jesus made random statements.

Jesus, in the model prayer put the "keep your name holy, hallow thy name, sanctify your name" the "father's name" ahead of the Kingdom and the Will.

Could it mean that giving Glory and praise to the NAME of the Father matters?


John 17:26 (http://tinyurl.com/28chla)

and (A)I have made Your name known to them, and will make it known, so that (B)the love with which You loved Me may be in them, and I in them."

Jesus is essentialy declaring in his prayer to His father, God, that making God's name known to them (disciples, followers, us) allows God's love with which God loved Jesus to be in them (disciples, followers, us)

The Love with which God loved Jesus, is the love that held the promise of the resurection.

There is nothing to argue, these words are simple and clear.


Malachi 3:16 (http://tinyurl.com/22vwle)

Then those who feared the LORD spoke to one another,
And the LORD listened and heard them;
So a book of remembrance was written before Him
For those who fear the LORD
And who meditate on His name.


Here we have wonderful statement of hope, those who meditate, think on His name will be remembered by Him... The LORD... The trick is that in the ""old testament"", the Hebrew scriptures, LORD, all capitalized is not Jesus...

In the model prayer AND here above AND over 100 times in the old and new testament, the name doesn't have a plural option...

"Hallow by thy nameS" is NOT what Jesus taught.

Would anyone assume that Jesus was approximative in his teachings, especially regarding the prayer!?

The name of God is as U know by now, YHVH, (Jehovah) as Jesus' is Yeshua (http://tinyurl.com/23y6h9)

Exodus 6:3 (New King James Version) http://tinyurl.com/3ac274
King James http://tinyurl.com/3ac274

I appeared to Abraham, to Isaac, and to Jacob, as God Almighty, but by My name LORD[a] I was not known to them.

Footnotes: [a]Exodus 6:3 Hebrew YHWH, traditionally Jehovah

EVERY TIME in UR Bible U read "LORD" in the Hebrew (old testament) it actually REPLACED "YHVH"...

In the Hebrew Scripture, the personal name of GOD, YHVH used to appear 6828 times and was removed and replaced by a title, not a name, LORD. (http://tinyurl.com/2kyg8n)

Now, some may say that the name changed from the old to the new testament, but there is NO scriptural back up to this statement, on the contrary, there are many scriptures to support the contrary:

Romans 10:13 : "For “everyone who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved.”
Paul was quoting Joel 2:32: "And it must occur that everyone who calls on the name of YHVH will get away safe"


Matt 22:37 He said to him: “‘You must love God with your whole heart and with your whole soul and with your whole mind"

Jesus was quoting Moses in Deuteronomy 6:5 "And you must love YHVH your God with all your heart and all your soul and all your vital force."


Matt 4:4 But in reply he said: “It is written, ‘Man must live, not on bread alone, but on every utterance coming forth through the mouth of God.’”

Jesus was quoting Moses in Deut 8:3 :"in order to make you know that not by bread alone does man live but by every expression of YHVH (Jehovah)’s mouth does man live."


Are the religeous leaders (pasters, preachers, priests etc supposed to be Christ Followers that duplicate the pattern that Jesus has set forth?

John 13:15 Jesus: "For I set the pattern for YOU, that, just as I did to YOU, YOU should do also."

Are the religeous leaders of Ur church making "the name known" as Jesus strived to?

John 17:26 (http://tinyurl.com/28chla)

and (A)I have made Your name known to them, and will make it known, so that (B)the love with which You loved Me may be in them, and I in them."

Does it matter if they don't?

Who's reasonning matters to U?

God's view point on it or men's view point on it?

Ask Ur Preacher, pastor, priest what is the "name" that we need to Hallow?

Will he be enthousiatic to reply to U and answer or will he beat around the bush?

Does it matter to God the enthousiasm with which U are given an answer to that simple question?

Read what God, Father of Jesus has to say about that...


Malachi 2:1-2

“And now this commandment is to YOU, O priests. If YOU will not listen, and if YOU will not lay [it] to heart to give glory to my name,” YHVH (Jehovah) of armies has said, “I shall also certainly send upon YOU the curse, and I will curse YOUR blessings. Yes, I have even cursed the [blessing], because YOU are not laying [it] to heart.”

Matthew 12:34

For out of the abundance of the heart the mouth speaks.

Like it or not, if Ur preacher, pastor, priest DOES NOT give GLORY (amplies enthousiasm) to God's Name, Jehovah (YHVH), he is cursed, and that is NOT according to Jerome, but to God, Jehovah.

It says the EXACT same thing in EVERY Bible out there...

SO why in the world do they NOT give Glory to the Name???

Here is Ur answer...http://tinyurl.com/2hoboo

Like it or not.

There is over 100 scriptures that back up how crucial, paramount, pivital, essential, undeniable, indispensable knowing and using God's name, YHVH (Jehovah) is.

That is why we DO NOT TRUST any publication other than ours, because the others hide the true name of God and try to make it forget from the people.

We, for certain work HARD to not let anyone make God's name be forgotten

http://tinyurl.com/yq9d3z

There is only one Truth and it starts in the Bible. If Ur religious """"Christian"""" leader does NOT give glory to God by using his name as ORDERED, COMMANDED, INSTRUCTED by God himself and His Son, they are CURSED, could they then have the Holy Spirit's guidance?

This so simple, it's scary!

Sincerly
JKJ

Once again all scriptural back up can be found in ANY Bible!
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Reply #1 posted 08/12/07 8:23am

SisterGirl

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THIS is going to be interesting cool pc chair coffee donut nod
"It's just around the corner"
Check out my Blog!
Get Paid to Wear Your Hair!
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Reply #2 posted 08/12/07 9:46am

JellyBean

This should be fun.
“When I give food to the poor, they call me a saint. When I ask why the poor have no food, they call me a Communist.” Brazilian bishop Dom Hélder Câmara
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Reply #3 posted 08/12/07 11:57am

Origen

sillyme said:

In the Hebrew Scripture, the personal name of GOD, YHVH used to appear 6828 times and was removed and replaced by a title, not a name, LORD.
YHVH was never removed from the Hebrew Scriptures. It is still there just check the Hebrew text.
[Edited 8/12/07 11:58am]
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Reply #4 posted 08/12/07 12:16pm

rodman2

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Origen said:

sillyme said:

In the Hebrew Scripture, the personal name of GOD, YHVH used to appear 6828 times and was removed and replaced by a title, not a name, LORD.
YHVH was never removed from the Hebrew Scriptures. It is still there just check the Hebrew text.
[Edited 8/12/07 11:58am]


hmmm, could you quote say 100 out of that 6828, this person is talking about?

say use good ole king james bible
I was being mean actually I believe King james only mentions god's name six times. But you get my drift!
added bible remark
[Edited 8/12/07 12:26pm]
[Edited 8/12/07 13:18pm]
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Reply #5 posted 08/12/07 12:22pm

ehuffnsd

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lurking
You CANNOT use the name of God, or religion, to justify acts of violence, to hurt, to hate, to discriminate- Madonna
authentic power is service- Pope Francis
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Reply #6 posted 08/12/07 12:53pm

Rhondab

OY Vey confused
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Reply #7 posted 08/12/07 2:35pm

Eternaldragon

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Well, that answers the question of why they stoned Stephen then. he called upon Jesus instead of YHVH.

Acts 7:59 (King James Version)

59 And they stoned Stephen, calling upon God, and saying, Lord Jesus, receive my spirit.

And these people must have been baptized wrongly:

Acts 8:16 (King James Version)

16 (For as yet he was fallen upon none of them: only they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus.)

And why they wanted to kill Saul....for not using the name YHVH....

Acts 9:29 And he spake boldly in the name of the Lord Jesus, and disputed against the Grecians: but they went about to slay him.

WAIT! How did this work without using YHVH????

Acts 9:34 And Peter said unto him, Aeneas, Jesus Christ maketh thee whole: arise, and make thy bed. And he arose immediately.

And....

Acts 10:36 The word which God sent unto the children of Israel, preaching peace by Jesus Christ: (he is Lord of all:)

And....

Acts 16:18 And this did she many days. But Paul, being grieved, turned and said to the spirit, I command thee in the name of Jesus Christ to come out of her. And he came out the same hour.

And...

Acts 16:31 And they said, Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and thou shalt be saved, and thy house.

And on and on....
pray flag "I am the way, the truth and the life; No man cometh unto the father, but by me." - Jesus of Nazareth (John 14:6)
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Reply #8 posted 08/12/07 4:20pm

sillyme

Eternaldragon said:

Well, that answers the question of why they stoned Stephen then. he called upon Jesus instead of YHVH.

Acts 7:59 (King James Version)

59 And they stoned Stephen, calling upon God, and saying, Lord Jesus, receive my spirit.


The prayer offered by Stephen when he was being martyred is recorded at Acts 7:59, 60, which says: “And they went on casting stones at Stephen as he made appeal and said: ‘Lord Jesus, receive my spirit.’ Then, bending his knees, he cried out with a strong voice: ‘Jehovah, do not charge this sin against them.’ And after saying this he fell asleep in death.”

Rather than indicating that Stephen understood both Jesus and Jehovah to be the same person, his prayer shows that he knew they were not, because he differentiates between the two. His request to Jesus he does not address merely to the Lord, but to the Lord Jesus, thus doing away with any ambiguity. Further, his statement shortly prior to this, as recorded in verse 56, indicates two persons: “And he said: ‘Look! I behold the heavens opened up and the Son of man standing at God’s right hand.’” He does not say the Son of man, Christ Jesus, is Jehovah God, but that he was standing at God’s right hand.

Not only does Stephen’s request, “Lord Jesus, receive my spirit,” not prove the trinity, but Jesus’ similar fervent prayer, “Father, into your hands I entrust my spirit,”in Luke 23:46 conclusively shows that Jesus is not the same as his Father Jehovah.

In the wording of his prayer Stephen showed that he understood the difference between Jehovah and the Lord Jesus as set out in Psalm 110:1 and applied by Jesus at Matthew 22:42-46. He was not perplexed by Jesus’ application of it, as were the Pharisees to whom Jesus spoke and who were silenced by his answer.

Jesus had taught his followers that the Father authorized him to raise others to life. (John 5:26; 6:40; 11:25, 26) So it was proper for Stephen to petition Jesus over this matter, and his prayer indicates proper understanding on his part. It does not support the trinity.


And these people must have been baptized wrongly:

Acts 8:16 (King James Version)

16 (For as yet he was fallen upon none of them: only they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus.)

What does it mean to be baptized “in the name of the Father”? It means that the baptismal candidate recognizes our heavenly Father’s office and authority. Jehovah God is thus acknowledged as our Creator, “the Most High over all the earth,” and the Universal Sovereign.—Psalm 83:18; Isaiah 40:28; Acts 4:24.

To be baptized ‘in the name of the Son’ means to recognize Jesus’ office and authority as God’s only-begotten Son. (1 John 4:9) Those qualified for baptism accept Jesus as the one through whom God has provided “a ransom in exchange for many.” (Matthew 20:28; 1 Timothy 2:5, 6) Baptismal candidates must also acknowledge the “superior position” to which God has exalted his Son.—Philippians 2:8-11; Revelation 19:16.

What is the significance of baptism ‘in the name of the holy spirit’? This indicates that the baptismal candidates recognize that the holy spirit is Jehovah’s active force, used in various ways in harmony with his purpose. (Genesis 1:2; 2 Samuel 23:1, 2; 2 Peter 1:21) Those qualifying for baptism acknowledge that the holy spirit helps them to understand “the deep things of God,” to carry on the Kingdom-preaching work, and to display the spirit’s fruitage of “love, joy, peace, long-suffering, kindness, goodness, faith, mildness, self-control.”—1 Corinthians 2:10; Galatians 5:22, 23; Joel 2:28, 29.


And why they wanted to kill Saul....for not using the name YHVH....

I dont get Ur question or point here, but I betcha I'd have an answer wink

Acts 9:29 And he spake boldly in the name of the Lord Jesus, and disputed against the Grecians: but they went about to slay him.

They can talk in Jesus name, he is the "leader, teacher, messiah, son of Man that has power over it all (according to God's will) once resurected...

The "God's will -Jehovah's will- is a constant to time indefinite, but the will is accomplished through Jesus.

Franckly it's real simple...

WAIT! How did this work without using YHVH????

Still don't get Ur questions...I'd love to answer. smile

Acts 9:34 And Peter said unto him, Aeneas, Jesus Christ maketh thee whole: arise, and make thy bed. And he arose immediately.

"However, now Christ has been raised up from the dead, the firstfruits of those who have fallen asleep [in death]. 21 For since death is through a man (Adam), resurrection of the dead is also through a man(Jesus). 22 For just as in Adam all are dying, so also in the Christ all will be made alive" 1 cor 15:20-22


"This is the will of him that sent me, that I should lose nothing out of all that he has given me but that I should resurrect it at the last day. 40 For this is the will of my Father, that everyone that beholds the Son and exercises faith in him should have everlasting life, and I will resurrect him at the last day.” John 6:39-40



Jesus: “Most truly I say to YOU, The hour is coming, and it is now, when the dead will hear the voice of the Son of God and those who have given heed will live. 26 For just as the Father has life in himself, so he has granted also to the Son to have life in himself. 27 And he has given him authority to do judging, because Son of man he is. 28 Do not marvel at this, because the hour is coming in which all those in the memorial tombs will hear his voice 29 and come out, those who did good things to a resurrection of life, those who practiced vile things to a resurrection of judgment. 30 I cannot do a single thing of my own initiative; just as I hear, I judge; and the judgment that I render is righteous, because I seek, not my own will, but the will of him that sent me."

(John 5:25-30)
And....

Acts 10:36 The word which God sent unto the children of Israel, preaching peace by Jesus Christ: (he is Lord of all:)

"And his name will be called Wonderful Counselor, Mighty God, Eternal Father, Prince of Peace." Isaiah 9:6

Mighty God, Not Almighty God.
Eternal Father because he resurects into Life.
Prince of Peace because he will rule with righteousness.


And....

Acts 10:40

1 Cor 15:45-47


Acts 16:18 And this did she many days. But Paul, being grieved, turned and said to the spirit, I command thee in the name of Jesus Christ to come out of her. And he came out the same hour.

When Jesus was resurected by God and he then received power & authority, but ALL glory and worship goes to God.

Matt 28:18 And Jesus approached and spoke to them, saying: “All authority has been given me in heaven and on the earth."

Psalm 145: 1I will exalt you, O my God the King,
And I will bless your name to time indefinite, even forever.

2 All day long I will bless you,
And I will praise your name to time indefinite, even forever.

3 Jehovah is great and very much to be praised,
And his greatness is unsearchable.

4 Generation after generation will commend your works,
And about your mighty acts they will tell.

Psalm 113: Praise Jah, YOU people!
Offer praise, O YOU servants of Jehovah,
Praise the name of Jehovah.

2 May Jehovah’s name become blessed
From now on and to time indefinite.

3 From the rising of the sun until its setting
Jehovah’s name is to be praised.

4 Jehovah has become high above all the nations;
His glory is above the heavens.

5 Who is like Jehovah our God,
And...

Acts 16:31 And they said, Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and thou shalt be saved, and thy house.

If U believe in Jesus, then U believe that he made his father's name known, that his father's will is paramount, that His father gave Jesus Authority over death etc, that we need to endure until the end, that he died as a ransom for our sins, U also believe that Jehovah is God and Jesus is subjet to him, then, once U get the order of things and priority and hierachy, then U can get saved, as this is basically what Jesus spent his years preaching and eaching and died for. Therefore to believe in Christ is believing that what he taught was true...

And on and on....

[b]
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Reply #9 posted 08/12/07 4:25pm

sillyme

JESUS CHRIST is the name and title of the Son of God from the time of his anointing while on earth.

The name Jesus (Gr., I‧e‧sous′) corresponds to the Hebrew name Jeshua (or, in fuller form, Jehoshua), meaning “Jehovah Is Salvation.” The name itself was not unusual, many men being so named in that period. For this reason persons often added further identification, saying, “Jesus the Nazarene.” (Mr 10:47; Ac 2:22)

wink interresting wink
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Reply #10 posted 08/12/07 4:30pm

morningsong

whistling coffee
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Reply #11 posted 08/12/07 4:41pm

sillyme

morningsong said:

whistling coffee


lol

In depth stuff, sorry... I thought we'd have a nice debate, but ... guess not lols
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Reply #12 posted 08/12/07 5:47pm

Origen

rodman2 said:

Origen said:

YHVH was never removed from the Hebrew Scriptures. It is still there just check the Hebrew text.
[Edited 8/12/07 11:58am]


hmmm, could you quote say 100 out of that 6828, this person is talking about?

say use good ole king james bible
I was being mean actually I believe King james only mentions god's name six times. But you get my drift!
added bible remark
Sillyme did not say KJV. He said Hebrew Scripture. The KJV O.T. is an English translation of the Hebrew Scripture. The tetragrammation is still in the Hebrew text. Also the tetragrammaton was never removed from the KJV. The tetragrammation was translated a few times but for the most part rarely translated.

But if you want a list all 6828 times the tetragrammaton appears in the Hebrew text I could supply that list.
[Edited 8/12/07 17:52pm]
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Reply #13 posted 08/12/07 5:58pm

sillyme

Origen said:

rodman2 said:



hmmm, could you quote say 100 out of that 6828, this person is talking about?

say use good ole king james bible
I was being mean actually I believe King james only mentions god's name six times. But you get my drift!
added bible remark


Sillyme did not say KJV. He said Hebrew Scripture. The KJV O.T. is an English translation of the Hebrew Scripture. The tetragrammation is still in the Hebrew text. Also the tetragrammation was never removed from the KJV. The tetragrammation was translated a few times but for the most part rarely translated.

But if you want a list all 6828 times the tetragrammation appears in the Hebrew text I could supply that list.
[Edited 8/12/07 17:50pm]


ok clarification... In the Hebrew scriptures YHVH is written 6828 times, in the KJV it was 5-6 times I think (JEHOVAH, JAH or YHVH) in the other "versions" is rarely appears ever, sometimes there are footnotes on exodus 6:3 or 3:15.

Regarless, the name of God is YHVH (Jehovah) and most of the Christians, leaders or followers, have NO clue what the name is, or they certainly do not praise it nor glorify it, and according to... GOD... in Malachi 2:1-2 it is a VERY SERIOUS OFFENSE...

Malachi 2:1-2-And now this commandment is to YOU, O priests. 2 If YOU will not listen, and if YOU will not lay [it] to heart to give glory to my name,” Jehovah of armies has said, “I shall also certainly send upon YOU the curse, and I will curse YOUR blessings. Yes, I have even cursed the [blessing], because YOU are not laying [it] to heart.”

Pretty straight forward...

It states the same thing in EVERY SINGLE BIBLE...
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Reply #14 posted 08/12/07 6:16pm

Origen

sillyme said:

Origen said:



Sillyme did not say KJV. He said Hebrew Scripture. The KJV O.T. is an English translation of the Hebrew Scripture. The tetragrammation is still in the Hebrew text. Also the tetragrammation was never removed from the KJV. The tetragrammation was translated a few times but for the most part rarely translated.

But if you want a list all 6828 times the tetragrammation appears in the Hebrew text I could supply that list.
[Edited 8/12/07 17:50pm]


ok clarification... In the Hebrew scriptures YHVH is written 6828 times, in the KJV it was 5-6 times I think (JEHOVAH, JAH or YHVH) in the other "versions" is rarely appears ever, sometimes there are footnotes on exodus 6:3 or 3:15.

Regarless, the name of God is YHVH (Jehovah) and most of the Christians, leaders or followers, have NO clue what the name is, or they certainly do not praise it nor glorify it, and according to... GOD... in Malachi 2:1-2 it is a VERY SERIOUS OFFENSE...

Malachi 2:1-2-And now this commandment is to YOU, O priests. 2 If YOU will not listen, and if YOU will not lay [it] to heart to give glory to my name,” Jehovah of armies has said, “I shall also certainly send upon YOU the curse, and I will curse YOUR blessings. Yes, I have even cursed the [blessing], because YOU are not laying [it] to heart.”

Pretty straight forward...

It states the same thing in EVERY SINGLE BIBLE...
The fact remains it was never removed. Every translation I know of explains why the tetragrammaton is translated as "LORD" in the preface, the introduction, or footnote. There is no cover up, intent to mislead, or get rid of the tetragrammaton.

Notwithstanding the tetragrammaton is never used in the N.T. Even when Jesus give his example of how to pray he uses "Father" not the tetragrammaton.
[Edited 8/12/07 19:45pm]
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Reply #15 posted 08/12/07 6:16pm

Eternaldragon

avatar

sillyme said:

Origen said:



Sillyme did not say KJV. He said Hebrew Scripture. The KJV O.T. is an English translation of the Hebrew Scripture. The tetragrammation is still in the Hebrew text. Also the tetragrammation was never removed from the KJV. The tetragrammation was translated a few times but for the most part rarely translated.

But if you want a list all 6828 times the tetragrammation appears in the Hebrew text I could supply that list.
[Edited 8/12/07 17:50pm]


ok clarification... In the Hebrew scriptures YHVH is written 6828 times, in the KJV it was 5-6 times I think (JEHOVAH, JAH or YHVH) in the other "versions" is rarely appears ever, sometimes there are footnotes on exodus 6:3 or 3:15.

Regarless, the name of God is YHVH (Jehovah) and most of the Christians, leaders or followers, have NO clue what the name is, or they certainly do not praise it nor glorify it, and according to... GOD... in Malachi 2:1-2 it is a VERY SERIOUS OFFENSE...

Malachi 2:1-2-And now this commandment is to YOU, O priests. 2 If YOU will not listen, and if YOU will not lay [it] to heart to give glory to my name,” Jehovah of armies has said, “I shall also certainly send upon YOU the curse, and I will curse YOUR blessings. Yes, I have even cursed the [blessing], because YOU are not laying [it] to heart.”

Pretty straight forward...

It states the same thing in EVERY SINGLE BIBLE...


You do know that Malachi was speaking to the PRIESTS and those references were stated while still under the law?

You also know that there are many names for God? Lord of hosts, God, Lord, etc?

Also, many Christians do know what the name is (it is in my schofield study Bible). Many do praise and glorify God.

Lastly, I am not sure you are aware but Jesus himself said you can't get to God but through him. So any praise or prayers to "Jehovah/JHVH" is sort of a negative point now. Jesus Christ is our link to God now and the only way to salvation. He is the God man. The link between man and God because he was both. Prayers and praise are to go through him.
pray flag "I am the way, the truth and the life; No man cometh unto the father, but by me." - Jesus of Nazareth (John 14:6)
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Reply #16 posted 08/12/07 6:58pm

sillyme

Eternaldragon said: You do know that Malachi was speaking to the PRIESTS and those references were stated while still under the law?


First, Malachi was NOT speaking to the PRIESTS, but it was God speaking to the priests through Malachi.

Second, Priests were under law, indeed, but they still needed to take it to the heart to give glory to God. The ONLY difference is that, after Jesus resurection there was no need for sacrifice (cows, sheeps, goats, doves etc), now our worship, demeanor, actions, deeds, etc became the "living sacrifice" through our bodies, as our bodies are performing the sacrifice by enduring until the end according to God's will (again & always).

“Present your bodies a sacrifice living, holy, acceptable to God.”—Romans 12:1.

The law may have changed, but what ticked off Jehovah then, still ticks him off now...

For I am Jehovah; I have not changed. Malachi 3:6

You also know that there are many names for God? Lord of hosts, God, Lord, etc?


There is only ONE name for God, period, there are bunch of titles that bring accuracy to the "mood and qualities" that God was emphasizing at the time of the "actions" Jehovah of armies is one (not Lord of Armies, that's a "title")

"we will walk in the name of YHVH (Jehovah) our God for ever and ever.”—Mic. 4:5

11 Instruct me, O Jehovah, about your way.
I shall walk in your truth.
Unify my heart to fear your name.

12 I laud you, O Jehovah my God, with all my heart,
And I will glorify your name to time indefinite,psalm 86:11-12

21 The praise of Jehovah my mouth will speak;
And let all flesh bless his holy name to time indefinite, even forever Psalm 145:21

etc

Does for ever and ever stopped at Jesus??

Did time indefinite end with Jesus?

Which scripture backs that up? Book/Chapter/Verse


Also, many Christians do know what the name is (it is in my schofield study Bible). Many do praise and glorify God.


That's great, I am addressing the ones that don't smile

I have come to call, not righteous persons, but sinners to repentance.” Luke 5:32


Lastly, I am not sure you are aware but Jesus himself said you can't get to God but through him. So any praise or prayers to "Jehovah/JHVH" is sort of a negative point now. Jesus Christ is our link to God now and the only way to salvation. He is the God man. The link between man and God because he was both. Prayers and praise are to go through him.


There is abosolutly NO scriptural basis for Ur statement, it is false reasoning, Ur OWN ORIGINALITY

Where do U get this from? Book/Chapter/verse

Jesus talkin: "If anyone desires to do His will, he will know concerning the teaching whether it is from God or I speak of my own originality. 18 He that speaks of his own originality is seeking his own glory; but he that seeks the glory of him that sent him, this one is true, and there is no unrighteousness in him." John 7:17-18

Pray to God (luke 11:2) -Model prayer-, through Christ.

ex: Heavenly Father, (to whom), Jehovah, (hallow the Name), let Ur kingdom come and let Ur will take place on earth as it is in the Heavens, let me be part of Ur will and not be taken apart by it, please forgive us as we do fall short, we pray in through Ur son Jesus Christ (through), our ransom Sacrifice, Amen

We can mix match anywhich way, an add any personal item (according to His will) etc put any wording U wish (according to His will, not ours) etc

To + Through= correct way to pray.
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Reply #17 posted 08/12/07 7:11pm

2the9s

sillyme said:

PLEASE TAKE THE TIME TO READ THIS AND BARE WITH ME


shrug

~~starts to disrobe~~
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Reply #18 posted 08/12/07 7:34pm

Eternaldragon

avatar

sillyme said:

Eternaldragon said:
Lastly, I am not sure you are aware but Jesus himself said you can't get to God but through him. So any praise or prayers to "Jehovah/JHVH" is sort of a negative point now. Jesus Christ is our link to God now and the only way to salvation. He is the God man. The link between man and God because he was both. Prayers and praise are to go through him.


There is abosolutly NO scriptural basis for Ur statement, it is false reasoning, Ur OWN ORIGINALITY

Where do U get this from? Book/Chapter/verse


Um...the scripture that says we have to come to God through Jesus only, is right on my signature line. confuse

You also do know what a "high Priest" is?

Hebrews 2:16-18

16 For verily he took not on him the nature of angels; but he took on him the seed of Abraham.

17 Wherefore in all things it behoved him to be made like unto his brethren, that he might be a merciful and faithful high priest in things pertaining to God, to make reconciliation for the sins of the people.

18 For in that he himself hath suffered being tempted, he is able to succour them that are tempted.

Hebrews 3:1

Wherefore, holy brethren, partakers of the heavenly calling, consider the Apostle and High Priest of our profession, Christ Jesus;

Hebrews 5:9-11

9 And being made perfect, he became the author of eternal salvation unto all them that obey him;

10 Called of God an high priest after the order of Melchisedec.

11 Of whom we have many things to say, and hard to be uttered, seeing ye are dull of hearing.

Hebrews 8:1

Now of the things which we have spoken this is the sum: We have such an high priest, who is set on the right hand of the throne of the Majesty in the heavens;
[Edited 8/12/07 19:35pm]
pray flag "I am the way, the truth and the life; No man cometh unto the father, but by me." - Jesus of Nazareth (John 14:6)
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Reply #19 posted 08/12/07 10:33pm

madartista

avatar

2the9s said:

sillyme said:

PLEASE TAKE THE TIME TO READ THIS AND BARE WITH ME


shrug

~~starts to disrobe~~

glad i'm not alone in my nakedness.

grouphug
let me come over it's a beautiful day to play with you in the dark
http://elmadartista.tumblr.com/
http://twitter.com/madartista
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Reply #20 posted 08/12/07 10:59pm

morningsong

sillyme said:

morningsong said:

whistling coffee


lol

In depth stuff, sorry... I thought we'd have a nice debate, but ... guess not lols


Me? I'm just a shadow 'round these parts. An interjecting shadow but a shadow nonetheless. No fun in a debate.
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Reply #21 posted 08/12/07 11:22pm

lazycrockett

avatar

I thought the whole ripping of the curtain that hide the ark from the public was the you don't need priest or others to talk to god moment. Though I never understood the "god can't look upon sin, when he did with adam and eve after they ate the fruit. maybe back then god hadn't created the sin part of the contract.
The Most Important Thing In Life Is Sincerity....Once You Can Fake That, You Can Fake Anything.
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Reply #22 posted 08/13/07 12:16am

rodman2

avatar

Origen said:

rodman2 said:



hmmm, could you quote say 100 out of that 6828, this person is talking about?

say use good ole king james bible
I was being mean actually I believe King james only mentions god's name six times. But you get my drift!
added bible remark
Sillyme did not say KJV. He said Hebrew Scripture. The KJV O.T. is an English translation of the Hebrew Scripture. The tetragrammation is still in the Hebrew text. Also the tetragrammaton was never removed from the KJV. The tetragrammation was translated a few times but for the most part rarely translated.

But if you want a list all 6828 times the tetragrammaton appears in the Hebrew text I could supply that list.
[Edited 8/12/07 17:52pm]


The tetragrammaton in the king james version it's replaced with 'Lord' and in the footnote it explains this! I got that, doesn't it seem weird to you that it's there 6828 times but only translated properly a few times?
I mean after all this book was written by Jehovah, King James version says that, it's a book about Jehovah, his name is in it 6828 times and man takes his writings and translates it into Lord, like his name is meaningless? And all you bible readers are okay with that? Is that how you sanctify his Name.

I figure that first-century Christians must have clearly understood texts such as Matthew 22:44, where Jesus quoted the Hebrew Scriptures to his enemies. “The first century church probably read, ‘YHWH said to my Lord’” instead of the later version, “‘The Lord said to my Lord,’ . . . which is as ambiguous as it is imprecise.”—Psalm 110:1.
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Reply #23 posted 08/13/07 2:06am

Mars23

Moderator

avatar

moderator

So what is the motivation to make this change in the bible?

Did every church on the planet conspire to hide the name Jehovah?

If so why?

Who spread the word?

Was everyone so apathetic that when the 1st translation came out without Jehovah in it they just didn't care, even though it was, as you say, a direct violation of God's law?

Maybe Lord was the familiar of Jehovah like when you call Richard "Dick".

Vindictive bible printers?

I'm just asking.
Studies have shown the ass crack of the average Prince fan to be abnormally large. This explains the ease and frequency of their panties bunching up in it.
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Reply #24 posted 08/13/07 3:17am

morningsong

Times when just the tiniest bit of Hebrew history comes in handy.
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Reply #25 posted 08/13/07 4:07am

sillyme

Mars23 said:

So what is the motivation to make this change in the bible?

Jeremiah 23-27 They are thinking of making my people forget my name by means of their dreams that they keep relating each one to the other, just as their fathers forgot my name by means of Ba′al.

Did every church on the planet conspire to hide the name Jehovah?

2 cor 4:4 among whom the god of this system of things (satan) has blinded the minds of the unbelievers, that the illumination of the glorious good news about the Christ, who is the image of God, might not shine through.

If so why?

All worship that doesn't go straight to Jehovah God, fortifies satan's point that men will not be obidient to God commands.

Adam and Eve disobeid...
l

Who spread the word?


The word is spread, but only the Witnesses strive to the accuracy of it, starting with the name of God.

Was everyone so apathetic that when the 1st translation came out without Jehovah in it they just didn't care, even though it was, as you say, a direct violation of God's law?

Not sure, buut then, the clergy were suuuuuper offensive if u challenged anything they did... remember they d burn people for asking questions...

Maybe Lord was the familiar of Jehovah like when you call Richard "Dick".

No. Jah is the only diminutive in poetic form of Jehovah (allelujah, means praise Jehovah) Spellings differ at times but basically the same.

Jerome in english, Hieronym in Polish, Geronimo in Spanish, Jérôme with accent in French... but still me


Vindictive bible printers?

Bible printing is a HUGE business and the Bible witnesses use is free and given away so they d never dare hitting the market because
1) putting jehovah 7000 times would flip out most "christians" (huge loss)
2) People could get it free from us, just like every single piece of litterature we use.


I'm just asking.
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Reply #26 posted 08/13/07 5:54am

Eternaldragon

avatar

Look, sillyme, you are basically trying to take the OT law and apply it to today, which isn't going to work.

God doesn't have this exclusive language thing going. People worship Him in spirit and he will hear us no matter what name or lack of names we use for Him. He will hear a prayer in any language or any name.

As for the priests, yes, lazycrocket is correct. In the OT times the priests had to enter into the holy of holies to speak with God for the people. Only a select few could do it. Jesus did away with that and the OT law, so now we are under grave and not under Judaic law. The temple veil was ripped to show this at the moment Jesus died.

Jesus is now the high priest and you can ONLY reach the father through him. He said nothing of what you are trying to say the scriptures mean. The only way to pray or talk to YHWH, Jehovah God is through Jesus, who was God in the flesh. The high priest and once and for all link between man and God.
pray flag "I am the way, the truth and the life; No man cometh unto the father, but by me." - Jesus of Nazareth (John 14:6)
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Reply #27 posted 08/13/07 7:00am

ficktyt

Eternaldragon said:

Look, sillyme, you are basically trying to take the OT law and apply it to today, which isn't going to work.

God doesn't have this exclusive language thing going. People worship Him in spirit and he will hear us no matter what name or lack of names we use for Him. He will hear a prayer in any language or any name.

As for the priests, yes, lazycrocket is correct. In the OT times the priests had to enter into the holy of holies to speak with God for the people. Only a select few could do it. Jesus did away with that and the OT law, so now we are under grave and not under Judaic law. The temple veil was ripped to show this at the moment Jesus died.

Jesus is now the high priest and you can ONLY reach the father through him. He said nothing of what you are trying to say the scriptures mean. The only way to pray or talk to YHWH, Jehovah God is through Jesus, who was God in the flesh. The high priest and once and for all link between man and God.
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Reply #28 posted 08/13/07 7:08am

ficktyt

It is amazing that you all follow a religion that was started less than 150 years ago by a man of questionable character at best.

It is amazing that you deny what Christianity has believed for over 2000 years.

It is amazing that the people who expressed the relationship between the Father, Son and Holy Spirit as being the Godhead understood and spoke Greek as their first language, they didn't have to interpret anything, and came to the conclusions they came to. (and they were only between 100-400 years after Christ, not 2000.

It is amazing that these same people who explained who Christ was, fully God and fully Man and the Trinity were the same God-inspired men who agreed on the canon of New Testament scripture, in the same councils for that matter. In other words, the Bible you us was determined by the same Church Fathers as being canonical by the same men who expounded that Christ was fully God and fully man and the Trinity. Therefore, if you reject some of their teaching, doesn't that call into question the entire New Testament?

Some thoughts to ponder . . . . .

If you are interested in a correct interpretation of scripture by people who lived the life and spoke the original language, take a look at the likes of Basil the Great, John Chrysostom, Gregory the Theologian, Athanasius and others, not some guy who didn't even speak Greek.

sillyme said:

Christian?
Christian?
Every Christian is supposed to be a "follower of Jesus" right?
But do we realize that Jesus was a "follower" too?

Doing of his Father’s will was uppermost at all times in the mind of Jesus is apparent from his own testimony:

“I cannot do a single thing of my own initiative; just as I hear, I judge, and the judgment that I render is righteous, because I seek not my own will but the will of him that sent me.”

“Because I have come down from heaven to do, not my will, but the will of him that sent me.”

“My food is for me to do the will of him that sent me and to finish his work.”—
John 4:34; 5:30; 6:38, (http://tinyurl.com/33p2bq)


PLEASE TAKE THE TIME TO READ THIS AND BARE WITH ME


If U were to ask anyone instructions on "how to pray", who would U chose?

Graham? Olsteen? John Paul II? or Jesus?

Luke 11:2 (http://tinyurl.com/2784vz)

"one of His disciples said to Him, “Lord, teach us to pray, as John also taught his disciples.” So He said to them, “When you pray, say:

(To whom)Our Father in heaven,[a]
1-Hallowed be Your name.
2-Your kingdom come.
3-Your will be done
On earth as it is in heaven."


That was a direct question with a direct answer by Jesus.

Please keep in mind that Jesus spent his ministry years exclusivly doing ONE thing, his father's will, which was mostly about announcing the Good News of God's Kingdom to come....

Jesus Christ instructed his followers to engage "spreading the Good News". “As you go, preach, saying, ‘The kingdom of the heavens has drawn near.”’ (Matt. 10:7; 4:12-17)

With that in mind, I am CERTAIN that no Christian would dare to assume that Jesus made random statements.

Jesus, in the model prayer put the "keep your name holy, hallow thy name, sanctify your name" the "father's name" ahead of the Kingdom and the Will.

Could it mean that giving Glory and praise to the NAME of the Father matters?


John 17:26 (http://tinyurl.com/28chla)

and (A)I have made Your name known to them, and will make it known, so that (B)the love with which You loved Me may be in them, and I in them."

Jesus is essentialy declaring in his prayer to His father, God, that making God's name known to them (disciples, followers, us) allows God's love with which God loved Jesus to be in them (disciples, followers, us)

The Love with which God loved Jesus, is the love that held the promise of the resurection.

There is nothing to argue, these words are simple and clear.


Malachi 3:16 (http://tinyurl.com/22vwle)

Then those who feared the LORD spoke to one another,
And the LORD listened and heard them;
So a book of remembrance was written before Him
For those who fear the LORD
And who meditate on His name.


Here we have wonderful statement of hope, those who meditate, think on His name will be remembered by Him... The LORD... The trick is that in the ""old testament"", the Hebrew scriptures, LORD, all capitalized is not Jesus...

In the model prayer AND here above AND over 100 times in the old and new testament, the name doesn't have a plural option...

"Hallow by thy nameS" is NOT what Jesus taught.

Would anyone assume that Jesus was approximative in his teachings, especially regarding the prayer!?

The name of God is as U know by now, YHVH, (Jehovah) as Jesus' is Yeshua (http://tinyurl.com/23y6h9)

Exodus 6:3 (New King James Version) http://tinyurl.com/3ac274
King James http://tinyurl.com/3ac274

I appeared to Abraham, to Isaac, and to Jacob, as God Almighty, but by My name LORD[a] I was not known to them.

Footnotes: [a]Exodus 6:3 Hebrew YHWH, traditionally Jehovah

EVERY TIME in UR Bible U read "LORD" in the Hebrew (old testament) it actually REPLACED "YHVH"...

In the Hebrew Scripture, the personal name of GOD, YHVH used to appear 6828 times and was removed and replaced by a title, not a name, LORD. (http://tinyurl.com/2kyg8n)

Now, some may say that the name changed from the old to the new testament, but there is NO scriptural back up to this statement, on the contrary, there are many scriptures to support the contrary:

Romans 10:13 : "For “everyone who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved.”
Paul was quoting Joel 2:32: "And it must occur that everyone who calls on the name of YHVH will get away safe"


Matt 22:37 He said to him: “‘You must love God with your whole heart and with your whole soul and with your whole mind"

Jesus was quoting Moses in Deuteronomy 6:5 "And you must love YHVH your God with all your heart and all your soul and all your vital force."


Matt 4:4 But in reply he said: “It is written, ‘Man must live, not on bread alone, but on every utterance coming forth through the mouth of God.’”

Jesus was quoting Moses in Deut 8:3 :"in order to make you know that not by bread alone does man live but by every expression of YHVH (Jehovah)’s mouth does man live."


Are the religeous leaders (pasters, preachers, priests etc supposed to be Christ Followers that duplicate the pattern that Jesus has set forth?

John 13:15 Jesus: "For I set the pattern for YOU, that, just as I did to YOU, YOU should do also."

Are the religeous leaders of Ur church making "the name known" as Jesus strived to?

John 17:26 (http://tinyurl.com/28chla)

and (A)I have made Your name known to them, and will make it known, so that (B)the love with which You loved Me may be in them, and I in them."

Does it matter if they don't?

Who's reasonning matters to U?

God's view point on it or men's view point on it?

Ask Ur Preacher, pastor, priest what is the "name" that we need to Hallow?

Will he be enthousiatic to reply to U and answer or will he beat around the bush?

Does it matter to God the enthousiasm with which U are given an answer to that simple question?

Read what God, Father of Jesus has to say about that...


Malachi 2:1-2

“And now this commandment is to YOU, O priests. If YOU will not listen, and if YOU will not lay [it] to heart to give glory to my name,” YHVH (Jehovah) of armies has said, “I shall also certainly send upon YOU the curse, and I will curse YOUR blessings. Yes, I have even cursed the [blessing], because YOU are not laying [it] to heart.”

Matthew 12:34

For out of the abundance of the heart the mouth speaks.

Like it or not, if Ur preacher, pastor, priest DOES NOT give GLORY (amplies enthousiasm) to God's Name, Jehovah (YHVH), he is cursed, and that is NOT according to Jerome, but to God, Jehovah.

It says the EXACT same thing in EVERY Bible out there...

SO why in the world do they NOT give Glory to the Name???

Here is Ur answer...http://tinyurl.com/2hoboo

Like it or not.

There is over 100 scriptures that back up how crucial, paramount, pivital, essential, undeniable, indispensable knowing and using God's name, YHVH (Jehovah) is.

That is why we DO NOT TRUST any publication other than ours, because the others hide the true name of God and try to make it forget from the people.

We, for certain work HARD to not let anyone make God's name be forgotten

http://tinyurl.com/yq9d3z

There is only one Truth and it starts in the Bible. If Ur religious """"Christian"""" leader does NOT give glory to God by using his name as ORDERED, COMMANDED, INSTRUCTED by God himself and His Son, they are CURSED, could they then have the Holy Spirit's guidance?

This so simple, it's scary!

Sincerly
JKJ

Once again all scriptural back up can be found in ANY Bible!
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Reply #29 posted 08/13/07 7:15am

JDODSONandFlas
hpointe

sillyme said:

Christian?
Christian?
Every Christian is supposed to be a "follower of Jesus" right?
But do we realize that Jesus was a "follower" too?

Doing of his Father’s will was uppermost at all times in the mind of Jesus is apparent from his own testimony:

“I cannot do a single thing of my own initiative; just as I hear, I judge, and the judgment that I render is righteous, because I seek not my own will but the will of him that sent me.”

“Because I have come down from heaven to do, not my will, but the will of him that sent me.”

“My food is for me to do the will of him that sent me and to finish his work.”—
John 4:34; 5:30; 6:38, (http://tinyurl.com/33p2bq)


PLEASE TAKE THE TIME TO READ THIS AND BARE WITH ME


If U were to ask anyone instructions on "how to pray", who would U chose?

Graham? Olsteen? John Paul II? or Jesus?

Luke 11:2 (http://tinyurl.com/2784vz)

"one of His disciples said to Him, “Lord, teach us to pray, as John also taught his disciples.” So He said to them, “When you pray, say:

(To whom)Our Father in heaven,[a]
1-Hallowed be Your name.
2-Your kingdom come.
3-Your will be done
On earth as it is in heaven."


That was a direct question with a direct answer by Jesus.

Please keep in mind that Jesus spent his ministry years exclusivly doing ONE thing, his father's will, which was mostly about announcing the Good News of God's Kingdom to come....

Jesus Christ instructed his followers to engage "spreading the Good News". “As you go, preach, saying, ‘The kingdom of the heavens has drawn near.”’ (Matt. 10:7; 4:12-17)

With that in mind, I am CERTAIN that no Christian would dare to assume that Jesus made random statements.

Jesus, in the model prayer put the "keep your name holy, hallow thy name, sanctify your name" the "father's name" ahead of the Kingdom and the Will.

Could it mean that giving Glory and praise to the NAME of the Father matters?


John 17:26 (http://tinyurl.com/28chla)

and (A)I have made Your name known to them, and will make it known, so that (B)the love with which You loved Me may be in them, and I in them."

Jesus is essentialy declaring in his prayer to His father, God, that making God's name known to them (disciples, followers, us) allows God's love with which God loved Jesus to be in them (disciples, followers, us)

The Love with which God loved Jesus, is the love that held the promise of the resurection.

There is nothing to argue, these words are simple and clear.


Malachi 3:16 (http://tinyurl.com/22vwle)

Then those who feared the LORD spoke to one another,
And the LORD listened and heard them;
So a book of remembrance was written before Him
For those who fear the LORD
And who meditate on His name.


Here we have wonderful statement of hope, those who meditate, think on His name will be remembered by Him... The LORD... The trick is that in the ""old testament"", the Hebrew scriptures, LORD, all capitalized is not Jesus...

In the model prayer AND here above AND over 100 times in the old and new testament, the name doesn't have a plural option...

"Hallow by thy nameS" is NOT what Jesus taught.

Would anyone assume that Jesus was approximative in his teachings, especially regarding the prayer!?

The name of God is as U know by now, YHVH, (Jehovah) as Jesus' is Yeshua (http://tinyurl.com/23y6h9)

Exodus 6:3 (New King James Version) http://tinyurl.com/3ac274
King James http://tinyurl.com/3ac274

I appeared to Abraham, to Isaac, and to Jacob, as God Almighty, but by My name LORD[a] I was not known to them.

Footnotes: [a]Exodus 6:3 Hebrew YHWH, traditionally Jehovah

EVERY TIME in UR Bible U read "LORD" in the Hebrew (old testament) it actually REPLACED "YHVH"...

In the Hebrew Scripture, the personal name of GOD, YHVH used to appear 6828 times and was removed and replaced by a title, not a name, LORD. (http://tinyurl.com/2kyg8n)

Now, some may say that the name changed from the old to the new testament, but there is NO scriptural back up to this statement, on the contrary, there are many scriptures to support the contrary:

Romans 10:13 : "For “everyone who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved.”
Paul was quoting Joel 2:32: "And it must occur that everyone who calls on the name of YHVH will get away safe"


Matt 22:37 He said to him: “‘You must love God with your whole heart and with your whole soul and with your whole mind"

Jesus was quoting Moses in Deuteronomy 6:5 "And you must love YHVH your God with all your heart and all your soul and all your vital force."


Matt 4:4 But in reply he said: “It is written, ‘Man must live, not on bread alone, but on every utterance coming forth through the mouth of God.’”

Jesus was quoting Moses in Deut 8:3 :"in order to make you know that not by bread alone does man live but by every expression of YHVH (Jehovah)’s mouth does man live."


Are the religeous leaders (pasters, preachers, priests etc supposed to be Christ Followers that duplicate the pattern that Jesus has set forth?

John 13:15 Jesus: "For I set the pattern for YOU, that, just as I did to YOU, YOU should do also."

Are the religeous leaders of Ur church making "the name known" as Jesus strived to?

John 17:26 (http://tinyurl.com/28chla)

and (A)I have made Your name known to them, and will make it known, so that (B)the love with which You loved Me may be in them, and I in them."

Does it matter if they don't?

Who's reasonning matters to U?

God's view point on it or men's view point on it?

Ask Ur Preacher, pastor, priest what is the "name" that we need to Hallow?

Will he be enthousiatic to reply to U and answer or will he beat around the bush?

Does it matter to God the enthousiasm with which U are given an answer to that simple question?

Read what God, Father of Jesus has to say about that...


Malachi 2:1-2

“And now this commandment is to YOU, O priests. If YOU will not listen, and if YOU will not lay [it] to heart to give glory to my name,” YHVH (Jehovah) of armies has said, “I shall also certainly send upon YOU the curse, and I will curse YOUR blessings. Yes, I have even cursed the [blessing], because YOU are not laying [it] to heart.”

Matthew 12:34

For out of the abundance of the heart the mouth speaks.

Like it or not, if Ur preacher, pastor, priest DOES NOT give GLORY (amplies enthousiasm) to God's Name, Jehovah (YHVH), he is cursed, and that is NOT according to Jerome, but to God, Jehovah.

It says the EXACT same thing in EVERY Bible out there...

SO why in the world do they NOT give Glory to the Name???

Here is Ur answer...http://tinyurl.com/2hoboo

Like it or not.

There is over 100 scriptures that back up how crucial, paramount, pivital, essential, undeniable, indispensable knowing and using God's name, YHVH (Jehovah) is.

That is why we DO NOT TRUST any publication other than ours, because the others hide the true name of God and try to make it forget from the people.

We, for certain work HARD to not let anyone make God's name be forgotten

http://tinyurl.com/yq9d3z

There is only one Truth and it starts in the Bible. If Ur religious """"Christian"""" leader does NOT give glory to God by using his name as ORDERED, COMMANDED, INSTRUCTED by God himself and His Son, they are CURSED, could they then have the Holy Spirit's guidance?

This so simple, it's scary!

Sincerly
JKJ

Once again all scriptural back up can be found in ANY Bible!


From the abundance of the heart the mouth speaks- Love is whatever you want it to be!
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