liberation said:

No, the ones you take care of don't need to be able to...

conch5184 said:

I caused?..i was under them impression that cats get each other pregnant. If you mean not having my males neutered i yes, i guess so.

I don't interfere with my animals like that, it's not my place as they are just doing what they should be doing naturally.

It's human beings that dictate what is right and wrong, for the animals it's perfectly natural.

liberation said:

I'm going to leave it at that for now at least.

conch5184 said:

True..and they fend for themselves, animals are resourceful creatures.

I always have my pets fixed, but I think it's up to the owner. my

conch5184 said:

Can the cats tell the vet they have no desires?...this has just been assumed by humans with no real factual or scientific evidence.

Neutering is done to control popluation, which is a human idea...not animals.

Sweeny79 said:

Co-yep

conch5184 said:

It's definitely up to the owner. I personally agree with not fixing pets, but that's just me.

liberation said:

Then I guess that they're not really your animals but rather these stray male cats who you feed but don't really own. Do you take them to the vet for checkups and vaccines?

jessyMD32781 said:

They've never been sick, but if they were then yes i would take them. None of them have been in any accidents either. Sure they come home with a bloody ear from fighting or a little gash...but nothing really serious.

These ain't prize pussies that you take to the vet for shots, there your average cats you see in towns and cities. They are self sufficient and do their own thing, they are mine in the sense i feed them and rub them.

But no they ain't house pets or something i went to a pet store and bought, not a breed or anything...just your average Joe

But these still my babies.

From the Cats Protection League website:

"Neutering
Cats Protection supports the neutering of all cats not required for breeding in order to reduce the number of strays.

One female cat can, in five years, be responsible for some 20,000 descendants and many of these must inevitably become homeless, with a life that offers only misery, hunger and disease.

Both male and female cats can be neutered at six months or older (please be guided by your vet on the right time to do this). In the case of the male, a simple routine operation only is involved. The female requires a longer operation, which although routine, usually requires a return to the veterinary surgery after seven to ten days for the removal of stitches.

Neutering produces a much more satisfactory and enjoyable pet. A neutered male should refrain from spraying about the house and leaving an unpleasant smell; he should also be disinclined to wander or to fight. It is not correct that a female cat should be allowed, on humane grounds, to have one litter before neutering."

Raspberry said:

Which is all cool except we've no right to impose human standards to animals. We're only imposing what we think is correct for them.

liberation said:

To be honest, I accept your argument when it comes to other practices, such as hunting. I'm against bloodsports and culling because I think we interfere far too much with nature, imposing our rules far too often ... humans tend to be rather arrogant when it comes to destroying habitats and wildlife, believing that we have a right to do so just because we're human.

However, when it comes to neutering domesticated animals I am very much in favour. I recently did some work for the local council, working alongside the dog warden. Whenever pets are found on the streets, or reported to the warden in our area, they are taken to a kennel or cattery and then put down within seven days if not claimed. It broke my heart to hear the warden coming back with stories about finding a beautiful, friendly animal knowing it would be put down within days. I'm afraid I had to stop working there because of it.

I support some animal charities but unfortunately there is only so much I can give each month. The truth is, I could probably be giving less (or my money could go further) if those people who had pets didn't breed them and had them neutered. There are so many unwanted pets in this world, why create more?

Raspberry said:

They are creating them, not me...i ain't their daddy tryna give him tips on sex and birth control.

I accept in principle what you and others have said, but my cats are just fine as they are, no need to inflict surgery on them for doing what they are supposed to do.

liberation said:

A cat should definitely be taken to the vet if they have been in a fight because there are serious diseases, such as FIV and rabies, that cats can catch from fighting and from having sex. ALL cats and dogs should AT LEAST get rabies vaccines every one to three years. if you consider these cats "your babies" you really need to take some kind of responsibility for their welfare or else stop calling them "your babies". You're really just some random person who feeds strays.
[This message was edited Tue Oct 28 18:35:07 PST 2003 by jessyMD32781]

From allwords.com

domesticate
verb domesticated, domesticating

1. To train (an animal) for life in the company of people.

Thesaurus: tame, train, break, housetrain, domesticize.



.

liberation said:

I didn't bash you at all...in fact, I didn't even mention you...I was suggesting to Conch that she go get some information for her friend to educate him.

Kill your friend.

In seven years, one female cat and her offspring can theoretically produce 420,000 cats


And that's a fact, I didn't just make that up. So I
would tell my friend those numbers and ask m how in
the hell they're gonna feed all them kittens



But seriously, it's a big problem with all those cats
running around in the wild. People say "it's nature",
but well, let's be honest, it isn't.

It's just another problem created by people.

Some more statistics:

Number of cats and dogs entering shelters each year: 8–10 million (HSUS estimate)
Number of cats and dogs euthanized by shelters each year: 4–5 million (HSUS estimate)

Number of cats and dogs adopted from shelters each year: 3–5 million (HSUS estimate)

Number of cats and dogs reclaimed by owners from shelters each year: Between 600,000 and 750,000—15–30% of dogs and 2–5% of cats entering shelters (HSUS estimate)

Number of animal shelters in the United States: Between 4,000 and 6,000 (HSUS estimate)

Percentage of dogs in shelters who are purebred: 25% (HSUS estimate)

Average number of litters a fertile cat can produce in one year: 3

Average number of kittens in a feline litter: 4–6

In seven years, one female cat and her offspring can theoretically produce 420,000 cats.

This is so off topic, but do abortions for cats & dogs exist? The reason I ask is because my friend said that her mom had their female dog fixed when she was pregnant with puppies.

Natsume said:

I would assume so, I don't see why not

Natsume said:

I don't think so. Probably either the puppies were taken out during the procedure (to be euthanized or taken to a shelter) or they stayed in and starved to death when her body stopped providing for them.

Natsume said:

im going to have you neutered

Depends how far along she was.

Abortion does exist, at least for dogs, but it's risky because the dog might develop illnesses due to the abortion. I do not believe that it would be possible to spay a dog while being with puppies, no.
Yes u should spay and neuter your cat if it's an outdoors cat, IMO.