Teacher said:

So, Europe is the magical continent where people and animals don't get cancer as often? I find that hard to believe.
And, why even take the chance of the animal getting cancer. I have never heard of an animal suffering from being spayed or neutered. I know HUMANS who have no uteruses or ovaries and they are doing just fine...better in fact. Also there have been many men throughout history who have been castrated for one reason or another and some of them were the greatest of lovers.
If an animal, human or otherwise, gets cancer it is much more horrible than being 'fixed'.

Some real information on the subject:

http://www.doghause.com/neuter.html

Spay and neuter your pet! In addition to saving lives, spaying and neutering can also drastically improve your pet's health and life expectancy. The idea that pets become fat or lazy when they are spayed or neutered is a myth. Sterilized pets lead healthier, longer lives. Spaying a female eliminates the possibility of uterine and ovarian cancer and greatly reduces the risk of breast cancer. Neutering a male reduces the risk of both prostate enlargement and prostate cancer. Neutering also will make your pet more affectionate and less likely to roam, get in fights, or become lost.


Spay/Neuter General Information

Spaying (ovario-hysterectomy) is the surgical removal of the reproductive organs (ovaries, uterus, fallopian tubes) of the female animal. Neutering (orchectomy or castration) is the surgical removal of the reproductive glands (testes) of the male animal. The outer is left, only the testes are removed. Appearance depends upon the dog's age at the time of the surgery. Females and males should be spayed or neutered by 6 months of age. Currently some clinics are performing surgeries on animals as young as 8 weeks of age. As this procedure becomes more common, perhaps it will be available in all areas. Older animals can be done as long as they are in good health. All sterilization surgery is performed under general anesthesia by a licensed veterinarian.

Female dogs and cats can be spayed when in heat or pregnant. This can usually be done up until a few days before delivery. These surgeries can take longer, and can therefore cost more. Spaying before having a first litter or heat cycle is usually a simpler procedure. The heat cycle for dogs is once or twice a year starting as early as 6 months of age. Duration is 3 weeks. Heat cycles in cats start as early as 6 months and occur every 3-4 weeks during spring through early fall. The gestation period for both dogs and cats is 63 days. Female cats can become pregnant again as soon as 10 days after giving birth (while still nursing the first litter).


Health Benefits of Spaying and Neutering

Spayed animals no longer feel the need to roam to look for a mate. The result is that they stay home and have less chance of being involved in traumatic accidents such as being hit by a car. They also have a much lower incidence of contracting contagious diseases, and get into fewer fights.

In males, neutering decreases the chances of developing prostatic disease and hernias, and eliminates the chances of developing testicular cancer. It also reduces problems with territorial and sexual aggression, inappropriate urination (spraying) and other undesirable male behaviors.

In Females, spaying decreases the incidence of breast cancer (the rate goes down to almost zero if the spaying is done before the first heat cycle!). It eliminates the chance of developing a serious and potentially fatal infection of the uterus experienced by many mature unspayed animals (pyometra). Spay surgery also eliminates the heat cycle and associated mood swings and undesirable behaviors, messy spotting (in dogs) and the attraction of all available males to your yard.

The simple fact is that spaying and neutering greatly increases the lifespan of your pet and increases quality of life as well!

Most text from Valley Oak SPCA (Society for the Prevention of Cruelty to Animals).


Five Good Reasons Why You Should Spay or Neuter Your Pet

1) Spaying or neutering increases your pet's chances for a longer, healthier life.


Spaying your pet before her first estrous cycle (that is, before she reaches sexual maturity) greatly reduces her chances of developing breast cancer and completely eliminates the threat of uterine and ovarian cancer and uterine infection, which are common occurrences in unaltered females.

Neutering your male dog or cat prevents testicular tumors and may prevent prostate problems. Neutering also decreases the possibility of perianal tumors and hernias, which are commonly observed in older, unaltered dogs. Because neutered cats are less likely to roam, the threat of abscesses caused by bites and diseases transmitted by fighting are greatly reduced.
2) An altered dog or cat is a better pet for your family.


Males neutered early in life are less aggressive toward other males and are not distracted by females in heat. Therefore, a neutered male will be less tempted to leave your property and cross that dangerous highway searching for a mate. Neutered males also are less likely to mark every one of your (or your neighbor's) expensive shrubs with his urine as well as inside the house.

Spaying your female pet eliminates the problem of stray males camping in your yard and decreases her desire to roam and breed.
3) No family wants to cope with an unwanted pregnancy.

Spaying prevents your pet from giving birth to unwanted puppies or kittens.

4) Spaying results in a cleaner female dog and home.

Because female dogs pass bloody fluid for about ten days, twice a year, as a part of their estrous cycle, constant care must be taken to avoid carpet stains in homes with such animals. Spaying your dog eliminates this problem.

5) You are helping to alleviate the dog and cat overpopulation problem.

Each year, millions of unwanted dogs and cats are euthanized (killed) at shelters across the country. Although pet behavioral problems are the main reasons animals are given to shelters, many orphans are the result of accidental breeding by free-roaming, unaltered pets. The more pets spayed or neutered, the fewer dogs and cats will have to be destroyed. Delaware Humane Association does not euthanized; however, hundreds of dogs and cats are turned away each year because there is simply not enough room at the shelter to accommodate them.

Above information adapted from "Should You Spay/Neuter Your Pet?" by Alpo Pet foods.

Six Common Excuses for Not Spaying or Neutering Pets

1) My pet will get fat and lazy.

Neutering or spaying may diminish your pet's overall activity level, natural tendency to wander, and hormonal balances, which may influence appetite. Pets that become fat and lazy after being altered usually are overfed and do not get enough exercise.

2) We want another pet just like Rover and Fluffy.

Breeding two purebred animals rarely results in offspring that are exactly like one of the parents. With mixed breeds, it is virtually impossible to have offspring that are exactly like one of the parents.

3) My pet's personality will change.

Any change will be for the better. After being altered, your pet will be less aggressive toward other dogs or cats, have a better personality, and will be less likely to wander. Spraying (urine marking), which is often done by dogs and cats to mark their territory, diminishes or ceases after pets are altered.

4) We can sell puppies or kittens and make money.

Even well-known breeders are fortunate if they break even on raising purebred litters. The cost of raising such a litter -- which includes stud fees, vaccinations and other health care costs, and feeding a quality food -- consumes most of the "profit." Well-known breeders raise breeds that they like. These breeders also try to improve the standard of the breeds they raise.

5) My children should witness our pet giving birth.

Pets often have their litters in the middle of the night or in a place of their own choosing. Because pets need privacy when giving birth, any unnecessary intrusion can cause the mother to become seriously upset. These intrusions can result in an unwillingness to care for the offspring or in injury to the owners or to the pet.

6) I am concerned about my pet undergoing anesthesia.

Placing a pet under anesthesia is a very common concern of owners. Although there is always a slight risk involved, the anesthetics currently used by veterinarians are very safe. Many veterinarians use equipment that monitors heart and respiratory rates during surgery to ensure that their patients are doing well under anesthesia. Thus, the medical benefits of having your pet spayed or neutered far outweigh the slight risk involved with undergoing anesthesia. Consult your veterinarian if your are concerned about this aspect of the procedure.

Above information adapted from "Should You Spay/Neuter Your Pet?" by Alpo Pet foods

Spay and Neuter Your Pets!
Good for You, Your Pet, and the Community

Prevent A Litter - It's Good for You


Spayed and neutered pets are better, more affectionate, companions.
Neutered cats are less likely to spray and mark territory.
Spaying a female dog or cat eliminates its heat cycle, which can last twenty-one days, twice a year, in dogs, and anywhere from three to fifteen days, three or more times a year, in cats. Females in heat often cry incessantly, show nervous behavior, and attract unwanted male animals.
Spayed and neutered pets are less likely to bite. Unaltered animals often exhibit more behavior and temperament problems than those that have been spayed or neutered.
Prevent a Litter - It's Good for Your Pet


Spayed and neutered dogs and cats live longer, healthier lives.
Spaying female dogs and cats eliminates the possibility of uterine or ovarian cancer and greatly reduces the incidence of breast cancer.
Neutering male dogs and cats reduces the incidence of prostate cancer.
Neutered animals are less likely to roam and fight.
Prevent A Litter - It's Good for the Community


Communities spend millions of dollars to control and eliminate unwanted animals. Irresponsible breeding contributes to the problem of dog bites and attacks. Animal shelters are overburdened with surplus animals.
Above information obtained from The Humane Society of the United States (HSUS.)

jessyMD32781 said:

Again, thank you for a voice of reason. I feel sorry for the pets of anyone who isn't responsible enough to see the realities involved with caring for a pet for a lifetime. In the long run it's the animals that suffer. It's better just to prevent that from happening all together.

psychodelicide said:

Awww... thanks. Here's my kitty Jinx (she just woke up in this pic .) She was spayed at the age of six months and she's just fine. A very sweet and loving cat. I adore her.

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apple... thanks for posting some great information, and the pic of your gorgeous cat!!

Human females come in heat once a month, for about 3 days to a week. If u don't intend to have a baby, do the responsible thing and get yourself spayed!!! Do u know the number of teenage or unwanted pregnancies and births??? Or, if u are a man, get yourself neutered, there are chemical processes quite painless u know, and it's so much better for everybody, reduces the risk of unwanted parenthood that u cannot take responsibility for.

Women, do u know that breast cancer is at an all time high? Remove your breasts and uterus today, eliminates the risk of cancer in those body parts... live a healthier and longer life, all u need to do is get rid of your womanhood. Do it, today!
[This message was edited Sun Jun 29 2:51:04 PDT 2003 by Teacher]

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Awww, she's beautiful!

Teacher said:

This does not make any logical sense and does not apply to what we're talking about. Animal physiology is different from human physiology. Humans can also use birth control while animals cannot and there are more ways for humans to be proactive about their health that just aren't available to animals. Also, sexuality, as it is expressed in humans is not the same for animals. Female cats don't enjoy sex the way that human females do. In fact, the penis of a male cat is barbed so that the female can't run away. If you've ever heard cat's having sex, you can attest to how painful it sounds for the female. The same goes for dogs. They're not as into sex as humans are, they do it because they're driven to it and they won't do it unless a female is in heat. Humans have sex for pleasure, not only during fertile times making humans different from most other animals. If you don't want to spayt and neuter your pet then fine, don't do it. You're going to be the one who has to deal with your pet's suffering and know that you are responsible for it.

Teacher said:

sorry this important discussion has come down to this.

Teacher said:

There is nothing "natural" about domesticated animals, and plenty of evidence shows that they are healthier if they are spayed/neutered before reaching sexual maturity. This is just fact, and any other position is anthropomorphic bullshit.

(I say this as an animal-rights-activist-veterinary-technician, btw.)

jessyMD32781 said:

Animals can't? So there isn't pills for females and chemical castration for male animals? Weird, could've sworn...

This thread has become too long for me to read, so I'll just say...



































KILL THE DOG!!!

tackam said:

I disagree, neutering in dogs is not a matter of course where I live, and we have plenty of dogs making it over 10, up to 15 and still being healthy. My old dog got to be 12½, had to put him down last December.

Keeping animals is different in different parts of the world, the further north u get in Europe the harder the rules and laws and the greater the responsibility taken it seems. I state what works where I am, and I believe that type of animal keeping to be the soundest.

I still say kill the dog. kill all dogs. No, even better, kill all humans

I'll make y'all a deal. I need one, just one of u, to put a guarantee up that my dog will be the exact same, meaning have all her drives and stability intact for the competition field. Monetary compensation if she's not, as well as a full trained equivalent dog. If one of u is willing to do that, I'll have my dog spayed. Otherwise I won't. Deal?

Btw, those drives I'm talking about, are for example.
* Defensive drive
* Aggressive drive
* Hunting drive

The dog is a Malinois. FYI, I train IPO, which is a variety of shützhund. Tracking, obedience and protection/bitework, the obedience is done in the presence of other dogs so no aggressiveness towards them is tolerated. Therefore I also need u to guarantee that u are able to provide a dog of equivalent pedigree and training.

Any takers?

Tackam, since u work at a vet hospital or practice, u have the stats; Give us the success rate in removing uterian and mammarian cancer if discovered at an early stage. Thank u.

MissCute said:

Damn right Cute!!!

Teacher said:

no. there aren't birth control pills for female animals. only human females have birth control pills. Perhaps for large animals there's chemical castration but not for small animals such as cats and dogs. If you mate your intact animal they will be fine, if you don't they won't be. If you choose not to neuter or spay your pet, then breed them. Is that simple enough for you?

It's been said a zillion times but FIX YOUR PETS!!

Oh and P.S. A lot of the bullshit being flung around on this thread makes me absolutely sick.

jessyMD32781 said:

Wrong. There are pills for female cats, a lot of people use them here. There is chemical castration for male dogs here as well, a lot of people use that too.

Teacher said:

As I said before, my brother-in-law and sister have two English Setters...they are show-quality and are wonderful bird dogs. They have gone to bird camp and are very well behaved. Also, they were neutered as puppies.
If you would have done the responsible thing and had your dog spayed when she was a puppy you wouldn't have to even think about the 'problems' you've been whining about.
Also, why even put the dog through cancer in the first place, whether or not it can be 'removed at an early stage'...jeez!

This is for Jessy. Simple enough for u?

http://www.cbsnews.com/st...4676.shtml

http://www.petplanet.co.u...nation.htm

http://serendip.brynmawr....amlin.html

http://www.isabellevets.c...rolcat.htm

Teacher said:

What about the side-effects of the medications?

Natsume said:

It would be better if owners actually looked after their pets and not let them roam about, or abandon their pets, when they get bored of them...

Natsume said:

I'm glad I'm not the only one!

There are side-effects to any medication Apples, I'm sure u know that. I don't know of any bad side-effects to the birth control pill for cats though, despite my research and talking to friends who are veterinarian professors and researchers.

Any takers on my bet yet? Didn't think so.

Teacher said:

Male cats

In the male cat puberty is normally reached by the age of six months. There is no "male pill" in the cat and so the only options are neutering (castration) or leaving him entire. Entire males tend to develop antisocial habits such as fighting, vagrancy, failure to groom and an unpleasant odour. For this reason most owners elect for neutering and usually have this performed at six months of age, although this can also be done at any later date.

Female cats

Female cats usually become sexually mature and active at some stage after six months of age. Cats are sexually promiscuous and will seek out and mate with tom cats, with a high breeding success rate. Gestation period for cats is 57 - 63 days and they can get pregnant within 6 weeks of giving birth. Some queens will have 2 - 3 litters per year with an average of 6 kittens at a time. Before allowing your female cat to breed, one should take into account the risks of pregnancy and of sexually transmitted diseases such as Feline Immunodefficiency Virus and Feline Leukaemia Virus. We would advise that you discuss these points at an appointment with your veterinary surgeon prior to allowing your cat to get pregnant.



Contraception

There are two forms of medical contraception in cats; tablets and injections. Both are prescription medicines and their use should be discussed with your veterinary surgeon at a consultation which should be undertaken before six months of age. No cat contraceptive is 100% effective and should be seen as a short term action, not a long term solution.'

Do you even read these links before you post them?

Teacher said:

Did you read my post about the bird dogs?
The fact is that if you would have gotten your dog fixed as a puppy, the problems that you are talking about wouldn't even exist.
No one is 'taking your bet' because it's a losing one that you've set up yourself.
Your poor dog.

Of course I read them. No medical contraceptive for humans is 100% effectice either. Did u know that?

Teacher said:

Not alot of people here know that Teacher...or know much as we witnessed
[This message was edited Mon Jun 30 7:56:14 PDT 2003 by REDFEATHERS]