IceNine said:

Millions of thieves. A nation of theives. Something's not right with this picture when normal everyday people are doing this...the world has changed, and the music industry simply has to come up with a better offer...or die.

teller said:

The thing is that most people don't realize that it is a crime or they don't feel like it should be a crime, therefore more people are doing it. Would these same people shoplift from a store? No, probably not. It just doesn't feel like theft to many people since there is no physical product... the same issues are affecting the computer software industry as well.

IceNine said:

True. I think most people don't realise he seriousness of it either. Most people think it's no big deal as nothing has phiscally been taken from anyone. People should be made aware that unless the companies are funded they are going to start producing shit (probably).

CAMILLE4U said:

Actually, they've already started!

CAMILLE4U said:

Actually, they've already started!

I've just worked it out. That's why we get shit on the telly like S-club-jns. Children are cheap to employ and they get to sell tons of records. That's how they make up for the money they lose.

Imagine all the great bands out there, playing in garages or makeing their music in their bedrooms that we havn't heard of because of piracy.

CAMILLE4U said:

Oh...and the music industry was so great before Napster existed?

jthad1129 said:

Me too, open your store and I'll also buy a hugh quantity of blank CD-R off U.

IceNine said:

So you would advocate suing everyone in the 1980's who shared music on cassette with friends?

teller said:

The music industry sucks, but that is not the issue at hand. The issue is that people are stealing material at an alarming rate... you could compare this to the Boston Tea Party if you wanted to make it into an ideological rebellion against tyranny in the corporate music world... but that isn't really the issue. The issue is that many people believe that it is okay to steal music.

teller said:

That is a good point. Say they do wipe out the scourge across the land that download music. What is to stop the masses from simply burning CDs and trading them either way? Or file trading without utilizing the big outfits out there?

CAMILLE4U said:

Hey Camille, the new slogan for the NFO is:

"You wont get sued for downloading this!"

CAMILLE4U said:

Oh...and the music industry was so great before Napster existed?

teller said:

The music industry sucks, but that is not the issue at hand. The issue is that people are stealing material at an alarming rate... you could compare this to the Boston Tea Party if you wanted to make it into an ideological rebellion against tyranny in the corporate music world... but that isn't really the issue. The issue is that many people believe that it is okay to steal music.

Muse2noPharaoh said:

Tis a force of nature...or a force of history...there is no stopping the change. They must adapt or die. Telling millions that they are immoral or criminal isn't the way...

Stealing is a force of nature and a force of history... many laws have been created to punish people for theft.

Muse2noPharaoh said:

Tis a force of nature...or a force of history...there is no stopping the change. They must adapt or die. Telling millions that they are immoral or criminal isn't the way...

IceNine said:

Punishing an entire nation?!

No...as Captain Kirk once said about the Klingons, I say about the RIAA..."let them die."

teller said:

It just isn't a solution. I would doubt the numbers of people that get the music without paying would hardly shift. So I am inclined to agree with you. As well, last time I checked the official "losses" recorded by RIAA were very minuscule. Hardly over whelming numbers.

...it's because the music industry wont sign them. They don't care about art, they just care about money. Just like the fast food industry doesn't care about your health, they just want to make a fast buck.

If an entire nation of people started stealing, they should be punished. As much as I dislike the music industry, I dislike people trying to dismiss copyright law and act like theft is acceptable.

The number of people perpetrating the crime should not factor into the equation... If 10,000 people started looting the shops on Fifth Avenue, should all of them be punished for stealing? Yes.

Muse2noPharaoh said:

So... stealing small items at your local store is cool too, because the losses are not overwhelming???

:LOL:

jthad1129 said:

Me too, open your store and I'll also buy a hugh quantity of blank CD-R off U.

teller said:

If an entire nation of people started stealing, they should be punished. As much as I dislike the music industry, I dislike people trying to dismiss copyright law and act like theft is acceptable.

The number of people perpetrating the crime should not factor into the equation... If 10,000 people started looting the shops on Fifth Avenue, should all of them be punished for stealing? Yes.

A truer statement on this topic hasn't been said. But i wanted to point out a huge misconception on the topic. Yes the cost of MAKING cd's has gone down. The cost of PRODUCING ALBUMS HASN'T. Studio costs, advertising costs, video budgets, placement at radio, all have GONE UP. And all those things factor into the cost of a cd. When you go into a Best Buy and all the cd's are between $9.99 - $13.99, they do that at a lost. They regularly sell cd's BELOW what they pay for them. They can afford to do this becuase the markup on everything else they sell is so high. And the goal is to drive the mom and pop music stores out of business. And when they've done that and there's no competition, the prices WILL GO UP.

Just thought you might like to know.

IceNine said:

A truer statement on this topic hasn't been said. But i wanted to point out a huge misconception on the topic. Yes the cost of MAKING cd's has gone down. The cost of PRODUCING ALBUMS HASN'T. Studio costs, advertising costs, video budgets, placement at radio, all have GONE UP. And all those things factor into the cost of a cd. When you go into a Best Buy and all the cd's are between $9.99 - $13.99, they do that at a loss. They regularly sell cd's BELOW what they pay for them. They can afford to do this becuase the markup on everything else they sell is so high. And the goal is to drive the mom and pop music stores out of business. And when they've done that and there's no competition, the prices WILL GO UP.

Just thought you might like to know.
[This message was edited Thu Jun 26 7:52:44 PDT 2003 by ButterscotchPimp]

Copyright law never anticipated the Internet.

VinaBlue said:

Quote of the day award (and it's only 3:30pm)

CAMILLE4U said:

Ah, thank you. It's only 8:30am here.

Should I put that in my sigy?