uPtoWnNY said:

OldFriends4Sale said:

It was darker, I love mystery. And every planet visited was full of mystery in the visuals and actuals.
It was more dangerous. Darth Vader was deadly in this one, more deadly I should say. Cloud City made me want to explore it, and was very intriguing. the tension in this movie was high. lots of shadhow and it did feel like the Empire stuck back. The back stories and side stories as a result were very good. (but ANH and ROTJ) gave good back stories as a result.
.
I didn't like ROTJ less, I just liked them for different reasons. I loved seeing Luke rise as a Jedi, the intesity of the space battle was intense. It was a brighter movie, even in Jabba's palace(great back stories too) Great back story of the Emperors Hand Mara Jade(force user) infiltrated Jabba's court to kill Luke Skywalker. I actually liked the Ewoks lol, They were actually savage warriors, people took them for cute. I saw some of the deleted scenes for both. And there was good stuff.

Return of the Care Bears is when Star Wars officially 'jumped the shark'. Teddy bears taking down military-trained stormtroopers? Yeah, right. Should've used Wookies instead, but the technology at the time probably prevented it.

LOL

Well the planet was 'force full' the Force was on the side of the Rebels. And remember, even though not shown alot there was a troup of (non Ewok) soldiers working with them. The Ewoks had blasters too stolen from troopers.

It would have been cool to see more Wookies there too though. They were a part of the rebel alliance too.

ROTJ should have taken place on the Wookies home planet Kashyyyk, which is a forest world like Endor.

uPtoWnNY said:

ROTJ should have taken place on the Wookies home planet Kashyyyk, which is a forest world like Endor.

That would have been hot. But Kashyyyk would have been too known to the rest of the galaxy.

uPtoWnNY said:

Return of the Care Bears is when Star Wars officially 'jumped the shark'. Teddy bears taking down military-trained stormtroopers? Yeah, right. Should've used Wookies instead, but the technology at the time probably prevented it.

How about teddy bears that multiply when they get wet, and turn into nasty savage fighters and killers when they are fed after dark?

They could name them after this car:

The Ewoks did kick some ass...

EmmaMcG said:

Just a quick question for longtime Star Wars fans. When you first saw Return of the Jedi, were you disappointed when Darth Vader took off his mask? The reason I ask, is because I was bitterly disappointed and I kind of knew what to expect because I'd seen the prequels first. So I had a vague idea. But for those of you old enough to have seen it upon release, were you expecting him to look, I don't know, "cooler"? He had the voice of James Earl Jones. He wore a cape. He was physically imposing in that outfit. He was the coolest guy in the Galaxy. Even more than Lando. But then he took off the mask and looked like a little egg.

OldFriends4Sale said:

EmmaMcG said:

OldFriends4Sale said:

The cap 😂. The only thing that could make that picture look better would be if he has a cigarette hanging out of his mouth.

He should have put a loosey or a toothpick in one of the mask holes.

I've seen pretty much Alll the Star Wars movies, and the plot was such HORSESHIT that I couldn't right now tell you even 1 iota of the story. All I saw were things blowing up and the screen flashing and the shots cutting so quickly that I had No Idea what was going on. Till now I have no clue which ones the Jedi are and which ones the Sith are.

domainator2010 said:

domainator2010 said:

I've seen pretty much Alll the Star Wars movies, and the plot was such HORSESHIT that I couldn't right now tell you even 1 iota of the story. All I saw were things blowing up and the screen flashing and the shots cutting so quickly that I had No Idea what was going on. Till now I have no clue which ones the Jedi are and which ones the Sith are.

I hafta ask since you disliked the plot so much, why did you continue on and watch all nine (at least) movies? I certainly wouldn't have watched more than two.

As for the plot itself, it seemed straightforward to me ... good vs evil.

Ross Douthat has a book that says these movies prove America is going to hell.

Wow! Disney really doesn't get Star Wars at all. They just released a promo video to hype their upcoming new direction for Star Wars, The High Republic. Set a couple hundred years before Phantom Menace, this new era is set to let them do whatever they want with the franchise without contradicting (ruining) the movies and stories we fell in love with before Mickey got his gloved hands on it.

https://www.youtube.com/w...Cat5fXRyyU

This looks really bad, especially when you see the whiteboard in the writers room that was briefly shown in the trailer.

Surprise! They rank "diversity" and "feelings" above "relatable characters". Not only that, "diversity" is so important, they list it again "representation / diversity". What else are they planning? "Not pro-war"... can't have war in Star WARS. They want to make sure to include "space", "lightsaber battles", "droids", "The Force" and... "dinosaurs"? What the actual fuck?

I don't see anything about good stories. Not even GOOD characters, just "relatable characters" and "no single MAIN character". Yeah.... NO!

This looks really bad. At least we have The Mandalorian.

Pokeno4Money said:

domainator2010 said:

I've seen pretty much Alll the Star Wars movies, and the plot was such HORSESHIT that I couldn't right now tell you even 1 iota of the story. All I saw were things blowing up and the screen flashing and the shots cutting so quickly that I had No Idea what was going on. Till now I have no clue which ones the Jedi are and which ones the Sith are.

I hafta ask since you disliked the plot so much, why did you continue on and watch all nine (at least) movies? I certainly wouldn't have watched more than two.

As for the plot itself, it seemed straightforward to me ... good vs evil.

Both sides were too extreme....two sides of the same coin.

After Anakin's downfall, even Yoda started to question if taking Force-sensitive children from their parents was a good idea. Maybe Anakin could have been saved if the Jedi had helped his mother.

As stated by Roan Shryne in 'Dark Lord-the Rise of Darth Vader', the Jedi order had become wealthy, privileged & entitled - like royalty. They turned a blind eye to the trap Palpatine set for them - they never saw it coming. They refused to accept their entitlement could come to crashing end. The Jedi were played.

It seems the only way to truly understand the Force is to find the balance between the dark and the light.

djThunderfunk said:

Wow! Disney really doesn't get Star Wars at all. They just released a promo video to hype their upcoming new direction for Star Wars, The High Republic. Set a couple hundred years before Phantom Menace, this new era is set to let them do whatever they want with the franchise without contradicting (ruining) the movies and stories we fell in love with before Mickey got his gloved hands on it.

https://www.youtube.com/w...Cat5fXRyyU

This looks really bad, especially when you see the whiteboard in the writers room that was briefly shown in the trailer.

Surprise! They rank "diversity" and "feelings" above "relatable characters". Not only that, "diversity" is so important, they list it again "representation / diversity". What else are they planning? "Not pro-war"... can't have war in Star WARS. They want to make sure to include "space", "lightsaber battles", "droids", "The Force" and... "dinosaurs"? What the actual fuck?

I don't see anything about good stories. Not even GOOD characters, just "relatable characters" and "no single MAIN character". Yeah.... NO!

This looks really bad. At least we have The Mandalorian.

After TLJ, I was done with Star Wars, and I'm never going back. I knew Disney would fuck it up and the above proves it.

Pokeno4Money said:

domainator2010 said:

I've seen pretty much Alll the Star Wars movies, and the plot was such HORSESHIT that I couldn't right now tell you even 1 iota of the story. All I saw were things blowing up and the screen flashing and the shots cutting so quickly that I had No Idea what was going on. Till now I have no clue which ones the Jedi are and which ones the Sith are.

I hafta ask since you disliked the plot so much, why did you continue on and watch all nine (at least) movies? I certainly wouldn't have watched more than two.

Oh, the VFX, mate, VFX! Industry-leading, standard-setting, and what-have-you. DEFinitely a treat for the eyes, though leaving out the brain.

djThunderfunk said:

EmmaMcG said:

djThunderfunk said:

Wow! Disney really doesn't get Star Wars at all. They just released a promo video to hype their upcoming new direction for Star Wars, The High Republic. Set a couple hundred years before Phantom Menace, this new era is set to let them do whatever they want with the franchise without contradicting (ruining) the movies and stories we fell in love with before Mickey got his gloved hands on it.

https://www.youtube.com/w...Cat5fXRyyU

This looks really bad, especially when you see the whiteboard in the writers room that was briefly shown in the trailer.

Surprise! They rank "diversity" and "feelings" above "relatable characters". Not only that, "diversity" is so important, they list it again "representation / diversity". What else are they planning? "Not pro-war"... can't have war in Star WARS. They want to make sure to include "space", "lightsaber battles", "droids", "The Force" and... "dinosaurs"? What the actual fuck?

I don't see anything about good stories. Not even GOOD characters, just "relatable characters" and "no single MAIN character". Yeah.... NO!

This looks really bad. At least we have The Mandalorian.

You know they have these kinds of whiteboards in every writers room, right? And they always have the same kind of bullshit written on it. It's not a big deal. Nor are the subjects that are listed ranked in any order so just because you see "diversity" and "feelings" listed above "relatable characters" doesn't mean that they are any more important in the writers mind. You'll also see "relatable characters" on every one of these kinds of whiteboards. No matter if it's for Star Wars, sitcoms, soap operas or anything else you can think of. Especially in fantasy stories. George Lucas would have had the same ideas when he wrote the original. In any fantasy story, you have to have relatable characters. It's common sense. In fact I don't see anything on that board that Lucas wouldn't have considered with the exception of diversity. Like, I get that it's "the cool thing to do" now to hate modern Star Wars. But at least wait for the finished product. You can't complain about the creative process as if it's unique to this project when every single major movie, TV or book series goes through the same process. You're setting yourself up to hate it already before it's even been written. At least give it a chance.

Here's thre thing, I'll give it a chance. Notice my ranking (reply #68) lists 14 movies, your lists 11. I may not have ranked the Ewok & Clone Wars movies high, but I ranked them. You left them out. I've purchased those 3 movies twice on various formats, have you?

I've also read every Star Wars comic ever printed and dozens of the novels. I'm pretty sure I'll be checking out the new stuff too, and yes, I'll "give it a chance". So far from Disney I've liked Rogue One, Rebels & The Mandalorian, and I'm sure I'll like more. Unfortunately, I don't like the new trilogy and yes, I'm sure I'll dislike more.

Esecially if they have to remind themselves to include "space" & "the force", focus on "feelings" and plan to have "dinosaurs".

Disney doesn't care about Star Wars. At least, Kathleen Kennedy doesn't. Her best bud Rian Johnson said it all "let the past die and if it doesn't, kill it". And they tried their best to do just that. Sorry if I have no faith, but if they ruined Star Wars as we know it, why trust them to create good new Star Wars.

Maybe we'll get lucky, Kennedy will be fired, and Favreu & Filoni will take over. Such a move would go far to restore my faith in the franchise. Until then, I'm still down, still giving it a chance, and still calling out the SUCK when I see it.

djThunderfunk said:

EmmaMcG said:

djThunderfunk said:

Here's thre thing, I'll give it a chance. Notice my ranking (reply #68) lists 14 movies, your lists 11. I may not have ranked the Ewok & Clone Wars movies high, but I ranked them. You left them out. I've purchased those 3 movies twice on various formats, have you?

I've also read every Star Wars comic ever printed and dozens of the novels. I'm pretty sure I'll be checking out the new stuff too, and yes, I'll "give it a chance". So far from Disney I've liked Rogue One, Rebels & The Mandalorian, and I'm sure I'll like more. Unfortunately, I don't like the new trilogy and yes, I'm sure I'll dislike more.

Esecially if they have to remind themselves to include "space" & "the force", focus on "feelings" and plan to have "dinosaurs".

Disney doesn't care about Star Wars. At least, Kathleen Kennedy doesn't. Her best bud Rian Johnson said it all "let the past die and if it doesn't, kill it". And they tried their best to do just that. Sorry if I have no faith, but if they ruined Star Wars as we know it, why trust them to create good new Star Wars.

Maybe we'll get lucky, Kennedy will be fired, and Favreu & Filoni will take over. Such a move would go far to restore my faith in the franchise. Until then, I'm still down, still giving it a chance, and still calling out the SUCK when I see it.

No, I've never seen those movies because I'm not all that invested in the series. I enjoy the "main" movies and The Mandalorian. I'm not particularly interested in the others. But that has absolutely nothing to do with my point. Nothing at all. Having things like "space" or "the force" written on a whiteboard is not to "remind them" of what they need to include. Nor is the inclusion of "feelings" any indication that future stories are going to be much different than what's come before. It's simply part of the creative process of every single big project. You should see some of the stuff from the Game Of Thrones meetings. If you think "feelings" and "dinosaurs" are bad, it's nothing compared to that stuff. I mean, it may turn out to be shit. Who knows? But seeing as we know absolutely nothing about what to expect from it, it's a bit early to be complaining about it. Especially if you're using what's written on that whiteboard as the basis for your argument. That's my point.

i find it interesting when casual fans take offense to hard core fans' criticism and complaints. It's a bit like if someone who only listened to Prince's hits took issue with a hard core fan's complaints about his posthumous releases.

I would not be at all surprised to see the same stuff from a Game Of Thrones meeting, either. Clearly when they ran out of source material, they had no clue what makes GOT work, just as these jokers don't get Star Wars. And my attitude comes from much more than the whiteboard and more than the promo trailer. I follow all the reports and interviews with those behind the scenes, this is just the latest example of the problem.

And finally, I mentioned Favreau and Filoni, and the fact that they DO get Star Wars. Take the toys away from Kennedy and give them to these guys and I'll have a new hope.

djThunderfunk said:

sro100 said:

kpowers said:

?????????????

Darth Binks was a dark lord of the Sith. So powerful and so wise .....

But really are you thinking I'm supposed to be embarrassed?

Are you familiar with Ewoks?

I LOVE Jar Jar. BTW, George Lucas said it was his favorite character in all of Star Wars.

But what I really don't think is cool is people like yourself who have to follow a certain protocol when it comes to Star Wars Prequels; I think the zombification started with the losers at Red Letter Media; then all then all "cool" kids had to mock everything about them.

George Lucas is an artist and its all his vision.

You really think the Disney garbage has interesting ideas? How about any ideas?

I'll take Jar Jar and Darth Maul and a real story and real ideas any day of the week.

Jar Jar Binks was based on the vietnamese prostitute from movie Full Metal Jacket. Deep. Jar Jar was also possessed.

domainator2010 said:

Pokeno4Money said:

I hafta ask since you disliked the plot so much, why did you continue on and watch all nine (at least) movies? I certainly wouldn't have watched more than two.

Oh, the VFX, mate, VFX! Industry-leading, standard-setting, and what-have-you. DEFinitely a treat for the eyes, though leaving out the brain.

Fair enough, thanks for the explanation.

EmmaMcG said:

djThunderfunk said:

i find it interesting when casual fans take offense to hard core fans' criticism and complaints. It's a bit like if someone who only listened to Prince's hits took issue with a hard core fan's complaints about his posthumous releases.

I would not be at all surprised to see the same stuff from a Game Of Thrones meeting, either. Clearly when they ran out of source material, they had no clue what makes GOT work, just as these jokers don't get Star Wars. And my attitude comes from much more than the whiteboard and more than the promo trailer. I follow all the reports and interviews with those behind the scenes, this is just the latest example of the problem.

And finally, I mentioned Favreau and Filoni, and the fact that they DO get Star Wars. Take the toys away from Kennedy and give them to these guys and I'll have a new hope.

I think you're confusing me with someone who gives a shit one way or another. I take no offense to your complaints about Star Wars. I probably share a lot of the same issues. And more besides. But your post was pointing out the whiteboard and what was written on it as if that was something that was wrong. When it's actually something that every major production uses and the final product is not influenced by a lot of what's written on it. At least not at a level that would be perceivable. And I'm not talking about the later seasons of GOT, I'm talking about the very first season. I'd guess you may get your wish regarding the future of Star Wars. To a degree anyway. I don't see Kathleen Kennedy stepping down anytime soon but she's not completely stupid. She was part of some very successful and brilliant movies over the years. After negative fan reaction to the recent Star Wars movies there will be a lot more thought put into future projects. Disney didn't become one of the biggest companies in the world by not adhering to their fanbase's requests. When something doesn't work, they will fix it. They know they rushed into the sequel trilogy and they know that it hasn't been as big of a success as it could and should have been. They spent a lot of time and money on acquiring the Star Wars brand so they obviously want it to succeed. And they'll see the reception of The Mandalorian and they'll know at this point what works and what doesn't. So no need to panic or approach everything Star Wars related with pessimism. It's been a rocky start but the franchise is in good hands.

Considering Disney's response to fan displeasure with TLJ was to label us "toxic fans" and accuse us of not liking the movie because of sexism and racism, or telling us that the movies are not for us, they're for kids, or any other the other examples of disrespect to the fans, I think it's perfectly fine to be pessimistic. Until they found out that treating the fans poorly resulted in a loss of ticket sales and merchandise sales, they didn't care what fans thought. They were more interested in the next generation of fans than the last, but, turns out the next generation doesn't spend the money on fanboy (or girl) stuff that we do.

We know what a competent executive producer looks like (Kevin Fiegie) and Kennedy ain't it. She was great when she was not in control of creative decisions, but as soon as she was, she FAILED.

Lastly, seems like you do "give a shit one way or another", otherwise, why 2 posts telling me I'm wrong?

[Edited 3/2/20 4:50am]

djThunderfunk said:

djThunderfunk said:

Considering Disney's response to fan displeasure with TLJ was to label us "toxic fans" and accuse us of not liking the movie because of sexism and racism,

the irony here: Rian Fucktwat Johnson took Finn, probably the most promising and interesting zero-to-hero character arc pitched in Episode 7, and turned him into the funny black guy sidekick with waterleaking suit and all that shit. it won't get more racist than that.
until then storm troopers were cannon fodder, no one of us ever cared if they got shot or blown to pieces. and then suddenly we had a face under the mask, hints at some background, even hints at the Force, this could have been great, so much potential. anyone can have the Force. cool idea, Rian, huh? but nope, let's drop that guy, let's insert that damn broomstick boy instead.





btw in other recent news finally the novellization for The Rise Of Skywalker will "explain" how Palpatine came back an that he was in fact a clone...

total incompetent assholes

if you need outside literature to explain a major plot point in a movie, then it is the shittiest script and story telling possible. awful


after Ep7 I also felt that the franchise was more or less in good hands....
that was becasue not im my wildest dreams I would have imagined, that they kicked this of without any plan our outline whatsoever!!

the franchise is dead just like the clusterfuck trílogy

[Edited 3/2/20 9:17am]

djThunderfunk said:

And finally, I mentioned Favreau and Filoni, and the fact that they DO get Star Wars. Take the toys away from Kennedy and give them to these guys and I'll have a new hope.

I've said the same thing here and elsewhere and I'm in full agreement with you and Emma.

The properties Filoni has run since the 2000's -- Clone Wars and Rebels -- were excellent and thematically consistent. They thoughtfully expanded the SW universe. Filoni gets that it is the believability and genuineness of the relationships that hold Star Wars together.

TRoS had the look and feel of a Filoni production. His influence is being felt. I can't wait to check out Mandalorian.

I do agree with BombSquad here on these points:

- the need for the novelization to add dimension to TRoS is an indictment of the script.

- Finn's arc is an indictment of both Johnson and Abrams. Finn's moments in TRoS were forced, and that's after he was relegated to secondary storylines in TLJ after being one of the most compelling characters in TFA. They didn't even fully reveal his Force-sensitivity, which would have explained how he was able to hold his own against Vader's grandson in the TFA duel (and why Maz felt she could give him the Skywalker blade in the first place). I ride for TLJ and continue to do so, but Finn's storyline was a glaring flaw which TRoS never amended.

uPtoWnNY said:

ROTJ should have taken place on the Wookies home planet Kashyyyk, which is a forest world like Endor.

Agreed. IIRC, for various reasons, Lucasfilm thought Ewoks would sell more toys than Wookiees.

BombSquad said:

btw in other recent news finally the novellization for The Rise Of Skywalker will "explain" how Palpatine came back an that he was in fact a clone...

total incompetent assholes

if you need outside literature to explain a major plot point in a movie, then it is the shittiest script and story telling possible. awful

That idea was weak the first time it was done, nearly 30 years ago in the comics. It's no better now, which is probably why they left it to a book instead of including it in the movie.