Pokeno4Money said:

duccichucka said:

Forgiveness occurs when you no longer desire to justifiably punish those who have punished
you. I use PBS' This Emotional Life's section on forgiveness when I'm conducting my group
therapy sessions. I find it very helpful.

I disagree. Forgiveness is when you no longer are impacted by the other person's actions that hurt you.

As long as you continue to feel the pain from what the person did to hurt you, they can't be truly forgiven ... because you will always associate that pain with them.

That's interesting....I guess if that's the case it would be nearly impossible to forgive in that situation. What do you think?

SeventeenDayze said:

Pokeno4Money said:

I disagree. Forgiveness is when you no longer are impacted by the other person's actions that hurt you.

As long as you continue to feel the pain from what the person did to hurt you, they can't be truly forgiven ... because you will always associate that pain with them.

That's interesting....I guess if that's the case it would be nearly impossible to forgive in that situation. What do you think?

If the painful reminder is still there, then yes.

I've heard of many situations where a parent has ACCIDENTALLY hurt or killed their child, and the spouse divorced them and never forgave them.

Hell, I know of kids who never forgave a parent for dying from cancer or a disease. Sure it's crazy, but what it boils down to is that many people can't deal with hurt unless they have someone they can blame. If the hurt eventually goes away, like with a breakup, then there's no more need to blame anyone ... therefore all is forgiven.

Pokeno4Money said:

SeventeenDayze said:

That's interesting....I guess if that's the case it would be nearly impossible to forgive in that situation. What do you think?

If the painful reminder is still there, then yes.

I've heard of many situations where a parent has ACCIDENTALLY hurt or killed their child, and the spouse divorced them and never forgave them.

Hell, I know of kids who never forgave a parent for dying from cancer or a disease. Sure it's crazy, but what it boils down to is that many people can't deal with hurt unless they have someone they can blame. If the hurt eventually goes away, like with a breakup, then there's no more need to blame anyone ... therefore all is forgiven.

Yeah I've heard that a miscarriage, for example, has also been a big factor in divorce. I'm wondering if Prince's son's death was the catalyst for his divorce from Mayte. I really don't want the thread to get derailed into that discussion but that situation reminds me of what you're talking about here.

Pokeno4Money said:

duccichucka said:

Forgiveness occurs when you no longer desire to justifiably punish those who have punished
you. I use PBS' This Emotional Life's section on forgiveness when I'm conducting my group
therapy sessions. I find it very helpful.

I disagree. Forgiveness is when you no longer are impacted by the other person's actions that hurt you.

As long as you continue to feel the pain from what the person did to hurt you, they can't be truly forgiven ... because you will always associate that pain with them.

Your behaviors that indicate you are no longer impacted by the other person's actions that
hurt you is not forgiveness. What you are suggesting here is closer to "moving on," which
usually occurs after forgiveness has been enacted. Merriam-Webster says:

Forgiveness: a : to give up resentment of or claim to requital for; b: to grant relief from pay-
ment of; 2 to cease to feel resentment against:

to stop feeling anger toward (someone who has done something wrong) : to stop blaming (someone)

: to stop feeling anger about (something) : to forgive someone for (something wrong)

: to stop requiring payment of (money that is owed)

From the PBS website:

Psychologist Sonja Lyubomirsky calls forgiveness “a shift in thinking” toward someone who has
wronged you, “such that your desire to harm that person has decreased and your desire to do
him good (or to benefit your relationship) has increased.” Forgiveness, at a minimum, is a
decision to let go of the desire for revenge and ill-will toward the person who wronged you. It
may also include feelings of goodwill toward the other person. Forgiveness is also a
natural resolution of the grief process, which is the necessary acknowledgment of pain and
loss.

So, it appears to me that forgiveness is not the same as being at a place in life where the
pain that was caused is no longer impacting. And I don't even know if that is possible in the
first place. I've found that in my clinical practice, the "trick" needed to help clients and patients
"move on" with their life after being wronged is to suggest how forgiveness could be one of
the movements needed to initiate some type of healing; and/or create meaning out of the event.
This means, then, that one could forgive his/her offender and yet still continue to feel pain as
forgiveness does not mean you are pain free, and it does not mean that you have to be free
of pain before you can move on.

SeventeenDayze said:

Hamad said:

Sometimes life forces you to deal with fake ass personalities, hence my low expectations logic.

Point taken Thanks!!

Sure thing hope you gain closure from whatever it is you've been through.

forgiveness is key because it heals you. To not forgive -- to be angry, hold a grudge or whatever the case may be -- only weighs you down. It may hold you back or manifest itself in the form of illness, sadness or other problems. Forgiving releases the negative emotion tied to whatever happened. It doesn't mean that what happened was okay, it just means it is over now and there's no longer a need to give it your emotional energy. very freeing.

deepabove said:

deepabove said:

forgiveness is key because it heals you. To not forgive -- to be angry, hold a grudge or whatever the case may be -- only weighs you down. It may hold you back or manifest itself in the form of illness, sadness or other problems. Forgiving releases the negative emotion tied to whatever happened. It doesn't mean that what happened was okay, it just means it is over now and there's no longer a need to give it your emotional energy. very freeing.

Hi, I have a question. These days I feel a bit confused as to what the concept behind :"forgiveness" truly is. A lot of people say you should forgive others for yourself, for your own good (for the reasons you have mentioned). My questions is, is it still forgiveness then? Of course it still is, but isn't it slightly different from fogiving others solely because one wants to free the person who has wronged from their guilt?

So basically, saying "I forgive you" only because one deosn't want to deal with his/her own inner anger anymore.....can that still be considered an act of forgiving?

(I'm asking because I am curious btw. I really loved your words on forgivness... )

[Edited 11/29/15 23:53pm]

Try to forgive, but never forget I think that's a good way to handle things.

SeventeenDayze said: