ZahndiFadzhina said:

Lianachan said:

In a few ways. There are numerous other mechanisms which can explain the erosion, plus there's the problem of isolation. How could the Sphinx be as old as he claims when there is absolutely no evidence of any artefacts or inscriptions anywhere in Egypt before about 7,000 years ago? How could people have made the Sphinx without leaving any other evidence whatsoever of their existence? Where are their settlements, where are their tools, etc.. ?

How would you explain the erosion? The erosional features on the side of the Sphinx and on the trench of bedrock from which it was cut have an undulating profile and vertical fissures which could not have been eroded by wind and sand.

Wind and sand are not the only mechanisms at play. There's a good paper called Deterioration of the Great Sphinx: an assessment of the literature by Charles Selwitz in volume 64, issue 245 of Antiquity which summarises the main ones - including wind/sand erosion, atmospheric pollution, rainfall (not just direct erosion but dissolution), thermal cycling, salt crystalisation, etc..

Graycap23 said:

Lianachan said:

The archaeological evidence suggests it was built during the reign of Pharaoh Khafre, which was approximately between 2650 BCE and 2480 BCE. One strong strand of evidence is from sequencing, while more cirumstantially the face on the pyramid looks a lot like his face (or, at least, they way it was depicted in sculpture).

The issue isn't the face............as the current face isn't the original face on the Sphinx.

The issue is the dating the base.

I said "circumstantially".

ZahndiFadzhina said:

Lianachan said:

The archaeological evidence suggests it was built during the reign of Pharaoh Khafre, which was approximately between 2650 BCE and 2480 BCE. One strong strand of evidence is from sequencing, while more cirumstantially the face on the pyramid looks a lot like his face (or, at least, they way it was depicted in sculpture).

Khafre might have been responsible for having the structure restored.
Since we now have Gobekli Tepe, which dates back to +/- 12.000 years ago, I do not think it is implausible that the Sphinx was constructed in an earlier epoch

Read the link about sequencing, and I dont see what Gobekli Tepe has to do with Egypt. Also, if the Sphinx is that old - where's everything else? Why did the people who built it leave absolutely nothing else behind? Where's the evidence?

[Edited 11/10/15 8:36am]

Lianachan said:

ZahndiFadzhina said:

Khafre might have been responsible for having the structure restored.
Since we now have Gobekli Tepe, which dates back to +/- 12.000 years ago, I do not think it is implausible that the Sphinx was constructed in an earlier epoch

Read the link about sequencing, and I dont see what Gobekli Tepe has to do with Egypt. Also, if the Sphinx is that old - where's everything else? Why did the people who built it leave absolutely nothing else behind? Where's the evidence?

[Edited 11/10/15 8:36am]

But that is the 1,000,000 dollar question.

No one has an answer.

Graycap23 said:

Lianachan said:

Read the link about sequencing, and I dont see what Gobekli Tepe has to do with Egypt. Also, if the Sphinx is that old - where's everything else? Why did the people who built it leave absolutely nothing else behind? Where's the evidence?

[Edited 11/10/15 8:36am]

But that is the 1,000,000 dollar question.

No one has an answer.

It's strong evidence that the Sphinx cannot be older than a max of around 7,000 years.

prittypriss said:

According to Hinduism, we live through 4 different ages on a repeated cycle. There is Satya Yuga, Treta Yuga, Dwapara Yuga, and Kali Yuga. We are considered currently to be in the Kali Yuga period. Each age is a different length: Kali Yuga is said to be 1200 years of Demigods, and one Demigod year is equal to 360 human years. But as we move into each age, we're said to lose some things from the previous age.

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hinduism isn't the only theory in which there are four ages, the mayan calendar also embraces this theory: according to the Popol Vuh, a mayan creation mythology, we are now living in the fourth world, or era of creation.

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the way i see them, and this is only my opinion, these ancient calendars seem to pre-suppose that human civilizations have been around much, much longer than is currently believed.

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[Edited 11/10/15 9:24am]

deepabove said:

i wonder if they've translated the cuneiform-style writing on that bowl

...there's a good chance human or humanoid civilizations have been here, then faded out or died out one way or another, many times over. Look at all the technology or creations that seem far more advanced then they should for the "past" that we still cannot replicate. Or weird findings that cannot be explained, such as a group of giant skeletons or oddly shaped skulls in just one region on the planet.

I've just noticed this post. The bowl is discussed HERE.

Also - giant skeletons? All fake. Oddly shaped skulls? Some are fake, the rest are understood and explicable.

RodeoSchro said:

That seemed like a really good strategy, although the clip does get quite sad towards the end.

Lianachan said:

deepabove said:

i wonder if they've translated the cuneiform-style writing on that bowl

...there's a good chance human or humanoid civilizations have been here, then faded out or died out one way or another, many times over. Look at all the technology or creations that seem far more advanced then they should for the "past" that we still cannot replicate. Or weird findings that cannot be explained, such as a group of giant skeletons or oddly shaped skulls in just one region on the planet.

I've just noticed this post. The bowl is discussed HERE.

Also - giant skeletons? All fake.

http://worldnewsdailyreport.com/smithsonian-admits-to-destruction-of-thousands-of-giant-human-skeletons-in-early-1900s/

So why the sudden dissappearance of news articles after the 1930s on the findings of these skeletons? Somebody had to put an end to that?

paisleypark4 said:

Lianachan said:

I've just noticed this post. The bowl is discussed HERE.

Also - giant skeletons? All fake.

http://worldnewsdailyreport.com/smithsonian-admits-to-destruction-of-thousands-of-giant-human-skeletons-in-early-1900s/

So why the sudden dissappearance of news articles after the 1930s on the findings of these skeletons? Somebody had to put an end to that?

The Smithonian is owned and operated by the U.S. gov't.

Graycap23 said:

More importantly, though, it's just bullshit. The claim, I mean, not the Smithsonian.

http://www.snopes.com/med...overup.asp

Even the World Daily News website itself says it shouldn't be take seriously, with this disclaimer:

World News Daily Report is a news and political satire web publication, which may or may not use real names, often in semi-real or mostly fictitious ways. All news articles contained within worldnewsdailyreport.com are fiction, and presumably fake news. Any resemblance to the truth is purely coincidental, except for all references to politicians and/or celebrities, in which case they are based on real people, but still based almost entirely in fiction.
[Edited 11/14/15 9:41am]

Folks...there clearly people here with BS. Agendas.

http://www.gao.gov/products/GAO-07-1127

The Smithsonian Institution (Smithsonian) is the world's largest museum complex and research organization. Its annual operating and capital program revenues come from its own private trust fund assets and federal appropriations, with the majority of funds for facilities coming from federal appropriations

Graycap23 said:

It's the claim about skeletons that's bullshit, not your claim about funding. That was extremely obvious from the link I posted. My post was an addition to what you said, not a response to it. Again, I thought that was extremely obvious.

Edited afterthought: it's good of you to warn folks that the are people around here with "BS. Agendas", though - that's certainly true. But it's not me.
[Edited 11/15/15 0:36am]

check this out: a submerged ruin carbon dating back 7,000 BC, that has a kind of 'stonehenge' around a fresh water spring. they think that in this case the henge was used for water rituals.

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from: http://www.antiquities.or...ubj_id=139

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Several Neolithic settlements dating from the 9th to the 7th millennium BP (uncalibrated C14) have been exposed on the seabed along the Carmel coast. The sites include a Pre-Pottery Neolithic C (PPNC) settlement called Atlit-Yam, and five Pottery-Neolithic (PN) settlements belonging to the Wadi Rabah culture.

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Lianachan said:

Graycap23 said:

Folks...there clearly people here with BS. Agendas.

http://www.gao.gov/products/GAO-07-1127

The Smithsonian Institution (Smithsonian) is the world's largest museum complex and research organization. Its annual operating and capital program revenues come from its own private trust fund assets and federal appropriations, with the majority of funds for facilities coming from federal appropriations

It's the claim about skeletons that's bullshit, not your claim about funding. That was extremely obvious from the link I posted. My post was an addition to what you said, not a response to it. Again, I thought that was extremely obvious. Edited afterthought: it's good of you to warn folks that the are people around here with "BS. Agendas", though - that's certainly true. But it's not me. [Edited 11/15/15 0:36am]

Okay cool. I still feel like there is something not being said however and that there is more to be discovered. There are anchient texts and depictions of giant persons from many different histories. Could be fake, however with so much of it, including the 1900's findings...entire fakes? Why couldnt they have exsisted?

Anyway to the topic at hand. It is known the Sphinx was created before the Great Pyramid. Apparently there are 3 chambers under there built by Toth according to a book i read on Thiaoouba, physical evidence show there is some hollow ground under the sphinx but no chamber evidence. Has anyone ever been down there?

paisleypark4 said:

No giant humanoid skeletons have ever been found, and none ever will be. Why could they never exist? The square-cube law.

http://web.archive.org/we...tml#square

Ancient depictions of giants shouldn't be taken literally. They are misrepresented by people who are usually selling something, and they rely on the majority of people not knowing much about iconography.

More to be discovered? Certainly, that's why we do what we do. Something not being said? Conspirational nonsense I'm afraid, which helps to feed the agenda of the likes of Hancock and helps them sell their bullshit books.
[Edited 11/15/15 7:53am]

XxAxX said:

Yes, there really are old sites. I've dug on sites older than the Sphinx, even. But the existence of such sites says nothing about the age of the Sphinx.

the calendar on the gate of the sun at puma punku appears to reference a date of 27,000 years BC.

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discovery of the sumerian cuneiform bowl at (or near) the tiahuanaca/puma punku site seems to imply that there was some connection between the ancient middle east and southamerican cultures. or, if not a connection, certainly there are striking similarities.

.

the existence of pyramids in south america as well as in the middle east has always been an unexplained coincidence.

.

and now look. just last spring, yet another similarity between ancient bolivia and egypt has been discovered. maybe once they excavate the thing they'll find another sphinx! :

.

http://latino.foxnews.com/latino/entertainment/2015/03/27/bolivia-detects-buried-pyramid-at-tiahuanaco-site/

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Bolivia detects buried pyramid at Tiahuanaco site

.

[Edited 11/16/15 3:50am]

XxAxX said:

the calendar on the gate of the sun at puma punku appears to reference a date of 27,000 years BC.

.

discovery of the sumerian cuneiform bowl at (or near) the tiahuanaca/puma punku site seems to imply that there was some connection between the ancient middle east and southamerican cultures. or, if not a connection, certainly there are striking similarities.

.

the existence of pyramids in south america as well as in the middle east has always been an unexplained coincidence.

.

and now look. just last spring, yet another similarity between ancient bolivia and egypt has been discovered. maybe once they excavate the thing they'll find another sphinx! :

.

http://latino.foxnews.com/latino/entertainment/2015/03/27/bolivia-detects-buried-pyramid-at-tiahuanaco-site/

.

Bolivia detects buried pyramid at Tiahuanaco site

Published March 27, 2015

EFE

The government of Bolivia announced it will start exploratory excavations this year at the ancient fortress of Tiahuanaco after a buried pyramid was detected.

.

Ludwing Cayo, director of the Tiahuanaco Archeological Research Center, told Efe that the formation is located in the area of Kantatallita, east of the Akapana pyramid.

.

In a presentation for the media, Cayo outlined a five-year for further research at Tiahuanaco, an archaeological site 71 kilometers (44 miles) west of La Paz that was the cradle of an ancient civilization predating the Incas.

.

Excavations may start in May or June, depending on the timing of cooperation agreements with foreign universities and institutes to enroll more forensic archaeology experts in the effort, Cayo said.

.

Besides the pyramid, ground-penetrating radar has detected "a number of underground anomalies" that might be monoliths, but those findings require more detailed analysis.

.

Tiahuanaco was the capital of a pre-Columbian empire known as Tiwanaku that left a legacy of impressive stone monuments such as Kalasasaya, the semi-underground Templete, sculptures of prominent figures, the Gate of the Sun and ruins of palaces.

.

Bolivian researchers say Tiahuanaco began as an agricultural village around 1580 B.C. and grew to become an imperial state by A.D. 724, but was in decline by the late 12th century.

.

At its peak, the Tiwanaku realm occupied over 600,000 square kilometers (231,000 square miles). EFE

.

[Edited 11/16/15 3:50am]

Kalasasaya, that was a pre-Aztec society correct? Its one of our oldest kept sites today. Very interesting.

XxAxX said:

the calendar on the gate of the sun at puma punku appears to reference a date of 27,000 years BC.

I've only seen that claim made on ancient aliens type websites - do you have a source? The original source I've seen for that claim uses deeply flawed archaeastronomy. There's nothing wrong with archaeoastronomy itself (in fact, I spent yesterday morning here with one of the top experts on Scottish Bronze Age religion discussing various alignments and their significance) but that work is recognised as nonsense.

I've posted a link about the bowl already. It is, to say the least, disputed. It's most likely that it's an outright fake.

Pyramids in Egypt and South America are not an unexplained coincidence at all. If you wanted a massive stone building, how else would you be able to build it? The pyramid is a very stable structure. Also, the pyramids in Egypt and South America are very different in both form and functionality.

Regarding your Bolivian info - all that's happened is that another pyramid has been located in an area where others are already known. It's very cool, of course, but it shouldn't be a massive surprise to anybody and it has nothing whatsoever to do with Egypt.

paisleypark4 said:

Kalasasaya, that was a pre-Aztec society correct? Its one of our oldest kept sites today. Very interesting.

It dates to sometime within about 300 years either side of the year 0 CE, well before the Aztecs, and it's also well outside of their geographical area.

paisleypark4 said:

XxAxX said:

the calendar on the gate of the sun at puma punku appears to reference a date of 27,000 years BC.

.

discovery of the sumerian cuneiform bowl at (or near) the tiahuanaca/puma punku site seems to imply that there was some connection between the ancient middle east and southamerican cultures. or, if not a connection, certainly there are striking similarities.

.

the existence of pyramids in south america as well as in the middle east has always been an unexplained coincidence.

.

and now look. just last spring, yet another similarity between ancient bolivia and egypt has been discovered. maybe once they excavate the thing they'll find another sphinx! :

.

http://latino.foxnews.com/latino/entertainment/2015/03/27/bolivia-detects-buried-pyramid-at-tiahuanaco-site/

.

Bolivia detects buried pyramid at Tiahuanaco site

Published March 27, 2015

EFE

The government of Bolivia announced it will start exploratory excavations this year at the ancient fortress of Tiahuanaco after a buried pyramid was detected.

.

Ludwing Cayo, director of the Tiahuanaco Archeological Research Center, told Efe that the formation is located in the area of Kantatallita, east of the Akapana pyramid.

.

In a presentation for the media, Cayo outlined a five-year for further research at Tiahuanaco, an archaeological site 71 kilometers (44 miles) west of La Paz that was the cradle of an ancient civilization predating the Incas.

.

Excavations may start in May or June, depending on the timing of cooperation agreements with foreign universities and institutes to enroll more forensic archaeology experts in the effort, Cayo said.

.

Besides the pyramid, ground-penetrating radar has detected "a number of underground anomalies" that might be monoliths, but those findings require more detailed analysis.

.

Tiahuanaco was the capital of a pre-Columbian empire known as Tiwanaku that left a legacy of impressive stone monuments such as Kalasasaya, the semi-underground Templete, sculptures of prominent figures, the Gate of the Sun and ruins of palaces.

.

Bolivian researchers say Tiahuanaco began as an agricultural village around 1580 B.C. and grew to become an imperial state by A.D. 724, but was in decline by the late 12th century.

.

At its peak, the Tiwanaku realm occupied over 600,000 square kilometers (231,000 square miles). EFE

.

[Edited 11/16/15 3:50am]

Kalasasaya, that was a pre-Aztec society correct? Its one of our oldest kept sites today. Very interesting.

.

it is very interesting. imo, along with the history we think we know, equally interesting is what we don't know.

XxAxX said:

paisleypark4 said:

Kalasasaya, that was a pre-Aztec society correct? Its one of our oldest kept sites today. Very interesting.

.

it is very interesting. imo, along with the history we think we know, equally interesting is what we don't know.

At this point in human history, there seems 2 be a great more we DON'T know than we know. Especially about activity related to B.C.

Graycap23 said:

XxAxX said:

.

it is very interesting. imo, along with the history we think we know, equally interesting is what we don't know.

At this point in human history, there seems 2 be a great more we DON'T know than we know. Especially about activity related to B.C.

How do we know how much we don't know?

Graycap23 said:

XxAxX said:

.

it is very interesting. imo, along with the history we think we know, equally interesting is what we don't know.

At this point in human history, there seems 2 be a great more we DON'T know than we know. Especially about activity related to B.C.

.

this is a cool time to be alive. now that we have ground penetrating radar i anticipate we'll see a lot more 'discoveries' of monoliths and ruined cities. i love that we are living in a day and age when we can update the record almost instantaneously (in the old days once something was "official" it stayed that way until the next run of textbooks; we have the internet today) and enjoy the free exchange of information. i can't wait to see what they excavate at tiahuanaco.

XxAxX said:

Graycap23 said:

At this point in human history, there seems 2 be a great more we DON'T know than we know. Especially about activity related to B.C.

.

this is a cool time to be alive. now that we have ground penetrating radar i anticipate we'll see a lot more 'discoveries' of monoliths and ruined cities. i love that we are living in a day and age when we can update the record almost instantaneously (in the old days once something was "official" it stayed that way until the next run of textbooks; we have the internet today) and enjoy the free exchange of information. i can't wait to see what they excavate at tiahuanaco.

Would you care to respond to any of my replies to you, or do you prefer an ideological echo chamber to engaging with an actual archaeologist?

Lianachan said:

Graycap23 said:

At this point in human history, there seems 2 be a great more we DON'T know than we know. Especially about activity related to B.C.

How do we know how much we don't know?

How?

It seems that every other week we declare that some belief that we thought was true and accurate..........isn't.

Graycap23 said:

Lianachan said:

How do we know how much we don't know?

How?

It seems that every other week we declare that some belief that we thought was true and accurate..........isn't.

Do we? Such as?

Even if that were true, that would be us knowing something new - which is great. But my question is, how do we know how much is left for us to find out? How do we know how much we don't know?

Lianachan said:

Graycap23 said:

How?

It seems that every other week we declare that some belief that we thought was true and accurate..........isn't.

Do we? Such as?

Even if that were true, that would be us knowing something new - which is great. But my question is, how do we know how much is left for us to find out? How do we know how much we don't know?

How do we know?

When we stop killing each other over nonsense.

No other species on this planet demonstrate the destructive behavior that humans do.

It appears that we don't know very much at all. Couple that with the flat out lies contained in history books...............there is a ton of truth 2 be learned from the so called lies passed down as facts.

Graycap23 said:

Lianachan said:

Do we? Such as?

Even if that were true, that would be us knowing something new - which is great. But my question is, how do we know how much is left for us to find out? How do we know how much we don't know?

How do we know?

When we stop killing each other over nonsense.

No other species on this planet demonstrate the destructive behavior that humans do.

It appears that we don't know very much at all. Couple that with the flat out lies contained in history books...............there is a ton of truth 2 be learned from the so called lies passed down as facts.

I don't see what killing each other over nonsense or humans being the most destructive species has to do with it, although I don't for one moment disagree that both of those things are true.

There are definitely things in history books which are contradicted by archaeological evidence - the dating of the first Roman adventures in Scotland, for example. But things like that are evidence based. Things like ancient aliens, giant skeletons, lost ancient technology, pseudoarchaeological claims about pyramids, etc, are not evidence based. It's unfortunate that the History Channel promotes such nonsense, as it creates an illusion of legitimacy which seems to fool a disappointing number of people.